Author Topic: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath  (Read 10712 times)

Kotetsu

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’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« on: 14 December 2012, 17:38:04 »
’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath

Goliath. Something large or massive, like the huge scorpions that lent their name to a Clan. Also a giant from Gath slain by David ben Yishai. And an 80-ton quadrupedal BattleMech created by Dr. David Harrison and Brigadier Corporation.

Just one of the many in-jokes that seem to inhabit BattleTech’s history.

Built sometime after the Scorpion presented some of the problems with early quads, the Goliath was built to iron out those troubles, and ended up being a solid, effective design. Unfortunately, the bad press of the Scorpion proved to be a bit of a hurdle to overcome.

Based on a note in Technical Readout: 3039, the Goliath appears to have entered service around the year 2600, with Dr. Harrison getting up there in years. The production model, the GOL-1H, is powered by a 320-rated Brigadier 1000F fusion engine (eventually replaced on Corean’s models with the Hermes model of the same rating), which weighs two tons less than the engine powering the Scorpion. The design mounts fourteen and a half tons of armor (though the original write-up mentioned eighteen tons, maximum protection would only require sixteen and a half). The armor is distributed in a 9, 30/19, 20/13, 24 and 30 sequence (head, center, side torsos, front legs and rear legs respectively).

Armament consists of a Particle Cannon in the right torso, supported by twin 10-pack LRMs, one in each side torso. Twin machine guns provide some infantry-killing potential. One ton of machine gun ammunition is stored in the left torso, and two tons of LRM ammo are stored in the center, providing a quick exit in the case of a lucky shot. Seventeen heat sinks allow for some modicum of heat dissipation. One other note in the original write-up indicates that there was a problem if the design had one of its legs lock up or blown off. As in, it ceased to have the ability to move. (Then again, there is also a note about the PPC being placed in the turret-like head.)

Though the Star League officially passed on the design, after over a hundred years of service in the Periphery, the SLDF began to look into purchasing the design. Unfortunately, the Amaris Coup intervened. On the other hand, with the design in use on the Periphery border, it appears some of the auxiliary (House) units that joined Kerensky’s army did bring them along. Enough so, that they appear on the RAT for the Pentagon Powers (at 6). (Side note, the Scorpion also appears on those RAT tables, and the one for the Clans.)

Considered the best product that Brigadier put out, apparently when the main factory was redesigned from orbit 2837, Corean Enterprises managed to pick the design up and produce a few every year.  Defiance also appears to have had access to the plans, but wanted to wait until a more advanced version came into existence. The Goliath remained exceedingly rare, with only one Goliath on Goliath duel recorded during the Succession Wars, which Kurita lost in 2950. One of the few places where Goliaths were used en masse was with the group Cochraine’s Goliaths. That group was decimated on St. Andre by Davion Wasps and Stingers during the Fourth Succession War.

After the rediscovery of the Helm Core, Corean decided to use the Goliath chassis to experiment with the Star League’s Gauss Rifle. (Based on the original write-up, it appears that the Gauss Rifle might have had similar problems to the later Heavy Gauss in the original rules set.) To make this prototype model, designated the GOL-3M, uses the Gauss Rifle in place of the PPC, and feeds it with a ton of ammunition. An extralight engine was also installed, and an additional ton of machine gun ammo was also added. All of the explosive ammunition is placed in the left torso, which is now CASEd. An additional half-ton of armor was also installed, which ends up being one point to each front side torso and rear leg, and two points to each front leg.

Now the ammunition situation is often cited to put this as one of the worst 3050 upgrades, specifically the two tons of machine gun ammunition compared to only one ton for the Gauss Rifle. While it is an abysmal situation, the fact the design was a test bed does help. As for why it would be put into production so quickly, there is one answer that comes to mind: the Clans. More to the point, the fact that the Free Worlds League agreed to send military equipment to those powers that were fighting the invaders. While the pilots who received one might have been a little disappointed by getting a quad, or the ammunition situation, it is also possible their superiors didn’t expect them to survive longer than eight rounds against the Heirs of Kerensky.

These two variants remained the only ones known of until the aftermath of the FedCom Civil War. At that time, Vicore Industries began their Project Phoenix. While not producing all of the machines created by themselves, their backers, the Word of Blake appear to have used this group to prepare for their “Third Transfer”, probably as a good will gesture, though the Jihad certainly changed that. Four new variants of the Goliath came on-line. The GOL-2H model uses the original variant as a basis, mounts a ton less of armor, but uses ferro-fibrous, allowing for increased protection to the rear center torso and front legs. In place of the machine guns, three Rocket Launcher 10-packs were installed in each side torso. Apparently built by the Blakist’s allies on Circinus, this variant is mostly a Periphery refit.

The GOL-3S variant was built by TharHes on Tharkad. Stripping all weapons from the -3M model, save for one LRM rack, the -3S adds Artemis IV fire-control to the remaining LRM rack, then adds a Class-20 LB-X autocannon in the left torso and left rear leg, an extended medium in each front leg and the head, and an extended large laser to the center torso.  The LRM ammo and the four tons of Class-20 ammo are stored in the right torso, which is CASEd. The engine was replaced by a light model, and one ton of armor was removed, leaving the armor at 29/10, 21/7, 28 for the center torso, side torsos, and legs respectively. Ten double heat sinks cause the pilot to be selective with his fire.

The GOL-4S model is built by Defiance on Hesperus II. The differences between it and the -3S are the LRM rack does not have Artemis, two of the medium lasers are now in the right torso, and the rest of the weaponry is removed to install a Heavy Gauss Rifle fed by four tons of ammunition. The Rifle is partially CASEd in the left torso, but a Golden BB to the center will send the pilot on a rocket sled into whatever is in front of him. Three and a half tons of armor were added, which puts the armor load at 97% of maximum, and is laid out in a 37/12, 25/8, 33 pattern for the center, sides, and legs.

The final variant from Project Phoenix is the GOL-5D produced by GM of Kathil. The design mounts maximum armor, which puts the torsos at 38/12 and 26/8 for the center and sides respectively. It uses a standard engine, and mounts a Class-5 rotary autocannon in the left torso, with three tons of ammunition, three extended mediums in the right torso, and an additional medium in the head, two machine guns are in the center torso and one rear-facing in each rear leg. A half ton of machine gun ammo is stored under the Class-5 ammo in the left torso which is CASEd. A targeting computer sits in the right torso. Finally, twelve double heat sinks moderate the heat output.

At the outset of the Jihad, a Periphery refit came to light. Designated the GOL-6H, this design utilizes a light engine, and mounts a Heavy Particle Cannon, new versions of the original twin 10-pack LRMs, a B-Pod in each leg, and six light machine guns, three in each side torso tied in an array. Two tons of LRM and one half ton of light machine gun ammo are in the CASEd left torso. Twelve double heat sinks make the design almost heat neutral. Fifteen tons of armor plate protect in a 9, 30/19, 20/13, 29 ratio.

Around the early 3070’s, the Word of Blake introduced their own model, the GOL-5W. One of the most interesting designs in history, this design mounts Stealth armor and an Improved C3 system, the first (and possibly only) to do so. The armor allocation is the same as the GOL-5D. Fifteen double heat sinks allow for a bracketed firing pattern. Twin Plasma Rifles and three medium lasers are mounted in the right torso. Three tons of ammunition feed the Plasma weapons. The Guardian for the Stealth is in the center torso, and the C3 system is placed in the head, under the small cockpit. A standard engine powers the design.

Early in the Post-Jihad period, House Liao premiered their GOL-3L model, which appears to have started from salvage of WoBble Goliaths. The armor loadout is the same as the -5W, and the ECM suite has been moved to the head. A 400-rated extralight engine powers the design to speeds equivalent to the much-maligned CGR-1A1 Charger. The design mounts an ER PPC, twin 7-rack MMLs, and a medium pulse laser. A mere ten double heat sinks struggle to deal with the heat load. This is exasperated by the fact that one of the three tons of MML ammunition is stored in the center torso under the engine. The other two are CASEd in the left torso.

The final variant is the GOL-6M, which is by far the most radical of the designs. The design uses a 240-rated standard engine, though a compact gyro is used for added survivability. Armor is in the pattern of the original. Armament consists of a Gauss Rifle, twin 7-rack MMLs, a medium laser in the right front and rear-mounted in the left rear, and small variable-pulse lasers in the left front and rear-mounted in the right rear leg. Four tons of ammunition are in the right torso with one of the launchers, and that torso is CASEd. The left torso uses a turret system to allow for better fields of fire, making it the first production model to mount one. Ten double heat sinks moderate the heat somewhat.

Using one is simple. For the most part, you are a plodding beast, likely to draw fire from those who know what you carry. You are also mostly a long range beast, so try and kill your opponents before they close. Newer models are more able to deal with up-close targets (or in the case of the -5W might thrive). Only a few models have rear-facing weapons, so watch your back (and sides). Though if someone decides to land right behind you, try and kick his knee into his chest. And if you are using the turret model, punish your opponent for not realizing it. The Stealth models are also useful to keep your opponents from hitting you as easily. Do also note with the -5W, if someone does close and try to reach your sides, turning the armor off to let your buddies turn him into fragments, go ahead.

Fighting one is also simple. Keep your movement numbers up. Against the early model, and you have a bunch of light jumpers, follow the Davion example against Cochraine. Jump in close, and keep moving, pestering the Goliath until he dies. As for the rest of them, hit them until they stop moving. If you can target locations (and have a pilot who can reasonably hit those spots), choose one with ammunition in it (or in the case of the -5W the right or center torso). When facing the -6M, consider targeting the left torso, since critting the turret will stick in whatever way it is facing, and the Gauss is not CASEd. In any case, volume of fire is a good plan. And if some of that fire happens to be plasma, so much the better.

One of the longest serving and most solid quad designs, the Goliath served as a vanguard for what came later. While I have been told to take the number of figures from the Dark Age game as a basis with a grain of salt, I do have to wonder if the Goliath will continue its long tradition of service into those years.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #1 on: 14 December 2012, 21:57:28 »
For some reason I was always disappointed that this wasn't seen as a commander's mech, or given a mine deployment system. That said... I always saw it as an ideal platform for modular armor, MG-Arrays, and/or A/B/M-Pods. Drop the LRMs for a Mech Mortar/8, ammo and better support/defense weaponry and you have a nice start.

As to the Cappie design... I think they were envisioning it as a quick way to deploy mag-mounted BA?
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #2 on: 14 December 2012, 22:38:04 »
I've always like design, though i found it frustrating use in practice.   

My favorite experience with one, was when a green pilot was doing a combat drop on to the map.   Due to conditions of the game, the Goliath coming down is hit by gauss rifle and is killed.  However, due to pilot's death it improved piloting of the mech and became accident death from aboved and landed on enemy mech killing it.
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mitchberthelson

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #3 on: 14 December 2012, 22:40:59 »

After the rediscovery of the Helm Core, Corean decided to use the Goliath chassis to experiment with the Star League’s Gauss Rifle. (Based on the original write-up, it appears that the Gauss Rifle might have had similar problems to the later Heavy Gauss in the original rules set.) To make this prototype model, designated the GOL-3M, uses the Gauss Rifle in place of the PPC, and feeds it with a ton of ammunition. An extralight engine was also installed, and an additional ton of machine gun ammo was also added. All of the explosive ammunition is placed in the left torso, which is now CASEd. An additional half-ton of armor was also installed, which ends up being one point to each front side torso and rear leg, and two points to each front leg.

Now the ammunition situation is often cited to put this as one of the worst 3050 upgrades, specifically the two tons of machine gun ammunition compared to only one ton for the Gauss Rifle. While it is an abysmal situation, the fact the design was a test bed does help. As for why it would be put into production so quickly, there is one answer that comes to mind: the Clans. More to the point, the fact that the Free Worlds League agreed to send military equipment to those powers that were fighting the invaders. While the pilots who received one might have been a little disappointed by getting a quad, or the ammunition situation, it is also possible their superiors didn’t expect them to survive longer than eight rounds against the Heirs of Kerensky.

In junior high, I looked at the errata sheet that FASA had slipped into my copy of Reinforcements 2 and noticed that it reduced the Gauss ammo on the GOL-5M to 8 shots. Then, when I finally got TR: 3050 and was able to make sense of the sheets, I kinda scratched my head. I was beyond sad when I saw how the thing actually performed in-game.

Seriously, guys....400 rds of MG ammo to burn and you passed up the chance to fix things? You chose to errata the *Gauss* ammo back down to 8 instead of just manning up and publising errata for the TRO to make the design playable?

Of course, this was the same "brain trust" that gave us the Awesome-9M and Panther-10K.

So tragic....and I actually liked the Dougram-based "walking tank" look of this baby, too. :(
« Last Edit: 14 December 2012, 22:43:54 by mitchberthelson »

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #4 on: 14 December 2012, 22:52:57 »
Quads are my #1 platform for Mech Mortars for exatly one reason: It looks [deleted] cool to have a bunch of mortar tubes flinging ordnance out of the top of your 'Mech.  See Chromehounds for exactly why that looks awesome. O0
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #5 on: 14 December 2012, 23:33:35 »
the original scream turrent and always thought a subtle change in weapons would allow to add one in any era... the more modern ones don't seem to have that same tank look which is a shame.. it was nice seeing a tank with legs

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #6 on: 15 December 2012, 00:22:25 »
400 rounds of MG ammo may seem insane, but is very fitting for a mech fighting in a city unprotected... but would fit much better if the other weaponry were short-ranged. An AC-20 and a Flamer would make this an ungodly terror in city fights. The -1 to piloting rolls really helps when you run on pavement too.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #7 on: 15 December 2012, 00:45:49 »
400 rounds of MG ammo may seem insane, but is very fitting for a mech fighting in a city unprotected... but would fit much better if the other weaponry were short-ranged. An AC-20 and a Flamer would make this an ungodly terror in city fights. The -1 to piloting rolls really helps when you run on pavement too.

What would fit better would be to rip out the second ton of MG ammo for more MGs to use the already-too-much ammo it has.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #8 on: 15 December 2012, 03:34:48 »
What would fit better would be to rip out the second ton of MG ammo for more MGs to use the already-too-much ammo it has.
And make those new MGs rear-firing
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #9 on: 15 December 2012, 03:45:24 »
make one ton rubber bullets?

400 rounds is only 2000 seconds of firing, or a bit over a half-hour of constantly raining lead down in the streets... maybe it is a tad excessive  ;D
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #10 on: 15 December 2012, 15:45:02 »
I've always like design, though i found it frustrating use in practice.   


Agreed.  I loved the Unseen version of the mini, and have 3 in my collection.  In game play they usually had issues.  One mod i am surprised i never saw officialled was pushing the engine to a 400xl, and adding masc to give it a 5/8(10) charge capacity).

Quote
What would fit better would be to rip out the second ton of MG ammo for more MGs to use the already-too-much ammo it has.

Agreed. 5 MGs with half a ton of ammo gives you 20 rounds of consistent firing.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #11 on: 15 December 2012, 15:58:54 »
GOL-3M is really bad, even old GOL-1H is better than that.

But I quite like GOL-6M.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #12 on: 15 December 2012, 16:41:53 »
...
Now the ammunition situation is often cited to put this as one of the worst 3050 upgrades, specifically the two tons of machine gun ammunition compared to only one ton for the Gauss Rifle. While it is an abysmal situation, the fact the design was a test bed does help. As for why it would be put into production so quickly, there is one answer that comes to mind: the Clans. More to the point, the fact that the Free Worlds League agreed to send military equipment to those powers that were fighting the invaders. While the pilots who received one might have been a little disappointed by getting a quad, or the ammunition situation, it is also possible their superiors didn’t expect them to survive longer than eight rounds against the Heirs of Kerensky.
...

IMO many of the less than stellar designs including the GOL-3M from TRO 3050 can be plausibly explained if you assume that they are technology demonstrators that were hurriedly pressed into production during the clan invasion. What is less forgivable is that after the truce of Tukkayyid the producers didn't make the effort to correct these design flaws. It wouldn't have been so hard to create a minor upgrade to the -3M that reduced the MG ammo and added some more for the Gauss. The same goes for the 17 heat sinks which this variant simply doesn't need.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #13 on: 15 December 2012, 16:56:25 »
IMO many of the less than stellar designs including the GOL-3M from TRO 3050 can be plausibly explained if you assume that they are technology demonstrators that were hurriedly pressed into production during the clan invasion. What is less forgivable is that after the truce of Tukkayyid the producers didn't make the effort to correct these design flaws. It wouldn't have been so hard to create a minor upgrade to the -3M that reduced the MG ammo and added some more for the Gauss. The same goes for the 17 heat sinks which this variant simply doesn't need.

The sad part in the GOL-3M's case (sorry I used 5M in my earlier posts by mistake) is that even a field refit would have done it.....in pretty short order, too. If the techs maintaining them weren't idiots, it should logically have appeared as rapidly as the field refit for the 3050 Hunchback did.

Similarly, anyone with half a brain would have been pulling excess MG ammo out of the old 3025 machines, too. It's old school FASA inconsistency that makes IC military designers and technicians look like morons. Sure, designs get through military procurement processes all the time with those kinds of flaws....but operators and field technicians find fixes in an extremely short time when their bacon is on the line.

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #14 on: 15 December 2012, 17:20:38 »
The Goliath is a design that in all variants looks underwhelming or flawed to me. If I would rank all the quad mechs it would most likely end up in the last place.


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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #15 on: 15 December 2012, 19:01:45 »
With all due respect, the make up of Delta Company was more towards Jenners, Firestarters, and Valkyries.

Having said that, where's the fun in a perfect 'mech?

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #16 on: 17 December 2012, 19:41:11 »
Somehow I still want to see one in MWO   }:)

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #17 on: 18 December 2012, 15:44:40 »
The classic Goliath is actualy a pretty workable mech in a lance, or better yet a company.  Its got good range, which is what you want if you're a quad and can't fire into your side arcs, its stable, its got solid armor, and it can sink most of its heat.  If you never let an enemy in close, what's not to like?  And with thouse guns, even a biped would be in trouble if a Jenner or Javelin got up too close due to the minimums, so who cares if its a quad, so long as you don't do something silly like make a whole battalion of nothing but the things (oh, wait...)

That said, I like the upgrades that keep that theme alive as far as ranged support, and I don't like the ones that dilute that.  The 4S I do like, because the HGR/quad mix just makes so much sense, even if I tend to view the HGR as a medium ranged weapon (since the 10 point hit at long range isn't really worth much) and the Goliath is a bit too slow for that role (the Barghest is quite nice).  But if someone were to prefect the 3M, I'd like that the best, more than the 15 hex ranges on the Plasma or RAC5 for sure.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #18 on: 18 December 2012, 16:36:46 »
What of making one with paired light gause rifles..  much further range.
Or barring an XL engine taking up crits in the side torso, go with compact gyros (to free up a little space in the CT) and put on an Arrow IV?
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #19 on: 18 December 2012, 18:00:24 »
What of making one with paired light gause rifles..  much further range.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #20 on: 18 December 2012, 20:42:12 »
Quote
Quad Mangonel?  Interesting, do continue.

As you wish . . . <Poof>

Code: [Select]
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel 4
Engine: 320 17
Type: Light
Walk MP: 4
Run MP: 6
Jumping MP: 0 0
Heat Sinks: 10 (20) 0
Gyro: 4
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 256 16
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 25 38
Center Torso (R ear) 11
R/L Torso 17 25
R/L Torso (Rear) 9
R/L Front Leg 17 33
R/L Rear Leg 17 32

Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
Light Gauss Rifle (2) RT 10 24
Snub-Nose PPC LT 2 6
VSP Medium Laser CT 2 4
Ammo (Light Gauss) 32 LT 2 2

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #21 on: 18 December 2012, 21:05:24 »
visually the Goliath is.....a tank on legs. it's as much a tank on legs as a 'mech can get, you can even see where the treads would go in the unseen design. there's the turret (which it doesn't have for rules reasons), some cockpit dealie stunk between it and the body, then the main body of a tank with four tall legs. the legs themselves are interesting, since they're in the minority of quads that have entirely straight legs. this means the unseen Goliath is very tall-looking, with a silhouette much like a giraffe....well, sans neck. the weapons are fairly subdued, with the PPC being the only weapon clearly visible which lends to design to looking undergunned (which isn't far from the truth). the LRM pods are to the rear of the side torsos, and the machine guns being tiny enough that they're easily overlooked. the end result of this combination is a proud but somewhat weak looking 'mech.

the reseen looks like an entirely new animal. the legs are thicker (for once) the body less vehicular in shape, with the cockpit brought forwards and down with a dropping head like some kind of cattle and the "turret" mated flush to the flattened body. the weapons have been moved largely into the "turret" and are considerably more visible and larger in appearance, although this is something of a double edged sword......it's worth pointing out though that the front legs on the reseen Goliath have had the knee joints reversed, which is a bit strange and doesn't look like it could walk..
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Iron Mongoose

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #22 on: 18 December 2012, 23:34:09 »
What of making one with paired light gause rifles..  much further range.

Well, there is a Sirrocco for that...

Quote
Or barring an XL engine taking up crits in the side torso, go with compact gyros (to free up a little space in the CT) and put on an Arrow IV?

I wouldn't dislike that.  Though you don't really need that many arrow IV platforms, since the difrences are pretty minimized on artilery mechs.
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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #23 on: 19 December 2012, 03:59:21 »
As you wish . . . <Poof>
Designs have to stay in the Fan Designs forum, but other than that not bad.   I'd prefer a 5/8 for the extra MP, since you get no torso twists, but that's just me. Not bad otherwise, not bad at all...nice choice for the GO AWAY side.

Think you can put three LGRs on? :D
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martian

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #24 on: 19 December 2012, 04:15:03 »
What of making one with paired light gause rifles..  much further range.

There is at least half dozen of 'Mechs with twin LGRs in 60+ range, and at least three or four of those are in Assault class. I don't think another one is needed.

sandstorm

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #25 on: 19 December 2012, 04:37:44 »
Hmm, could one stick LTC on a GOL with LFE and still retain any reasonable secondaries to keep people from getting uppity?
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Jim1701

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Re: ’Mech of the Week: GOL-** Goliath
« Reply #26 on: 19 December 2012, 15:15:43 »
What of making one with paired light gause rifles..  much further range.
Or barring an XL engine taking up crits in the side torso, go with compact gyros (to free up a little space in the CT) and put on an Arrow IV?

Isn't that called the Sirocco?   ???

 

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