Author Topic: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx  (Read 24143 times)

Kotetsu

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’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« on: 17 May 2012, 04:43:15 »
’Mech of the Week: Sphinx

The Sphinx. Guardian of the Egyptian Pyramids. Riddler of ancient times. And this machine is indeed a riddle. Though to paraphrase a movie villain, “Riddle me this, riddle me that. How shall I kill you, you dezgra bat?”

Sorry, that line is one of the few Jim Carrey quotes I can stand…

Designed both as a heavy cavalry ’Mech, and a companion to designs such as the Nova (that’s Black Hawk to Spheroids), the Sphinx was also apparently envisioned as an OmniMech, before the rush for more machines caused the Nova Cats to go forward as a standard BattleMech, entering service in 3078. At 75 tons, the Sphinx is half again the size of the Black Hawk.

It is built around an endo-steel skeleton and uses the same Starfire 375-rated extralight engine as the Timber Wolf. This later choice appears to have made repairs a bit more difficult (OmniMechs get precedent, after all). Thirteen and a half tons of standard plate provide 93% of maximum protection. Aside from the head, all front locations can take a single Class-20 shot, with the legs and center torso able to withstand two Gauss slugs. Rear locations can take a medium laser blast, and the center rear a large laser. The weapon’s load consists of two arm-mounted large lasers, and ten torso-mounted mediums. Twenty-three double-strength heat sinks struggle with the heat load, and inexperienced pilots are likely prone to shutting themselves down.

A second variant showed up in 3080. Removing all of the medium lasers and one heat sink, the Sphinx 2 moves both large lasers to the center torso, adds five small lasers to each side torso, as well as MASC and a targeting computer. This design is a great dueling machine, at least when you get in close.

In the 3090’s, a streamlined variant, designated Sphinx 3 entered service. This model mounts ten medium lasers, four in each side torso, two in the center. All are tied into a targeting computer. An ECM suite provides some added protection. Twenty-five double-strength heat sinks provide adequate cooling, as only movement increases heat. MASC is also installed for extra boosts when needed.

The Sphinx 4 was created at the same time, for issuing to garrison clusters. This variant lacks the MASC, ECM, and targeting computer. Instead the design mounts one large pulse in each arm, and ten heavy smalls, mounted in the pattern of the mediums of the 3. Twenty-four heat sinks moderate the heat somewhat.

Using one of these machines is relatively simple. Snipe from long range with your large lasers as you close, then when you can supplement with the medium (or small) laser fire. The primary variant can only sustain four mediums in addition to the larges while running, or nine mediums while walking, before you start gaining heat. The secondary variant can fire all weapons while only gaining movement heat. Depending on your opponent, you may well put him down before he knows what hit him.

Fighting one is not so easy. Either you need to outmaneuver him, or you need to have more firepower. And since most machines with more firepower are heavier, he may not decide to attack you. That said, if you do have a Hellstar or Turkina B, go to town. Inner Sphere foes are even more troubled. Simply put, if you are using Spheroid machines, pour as much fire into him as you can until he stops moving.
« Last Edit: 27 January 2014, 17:27:42 by Kotetsu »

TigerShark

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #1 on: 17 May 2012, 04:54:04 »
This is basically what the pitifully-sad Kodiak should have been from the start. At 5/8, the BV is more than justified for the ridiculously over-powered armament while the Kodiak is still lumbering about, trying to get 50% of its weapons in range. I could easily see this unit replacing the aforementioned boondoggle, were it from the Dominion.

The Nova Cats, however, are likely to face Dominion troops who are mired in slow-moving units or Spheroid gear, for the most part. This is an absolute death machine against such a force and I shudder to think of this thing in a combined-arms capacity, guarding a Hellstar or formation of missile-carriers. An excellent design, all around.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #2 on: 17 May 2012, 09:10:09 »
And if you think it's bad now, there's always the Dossier statted DA Sphinx to worry about, if they ever make it legal. The one that removes the ERLL's for MASC and a TC, keeping 10 ER Mediums. You lose the long range guns, but in return you get an absolute nightmare to fight against. It's especially nasty if you use hidden unit rules.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #3 on: 17 May 2012, 12:59:02 »
And if you think it's bad now, there's always the Dossier statted DA Sphinx to worry about, if they ever make it legal. The one that removes the ERLL's for MASC and a TC, keeping 10 ER Mediums. You lose the long range guns, but in return you get an absolute nightmare to fight against. It's especially nasty if you use hidden unit rules.
Don't forget the Revekka Shteysel version, 5/8, 2xLPL, 10xHSL. If you start with the Sphinx a straight weapons swap leaves you with one spare ton which can go to armor or heat sinks. If it goes to heat sinks you'll end up with 24 DHS and a max heat of 52 on a running alpha.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #4 on: 17 May 2012, 13:24:35 »
I love the Sphinx, it does the whole heavy cav thing while also sporting a super swayback death hug. It's so simple even I can use it  :D
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #5 on: 17 May 2012, 18:02:23 »
It's my favorite heavy mech. I made a mod once that uses fractional accounting and replaces the ERLLs for two retractable blades. If it gets close, not only do you face its ERMLs, but two potentially crit-inducing punches.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #6 on: 17 May 2012, 18:58:09 »
I fell in love with the Sphinx when I first saw it in MWDA; I liked the blocky, grungy asthetic of it with its Highlander-esque design, as well as the rather nonsenseawesome weapons load. It was near the top of my "please get stats soon" list, and TRO85 did not dissapoint.

I've had a fair deal of luck using it; bum-rush target, melt his fase off, repeat. It's pretty hard to kill, so save for getting a TAC or a headshot, it's not going to go down easy. Meanwhile, fase-melting.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #7 on: 18 May 2012, 15:28:16 »
The DA version is a nightmare, and ranks right up there with the Hellstar.
The two current canon versions are so-so.
Mostly interesting as a lead-up to the real monster of the family... >:D

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #8 on: 18 May 2012, 15:57:06 »
This is basically what the pitifully-sad Kodiak should have been from the start. At 5/8, the BV is more than justified for the ridiculously over-powered armament while the Kodiak is still lumbering about, trying to get 50% of its weapons in range. I could easily see this unit replacing the aforementioned boondoggle, were it from the Dominion.

The Nova Cats, however, are likely to face Dominion troops who are mired in slow-moving units or Spheroid gear, for the most part. This is an absolute death machine against such a force and I shudder to think of this thing in a combined-arms capacity, guarding a Hellstar or formation of missile-carriers. An excellent design, all around.

Not so much as you think.  A good wall-'o-steel assault star can consistently scrap a 'Mech this size in a single volley which seriously limits the utility of the Sphinx because it will not survive long enough to do any real damage even though it has a BV on par with many assault 'Mechs.  Even in single combat it can run into serious trouble against slower machines of similar BV because they tend to be assaults with a significant advantage in firepower and armor.  For example, the Kodiak you were complaining about ran into a Sphinx, it would ave a significant advantage over the smaller machine thanks to its Ultra 20 and thicker armor, although it would need to use terrain to minimize the impact of the Sphinx's extra ERLL at long range.


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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #9 on: 18 May 2012, 18:39:56 »
Not so much as you think.  A good wall-'o-steel assault star can consistently scrap a 'Mech this size in a single volley which seriously limits the utility of the Sphinx because it will not survive long enough to do any real damage even though it has a BV on par with many assault 'Mechs.  Even in single combat it can run into serious trouble against slower machines of similar BV because they tend to be assaults with a significant advantage in firepower and armor.  For example, the Kodiak you were complaining about ran into a Sphinx, it would ave a significant advantage over the smaller machine thanks to its Ultra 20 and thicker armor, although it would need to use terrain to minimize the impact of the Sphinx's extra ERLL at long range.

So, we're judging a 'Mech by its ability to not get insta-gibbed by an entire Star of Clan Assault 'Mechs.

I'm sorry, but could you point out to me how this makes an effective measure against any 'Mech? ???
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #10 on: 18 May 2012, 18:56:51 »
Not so much as you think.  A good wall-'o-steel assault star can consistently scrap a 'Mech this size in a single volley which seriously limits the utility of the Sphinx because it will not survive long enough to do any real damage even though it has a BV on par with many assault 'Mechs.  Even in single combat it can run into serious trouble against slower machines of similar BV because they tend to be assaults with a significant advantage in firepower and armor.  For example, the Kodiak you were complaining about ran into a Sphinx, it would ave a significant advantage over the smaller machine thanks to its Ultra 20 and thicker armor, although it would need to use terrain to minimize the impact of the Sphinx's extra ERLL at long range.

 wait wait, so your comparing 5, thats FIVE assault mechs against just this 1 , thats ONE heavy mech!? your being rediculasly silly here

 also, as was stated in the artical, the Sphinx would just stay out of range of the Kodiak and tear it to peices. that U20 only does it any good at close range buddy
« Last Edit: 18 May 2012, 19:07:28 by Zureal »

Diablo48

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #11 on: 18 May 2012, 23:44:46 »
So, we're judging a 'Mech by its ability to not get insta-gibbed by an entire Star of Clan Assault 'Mechs.

I'm sorry, but could you point out to me how this makes an effective measure against any 'Mech? ???

The comment was that the Sphinx beats slow moving Ghost Bear formations, so I am pointing out that those slow moving formations will likely be either assault or pocket assault machines and the Bears are perfectly happy to focus fire, so in a Star vs. Star (or larger) battle the Sphinx will disintegrate the turn before it gets into range which makes it a total waste of time against what it was supposed to counter.

Really, what the Sphinx is best at is kicking around IS heavies which cannot easily keep it from closing into short rage (for the Clans at least) and lack the thick armor of assaults to try to weather the storm as they bring it down with support from their allies.

also, as was stated in the artical, the Sphinx would just stay out of range of the Kodiak and tear it to peices. that U20 only does it any good at close range buddy

I explicitly mentioned the range issue, but frankly if you are using the Kodiak in such a way that there is nothing compensating for its lack of long ranged firepower then you are doing it horribly wrong.  You have to either use the Kodiak as a heavy duty bodyguard and keep it in reserve to serve as a finisher or keep it in terrain tight enough to make it very difficult to get a shot from 16+ hexes.  That said, this thread is about the Sphinx an not the Kodiak so we should not spend time discussing general use of the Kodiak.


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Scotty

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #12 on: 19 May 2012, 00:00:29 »
Quote
I explicitly mentioned the range issue, but frankly if you are using the Kodiak in such a way that there is nothing compensating for its lack of long ranged firepower then you are doing it horribly wrong.

The same argument goes double for being in range and LOS of an entire Star of Assault 'Mechs.  if every single one of them has range and LOS to you at the same time and doesn't have a better target, you're Doing It Wrong.
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Diablo48

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #13 on: 19 May 2012, 00:42:23 »
The same argument goes double for being in range and LOS of an entire Star of Assault 'Mechs.  if every single one of them has range and LOS to you at the same time and doesn't have a better target, you're Doing It Wrong.

What better targets would you propose they go after?  The Sphinx does an enormous amount of damage if you let it in close and is not that hard to kill before it can do anything which puts it way up on the target priority list.


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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #14 on: 19 May 2012, 00:57:42 »
Well, yeah, if they're on a featureless plain in which all participants have LOS and range to all other participants.

Meanwhile, in a realistic setting, the Sphinx can at least limit incoming fire by being smart about where it stops movement.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #15 on: 19 May 2012, 01:09:41 »
Well, yeah, if they're on a featureless plain in which all participants have LOS and range to all other participants.

Meanwhile, in a realistic setting, the Sphinx can at least limit incoming fire by being smart about where it stops movement.

Good fields of fire can always be assumed when working with assault formations because any assault commander worth their salt will be planning ahead to ensure the fighting happens somewhere they want it to because they know they do not have the speed to adapt on the fly.  Ambushes and hitting them on rout to objectives are also not something to count on because recon nets will spot enemies on the way in and give the big boys time to dig into good firing positions.


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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #16 on: 19 May 2012, 01:20:43 »
So, you're calling the Sphinx not worth it because of the off-chance that the Assault Star Commander sets up the field perfectly, is not taken by surprise, does not have any other targets to deal with, and does not have to worry about protecting an objective.

Yeah, still not seeing how this actually applies to any real measure of the 'Mech.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #17 on: 19 May 2012, 02:14:22 »
Gentlemen, this is going nowhere.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #18 on: 19 May 2012, 02:43:57 »
Its like the lovechild of a Highlander IIC(looks) and Flashman(stats).  I approve of the Sphinx.  Works well as a heavier Stormcrow Prime type design.

Kotetsu

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #19 on: 19 May 2012, 04:12:35 »
What better targets would you propose they go after?

The Dire Wolf or Turkina striding up behind him.

Seriously, I bring back-up. And since in attack scenarios assaults are used as damage sinks and back-stops, people tend to shoot them first.

Then again, usually one of my assaults is moving up to try and beat you to death. Often with your friend's leg.

Of course, you also could shoot his Nova partner.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #20 on: 19 May 2012, 05:08:23 »
If you can't get within 15 hexes of a unit while sporting a 5/8 movement profile, you have problems. Either the terrain was stacked against you, you got Gyroed in the first round, are in a city facing off against an IDF army, etc., or you simply don't know how to use the 'Mech.

The Nova Prime is one of the most solid Clan Mediums ever made and can easily wipe any Assault 'Mech ever made off the map within 2 turns, flat, if not 1 turn. The same goes for the Sphinx, which performs this role without the ridiculous BV spike from the jump jets.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #21 on: 19 May 2012, 08:53:46 »
Good fields of fire can always be assumed when working with assault formations because any assault commander worth their salt will be planning ahead to ensure the fighting happens somewhere they want it to because they know they do not have the speed to adapt on the fly.

Any commander with a more mobile force fighting on the terrain of the Assaults choosing isn't worth his salt...  O:-)

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #22 on: 19 May 2012, 10:37:01 »
So, Sphinx vs Tundra Wolf -- the battle of the TRO3085 75 ton Clan mechs, which one is better?

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #23 on: 19 May 2012, 10:41:37 »
I think that the Sphinx may win. The Thundra is slower and the odds are clearly against it if the Sphnix gets close. And it should get close.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #24 on: 19 May 2012, 11:19:37 »
Well, yeah, if they're on a featureless plain in which all participants have LOS and range to all other participants.

Meanwhile, in a realistic setting, the Sphinx can at least limit incoming fire by being smart about where it stops movement.
Interestingly, the same argument works in reverse for a Sphinx/Kodiak duel.  Given terrain, the Kodi can force the Sphinx to close within weapons range it he's smart about it.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #25 on: 19 May 2012, 16:15:40 »
The Sphinx fails the long range firepower test. If a Clan 75 ton 'Mech can't clear 30 points it better have a good excuse. Arguably the 10 medium lasers are a good excuse. But it does make the 'Mech vulnerable in line engagements. The more hostile 'Mechs on the table, the more difficult the Sphinx will find it as it becomes increasingly dangerous to expose any 'Mech at medium ranges.

wait wait, so your comparing 5, thats FIVE assault mechs against just this 1 , thats ONE heavy mech!? your being rediculasly silly here

The problem isn't so much the 1:5 odds. As the number of units go up the chances of getting a hit at any range on any unit go up. No brainer. This in turn means that certain range brackets become unhabitable. If any one 'Mech has the misfortune to show up in that range bracket it will probably take crippling damage.
Clan Tank drivers are very familiar with this problem. They have the armor to take anyone one on, one on one, but when the firepower being sent against them increases they suffer.
In this environment the only defenses are range (increasing the mods) or cover. The game changes to trying to isolate targets so that one side can expose single targets to their wall of death while trying to prevent the reverse. Short and medium ranged brawlers are at a premium here because it is more difficult to bring their considerable firepower to bear.


The Nova Cats, however, are likely to face Dominion troops who are mired in slow-moving units or Spheroid gear, for the most part.
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« Last Edit: 19 May 2012, 16:24:09 by Jellico »

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #26 on: 19 May 2012, 16:19:16 »
I desire one simply due to its vague resemblance to shockwave. It shall join my Shootist and (eventually) Phoenix Hawk LAM in battling a Grand Titan.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #27 on: 19 May 2012, 18:45:27 »
I desire one simply due to its vague resemblance to shockwave. It shall join my Shootist and (eventually) Phoenix Hawk LAM in battling a Grand Titan.
The question is, are you going to have a Rottweiler, a Djinn, and an Achileus leaping out of a modified cargo bay on the Sphinx? ;)

Seriously, though, I don't see why anyone would bad-mouth this design. It's not bad at all, being an up-gunned Nova.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #28 on: 19 May 2012, 21:44:44 »
The question is, are you going to have a Rottweiler, a Djinn, and an Achileus leaping out of a modified cargo bay on the Sphinx? ;)

Procyon Quad, haven't decided beyond that. Of course that's for Soundwave. :P

Quote
Seriously, though, I don't see why anyone would bad-mouth this design. It's not bad at all, being an up-gunned Nova.

It feels... I don't know, boring to me.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: Sphinx
« Reply #29 on: 19 May 2012, 23:59:47 »
The Nova Prime is one of the most solid Clan Mediums ever made and can easily wipe any Assault 'Mech ever made off the map within 2 turns, flat, if not 1 turn. The same goes for the Sphinx, which performs this role without the ridiculous BV spike from the jump jets.

How does that work?  Unless you can circle around for a backshot or get lucky with TACs/headshots you will need to pump something like 200 to 300 damage into your typical assault before you have any real chance of killing it.  Even neglecting heat and misses that will take the Sphinx/Nova 3~4 turns which is easily enough time for a Clan assault 'Mech to blast through the thinner armor of the lighter 'Mechs.

Seriously, though, I don't see why anyone would bad-mouth this design. It's not bad at all, being an up-gunned Nova.

The problem is it has some serious limitations due to its short range which can be crippling against the expected opposition.  It works great against IS tech or in duels, but the Bears will be rolling in with Clan tech and focusing fire on the best target which will result in the Sphinx being torn to shreds if it tries to get close enough to use its weapons.


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