Author Topic: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST  (Read 29363 times)

nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #630 on: 03 April 2017, 10:07:08 »
TRO 3039 page 58 states the Machine Gun variant of the Goblin is a "rare Kurita variant".  The MUL lists no Draconis Combine availability for this variant after the Early Succession War era (where it's IS General, Mercenary, and Periphery General): http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1224/goblin-medium-tank-mg

Curiously, the SRM variant of the Goblin is listed with exclusive Draconis Combine (and Rasalhague, during its existence) availability after the Early Succession War era: http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1225/goblin-medium-tank-srm

It appears the two variants were confused at some point with regard to their availability.  Recommend adding Draconis Combine/Rasalhague availability to the MG variant, and wider availability to the SRM variant (which isn't characterized as a "Kurita" variant).  The Combine already has access to the base and LRM variants.

Goblin MG updated to being DC (and FRR), Goblin SRM updated to match Goblin LRM.
Thanks.
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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #631 on: 03 April 2017, 10:11:23 »
Constable Pacification Suit

The MUL restricts availability to the Rasalhague Dominion.   According to its source material:

The source goes on to give an example of a notable ISF operation making use of the suits, and one of the two notable pilots is a Combine agent.

According to the fluff, even though there's no evidence of its use by the actual military, the paramilitaries of the Combine seem to make notable use of suit, even if it may or may not be widespread use by those paramilitaries.  Should Draconis Combine availability be added?
Yep, DC added for Constable suits. Thanks.
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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #632 on: 03 April 2017, 10:28:55 »
I could easily be missing something here, but I was wondering about the Faction Availability of the Rifleman IIC 8 and 5;

Of the IIC 8 (http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2717/rifleman-iic-8) TRO3085 says:
"This variant appeared in forces from all three Clans who soiled New Earth with their presence ... Though offered to all Inner Sphere factions, prior to 3080 the IIC 8 only appeared with the Sharks, Wolves, Falcons, Bears and AFFS. Since then, the DCMS and Duchy of Oriente have both aquired the design in small numbers."

This doesn't seem to agree with what's in the MUL for the Rifleman IIC 8.
correct, adjusted.

Quote
Of the Rifleman IIC 5 (http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2714/rifleman-iic-5), TRO3085 continues:
"In a futile attempt to confuse us, the putrid Falcons deployed a second variant of the Rifleman IIC ... The second variant identified by the Blakists is the IIC 5."

This is presumably the Rifleman IIC refit the Jade Falcons have coming out of Red Devil Industries on Pandora, but as per the MUL, it is not available to the Falcons but is available to a host of factions that the Falcons generally wouldn't trade with (trade of the merchant or warrior caste variety). I think the IIC 5 was mistakenly thought to have come from the Diamond Shark line on Twycross in the MUL.

http://www.battlecorps.com/BC2/news.html?article=258 specifically states the IIC 5 is Diamond Shark.  But you are correct that TR3085 makes it clear the Falcons used it as well, and our production notes have both CJF and CDS making it.  Adding CJF.

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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #633 on: 03 April 2017, 10:31:04 »
STINGER  STG-5G

http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3062/stinger-stg-5g

should not have an OV 1

it has only one weapon, a light PPC with capacitor, and 10 DHS (according to RS3085 PP, and i checked the errata thread whether it are DHS or SHS).
even with single HS it could not overheat (11 heat build-up vs. 10 heat dissipation), so it should be corrected to OV 0 and PV 13 (it loses one point in the calculation for OV value).

(and btw, it would be impossible, even with AS conversion up-rounding all weapon damage, to deal 2 damage points with only a light PPC w/ capacitor.  ;) )

Fixed, thanks.
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Scotty

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #634 on: 03 April 2017, 12:38:22 »
The MUL isn't showing quirks for any units, we're not going to just do one.

The problem with VRT is that it actually affects PV as a Special mentioned in the conversion rules.  This makes it unique among quirks, and probably warrants inclusion as an exception.
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cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #635 on: 03 April 2017, 13:06:58 »
Do you add the cost to the base unit with a note to reduce the cost if you aren't playing with the optional quirks rules or do you just add a note with the additional costs if you are playing with those additional quirk rules. There is no place other than notes to show quirks so it wouldn't be on the card as the MUL is currently designed.

Scotty

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #636 on: 03 April 2017, 13:17:01 »
Cost the unit appropriately.  The Special is defined in the usual place; I suggest the exception to be treat VRT as always in play.  That, or remove it from being a Special and the conversion rules entirely.  Given how much easier it is to edit the MUL than it is to issue errata for a book that most people might realize had changed, my preference is for the former.
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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #637 on: 03 April 2017, 13:31:30 »
That, or remove it from being a Special and the conversion rules entirely. 

Bingo.  Same as all the other quirks.
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Bishop Steiner

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #638 on: 04 April 2017, 10:50:33 »
CPLT-K2 updated.

Thank you for that.  Am curious about the extinct from 3020 to 3033 part, if that was based on some errata, or a bit of a salve to make conflicting info work a little more harmoniously?

nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #639 on: 04 April 2017, 10:55:43 »
Thank you for that.  Am curious about the extinct from 3020 to 3033 part, if that was based on some errata, or a bit of a salve to make conflicting info work a little more harmoniously?

Opposite direction, it's ancient.
TR3025 Catapult entry says "One of House Kurita’s few Catapults was lost to Davion forces during the battle for the planet Hoff; the Draconis Combine has at least one other Catapult assigned to Brion’s Legion, but no others have been deployed with any regular Kurita unit.”  And that's for all Catapult's for Kurita.  Since Kurita has no Catapults from 3020 (Hoff was 3019) until some undefined later date that's at least post 3025, and only Kurita has K2s, there's no K2s after Hoff until Kurita starts new production of K2s in 3033.

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Bishop Steiner

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #640 on: 04 April 2017, 11:00:11 »
Opposite direction, it's ancient.
TR3025 Catapult entry says "One of House Kurita’s few Catapults was lost to Davion forces during the battle for the planet Hoff; the Draconis Combine has at least one other Catapult assigned to Brion’s Legion, but no others have been deployed with any regular Kurita unit.”  And that's for all Catapult's for Kurita.  Since Kurita has no Catapults from 3020 (Hoff was 3019) until some undefined later date that's at least post 3025, and only Kurita has K2s, there's no K2s after Hoff until Kurita starts new production of K2s in 3033.

Ah, that works well.  Good to know and makes sense.  Plus as the entire TRO 2750 knows... extinct is seldom as extinct as one thinks.  So I reckon it's not too far of a stretch for there to be another stray or three like the one in Brion's Legion, but none in any Kurita House Unit, etc......and yeah, rare enough to be for all intents and purposes, extinct. And let's be honest, even before Hoff... it was essentially extinct with that info.  Very interesting stuff. 

Sigil

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #641 on: 04 April 2017, 11:32:41 »
Opposite direction, it's ancient.
TR3025 Catapult entry says "One of House Kurita’s few Catapults was lost to Davion forces during the battle for the planet Hoff; the Draconis Combine has at least one other Catapult assigned to Brion’s Legion, but no others have been deployed with any regular Kurita unit.”  And that's for all Catapult's for Kurita.  Since Kurita has no Catapults from 3020 (Hoff was 3019) until some undefined later date that's at least post 3025, and only Kurita has K2s, there's no K2s after Hoff until Kurita starts new production of K2s in 3033.

Are there any other BattleMechs that have a similar "period of extinction" in the MUL?  I was under the impression the MUL only dealt with introduction dates specifically and steered clear of "extinction" dates.  Is this a change in policy?

nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #642 on: 04 April 2017, 11:47:38 »
Are there any other BattleMechs that have a similar "period of extinction" in the MUL?  I was under the impression the MUL only dealt with introduction dates specifically and steered clear of "extinction" dates.  Is this a change in policy?

It's an interesting tidbit that I thought to include.  We put them in public notes every now and then.  There is no policy on the public notes. 
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Empyrus

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #643 on: 04 April 2017, 15:21:23 »
Zeus ZEU-9S2 seems to have REAR 1/1/- ability in its AS card even though the 'Mech does not have any rear-facing weapons.

http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/5459/zeus-zeu-9s2
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Card/5459?skill=4


On the other hand, Zeus ZEU-9S seems to be missing REAR 1/1/- ability. I believe single rear-mounted Medium Pulse Laser is enough for that.

http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3644/zeus-zeu-9s
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Card/3644?skill=4

Posted this note long-ish time ago, seems these got missed. Not sure if point values and other stats are correct. Other Zeuses don't seem to have issues at cursory glance.

nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #644 on: 04 April 2017, 15:31:15 »
Posted this note long-ish time ago, seems these got missed. Not sure if point values and other stats are correct. Other Zeuses don't seem to have issues at cursory glance.

Yep, thanks for the reminder, ZEU-9S and ZEU-9S2 updated.
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Bishop Steiner

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #645 on: 05 April 2017, 12:25:12 »
A few more Blackjack Issues:

Had someone point out the Blackjack Prototype, the BJ-1X, is listed as being produced in 2769.... 12 years after the later production model, the BJ-1 entered production (2757).  Not sure if this implies that the original Prototype BJ-1X was later released as a full production model, or just a fact check/typo issue?

Also noted that the BJ-3X http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3831/blackjack-bj-3x does not show on the base BJ entry? http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Filter?Name=blackjack


nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #647 on: 05 April 2017, 14:03:00 »
BJ-1X intro date fixed.
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Cache

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #648 on: 05 April 2017, 17:35:05 »
Vedette Medium Tank (Standard)
Vedette Medium Tank (AC2)
Vedette Medium Tank (Liao)

Image for these three should be the older TRO:3039 version, not the updated TRO:3058 version.

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Sartris

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #650 on: 16 April 2017, 14:05:35 »
is there a way to add RS: 3145u as a searchable source? it would be easier than having to add all eight 3145 faction TROs when looking at 3145/50 units.

thanks

Empyrus

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #651 on: 16 April 2017, 22:49:20 »
Very minor thing but... The Celerity CLR-02-X-D has wrong intro date (3052). Kinda, maybe.
The issue is the XL Gyro the Celerity uses. The XL Gyro is prototyped in about 3055 according to Interstellar Operations pg 48.
On the other hand, XTRO ComStar describes the Celerity project starting in 3052. Now, perhaps the project was indeed started then but assuming IO is correct, then the first functional Celerities can't have been produced before 3055 (indeed, perhaps XL gyro is basically a side-effect of the project). Seems to me that adjusting the 'Mech's intro date makes more sense than issuing errata for IO and XTRO ComStar so i figured i'd drop this here rather than somewhere else.

http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/5553/celerity-clr-02-x-d