Unit Role Classification Question (Answered)

[Hayden.]

I am buidling a light 'mech force for the late succession wars using the lists in CM: Kurita (pg. 117-119).  Trying to build a command lance, but I hit a snag in what's available:

Per pg. 153 of the AS Companion, 50% of the command lance has to be sniper, missile boat, skirmisher, or juggernaut.  Additionally one unit must be a brawler, striker or scout. 

The problem I run into here is that there are no DCMS light 'mechs with the sniper, missile boat, skirmisher or juggernaut role in the late succession wars era (per the list on pg. 117-119 of CM: Kurita.

My question is if a unit meets the description for another role (per pg. 134-137 of the AS Companion) could I use it in that role to meet the lance requirements?  I.E. a PNT-9R Panther is described as a Brawler on its card, but meets the description/qualification for the sniper role (per pg. 136 of the AS Companion). Could the PNT-9R then meet the sniper qualification for the command lance?

Thanks!

[Son of Kerenski]

What are the other 3 units in the Command lance?

The Panther qualifies as a Brawler which you need. You can't get 2 of the other types out of what else you have?

[Moonsword]

Based on the MUL, you can't do that using just DCMS lights in the Late Succession Wars.

[nckestrel]

Use an Order Lance, take Tactical Genius from the options for Order Lance?

As for your actual question, without house rules, no you can't change canon unit role assignment. Most every unit could qualify for multiple roles.  If you're going to go that route (changing canon roles, as necessary and even with meeting the other role 'qualifications' to meet requirements), it's simpler to just ignore the role requirements.

[Jones]

If you want to stick with rules as written, you can also use Faction Points to select units off the Allied (Liao/Marik) or Enemy (Davion/Steiner) lists. There's bound to be a light unit somewhere on those lists that would work. Like a VLK-QA, captured in honorable combat?

[Weirdo]

Don't forget the Ideal Role rule. In most formations, that rule allows you to ignore all of the other requirements if every unit matches the Ideal unit role listed for that lance type. Because Command Lances need to be multipurpose formations, their ideal role is as such: As long as the units in your command lance fill at least three different roles, you can call it a command lance. So a lance with a Scout, Skirmisher, and Striker can be a Command Lance, with the fourth unit being anything you want.

[Scotty]

That was subject to errata.  The ideal role for a Command Lance is "None".

[GoldBishop]

From experience, most Size 1 units are Scouts, Strikers, and Ambushers... so if you want to make a Light Command Lance, would you consider picking up a single Medium element?  (your own research will net you far more for yourself than I can guess, but here's a brief list from a quick glance for an example):

Juggernaut - Centurion, Hunchback
Sniper - Clint, BlackJack, Griffin, Shadow Hawk
Missile Boat - Whitworth, Dervish, Trebuchet
Skirmisher - pretty much everything above and then some

Some of these actually overlap roles based on the variant, and most I glanced at appeared to be "InnerSphere General" which should give you the flexibility to be considered a DCMS formation, but thats up to you and your end.

A single Medium with 3 Light units should still be considered a Light Lance, and therefore still meet your criteria (Light, Command)

[nckestrel]

Good point, I had forgotten that the ideal role for Command Lance was different that it's normal requirements. (Ack, and then Scotty points out the hindsight obvious errata).
There are no light skirmishers though.  There are Strikers and Scouts.   The only light SW Missile Boat is the Valkyrie. Only Ambusher is Urbanmech.
The lack of light Sniper is surprising. The Panther was a Sniper (Box Set specifically calls it one).  I don't recall why it changed.  But then, Panther is the only Brawler light 'mech in the SW too.

So maybe one salvaged Davion Valkyrie and a medium Skirmisher (Phoenix Hawk?).
Or use an Order Lance of all Panthers or all Jenners.
Or house rule and use what you would like.

[Hayden.]

My sincere thanks for all the responses.  This more than adequately answers my question.

Build-wise, I'll probably end up doing a (captured) Valkyrie and some kind of medium (something to fill the other part of that 50% sniper/missile boat/skirmisher/juggernaut requirement), a Panther (Brawler role, and I love panthers) and probably a Jenner or Commando to round out the lance.

One final follow-up question: For the 50% sniper/missile boat/skirmisher/juggernaut role requirement, can the 50% be any combination of these four, or do they have to have the same role?

[Scotty]

Any combination of those roles.  The same is true for any other formation that requires a certain number of multiple different possible roles.

[Hayden.]

Any combination of those roles.  The same is true for any other formation that requires a certain number of multiple different possible roles.

Makes sense, thanks a lot!  Consider this thread answered.

[worktroll]

The "Inner Sphere General" list is pretty much my "get out of jail free" card for putting existing minis into new formations. There are some relatively rare exceptions in the late SW period, and many more as you get past 3050, but it's mainly a case of "Weellll, I can get the MAD-3R. Would have liked the MAD-3M, but ..."

[Hayden.]

The "Inner Sphere General" list is pretty much my "get out of jail free" card for putting existing minis into new formations. There are some relatively rare exceptions in the late SW period, and many more as you get past 3050, but it's mainly a case of "Weellll, I can get the MAD-3R. Would have liked the MAD-3M, but ..."

I always try to keep the IS general list in mind, I appreciate the thought!