Baron vs Naga vs Davion I

[Alan Grant]

These three warships have similar price tags. Which is the best of the 3?

I'm thinking, hands-down, it's the Davion, for speed, armor and weaponry. But I presently lack their record sheets, so all my information is second-hand and incomplete. from sources like Sarna. That's making it difficult to make an accurate, detailed comparison on my end.

[Neufeld]

Well, I am no warship expert, but this allows me to take a look and learn more.
My impression is that the Davion would be best for a destroyer role as part of a battlegroup, while the Baron would be best for independent operations. The Naga seems weakest.

[HavocTheWarDog]

The davion block I has no fighter support but twice the speed of the naga and baron, and davion block I fire power is far superior!

[Ruger]

Well, while the Davion block 1 is overall much faster than either of the others, it does have glaring issues with a couple of things:

1) The other 2 classes have between 3 and 7 times as many fighters as the Davion block 1 can carry (2 max vs. 12 (Baron) or 14 (Naga) max).

2) The Davion block 1 has glaring blind spots in its armament package. each side arc is only covered by minimal capital armaments: 4 x NL-45's on the FL/FR, 6 x NL-45's and a light NPPC on LBS/RBS and nothing on the AL and AR flanks, meaning it can only generate a max of 52 pts of capital scale damage on a broadside. Conversely, the Naga can counter with a 72 pt broadside (admittedly at a shorter range) with part of that having crit chances (White Shark launcher), but has less heat dissapation. The Baron has an even more impressive broadside of 81 pts, with no heat issues and crit chances (White Shark launchers), but again, with less range. The Davion is better able to dictate the battle, due to better thrust, but if something gets in its weak spot...

3) While the Davion-class destroyer has more SI than the Baron-class destroyer, it has less than the Naga-class destroyer. However, it does have superior armor to both of the others.

4) The Davion's fuel supply is superior to the Naga's, but inferior to the Baron's.

Basically, the way I see it (and take this with a barrell full of salt, as I haven't played out the battle), it would seem that both sides have some advantages they could exploit to win, and although the Davion would be the favorite at the betting tables, the others could take it if they were properly handled.

Ruger

[Kamov]

Seems like it come down to what sort of fighters are being carried?

[Weirdo]

For the record: The OP only asked about the WarShips, so I will assume that fighter or DropShip capacity are NOT part of the equation.

An interesting matchup. The Davion has the edge in raw firepower, speed and armor, and can out-bracket the Naga at least. On the other hand, the Baron and Naga each possess White Sharks, and so have much deeper engagement envelopes, able to fire bearings-only shots as far out as they can predict their target's movements(call it 100-150 hexes, further if your enemy is really predictable). Sure, most aero games are played on smaller maps than that, and the damage is pretty low, but the chance to score some game-changing crits before the Davion can reply is something to take full advantage of. Crit placement is another advantage of the Naga and Baron. Both SLDF ships are broadside fighters, while the Davion's firepower is concentrated in bow and aft. This means that to do real damage to them, the Davion must expose either its nose or or aft hit facings to the target, and thus exposing itself to hits on the juicy fore and aft hit location tables. It may dish out ferocious firepower, but it must kill its target quickly, or else any thresholding damage it takes can very quickly cripple it. On the other hand, the Baron and Naga will try to do most of their fighting side-on, meaning they can soak crits with tactically useless hits like cargo bays, doors, and docking collars.

Honestly, I still need to give the edge to the Davion due to those massive nose and tail guns(and in a high speed engagement, vaporizing the other ships is a very real possibility), but the margin isn't as wide as it first appears, and the Davion still has to play it smart. My advice would be to dash into gun range as quickly as possible, then try to get your target into those narrow zones where you can hit with your nose or aft guns, but incoming fire uses the side charts. For the Baron or Naga, keep up a constant barrage of missiles from the moment the game starts, then bracket for all you're worth and try to keep the range open as long as possible.

[Neufeld]

For the record: The OP only asked about the WarShips, so I will assume that fighter or DropShip capacity are NOT part of the equation.

Still, carrying capacity would need to be evaluated if you are considering which one to buy, and being able to carry its own CAP is an advantage.

Now, most discussion has been on Davion vs the rest, but what about Baron vs Naga?
The Baron seems like a better design with more endurance, better armor, better bracketing and better heat balance.
The Naga has the benefit of more fighters and better frontal firepower.
Baron is the better one.

[sillybrit]

Davion has the edge in raw firepower, speed and armor, and can out-bracket the Naga at least.

Bracketing raises another possible variable: can the Davion use Bracketing Fire Mode? I know some players interpret the sentence at the start of those rules "A skill lost during the Star League (along with the top-secret algorithms that made it practical to employ)... " to mean that bracket fire was a SLDF navy, and perhaps HAF navy (which seems to have still existed during the Star League according to the Naga fluff), ability not known to the other states, all part of the Hegemony and League's longstanding technological edge.

If that interpretation is used,  and the Baron is determined to be in the SLDF or HAF fleets instead of one of those transfered to the member states, then it gives the Baron and Naga an advantage at longer ranges and increases their ability to cope with poor electronic warfare rolls.

That said, even if the Davion is denied the ability to bracket, given its thrust advantage any edge the Baron and Naga possess at longer ranges isn't going to last, although it should be noted that to close the range the Davion will need to point its bow towards the enemy, presenting the possibility of a nice juicy nose crit if it does so while in range.

Overall, I think the Davion will win more encounters than it'll lose, but I can see some useful possibilities for the other two. With either the Baron or Naga, I'd attempt to keep the Davion in my broadside/aft quarter overlap, allowing me to attack with two decent arcs aided by the capital missiles using Preprogrammed Waypoint Launches, plus it'll give me a heading partially away from the Davion, helping to keep the range open for a little longer. The Naga does have heat issues, but it's not difficult to work out the maximum damage possible for the arcs fired, and in the broadside/aft quarter you can still be throwing 56 point salvos plus the missiles. Barring poor control of the Davion or lucky crits though, I don't hold out much hope, particularly if the Davion snapshots its nose around for a killing blow - those pair of 50 point NAC bays backed by one and probably two 18 point NL bays can potentially shred the Terran designs in one salvo, either outright destroying them or crippling them.

For a Naga vs Baron fight,  I'd favor the former if the above SLDF/HAF-only interpretation of bracketing is being used and the Baron is a transfer, but if both are equal on the bracketing rules, then it becomes more of a toss up. The Naga has the potential of achieving more threshhold crits due to its larger number of bays, and also could achieve more crits once the Baron's armor is down, plus its strong SI enables it to survive longer thus giving it more time to hurt its foe. The Baron has superior bracketing capability and while it will likely get fewer threshhold crits, it'll be hitting SI sooner, with that big broadside NL bay in particular guaranteed to be chewing through the Naga's SI with every hit. Overall, with equal bracketing availability, I'd still give the nod to the Naga, but it's marginal and it'd be a fight that could change with a single dice roll, plus I doubt there will be much Naga left to savor its victory.

With fighters involved, the questions are what fighters and how many does the Baron get? Give a SLDF ship in this matchup a squadron of Hellcat IIs and the electronic warfare battle suddenly becomes very one-sided against non-SLDF, which can have a big effect on the long range fight, especially if using the SLDF/HAF-only bracketing interpretation.

[Alan Grant]

Tack-on to the original question

How about anti-fighter defenses? How do the 3 fare (each individually, separately) against a determined ASF assault?

[Weirdo]

Using onboard guns only? From highest to lowest, I'd go Baron->Davion->Naga. The Naga has very few really bracketable bays(though it does have those missiles), no NLs, and no small guns. The Davion has some decent NL bays and some light defenses with small guns. The Baron has the missiles, and large NL bays that'll almost guarantee a fighter kill every turn, either through use of bracketing, or AA mode.

Bracketing raises another possible variable: can the Davion use Bracketing Fire Mode? I know some players interpret the sentence at the start of those rules "A skill lost during the Star League (along with the top-secret algorithms that made it practical to employ)... " to mean that bracket fire was a SLDF navy, and perhaps HAF navy (which seems to have still existed during the Star League according to the Naga fluff), ability not known to the other states, all part of the Hegemony and League's longstanding technological edge.

Perhaps, but don't forget that the SLDF used some Davions(refitted into Whirlwinds). Bracketing is more of a doctrinal thing, not something built into the ship. Sure, I don't think it's as easy as loading the algorithms into the FCS via a flash drive, but if your faction can bracket and comes into possession of a ship from a non-bracketing nation, I think they'll make that ship bracket-capable as part of standard procedure before putting the ship into regular service. As a result, I always assume bracketing when judging a ship, on the possibility that it'll be used by a bracket-capable nation.