Evolution of the 2nd Bear Regulars

[MidfieldMarauder]

[REDACTED]

Nothing to see here.

[mdauben]

Looks like a really interesting unit, MM!  The combination of Omnis, 'Mechs, BA and vehicles looks like it would be a blast to play with or against.  I'd love to see some pics, if you have put together the required miniatures.   O0

[MidfieldMarauder]

I have all of the models from the roster in my possession. They are about 30% put together so far. I will make sure to post up pics when I get them all together.

[Atlas3060]

Wonderful write up, but moved to the Non-Canon section of the boards all the same.  :)

[MidfieldMarauder]

Huh, that's confusing. The 2nd Bear Regulars are a canon unit, and I'm trying to recreate what they might have looked like in the time period that I have chosen.

I'm just confused about why the discussion would be moved to the Non-Canon section. There is no TO&E for the unit, so I'm not breaking with a canonized roster.

Oh well, if this is where it belongs, I guess this is where it belongs.

[(SMD)MadCow]

Nova Stars with vehicles will still have 2 vehicles per point, quiaff?

[MidfieldMarauder]

Nova Stars with vehicles will still have 2 vehicles per point, quiaff?

At full strength, I believe you are correct.

[(SMD)MadCow]

At full strength, I believe you are correct.

Hmm, I think you are more then 50% under strength here. The 2nd is listed at full strength of 5 Trinaries, which means half should be 7 mech stars plus support.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Actually, you're right about the Trinaries. I should change all of the Binaries to Trinaries, at least on paper, since they all have half of a transport Star on top of the Battle Armor Star.

[(SMD)MadCow]

Actually, you're right about the Trinaries. I should change all of the Binaries to Trinaries, at least on paper, since they all have half of a transport Star on top of the Battle Armor Star.

I think your terminology is spot on with the Novas and Binaries, but you could drop 2 more mech stars in there and still be at half strenght value I think.

[MidfieldMarauder]

If I added in two more Mech Stars, I would be at 7 Mech Stars, which is around the full strength Mech complement for this type of Cluster, quiaff?

[(SMD)MadCow]

If I added in two more Mech Stars, I would be at 7 Mech Stars, which is around the full strength Mech compliment for this type of Cluster, quiaff?

Neg, you would be right at half. Full strength is listed at 5 mech trinaries, or 75 mechs, for the 2nd Regulars.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Neg, you would be right at half. Full strength is listed at 5 mech trinaries, or 75 mechs, for the 2nd Regulars.

Tau Galaxy is not a front-line galaxy, which means it does not have that many Mechs in it. FM:3085 indicated that the formations run in Tau, including the 2nd, are comprised of vehicle-based transport Novas and vehicle Binaries to support their lower Mech numbers, which is a close proximity to the "phalanx Cluster" formations described in FM: Warden Clans.

[MidfieldMarauder]

And, actually, all of this discussion has prompted me to re-think some of the organization of the Cluster. Might have an update incoming.

[(SMD)MadCow]

Tau Galaxy is not a front-line galaxy, which means it does not have that many Mechs in it. FM:3085 indicated that the formations run in Tau, including the 2nd, are comprised of vehicle-based transport Novas and vehicle Binaries to support their lower Mech numbers, which is a close proximity to the "phalanx Cluster" formations described in FM: Warden Clans.

Per FM:WC, the 2nd Bear Regulars have a strength of 5 Trinaries. Per that same publication, the typical GB second line cluster follows the typical GB front line formation:
3 Trinaries
1 Elemental support Binary
1 ASF support Binary

Therefore at half strength, you will have 7 stars, 1 elemental star and 1 ASF star.
Now, it doesnt say what units actually make up the Trinaries, but everything Ive seen points to mechs. Also, star and nova formations are used pretty interchangably while not counting the nova elementals as part of or from the support binary.
If they are using vehicle binaries at 3085, then I dont know if those are counting toward being half strength or not since the clans place a high value on mechs.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Per FM:WC, the 2nd Bear Regulars have a strength of 5 Trinaries. Per that same publication, the typical GB second line cluster follows the typical GB front line formation:
3 Trinaries
1 Elemental support Binary
1 ASF support Binary

Therefore at half strength, you will have 7 stars, 1 elemental star and 1 ASF star.
Now, it doesnt say what units actually make up the Trinaries, but everything Ive seen points to mechs. Also, star and nova formations are used pretty interchangably while not counting the nova elementals as part of or from the support binary.
If they are using vehicle binaries at 3085, then I dont know if those are counting toward being half strength or not since the clans place a high value on mechs.

If you read the unit entries, Elemental and Aerospace units are indeed counted in the overall unit composition of the individual Clusters. My point is that from the time of FM: Warden Clans, which is set just after the First Combine-Dominion War, to the time of FM: 3085, the composition of the 2nd Bear Regulars (and the whole of Tau Galaxy, for the most part) appears to have changed to more closely resemble a phalanx Cluster rather than a typical formation.

Further, the unit entry for Tau Galaxy in FM: 3145 suggests that this phalanx formation stays in effect until 3140, when the Regulars began to once again be properly outfitted with Mechs and could abandon their tanks.

[MidfieldMarauder]

OP Updated with revised roster, 7/27/14.

[mdauben]

Also, star and nova formations are used pretty interchangably while not counting the nova elementals as part of or from the support binary.
If they are using vehicle binaries at 3085, then I dont know if those are counting toward being half strength or not since the clans place a high value on mechs.

If you read the unit entries, Elemental and Aerospace units are indeed counted in the overall unit composition of the individual Clusters.

I think(?) what MadCow meant, was that if there is a Nova in one of the Trinaries, those Elementals do not come from the Elemental Support Binary.  They are in addition to those Elementals.   At full strength, the Cluster would have 50 Elementals in the Support Binary, plus however many are present as part of Novas in the Trinaries. 

My point is that from the time of FM: Warden Clans, which is set just after the First Combine-Dominion War, to the time of FM: 3085, the composition of the 2nd Bear Regulars (and the whole of Tau Galaxy, for the most part) appears to have changed to more closely resemble a phalanx Cluster rather than a typical formation.

While my knowledge of the Clans (such as it is) is focused more on the Invasion time frame, this statement does agree with what I know of the CGB organization post-invasion. 

[MidfieldMarauder]

Updated the OP with some revision and clarification to the roster.

I'm at the point now where I need to start diving in and making selections for the 2nd's vehicle and Aerospace forces. One of the most frustrating things at this juncture is that there are several units that I would like to use that don't have models yet.

[MidfieldMarauder]

I continue to fiddle with the structure of the 2nd, and I think I've really got it this time. I found that I needed to go back to the original feel of the a standard cluster's organization and throw some phalanx into the mix in order to strike the right pose. (Couldn't help the Ginyu reference there.)

I will update the OP as I get a chance, but this is a basic rundown of the finalized structure. I knew this new structure would be the final one because when I wrote it all out, I got that "This is it!" feeling.

Command Supernova (Trinary) - Command Nova (5 OmniMechs, 25 Elementals), Golem Nova (25 Golem BA, 10 Vehicles), Scout Star (5 BattleMechs)

Totem Guard Trinary - Totem Command (5 BattleMechs), Totem Assault (5 BattleMechs), Rogue Nova (25 Rogue Bear BA, 10 Vehicles)

Gamma Trinary - Gamma Command (5 BattleMechs), Gamma Assault (5 BattleMechs), Gamma Support (5 BattleMechs)

Elemental Support Supernova - Claw Command Nova (25 Elementals, 10 Vehicles), Claw Support Nova (25 Elementals, 10 Vehicles)

ASF Support Binary - Halo Command (10 ASF), Halo Striker (10 ASF)


The overall plan also includes a total cheaper remainder for units that need to be purchased, which will help to hasten the unit's completion. Also, I have decided to use the micro versions of the ASFs in order to not only cut costs but also to be able to use models the represent a wider range of available ASFs in an effort to not have to proxy the larger fighters. As long as I'm using a standard filght base, the actual size of the model doesn't matter all that much, and I know I won't care if they are tiny models. It just means you're looking at them from far away.

[MidfieldMarauder]

OP updated.

[mdauben]

A very cool TOE.  I especially like the "Totem Guard" with all those bear-themed mechs and BA in one Trinary.   O0

[MidfieldMarauder]

A very cool TOE.  I especially like the "Totem Guard" with all those bear-themed mechs and BA in one Trinary.   O0

Thanks! I just think the Bears have too many awesome totem 'Mechs to not showcase them in some way.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Small update to the roster, in the OP with explanation of changes.

[mdauben]

Small update to the roster, in the OP with explanation of changes.

I like the final list for Delta Cluster.  I think the "Huey" assault tanks are a very nice choice.  The point of Donars can also be a very effective additon, as their movement and mobility allow them to easily get behind your opponent, allowing them to shoot up the typically weaker rear armor, or forcing at least some units to turn and face them, exposing rear armor to the rest of the Nova.   O0

If you get a chance to test this TOE out on the table, be sure to share your experience with us!  I'd be very interested in reading how it performed.  I'm tossing around the idea of building a small Hells Horses cluster (as if I don't already have enough projects to work on!) that features both the "Hueys" and Donnars in the TOE. 

[MidfieldMarauder]

I am not sure when, if ever, the entire Cluster would or could ever hit the battlefield. I will, once they are at full strength, take each Trinary into a game of Alpha Strike at some point.

My problem now is that I need to figure out proxies for most of the tanks, as many of them do not even have models yet.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Beta and Gamma Trinaries reformed into better units.

[mdauben]

My problem now is that I need to figure out proxies for most of the tanks, as many of them do not even have models yet.

Are you just looking for proxies (other miniatures to stand in) or did you want to do some conversions?  Some ideas for either: 

Vidar Heavy Defense Tanks
I think the Zhukov Heavy Tank (2) [20-747] comes about the closest in general appearance for a proxy.  If you want a more accurate conversion I’d add a Zhukov Heavy Tank turret [20-747TRT] (cut guns off and add to original turret) and two Loki H LRM 15 [OP-026] in the back deck.

Axel Heavy Tank IICs
Since the description says they are based on the old Rommel tank, the obvious proxy is the Rommel / Patton Tank (2) [20-750].  If you want to covert it, I’d replace the LRM5s with Loki H LRM 15 [OP-026] and add something for a second barrel to represent the large pulse laser (maybe the laser from the Scylla Laser / Waist Sprue [20-996 H].)   

I actually think all your other vehicles are available from IWM, although some may be only direct order or achived.

[MidfieldMarauder]

Are you just looking for proxies (other miniatures to stand in) or did you want to do some conversions?  Some ideas for either: 

Vidar Heavy Defense Tanks
I think the Zhukov Heavy Tank (2) [20-747] comes about the closest in general appearance for a proxy.  If you want a more accurate conversion I’d add a Zhukov Heavy Tank turret [20-747TRT] (cut guns off and add to original turret) and two Loki H LRM 15 [OP-026] in the back deck.

Axel Heavy Tank IICs
Since the description says they are based on the old Rommel tank, the obvious proxy is the Rommel / Patton Tank (2) [20-750].  If you want to covert it, I’d replace the LRM5s with Loki H LRM 15 [OP-026] and add something for a second barrel to represent the large pulse laser (maybe the laser from the Scylla Laser / Waist Sprue [20-996 H].)   

I actually think all your other vehicles are available from IWM, although some may be only direct order or achived.

Hey, those are some great ideas! Thanks for the info.

[MidfieldMarauder]

OP updated with final evolution of structure. I almost have everything I need to complete construction.