Bienvenidos al Imperio del Escorpión

[Drewbacca]

I thought the council of six knew the rue story too. What would the Scorpions tell anyone.

And I am having a hard time finding it in WoR, which Kindraa remnants did we pick up?

[Archangel]

Rood was only able to gather what little remained of Beta Galaxy.  The rest of his task force was either destroyed or captured by either the Falcons or the Horses.  There is no indication that he attempted to summon any additional forces to the Dark Nebula.

The Ice Hellions that gathered at the Camelot Command to regroup were all that remained of his task force, the rest having been either destroyed or captured by the Falcons/Horses. Two battered clusters of Beta Galaxy and three WarShips with little hope of receiving fresh supplies or reinforcements.  There is nothing to indicate he summoned any additional forces to the Dark Nebula.  Their regrouping at the Dark Nebula facility had less to do with Clees declaring the Hellions dezgra and more to do with the simple fact that the combined Falcon-Horse Counter-/offensive were pushing the Hellions back.  It is doubtful that the Hellions cared about Clees' declaration as it merely provided the Falcon commanders justification in using dezgra tactics of their own - many of which some commanders had already been using.

[Archangel]

The other big fear for the Homies is that the Imperio is the only Clan that knows the full story behind the Wars of Reaving and is capable of telling it to anybody they meet for the right price. All the other Clans are bound to silence or exiled before 3068. Just one ComStar JumpShip stoked the fears of the Clans to IS discovery and launched the invasion. If the Imperio reveals anything to the IS, then the Homies will lose the element of surprise.

It is doubtful the HW Clans would care one way or the other.  The next time they enter the Inner Sphere it will be to conquer and destroy not sit down and negotiate.  The only ones that might be concerned with the Imperio revealing the truth would the the IS Clans.  After all there are reasons why they are so hostile when Spheroids start asking questions about the taboo subject of what happened during the Wars of Reaving.

[Colt Ward]

Nope, check the fiction . . . he had survivors from Delta off Steelton and where they retreated to IIRC.  He also had survivors from Alpha, the Star Captain Vandal Hildenrath who was given command of her cluster that Montrose came from but never promoted.  Stripped down to a trinary or so and sent off to Derf which she lost in a duel and retreated.  Third Hector Cavaliers escaped the Horses cutting off the retreat by taking periphery worlds.  After Clees made the announcement (29 Oct 3071/IceS2 Ch3) Rood started gathering what of his forces remained, taking reports from units like Third Hector Cavaliers.  Once Hildenrath reached Rood he sent out orders to gather what would at Caemlot to survive and sent Cage to take the Potemkin (28 Jan 3072).  Bits of galaxies other than Alpha and Zeta arrived at Camelot Command along with survivors/escapees of the garrison units he had left on worlds joined up awaiting the Potemkin- two clusters with more needing repairs to be operational.  Even before the Clees offered Hegira he sought to escape the OZ.  He left with a bit over three clusters of ground troops, hardly any Aero forces IMO due to them being spent to kill Falcons & Horse DS.

[Archangel]

Much of which clashes with WoR (p85) which clearly stated that Rood's forces at Camelot Command consisted of the last two clusters of Beta Galaxy which in turn is supported by Jihad Secrets (p30) which states that Rood fled with less than three clusters of Beta Galaxy.

[Colt Ward]

Have to read the portions . . . I will admit I am not sure what galaxy the 3rd Hector Cavaliers is from, but yes in the story those two clusters were designated under Beta so technically yes.  The two ad hoc clusters were commanded by the Falcon abatkha Star Colonel Idris in his Marauder IIC and Star Colonel Vandal Hildenrath in the salvaged Nova.  But her cluster also had the roughly two stars of troops she had brought from Derf.  Which garrison survivors/escapees were from what galaxy is never mentioned so since they had been his AO, they might have fallen under Beta's administration.  IMO it also explains the re-organization, he commands Beta which got gutted- without looking back at the story they learned of I think four clusters which had fallen in the defense.  Some were absorbed, others wiped out with no survivors.  Add to that the Lithe Kill's death when he had two clusters with him . . . the galaxies assigned to his area were gone with only bits left over as described.  It makes sense to place them all under his command which just happens to be Beta . . . and he had more warriors than operational gear by some of the comments.

As he faces the Falcons & Horses on Camelot he had the two operational ad hoc clusters made up of the survivors of
-his two clusters when Clees declared him dezgra
-garrison units that had rejoined him
-Hildenrath's trinary

Rood also said if they had another week they could have a further trinary available- more if he had the time and two dropships worth of parts.  The Delta survivors which told him Montrose was dead was roughly two trinaries of troops.

I think it meshes, its just not all of those 'clusters' were originally Beta Galaxy members- or even Hellions!- when the invasion was started.  Besides would the Sharks really know all the codex information from the survivors who avoided contact then ran off with the Scorpions?

[Archangel]

Regardless, while it may be fascinating, this tangent of yours doesn't change the fact that it is largely irrelevant to the discussion.  It tells us very little about Rood as he was operating under extraordinary (read desperate) circumstances at the time unlike prior to the Scorpions' being abjured when they were the second-largest Clan in the Homeworlds.  Their failure to exploit their power and influence merely reinforces the impression that they weren't feeling any pressure to rapidly rebuild their battered touman meaning there was little need to push for a large increase of ProtoMech production.  At the time they probably felt they had plenty of time to rebuild.

[Colt Ward]

Lol . . . I honestly do not think we are disagreeing much . . . not saying they were doing a huge rush to produce them that it would make sense for them to be a natural place in the tech/factory growth before mechs.

[ArkRoyalRavager]

I thought the council of six knew the rue story too. What would the Scorpions tell anyone.

And I am having a hard time finding it in WoR, which Kindraa remnants did we pick up?

Yeah, but the Council of Six was bound to silence. Everybody else were clamoring to know about the Wars of Reaving, so the Imperio can use this as a bargaining chip.

The Scorpions picked up what remained of Mattila-Carrol at Glory, and another group of Mandrills at Dagda. The second group was a very mixed bunch, since the enclave had people from every Kindraa except for Mattila-Carrol. That means the Scorps had Mandrills from every Kindraa.

So we can say that the Scorps actually absorbed two Clans during the WoR, the Hellions and Mandrills  O:-)

[Drewbacca]

Actually I have been working under that assumption since I read WoR. We picked up two clans.

[Drewbacca]

I think we are all going to be surprised to find the green ghosts are really Scorpions.


And where are the GoliathIICs and ScorpionIICs.

[snewsom2997]

I think we are all going to be surprised to find the green ghosts are really Scorpions.


And where are the GoliathIICs and ScorpionIICs.

The have the Fire Scorpion, that is a pretty solid ride.

[Colt Ward]

Besides . . . as someone said, I would love to finally see a Black Knight IIC and it WOULD be a Scorpion style mech- lots of beams!

Sort of like the Proto . . . do you think we will see the military philosophy of the Imperio change from the basic Clan model the Scorpions brought to something closer to Horse doctrine or the Dominion?

[ArkRoyalRavager]

Actually I have been working under that assumption since I read WoR. We picked up two clans.

O0 O0 O0

I think we are all going to be surprised to find the green ghosts are really Scorpions.

And where are the GoliathIICs and ScorpionIICs.

I do think the Scorpions are one of the Green Ghost suspects, since Seeker Clusters would need a cover to operate near the Inner Sphere, but the Scorps could also be behind the Knights of St. Cameron.

Goliath IICs and Scorpion IICs are possible as refits on the Castilian/Umayyad L1-tech Mechs.

The have the Fire Scorpion, that is a pretty solid ride.

The Hellions would clamor for faster rides, which makes the Scorpion a good compromise.

Besides . . . as someone said, I would love to finally see a Black Knight IIC and it WOULD be a Scorpion style mech- lots of beams!

Sort of like the Proto . . . do you think we will see the military philosophy of the Imperio change from the basic Clan model the Scorpions brought to something closer to Horse doctrine or the Dominion?

YES! Black Knight IICs for the Imperio! It's one of the easier Mechs to upgrade to Clan standards. Simplest would be Clantech all the weapons, delete the probe and get a TC inside. Now we have a Scorp/Castilian totem, solid with easy logistics chains.

I am not surprised if the Imperio adopts Protos fully...although they never emphasize the Scorps Touman as like the Horses, the Scorps are always noted as embracing SLDF doctrines(as much as a Clan can) and the ones who trained the original badass Dragoons. Now think about that. The Dragoons were notable users of combined-arms and were trained using SLDF manuals and techniques supplied by the Scorps.

Won't be surprised if the Imperio fully integrates combined-arms to compensate for loss of Mech production.

[Drewbacca]

I am not surprised if the Imperio adopts Protos fully...although they never emphasize the Scorps Touman as like the Horses, the Scorps are always noted as embracing SLDF doctrines(as much as a Clan can) and the ones who trained the original badass Dragoons. Now think about that. The Dragoons were notable users of combined-arms and were trained using SLDF manuals and techniques supplied by the Scorps.

Won't be surprised if the Imperio fully integrates combined-arms to compensate for loss of Mech production.

And that right there is the key point. They were pretty heavy combined arms to begin with, though aerospace was largely ground support and vehicles were mostly garrison and solahma, but each cluster type was a mix of infantry and mech or aero or both. They had clusters which consisted of using heavy aeros to airdrop elementals for goodness sake. Now with production limited, protos and UPMs would fill in where the mechs are lacking and for less investment. The same high end tech needed for mechs is needed for protos and TRO: 3060 says protos were created to deal with resource shortcomings. Whether you build mechs or protos, the tech needs are the same, the difference is in the amount of materials.

We may even see "primitive" protos.

Why? Well, one of the roles protomechs excel at is defensive operations. The Scorpions were named so for their ability to take an objective and HOLD THAT BLESSED THING FOREVER!!! as it were. There biggest threat is being invaded while they are still cementing their hold. So, you build new protos because. especially with UPMs you do not need a specially bred pilot like you do for battle armor and you still get a resources savings over mechs.

[ArkRoyalRavager]

UPMs can not only stand in for Mechs, they can supplement aerofighters quite well. The Scorpions should know, since they lost a whole WarShip to Aerial UPMs and aerofighters at Huntress. That's first-hand experience.

A touman of UPMs will enhance the durability of the Imperio in case of a full-scale Homie invasion. The little buggers have less resource needs and more importantly are much smaller than Mechs, making them easier to conduct guerrilla warfare and fade back into the wilderness. They can also go to/fight in places no vehicle can, and are to a battlesuit what a battlesuit is to an infantryman.

The Imperio created a garrison sub-caste for the natives to fight in. If they don't trust the natives fully with high-end tech, they can organize the natives in clusters of conventional units(clantech infantry,tanks and conventional fighters) that defend local areas and act as terrain guides. While the warrior caste/Touman have the Mechs, battlesuits, ASFs, UPMs, DropShips and JumpShips and act as the rapid-reaction force for plugging holes.

This organizational model will be useful until the different peoples are truly bonded and integrated. Then we can have units that are only loyal to the state rather than to an ethnicity.

[Drewbacca]

Boy info in this thread is as sparse as info on the Imperio.

[ArkRoyalRavager]

The best quote: No News Is Good News

[Colt Ward]

Well, 3145 has not given us much information about most of what is going on in the periphery or deep periphery.  Its more about Davion taking it from both sides, the Falcons ripping the Lyrans, Crusader Wolves hitting the Republic, League and then Lyrans . . . and wtf is going on in the Fortress?!

[jklantern]

Boy info in this thread is as sparse as info on the Imperio.

I could always start manufacturing information.

El Imperio's primary battlemech production is devoted to Warhawks and Ebon Jaguars (which they have renamed El Senor Vorpal Kickass-o and The Equalizer, respectively.)  They went and destroyed the Coyotes (surprisingly, the Clan Council gave them their blessing for this).  Their primary allies are the Sea Foxes, and they have eighty seven galaxies of troops.  In a strange turn of events, instead of having a Khan and SaKhan, the leaders of El Imperio are now referred to as "El Cid."  They are producing warships for the Sharkfoxes (although I have no idea what kind because I know bugger all about warships).  In order to please the Hellion members of the group, they have recently started making Phantoms and Fire Moths, and in order to please the Mandrill members, they've started EXCLUSIVELY producing the Salamander Battle Armor.

Ben Rome, are you taking notes?   :P

[rebs]

Please, please, don't forget about the bloody war with the Escoches of New St. Andrews-o   ;D

[ArkRoyalRavager]

In order to further integrate with the Castilians and let the Umayyads turn a new leaf, the Imperio adopts Roman Catholic Christianity as its new official religion. The Imperio now has a unifying element, and another reason to reclaim Terra. Now deeply offended by the selfish Fortress, the Imperio joins the Wolf Empire in a crusade to liberate Terra so that they can continue to make a pilgrimage to the Vatican and the Holy Lands, in addition to the standard reasons for any Clan to return to Holy Terra  :D

What would be more dangerous than a high-tech Spartan warrior? A high-tech Spartan warrior of the faith!

[jklantern]

In order to further integrate with the Castilians and let the Umayyads turn a new leaf, the Imperio adopts Roman Catholic Christianity as its new official religion. The Imperio now has a unifying element, and another reason to reclaim Terra. Now deeply offended by the selfish Fortress, the Imperio joins the Wolf Empire in a crusade to liberate Terra so that they can continue to make a pilgrimage to the Vatican and the Holy Lands, in addition to the standard reasons for any Clan to return to Holy Terra  :D

What would be more dangerous than a high-tech Spartan warrior? A high-tech Spartan warrior of the faith!

El Imperio has decided to take up the Crusader Cause.  No, not that one.   :D

[rebs]

El Imperio has decided to take up the Crusader Cause.  No, not that one.   :D

Pronounced by none other than the 13th El Cid Pepe Elam.  He leads the Hospitalers Galaxy; they fill many of them and staff the nicest MASH units human occupied space.

The Escorpions had it in them to become ilClan all along.  Who knew?  ;)

[jklantern]

Pronounced by none other than the 13th El Cid Pepe Elam.  He leads the Hospitalers Galaxy; they fill many of them and staff the nicest MASH units human occupied space.

The Escorpions had it in them to become ilClan all along.  Who knew?  ;)

All of this would not be possible without Pepe Elam's second, Cadfael Ben-Shimon, commanding from the bridge of the IES Maria Madre de Dios.

[ArkRoyalRavager]

The Imperio Armada Escorpion is reorganized into separate Crusade Fleets, each led by a McKenna Prime-Class flagship, reverse-engineered from the Lei Kung and improved by Imperio engineers and constructed at the Scorpion Fleet Shipyards at Aragon. The lead ship of the class being...the Santisima Trinidad

How many shoutouts can you fit into the Imperio ;D

[Drewbacca]

I could always start manufacturing information.

El Imperio's primary battlemech production is devoted to Warhawks and Ebon Jaguars (which they have renamed El Senor Vorpal Kickass-o and The Equalizer, respectively.)  They went and destroyed the Coyotes (surprisingly, the Clan Council gave them their blessing for this).  Their primary allies are the Sea Foxes, and they have eighty seven galaxies of troops.  In a strange turn of events, instead of having a Khan and SaKhan, the leaders of El Imperio are now referred to as "El Cid."  They are producing warships for the Sharkfoxes (although I have no idea what kind because I know bugger all about warships).  In order to please the Hellion members of the group, they have recently started making Phantoms and Fire Moths, and in order to please the Mandrill members, they've started EXCLUSIVELY producing the Salamander Battle Armor.

Ben Rome, are you taking notes?   :P

Bugger all?

[Drewbacca]

Please, please, don't forget about the bloody war with the Escoches of New St. Andrews-o   ;D

I thought we voted no on that.

[Drewbacca]

In order to further integrate with the Castilians and let the Umayyads turn a new leaf, the Imperio adopts Roman Catholic Christianity as its new official religion. The Imperio now has a unifying element, and another reason to reclaim Terra. Now deeply offended by the selfish Fortress, the Imperio joins the Wolf Empire in a crusade to liberate Terra so that they can continue to make a pilgrimage to the Vatican and the Holy Lands, in addition to the standard reasons for any Clan to return to Holy Terra  :D

What would be more dangerous than a high-tech Spartan warrior? A high-tech Spartan warrior of the faith!

No one expects the Imperio Imposition!

[Drewbacca]

The Imperio Armada Escorpion is reorganized into separate Crusade Fleets, each led by a McKenna Prime-Class flagship, reverse-engineered from the Lei Kung and improved by Imperio engineers and constructed at the Scorpion Fleet Shipyards at Aragon. The lead ship of the class being...the Santisima Trinidad

How many shoutouts can you fit into the Imperio ;D

Of note is the Potemkin-class Isabella carrying an entire galaxy of Minotaur protomechs, The Matador Galaxy also known as the Ferdinands.