Author Topic: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle  (Read 9154 times)

Scotty

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Moving to the opposite end of the Inner Sphere this week from the heavily Lyran Drillson hovertank, the Morningstar City Command Vehicle is almost as different as it is possible to be from the speedy hovertank. Beginning production in 3065 in the heat of the FedCom Civil War, the Morningstar is produced locally to the Federated Suns portion, specifically by General Motors on Kathil and Ceres Metal Industries on Tikonov. Because of the time of its production, the vehicle is almost exclusively a Davion vehicle, although some production models have found their way into Capellan Confederation hands, and Ceres Metals on Warlock in the CapCon has been considered for a production line.

Weighing in at an even 60 tons on a wheeled vehicle chassis, the Morningstar falls squarely into the heavy vehicle category. Its mobility is pretty much average for a wheeled vehicle of this size, scooting along at a cruising speed of 54 kph with a flanking top speed of 86 kph. In a city, that jumps up another few kph for an effective flanking speed of 97 kph on pavement. This speed stems from the VOX 280 Extra Light fusion engine, which though it manages to keep a lot of open tonnage for equipment makes this particular vehicle pretty expensive. To protect such an expensive investment, the standard chassis is armored with a substantial nine tons of Durallex Standard armor, giving it a hair over 57% armor coverage. The distribution of that armor, however, might leave a few people scratching their heads. The front of the vehicle receives the lion's share of the protection, able to stop a pair of AC/20 hits without even flinching with armor left over to take a Small Laser hit before any damage is transferred to the internals. The rest of the armoring isn't so impressive. A pair of Gauss Rifle slugs will tear through the side armor with enough energy left to damage the structure, if only barely, and the rear armor can't even handle one AC/20 hit, much less two, without breaching straight to the internals. Capping it all off is the turret, which mounts enough armor that a close range Heavy Gauss Rifle slug will only barely be able to scratch the insides (Armor layout: 43/29/19/24).

Interesting armor layouts aside, the Morningstar is still quite a capable vehicle. In a deliberate attempt to cash in on the resurgence of specialty types of autocannon ammunition, the primary weapon for the standard variant is your bog-standard Mydron Excel AC/10, mounted in the turret. I'm sure many will hotly contest the utility of such a weapon on such a modern vehicle, but with two tons of ammo hidden away in the body it's at least possible to mix and match the kinds of ammo the autocannon can actually use. Backing up the autocannon in an anti-infantry capacity, the Morningstar mounts three Slingshot Machine Guns, one in each of the front and side facings, but not the turret. All three of these weapons are fed by a single ton of ammo located in the body. To assist the AC/10 primary weapon in making those tough shots, a Brightstar 17 Mk. II Targeting Computer nestled deep in the body comes into play. The combination of targeting computer and precision ammo can be very helpful for removing those pesky fast movers, and the computer can also negate the accuracy penalty when using armor-piercing ammunition, which is always a plus. A four-ton infantry bay also mounted in the body allows the Morningstar to carry its own infantry support around with it, whether it's a conventional infantry platoon or a squad of battle armor for that extra punch. Finally, the entire reason for the Morningstar's existence, and why it calls itself a Command vehicle, a C3 Master computer rests alongside the targeting computer in the body. Capable of coordinating up to three C3 Slave computers at once, the Morningstar can easily anchor a lance in a city fight, contributing decent anti-infantry firepower and versatility of the main gun AC/10 while also making shots easier for everything in the same network, as well.

Only two variants of the Morningstar are known to exist. The first to arrive on scene the very same year as the parent variant, the Morningstar (Laser) rips out the C3 Master computer and the machine guns and replaces them with a Large Laser, mounted in the front section of the vehicle, and also tied into the targeting computer. The extra half ton left over goes into armor. In what can only be described as colossal lapse in judgment on the side of the manufacturer, the half ton of armor is split between the sides, bringing them up to being able to withstand a pair of Gauss Rifle slugs with enough armor left over to at least claim there's still armor there, if not much else; bringing the rear armor up to the ability to survive an AC/20 hit without breaching with nothing left; and bringing the turret up high enough to survive a close range Heavy Gauss Rifle hit without actually breaching, again with nothing else left. (Armor layout: 43/31/20/25) How is that a colossal lapse? For whatever reason, the manufacturer left over a hundred kilograms of possible armor off of the design, functionally wasting 1/8th of a ton of armor on a design that doesn't even approach maximum armor. Regardless of manufacturing mistakes, nine and a half tons of armor is still significant, and the total armor protection with missing pieces is almost exactly 60% of the chassis maximum. For whatever reason, neither the Capellan Confederation or the Federated Suns has shown much interest in this variant.

The second and final production variant keeps the armor profile of the original chassis. The AC/10 is dropped in favor of a smaller AC/5 still tied into a proportionally smaller targeting computer, and the ammo is dropped as well, leaving the same duration of fire but less flexibility in ammunition choices while also slightly increasing range. The machine guns stay as they were, one in each of the front and side facings, still fed by the same solitary ton of ammunition. The fruits of the main armament downgrade are immediate and readily apparent. A second C3 Master computer sits alongside the first, allowing this variant, appropriately called the Morningstar (Company Command) to coordinate an entire company's C3 net. Finding an extra ton and a half of space left over, the designers also saw fit to add a Guardian ECM unit. Overall, while less damaging than the original variant, the Morningstar (Company Command) is head and shoulders more useful on the battlefield with the combination of built-in ECCM to keep the C3 nets working and ability to link even more units on the field.

Using a Morningstar is fairly simple. It's a C3 Master design, which means it's always going to be a priority target, and also a wheeled vehicle, which are prone to being disabled easily. This thing should not be on the front lines slugging it out with enemies at knife-fight range; the weapons on this are for self-defense, not headhunting. With that in mind, mounting a ton of precision ammunition for the autocannon is always going to be a good idea, even on the AC/5 model. With the targeting computer available on all versions, fast movers are going to be in for a nasty shock when you start taking shots at them as if they aren't even moving. The Morningstar (Laser) is less important, all things considered, and mixing in one or two of these on the same field you have a standard or (Company Command) variant can go a long way toward keeping your enemy guessing. The (Laser) is actually about hurting things, even if it's not especially good at it. With just an AC/10 and a large laser, it's incapable of forcing an enemy 'Mech to the ground by weight of fire, but it can still be useful. Fast movers aren't going to like precision ammunition coming out of the (Laser) variant any more than they are any other.

Fighting a Morningstar is just as simple. Kill it dead and kill it fast. Every minute it's still active is another minute it's still coordinating at least a lance of enemy units. If you can tell from a distance if it's a (Laser) or not, good for you, but it's still fast enough in a city to be a nuisance if you try to ignore it. The normal vehicle killers still work well, at least. LBX ACs to immobilize it, and heavy weapons to pound at a vulnerable spot until it gives in. Your best bet is to try for the rear, where it mounts less than half the armor of the front. A single close range Heavy Gauss Rifle that hits a non-(Laser) Morningstar in the rear is going to wreck the vehicle right then and there. Against the (Laser), ignore it until you know there aren't any more important Morningstars on the field, and then kill it if it's the most dangerous thing left. If it gives you a good shot, though, don't be afraid to take it. An AC/10 and a Large Laser may not be much damage, but with precision ammunition and a targeting computer, it's going to be annoyingly accurate until it's put down.

As usual Camospecs has the mini, and the MUL has additional information not covered in this write-up.

As usual, feedback is welcome.  I've added a small blip for each distinct armor layout that should make a bit more sense in terms of the game than just the fluff description, and I'm pretty sure it fits well enough with the article.  Posting this early because I'm going to be out for most of tomorrow and i don't want to miss it.
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SCC

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #1 on: 01 July 2012, 23:16:40 »
Is it even legal to under armor like the laser is?
If your going to play the variant ammo types game you something lie 3 or 4 tons
Just remember when you a peppering this thing with LB-X rounds front crit #12: crew killed, this makes the vee count as dead for purposes of calculating victory but the electronics remain active

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #2 on: 02 July 2012, 00:43:21 »
I've never used the C3 variants, but I've actually gotten a lot of utility over the years out of the Laser variant. I like to use it as a super-heavy IFV for urban combat. Just tote a squad of Grenadiers and load up on precision ammo, and a lance of those will tear apart anything that gets in their way.


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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #3 on: 02 July 2012, 03:03:32 »
I prefer the reach of a LB 10-X, over the special ammo capability of the AC/10.


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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #4 on: 02 July 2012, 03:11:11 »
Is it even legal to under armor like the laser is?

I don't believe there's any rule saying that you have to spend all the points you paid tonnage for. So, yes.

I'd have to say that the armor distribution on the Morningstar isn't actually that far off from how I might have arranged it myself. A rule of thumb I generally like to use on my own vees is basically "split armor evenly between locations with any leftover points going to the front, then scrape about half the rear armor off again and slap that onto the glacis as well"; of course, that's before then tweaking things further if that rough draft doesn't look quite good enough yet. So with 144 points to spend my starting spread might look something like 46/28/14/28...in practice perhaps a point or two less on the nose, or perhaps one off each side, in favor of making the rear at least temporarily Gauss-proof, but I wouldn't necessarily go so far as to worry overmuch about taking an AC/20 there. Can't eliminate all the risks, and having my front breached too soon because I worried too much about getting stabbed in the back instead isn't really a good tradeoff in my book, either.

...yes, most of my battle plans involving vehicles do in fact include a healthy dose of "keep nose firmly pointed at enemy at all times". Why do you ask? ;)

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #5 on: 02 July 2012, 05:21:34 »
I have had some good fun with the AC10. Thanks to all of the electronics it's one of the most accurate weapons in the game. Fight at maximum range. Don't be afraid of rounds other than guided. Eg, armor piercing at 15 hexes with targeting bonuses is fun.

Taurevanime

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #6 on: 02 July 2012, 05:38:01 »
I like the Morningstar. It's a very usefull vehicle to have for all those C3 slave equipped Davion vehicles.

I agree that I normally would favour the LB 10X over the standard AC/10. I think the standard AC is warrented on this as the vehicle should stay away from the front lines and will thusly be hunted down by fast units that tend to rely on their speed to keep them alive. I just do not think 2 tons of ammo is the right ammount. I'd much rather have a third ton and feel more comfortable.

And as much as a Davion player I am and thusly a fan of the autocannon. It is a shame that aside from the Laser variant, not one energy weapon is mounted on this vehicle, despite having a fusion engine. Which makes me wonder if this vehicle could be made cheaper by changing to a non-fusion engine (doubtfull since the XL engine saves so much weight) Heck considering the free heatsinks you might as well use them by taking out machine guns for small pulse lasers.

All in all it is a decent vehicle, and with very minor tweaks could be turned into a great one.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #7 on: 02 July 2012, 05:48:15 »
The Morningstar is the C3M vehicle par excellence. Low cost (relative to other canon solutions) and relatively easy to hide, it carries its own short range protection (in the form of those infantry / BA). This combination also allows one of my favorite company design set-ups with one of these and two SchiltronPs forming a company command team and the remaining 9x vehicles / mechs carrying TAG. That just gets brutal.

sandstorm

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #8 on: 02 July 2012, 07:55:19 »
Hmm, something occurred to me.

Vehicle lance is 2 units, so a vehicle company is what, 6 units? So exactly how would a Morningstar CC fit into a vehicle-only unit? Double Company?
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Sabelkatten

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #9 on: 02 July 2012, 08:14:53 »
Hmm, something occurred to me.

Vehicle lance is 2 units, so a vehicle company is what, 6 units? So exactly how would a Morningstar CC fit into a vehicle-only unit? Double Company?
You're thinking of vehicle points in the clan system. IS powers usually assign 4 vehicles to a lance/platoon.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #10 on: 02 July 2012, 08:35:25 »
No, sandstorm, Vehicles use the same organizational structure as 'Mechs so a lance is still 4 Vehicles (other wise you couldn't have mixed lances
That said even if they used a different one it wouldn't matter to the C3 rules

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #11 on: 02 July 2012, 09:19:48 »
The problem with the 'hang back front the fight' is that with a 15 hex max range (18 for the Company command variant) you have to lurk on the edges of a fight just to contribute.  A C3M that can't fight at all is an empty slot in the net.

My other issue is that in my experience C3 nets and a city fight rarely work well together.  There are simply too many broken site lines, particulary for vehicles, to get the full use out of the C3 net.  Particularly if your oppnent is smart.

Scotty

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #12 on: 02 July 2012, 10:12:52 »
I'm actually okay with the ammo on this thing.  Keep one ton of standard ammo and one ton for precision/armor piercing keeps a good duration of fire and lets you make the best of shots that actually need the precision bonus.

There are only two (mutually exclusive) changes I would make to the basic vehicle.  The first would be to drop the full ton of machine gun ammo to a half ton and add CASE, and that's it.  The other would be to drop half a ton of machine gun ammo and the forward mounted machine gun (let's face it, if infantry is in front of you, it's less of a problem than next to you) in exchange for another ton of AC/10 ammo.  I think I'd honestly prefer the CASE, since if you've got a command vehicle that crew is pretty valuable.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #13 on: 02 July 2012, 10:14:16 »
The problem with the 'hang back front the fight' is that with a 15 hex max range (18 for the Company command variant) you have to lurk on the edges of a fight just to contribute.  A C3M that can't fight at all is an empty slot in the net.

I don't know. The Morningstar strikes me as a plausible enough take on the same concept as my old homebrew "C3 command truck" -- whose entire point was to stay back and just coordinate. Same wheeled movement profile, two C3 masters...and a single token Streak-2 rack for self-defense on grounds that if it ever actually needed that, things had gone badly wrong anyway.

The Morningstar's bigger, a bit better armored, and using an XL engine instead of a plain old internal combustion one lets it mount rather more impressive self-defense guns...but again, it doesn't really want to be shot at. It's too expensive, too important to keeping the rest of the lance/company going, and too vulnerable to motive system hits. It's a mobile command node with some organic bodyguard transport capacity, not a tank. (Your mileage may vary with the laser variant, I suppose.)

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #14 on: 02 July 2012, 10:18:42 »
The Laser variant is a wheeled tank that loves the city.  The C3M variants should not be within 20 hexes of combat unless you're prepared to accept its relatively quick loss.  It still loves the city, but it has to be careful it doesn't stumble into something that can remove it from play.
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Ian Sharpe

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #15 on: 02 July 2012, 11:43:21 »
Not a fan.  C3 nets in the city don't work real well, as already pointed out.  Works better outside the city, in the open field.  As long as terrain isn't too heavy, its a perfectly viable C3M carrier for vees.  I wouldn't have minded seeing a true command version, like a better armed mobile HQ, in addition to the more tactically oriented city command variants. 

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #16 on: 02 July 2012, 12:02:55 »
C3 works plenty well in cities.  You don't need LOS for C3 bonuses, so you can park just a scant few hexes away and be completely safe from enemy fire while helping your friend down the avenue get a perfect shot.

That's not to say it works best in cities, but it's definitely not bad.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #17 on: 02 July 2012, 13:34:01 »
C3 works plenty well in cities.  You don't need LOS for C3 bonuses, so you can park just a scant few hexes away and be completely safe from enemy fire while helping your friend down the avenue get a perfect shot.

That's not to say it works best in cities, but it's definitely not bad.

That seems...broken. :-\

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #18 on: 02 July 2012, 13:36:32 »
Given how expensive C3 is in the first place, I don't see it as being too bad. Besides, at least one guy still needs LOS to make C3 work: The shooter.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #19 on: 02 July 2012, 14:08:23 »
That seems...broken. :-\

And I'd agree that it is -- a spotter that doesn't need LOS to the target, just for this one very-special-exception-case? What kind of bad joke is that?

Still, it's the official rule for the time being. It even had to get errataed into existence -- my own old physical copy of Total Warfare still mentions LOS between spotter and target as a requirement --, and so I don't expect it to get repealed again until, say, maybe that far-off day when BattleTech may see yet another entirely new edition. Maybe. In the meantime, yes, it definitely helps C3 networks in city fights in particular. After all, the guy on just the other side of the building an enemy unit is next to can help direct shots from everything that actually can draw a bead on it...

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #20 on: 02 July 2012, 14:20:00 »
Hmm, could one arm the Morningstar with a Thumper cannon or MechMortar(s) in the turret to make it easier to contribute fire without exposing the C3M? I don't think the Dual-master could fit it... Although the TarComp would be useless with the arty/mortars...
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #21 on: 02 July 2012, 14:22:20 »
Ayup. Just remember that the C3M would only then be helping the Morningstar's lancemates, since C3 never helps with indirect fire or artillery.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #22 on: 02 July 2012, 17:47:25 »
That seems...broken. :-\

Don't feel too bad. It has been flipped one way or the other for years. One of the more annoying exploits of it I have seen involves running a spotter up prone against the base of a fortress wall. The units in partial on the wall (or hill) can't see over the wall to the base, and stepping to the top of the wall to see over the edge is usually a bad idea.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #23 on: 02 July 2012, 20:20:57 »
And I'd agree that it is -- a spotter that doesn't need LOS to the target, just for this one very-special-exception-case? What kind of bad joke is that?

Still, it's the official rule for the time being. It even had to get errataed into existence -- my own old physical copy of Total Warfare still mentions LOS between spotter and target as a requirement --, and so I don't expect it to get repealed again until, say, maybe that far-off day when BattleTech may see yet another entirely new edition. Maybe. In the meantime, yes, it definitely helps C3 networks in city fights in particular. After all, the guy on just the other side of the building an enemy unit is next to can help direct shots from everything that actually can draw a bead on it...
I think it comes from situations like heavy enough forest to block firing, doesn't mean you can't see the target, just that you can't shoot at him well

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #24 on: 02 July 2012, 22:42:16 »
Also don't forget that the sensor suites in Battletech contain sensors that do not require Line Of Sight. And it is supposed to be those sensor readings that make a C3 network work.
If C3 needed Line of Sight it would be usefull in a lot fewer battlefields, and the equipment already costs a lot to carry without taking BV into account.

See it as another great reason to have ECM equipment on urban specialist units. O0

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #25 on: 03 July 2012, 00:27:13 »
Also don't forget that the sensor suites in Battletech contain sensors that do not require Line Of Sight. And it is supposed to be those sensor readings that make a C3 network work.
If C3 needed Line of Sight it would be usefull in a lot fewer battlefields, and the equipment already costs a lot to carry without taking BV into account.

See it as another great reason to have ECM equipment on urban specialist units. O0

Then why do I need a spotter for indirect LRM fire?  As pointed out, it wasn't this way for C3 nets until recently.  But to keep things on topic, I'd welcome a Morningstar shooting at me in a city, because chances are its not going to like the attention it receives at all.  And regardless of variant, its within range 18, which my LB-10 s like. 

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #26 on: 03 July 2012, 01:38:46 »
Also don't forget that the sensor suites in Battletech contain sensors that do not require Line Of Sight. And it is supposed to be those sensor readings that make a C3 network work.

Ironically, buildings tend to block those sensors as well... ;)

Besides, that just makes the next question "well, if I don't have LOS but do have a sensor reading, why can't I use that to spot for anything else?". Indirect LRM fire, artillery, and I'm sure a few more rules I've forgotten would dearly love to know. :D

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #27 on: 03 July 2012, 02:02:08 »
Ironically, buildings tend to block those sensors as well... ;)

Besides, that just makes the next question "well, if I don't have LOS but do have a sensor reading, why can't I use that to spot for anything else?". Indirect LRM fire, artillery, and I'm sure a few more rules I've forgotten would dearly love to know. :D
Well looking at modern indirect fire, it's inaccurate and the spotter serves the role to direct the fire onto the target. Like saying the first spotting round was off by 12 meters to the east. For indirect artillery you need to see it drop.

But then you have to remember logic does not apply to Battletech since it is a game and it needs to be balanced as a game. I mean why does precision ammo only have a bonus to hit moving targets. You'd think a stationary one can still benefit from the guided nature of the projectiles. They simply did it for game balance reasons.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #28 on: 03 July 2012, 04:35:26 »
Can you target specific locations with an AC using Precision Ammo and a Targeting Computer? If so...
then I do not think I would want to be a big, slow thing that fought its way past the Morningstar's
body guards to where the Morningstar can fire at me...
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Morningstar City Command Vehicle
« Reply #29 on: 03 July 2012, 04:42:50 »
Can you target specific locations with an AC using Precision Ammo and a Targeting Computer? If so...
then I do not think I would want to be a big, slow thing that fought its way past the Morningstar's
body guards to where the Morningstar can fire at me...

Yes, but you're really not any better off than if you were trying to make the same aimed shots with standard ammo at a suitably slower target instead. Precision ammo just reduces the target movement modifier, remember, it doesn't provide any actual to-hit bonus aside from that.

 

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