Commando Mk.I, Prototype Battle Armor

[Black_Knyght]

I've been toying around with a type of light battle armor to use for an anti-mech headhunter unit, and this is the first prototype I "think" I like.

I'm looking for friendly advice and suggestions to improve this as needed, within the constraints of the FedCom Civil War era and it's intended role as a headhunter/commando-type battle armor suit.

The base concept here is pretty simple - It mounts a Support PPC on an over-the-shoulder mount, similar to the old Shadow Hawk's AC-5, and has a heavy caliber submachinegun in an A-P mount on the right arm. It has a Battle Claw on the left arm, for ripping open cockpits, and a Basic Manipulator on the right arm for handling stuff. It has limited stealth capabilities and can jump, but isn't terribly quick.

I considered a Plasma Rifle in place of the Support PPC, but chose the latter for range and my lack of familiarity of the former.


Commando Mk.I, Prototype Battle Armor

Code: [Select]

Commando Mk.I, Prototype Battle Armor
IS Light Battle Armor (3065)

BV: 209
Cost: 2,406,750 C-bills

Movement: 1/1/2

Internal: 6
Armor: 24
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Trooper 1                   1        6
Trooper 2                   1        6
Trooper 3                   1        6
Trooper 4                   1        6
Trooper 5                   1        0
Trooper 6                   1        0

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Support PPC (Body)             Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0

Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
A-P Weapon Mount (Right arm)   Squad
Basic Manipulator (Right arm)  Squad
Battle Claw (Left arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Left arm)  Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Body)      Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Right arm) Squad

[Cryhavok101]

Interesting concept. I've been thinking about doing something for the same purpose. I am not entirely sure where I would take it.

The concerns I would have with it are it's speed, and armament. If it is going in with anything that can transport it, it's speed is less of a concern. I do wonder how you envision this attacking a mech, since that is it's stated purpose? Leg, Swarm, or weapon attack?

If you have the slots for it you might be able to switch the support PPC for a magshot gauss rifle instead, and it would save you some weight, which you could use for another weapon. Alternatively, if leg/swarm attacks are your thing, you could use the weight saved by the magshot to upgrade your manipulators to one that gives you advantages in those actions.

[Black_Knyght]

My initial idea was to have it jump onto a mech and attack the head, though now I'm not sure how realistic that idea is. I was think it could jump up in teams, tear open a cockpit and fire inside, using weapons to cause extra damage too.

Here's a Mk.II prototype, with increased speed, two battle claws, and a Magshot in place of the Support PPC

Code: [Select]

Commando Mk.II, Prototype Battle Armor
IS Light Battle Armor (3065)

BV: 320
Cost: 2,865,750 C-bills

Movement: 2/2/3

Internal: 6
Armor: 36
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Trooper 1                   1        6
Trooper 2                   1        6
Trooper 3                   1        6
Trooper 4                   1        6
Trooper 5                   1        6
Trooper 6                   1        6

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Magshot (Body)                 Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0

Swarm Mek                      Squad     0
Attack Swarmed Mek             Squad     0
Stop Swarm Attack              Squad     0
Leg Attack                     Squad     0

Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
A-P Weapon Mount (Right arm)   Squad
Battle Claw (Left arm)         Squad
Battle Claw (Right arm)        Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Body)      Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Right arm) Squad
BA Stealth (Basic) (Left arm)  Squad

[worktroll]

That's pretty much optimised for a light combat BA. Magshot is THE optimised weapon. However, it's FedCom, and FedCom are using 4-trooper squads. Marians use 5, Blake/Comstar 6, everyone else including Mercs uses 4.

The ground speed of 2 really doesn't add much flexibility outside cities. If so, consider dropping the armour to 5 (a magic number), in the hope of increasing the ground speed to 3. Or drop the ground speed to up the jump to 4.

(5 armour is a magic number for light IS BA - you can survive a ML/ERML strike, an AC-5 strike, or a LRM damage cluster. These are more common than short-ranged MPLs, and 6 armour won't save you from AC-10s, LLs, PPCs, or other ills BA are heir to.)

And it's a pretty basic thing, training all revolves around standardised squads. You can't take 6 people from 4-person squads & get good results without training extensively, breaking old habits. So unless your unit is ex-ComStar/Blake, you may want to drop the squad size.

I'd look at trying Camo Suit instead of basic stealth possibly, or levering in some ECM if you have spare kilos.

W.

[Black_Knyght]

Damn, damn, damn...


No matter how I do it, to get some combination of what you suggest I either end up overweight or too short on slots. I still just don't fully grasp the intricacies of creating Battle Armor.


Grrrrr.......

[Black_Knyght]

So far, THIS is the best I can work out.

Number of troops has been reduced to 4 per team, with overall speed and jump improved and armor reduced to 5 points.

I just couldn't get either a Camo System or 1-hex ECM system to work, despite my best efforts.


Commando Mk.III, Prototype Battle Armor

Code: [Select]

Commando Mk.III, Prototype Battle Armor
IS Light Battle Armor (3065)

BV: 200
Cost: 2,022,500 C-bills

Movement: 3/3/3

Internal: 4
Armor: 20
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Trooper 1                   1        5
Trooper 2                   1        5
Trooper 3                   1        5
Trooper 4                   1        5

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Magshot (Body)                 Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0

Swarm Mek                      Squad     0
Attack Swarmed Mek             Squad     0
Stop Swarm Attack              Squad     0
Leg Attack                     Squad     0


Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
A-P Weapon Mount (Right arm)   Squad
Battle Claw (Right arm)        Squad
Battle Claw (Left arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Right arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Body)              Squad
BA Stealth (Left arm)          Squad
BA Stealth (Left arm)          Squad

[Cryhavok101]

It is hard to fit the camo system or ECM on a light battle armor with stealth and a magshot. Spaces are definitely at a premium.

If your intention is to jump onto a mech and tear it's cockpit open, there is some further tweaking you can do. The ground movement is unnecessary, and you can drop it entirely. When you have as much jump MP as you do, the only place ground MP gives you an advantage is in moving around inside buildings. You could use the extra weigt you save to put on even better manipulators. Basically you have a choice between magnets and vibroclaws. One gives you a bonus on the die rolls involved, the other makes you do more damage. Alternatively, you could upgrade to heavy battle claws (I don't think there is a restriction on light battle armor having them, off the top of my head), or if dropping ground MP gives you enough weight, you could do both heavy battle claws and a choice of upgrades.

Of course keeping the ground MP is a valid choice too, especially if you intend to use this in city fighting.

[Black_Knyght]

The basic idea I was shooting for is a lightweight "ambusher" type battle armor that could surprise attack mechs and act as headhunters. Given my inexperience with designing BA i assumed a light suit would be the optimal choice for an ambusher, but now I'm wondering if a medium would be better or more practical?

What is an Elemental considered? I kind of wanted something lighter than that.

[Cryhavok101]

The elemental is medium. Medium is the largest you can get and still be able to do swarm attacks (which is the rules you would be using for what you describe). If you search around, there are some convincing arguments that Light battle armor don't actually bring much to the table on a design that wouldn't be better served by going either PA(L) or Medium. I wouldn't articulate them very well, even though I understand them, but sufice to say, you could probably have an even more optimized suit if you went medium. Get too optimized and it gets boring though.

If you want to see what something very well suited for Swarm Attacks, check out the LMG version of the Salamander battle armor. It's use is described in the BA of the week article for the salamander, if you want a description of how it works from someone more articulate than I am.

[Black_Knyght]

Okay, tried a few new things

Overall weight was increased to medium-class, speed reduced back to 1pt but jump remains 3pts, Stealth armor is retained and a 1-hex ECM system is added. Armor is increased to 6pts. Two battle claws are mounted, each with it's own built-in SMG, and an over-the-shoulder magshot is mounted.


Commando Mk.IV, Prototype Battle Armor

Code: [Select]

Commando Mk.IV, Prototype Battle Armor
IS Medium Battle Armor (3068)

BV: 219
Cost: 2,583,000 C-bills

Movement: 1/1/3

Internal: 4
Armor: 24 (Stealth)
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Trooper 1                   1        6
Trooper 2                   1        6
Trooper 3                   1        6
Trooper 4                   1        6

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Magshot (Body)                 Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0

Swarm Mek                      Squad     0
Attack Swarmed Mek             Squad     0
Stop Swarm Attack              Squad     0
Leg Attack                     Squad     0

Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
Single-Hex ECM (Body)          Squad
Battle Claw (Left arm)         Squad
Battle Claw (Right arm)        Squad
A-P Weapon Mount (Right arm)   Squad
A-P Weapon Mount (Left arm)    Squad
BA Stealth (Right arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Right arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Left arm)          Squad
BA Stealth (Left arm)          Squad

[Black_Knyght]

Do two battle claws actually make that much difference? Just curious.

[Black_Knyght]

The Mk.IVa  experiment:  speed increased to 2 pts, jump booster added to increase jump to 4pts, stealth armor reduced to 5 points and 1-hex ECM removed, now mount 1 battle claw and 1 basic manipulator fitted with a built-in SMG


Commando Mk.IVa, Prototype Battle Armor

Code: [Select]

Commando Mk.IVa, Prototype Battle Armor
IS Medium Battle Armor (3068)

BV: 264
Cost: 2,702,500 C-bills

Movement: 2/2/4

Internal: 4
Armor: 20
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Trooper 1                   1        5
Trooper 2                   1        5
Trooper 3                   1        5
Trooper 4                   1        5

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Magshot (Left arm)             Squad     0
SMG (Gunther MP-20) (APM)      Squad     0

Swarm Mek                      Squad     0
Attack Swarmed Mek             Squad     0
Stop Swarm Attack              Squad     0
Leg Attack                     Squad     0


Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
A-P Weapon Mount (Right arm)   Squad
Basic Manipulator (Right arm)  Squad
Battle Claw (Left arm)         Squad
Jump Booster (Body)            Squad
BA Stealth (Right arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Right arm)         Squad
BA Stealth (Body)              Squad
BA Stealth (Body)              Squad

[worktroll]

That's about as far as anyone can push that idea. The concept being you slide into Dodge before the bad guys, hide under Stealth, then when they drift close - bang!

But it'll still require large stacks of "Dear sir/madam we regret to inform you ..." form letters ;)

[Black_Knyght]

LOL  O0


I honestly thought going UP a weight class would've allowed more armor weight by default, but apparently not.

[Black_Knyght]

Too bad Battle Armor doesn't use something like the M118 demolition charge.

Those babies were a wonder when I was in the Corps. Slap a little Flex-X with a preset timer on a cockpit and vamoose!

Problem solved.

[worktroll]

a) You're paying off the split between greater spaces, and maintaining the speed. But it does end up a design advantage going medium.

b) One could argue that the magic BT armour & cockpit glass would laugh at Flex-X. Remember, don't bring real world arguments to a BT fight O0

W ;)

[Black_Knyght]

b) One could argue that the magic BT armour & cockpit glass would laugh at Flex-X. Remember, don't bring real world arguments to a BT fight O0

True enough, though I actually meant it more as a joke than a real suggestion.

And I'd have to say that BT armor & glass would have to be some REALLY magical stuff to shrug off Flex-X. I've personally seen the stuff do some SERIOUS damage to both armored vehicles AND da..., err... darn, solid defenses!  ;) 8)

[worktroll]

I've noted that BT magic armour seems to easily stand up under concentrated kinetic force. Kinetic rod penetrators, shaped-charge warheads, do a couple of points of damage. Even AC-20s are usually depicted as streams of shells, rather than one big shell.

Blunt force trauma, on the other hand  - being within 45 meters of a Long Tom shell going off, being hit by a hypersonic metal watermelon, skidding into a wall, or even being hit by a tree - produces both more, and concentrated, damage.

I'm sort of picturing a crystal lattice structure that deforms under point stress so that the rest of the matrix scrunches down and distributes the load across a wide area. But when you put the force across a wide area, the structures can't reinforce each other, and so fail simultaneously.

I can see this all in an animation in my head, but still can't figure out how it would actually work ...

[Cryhavok101]

I can see this all in an animation in my head, but still can't figure out how it would actually work ...

The old Star Wars EU had an armor like that. They claimed every molecule was aligned in just such a way to do that. I think scifi magic is the best explanation though.