Notably, the example of individual large PWS attacking large WarShips continues to be used.
Because that is the way in which statements like: “The Grand Inquisitor is a large PWS that would be deadly to any WarShip short of a heavy cruiser…†are quantified. In large groups, Vincents are deadly to battleships and Leopard PWS can overwhelm even the largest ships.
What do you consider a large WarShip?
Anything more powerful than the lightest corvettes (Vincent, Zec and similar). Actual tonnage is irrelevant; a Fox is more a light destroyer than a corvette, for example. In other words, warships that present a credible threat to other warships (i.e. capable of withstanding moderately powerful capital-grade fire [at least 30-40 capital points per facing] AND enough capital SI to survive a penetrating shot from a 60-point capital bay, as well as being capable of delivering at least 60 capital points onto a single target per turn].
Certainly, something like a Lola or an Essex would not be considered to be such an overmatch to a GI to fit that category.
Yes, they would. The Essex can withstand 37 capital points of damage per facing (capital SI: 60) and can pump over 140 capital points into a single target in a single turn. The Lola III can withstand 48 capital points of damage per facing (capital SI: 50) and can pump over 112 capital points into a single target in a single turn.
Perhaps you are looking at WarShips like the Black Lion or even a Cameron. In those cases, it would be a ridiculous comparison.
Agreed, which is why I’m only looking at the smaller end of the spectrum.
In any event, the overall statement of the GI being a viable threat against many WarShips SMALLER than a heavy cruiser is still valid.
Nope.
Smaller than a heavy cruiser:
(A=capital armour, SI=capital SI, Dmg=capital damage potential into one target in one turn)
Fox (A: 70/67/54/64, SI: 100, Dmg: 60+)
Impavido (A: 50/55/54/50, SI: 50, Dmg: 116+)
Suffren (A: 80/63/60/70, SI: 60, Dmg: 158+) + 5/8 thrust
Kyushu (A: 140/90/70/110, SI: 60, Dmg: 265+)
Fredasa (A: 40/30/30/35, SI: 40, Dmg: 79+) + 5/8 thrust
Vincent (A: 16/19/19/16, SI: 40, Dmg: 24+)
Whirlwind (A: 100/70/65/80, SI: 55, Dmg: 164+)
York (A: 120/100/100/120, SI: 60, Dmg: 192+)
Essex (A: 37/37/37/35, SI: 60, Dmg: 140+)
Lola III (A: 48/48/48/48, SI: 50, Dmg: 112+)
Zechetinu (A: 24/21/20/20, SI: 15, Dmg: 55+) + 5/8 thrust
Inazuma (A: 28/30/30/25, SI: 46, Dmg: 91)
Tatsumaki (A: 70/70/70/60, SI: 50, Dmg: 103+)
Dante (A: 100/90/90/70, SI: 50, Dmg: 250+) + 5/8 thrust
Eagle (A: 39/36/33/33, SI: 45, Dmg: 259+)
Carrack (A: 10/8/6/9, SI: 15, Dmg: 71+)
GI (A: 82/72/62, SI: 7, Dmg: 66+) + 5/8 thrust
Lak I (A: 101/101/101, SI: 17, Dmg: 173+) + 5/8 thrust
Lak II (A: 70/70/70, SI: 9, Dmg: 173+) + 5/8 thrust
Note: only four armour facings on the PWS. Thrust is mentioned because theship with the higher thrust can dictate range.
Try playtesting the GI and all of its assets (with the full intent of winning) against a WarShip that is smaller than than a heavy cruiser and bigger than a corvette. You will obviously be surprised as to the results.
No, I won’t be surprised by the results; as you can see by the list above (ALL ships being smaller than a heavy cruiser), any ship with a potential damage of 96+ (doubled SI) can one-shot the GI in its strongest armour facing, to wit, everything except the Carrack (a transport!), the Zec (both I & II), the Vincent, the Fox, the Inazuma and the Fredasa. That is not “most†of the list… not by a long shot.
Now, let’s see how many can be one-shot by the GI, meaning all armour from one facing and all SI eliminated in one turn; the Zec (no surprise, but with 5/8 thrust it can choose to run) and the Carrack (which as a transport has no business seeking combat with a PWS).
Can the GI come out ahead in a one-on-one against larger ships? Sure, lucky shots and unlucky targeting by the opponent make anything possible, but looking at the sheer numbers (and keeping basic capital combat truisms in mind), the GI is superior to the Zec and the Carrack, takes a gamble on the Vincent, a bigger gamble on the Fox, Inazuma and Fredasa and is fodder for everything else.
Why? Because the GI is a one-shot wonder; its main battery is in the nose, no other two arcs combined can come close to matching its forward firepower. If the GI fails to kill its opponent with the first shot, the damage it receives in the first exchange (don’t forget; in order to shoot its SCCs, the GI has to enter the range of the target’s own capital batteries), and assuming the GI is not destroyed outright in the exchange, will either completely destroy the GI’s forward armour (yes, forward; it has to aim its nose at the enemy) or leave it so weak that a second shot will doughnut the GI. This means that the GI has to maneuver to present a fresh armour facing, losing the use of its big battery OR it continues to face the opponent and risk a very high probability of being destroyed. Meanwhile, the opponent (assuming the armour on the facing that just got hit cannot survive a second hit) will also maneuver to present a fresh armour facing (don’t forget it has two more than the GI!) and still (in the vast majority of designs) present enough damage potential to either destroy (GI has weaker sides and rear, remember? Some designs might not penetrate the GI’s nose, but can slice through the sides like a hot knife through warm butter) or seriously reduce that armour’s facing as well, while inflicting significantly less damage on its target.
In other words, if the GI can’t one-shot it’s target, it will lose the battle. It might not be
destroyed, but it will be unable to engage its target effectively without risking instant destruction.
Oh, and the capital missiles are great, but if you are going to depend on capital missiles alone, you might as well go with a Leopard PWS… of course, you’d still be inside the range of their missiles and if
they have AMS, your missiles are not going to be worth much.
Fighters? They have fighters too. If you are going to count on your fighters towin the battle you might as well go for a Vengeance or a dedicated custom CV.
Large numbers of GI? How about large numbers of Leopard PWS or Nekohono’o or Overlord A3’s? Heck, give me enough Avengers, Achilles or Claymores and I’ll bring down a Lev II.
You have to understand that in order to bring your SCC’s into range,
you have to be within range of even their shortest-ranged capital bays. No matter how much armour you put on a facing, you simply can’t overcome the 65 points of standard SI and four facings.
The Lak (both versions) has comparable armour to the GI, the same thrust and bays (in all six weapon arcs) that deliver more damage than the GI’s only “big†bay in the nose… and it still dies fast against warships that can one-shot it… which basically matches the list that one-shots the GI. Three+ years of playtesting prove it.
It doesn’t matter how much play testing gets done; A) every single capital bay on a warship matches or exceeds the range of the GI’s sub-capital cannon; it
has to enter the range of the warships capital bays, possibly even some of its conventional bays (long & extreme conventional reach into medium capital), B) GI has only one arc with a significant bay, C) GI can’t survive (i.e. armour
and SI gone) two hits in the same armour facing from ANY of the ships on the list (except the Vincent).
Even if we “Try playtesting the GI and all of its assets (with the full intent of winning) against a WarShip that is smaller than a heavy cruiser and bigger than a corvetteâ€, we have problems. If we assume the GI has all its assets, we have to also assume that the warship has all its assets as well; the York is a destroyer; it has 50 fighters, 5 small craft and two dropships, as well as 100 capital points of armour in its weakest facing and can doughnut the GI in a single volley at medium capital range. Even the Essex and the Lola III can one-shot it, each has 10 fighters and 10 small craft. If your argument is that the 40 fighters can win the battle, same applies for the Vengeance. I’ll add “what fighters?†If my ten fighters are R3 Eisensturms and your 40 are Thrushes, the advantage is not as big at it would appear.
Luck? I have seen a BMR-era foot rifle infantry squad kill a pristine Cyclops with a single lucky shot. Anything is possible. But depending on good rolls and capital missile crits is in no way representative of overall performance.
Simply put; the design is good as an anti-dropship platform, but it has nowhere near the performance characteristics that would make it a reliable “small warship killerâ€.
