The Free Worlds League: Winning with what we've got!

[Wotan]

58-67 can be pretty much summed up with 'Screwed'.

We may not get the best designs - but we have some good choices for all weight classes. We have good designs for nearly every situation - and we have a lot of them. You heard the Lyrans are the industrial powerhouse? Don't believe that. We have enough output to increase our army and export much more.
Plus we have a fleet! Not that collection of pour dropships and some cool ASF. No we have masses of ASF and we have the right warship to bring them on target.
In the time of 58-67 i consider the FWL as the sleeping beast amongst the houses.

[Dies Irae]

In-Universe, yeah! Great!

During that period, it was hard to compete properly when you are rolling Griffin 5Ms (which I hold up as one of the worst designs in the Phoenix Book), and your TRO3067 entries amount to the Cronus and Bloodhound and a reprint of the Perseus, when the FedCom gets... well... the rest of the book.

Exaggerated, yes. But those were still lean years when it was obvious TPTB of the time really didn't give a fig to the FWL Fans, such as they were.

EDITED: Yes. 5M.

[Colt Ward]

So you mean the -5M right?  B/c the -3M ERPPC Griffin is pretty much spot on.

And I think '58 to '67 is fine, you just have to put together the synergy you do not have stand alone stand outs.

[Dies Irae]

So you mean the -5M right?  B/c the -3M ERPPC Griffin is pretty much spot on.

And I think '58 to '67 is fine, you just have to put together the synergy you do not have stand alone stand outs.

Yeah. The 5M. Typo.

In an era where Devastators, Verfolgers, Nightstars and Thunder Hawks were being rolled out, it makes me feel like the League was being unfairly singled out as a repository for junk.

Not to say that the FWL doesn't score it's wins when played well... it's just that the skill curve is so much higher for League machines. And even running at peak efficiency, they're not actually all that good at their job either.

There's plenty of residual bitterness at that treatment that occasionally oozes out, even decades later.

[The Eagle]

While our 'Mech selection in that time period is certainly smaller than other factions and certainly less inspired -- LGR vomit was a serious issue --I'd say that if you play combined arms then things aren't nearly as dour looking.  We got the Achileus, one of the best light battle armor designs in the game, as well as the Longinus and Phalanx, both of which are reasonably solid.  We're spoiled for choice on the tank front with Ontos (LGR), Stygian, Regulator, and Yellow Jacket, plus decent options on the Galleon, Hawk Moth, and Main Gauche (the last which ends up making a fantastic battle armor transport during the Jihad era).

Would I have preferred that we got the same breadth of new materiel that all four other Houses got?  Absolutely.  But can I win games with what we did get?  Absolutely.

[glitterboy2098]

it is somewhat ironic that the FWL, one of the most dis-unified and fractious states, is the one that got the military that consistently conformed to a specific tactical doctrine.

[Wotan]

it is somewhat ironic that the FWL, one of the most dis-unified and fractious states, is the one that got the military that consistently conformed to a specific tactical doctrine.

That is the "L" for in FWL  ;)

[Kidd]

I've posted this here before, but again: I don't know nuts about the Free Worlds League. So I've a question: What would you consider the iconic Free Worlds League regiments? "Iconic" doesn't have to be mean elite; I think the Ghost Regiments can be considered iconic to the DCMS, for example.

[Deadborder]

To me it would be the Fusiliers of Oriente (for beign seen as "the best" of the FWLM) and the Marik Milita

[The Eagle]

I've posted this here before, but again: I don't know nuts about the Free Worlds League. So I've a question: What would you consider the iconic Free Worlds League regiments? "Iconic" doesn't have to be mean elite; I think the Ghost Regiments can be considered iconic to the DCMS, for example.

The Free Worlds Guards and Marik Militia.  Both are Federal brigades and so represent the entire League instead of just a single province, and they are the only brigades that wear the faction color (being purple, of course) as part of their livery.  If I had to pull out individual units, I'd say the 1st Guards and the 10th Militia.  The 1st Guards have been "the elite" unit of the FWLM for their entire history (except for that brief decade where the Knights of the Inner Sphere existed, and even then I'd still say the two were even in ability if not prestige).  The Knights might have gone to Huntress, but the 1st Guards fought in the Great Refusal.  The 10th Militia -- my personal favorite unit, so bias might be peeking through here -- is one of the rare few Marik Militia units that is not just a cadre formation for the rest of the FWLM.  They're a heavy-weight regiment, veteran-rated, and tough as nails as proved on Callison, Xanthe III, and Andurien.  They're also one of only two Marik Militia units to remain solvent into the Dark Age era, having become the 1st Marik Protectors, a quasi-mercenary command devoted to the protection of former and unaligned Free Worlds.

Edit:  Actually, I suppose the 6th Marik Militia is probably a better representative.  As an assault-weight regiment, they're much heavier than the average FWLM unit, but they're famed across the League and beyond as shock troops par excellence.  They survived two or three scraps with the Dragoons during Anton's Rebellion and performed a picture-perfect orbital insertion on Arcadia that crushed an LAAF unit and saved Kristen's Krushers at the start of the Fed Com Civil War.

[truetanker]

It's not the fault of equipment you should wonder, it's the fault of the usage of said equipment in battle.

If your tactics are up front and center, per say: assault and your using LGRs for it then your doing it wrong. And then you need some fire support and use heavy short ranged items with little reach.

Best part of using with FWL equipment is I can attempt to cover every aspect possible on a single chassis. Weird combos are meant for you to explore and decide on what you have to use, not what you want to use. Try rolling on the RAT and use off brand mechs that most people don't use cause of something or another. Freaks them out when you win with " useless " tech.

TT

[MarauderD]

While our 'Mech selection in that time period is certainly smaller than other factions and certainly less inspired -- LGR vomit was a serious issue --I'd say that if you play combined arms then things aren't nearly as dour looking.  We got the Achileus, one of the best light battle armor designs in the game, as well as the Longinus and Phalanx, both of which are reasonably solid.  We're spoiled for choice on the tank front with Ontos (LGR), Stygian, Regulator, and Yellow Jacket, plus decent options on the Galleon, Hawk Moth, and Main Gauche (the last which ends up making a fantastic battle armor transport during the Jihad era).

Would I have preferred that we got the same breadth of new materiel that all four other Houses got?  Absolutely.  But can I win games with what we did get?  Absolutely.

Two of the best things in TRO:3145 Davion are yours to play with as well: The new Black Knight, which is slow but sturdy and mean as all get out, and the outstanding Zibler hover omni.

While I have average luck with the Black Knight, I've gotten great results with the Zibler every time I use a lance of them. I feel like the almost always die, but man do they do a number on enemy armor and mechs. (in my own humble experience).

[Weirdo]

Freaks them out when you win with " useless " tech.

This. This man truly understands the core truth of playing the FWLM.

[Kit deSummersville]

Well, OS really is useless. Go with iOS.

[glitterboy2098]

Two of the best things in TRO:3145 Davion are yours to play with as well: The new Black Knight, which is slow but sturdy and mean as all get out, and the outstanding Zibler hover omni.

While I have average luck with the Black Knight, I've gotten great results with the Zibler every time I use a lance of them. I feel like the almost always die, but man do they do a number on enemy armor and mechs. (in my own humble experience).

you sure it is the Davion mixed tech one? i know there was a Black Knight line on one of the worlds that joined the renewed FWL.. but IIRC it was making the Royal Black knight?

[(SMD)MadCow]

Two of the best things in TRO:3145 Davion are yours to play with as well: The new Black Knight, which is slow but sturdy and mean as all get out, and the outstanding Zibler hover omni.

While I have average luck with the Black Knight, I've gotten great results with the Zibler every time I use a lance of them. I feel like the almost always die, but man do they do a number on enemy armor and mechs. (in my own humble experience).

That Black Knight is specific to the plant on Robinson, and may very well be unavailable to Davion until the planet is re-taken from Kurita.

[MarauderD]

The MUL says FWLM forces have access to the mix tech 5H. It’s a solid mech unless you are fighting reflective armored forces (darn Combine!)

[glitterboy2098]

well, IIRC the Davions were selling them to the Republic.. the NeoFWL inherited a lot of ex-republic worlds and troops, so it is possible that they got a notable number from there.

though i suppose it is possible that the Kong Interstellar facility on Connaught could be building some. not sure why a world that has been independent since 3130 would even have the plans to a 30138 introdate Davion design from the other side of the IS though. more likely the Connaught facility was building some other version, like the BL-6b-KNT or one of the other pre-jihad models. parts from which could probably be used to support the BLK-NT-** series, but i doubt they'd be building that series.

[truetanker]

This. This man truly understands the core truth of playing the FWLM.

Yep! Gimme any unit and I'll find a way.

From Infantry to AeroMech, including my fav., the Tank!

Just don't expect me to cry, only at your funeral!

Best thinker out of the box scenario idealist around!

TT

[MarauderD]

well, IIRC the Davions were selling them to the Republic.. the NeoFWL inherited a lot of ex-republic worlds and troops, so it is possible that they got a notable number from there.

though i suppose it is possible that the Kong Interstellar facility on Connaught could be building some. not sure why a world that has been independent since 3130 would even have the plans to a Davion design from the other side of the IS though. more likely the Connaught facility was building some other version, like the BL-6b-KNT or one of the other pre-jihad models. parts from which could probably be used to support the BLK-NT-** series, but i doubt they'd be building that series.

Yup, the TRO says that the 5H is produced on Connaught by Kong Interstellar. I'm not sure who produces the clan tech laser equipment there, but it could certainly be bought from the Sea Foxes or Spirit Cats, right?

[(SMD)MadCow]

Yup, the TRO says that the 5H is produced on Connaught by Kong Interstellar. I'm not sure who produces the clan tech laser equipment there, but it could certainly be bought from the Sea Foxes or Spirit Cats, right?

Happy to be wrong about that then, Pew-pew time!

[MarauderD]

Not just pew pew, but pew pew with a shield! So its like Wonder Woman with lazorz (maybe without the good looks, but what can you do?)

[Weirdo]

Yep! Gimme any unit and I'll find a way.

From Infantry to AeroMech, including my fav., the Tank!

Just don't expect me to cry, only at your funeral!

Best thinker out of the box scenario idealist around!

TT

[Dies Irae]

It's not the fault of equipment you should wonder, it's the fault of the usage of said equipment in battle.

If your tactics are up front and center, per say: assault and your using LGRs for it then your doing it wrong. And then you need some fire support and use heavy short ranged items with little reach.

Best part of using with FWL equipment is I can attempt to cover every aspect possible on a single chassis. Weird combos are meant for you to explore and decide on what you have to use, not what you want to use. Try rolling on the RAT and use off brand mechs that most people don't use cause of something or another. Freaks them out when you win with " useless " tech.

TT

It's one thing to be able to literally take lemons and jam it in the eye of the person across the table from you. It's another thing to have to do it game after game after game because the writers of the time decided that everything needed a LGR or a tacky combination of odd lasers because FWL, HAHA. The equipment feels almost fundamentally flawed in comparison to what appears on the other faction tables - and I did a lot of rolling on those tables.

If I sound bitter, it's because I did a lot of that. And while I learned to adapt and to use FWL gear in all ways weird and wacky, bring in the combined arms, occasionally drown people in infantry... etc, it still felt like I was running the engine full tilt just to match an opponent who was going at cruise. And while it sounds boorish, it was even more frustrating that during the period, factions like Liao and Word of Blake basically fielded a lineup that included the "FWL All Stars" while still getting their own stables of unique designs.

So it's not unwinnable, but there was a point where it began to feel like too much work, to the point where I realised I was beginning to burn out on the game and took a break from it. Which is also again why I'm not fond of the 58-67 era where FASA was fleshing out the armories of the other factions at the expense of the League.

Now that the League's arsenal is back on par with the other Houses, (even with the quirky nature of their designs) I've no real complaints.



EDIT: But, this is dragging the discussion down. I apologize. I needed to get it out of my system. I'm good. And happy to go back to blinding people with lemon juice.

[MarauderD]

We who man the "other" factions noticed FWL gear getting the short end of the stick when it came to designs. I loved the Project Phoenix TRO, but with a few exceptions, it was mercilessly unkind to the FWLM.

On the bright side, in 3145 (where I live lately) you guys have some really strong units, and I feel like there is much more parity between factions.

[Kit deSummersville]

I do regret that I haven't had the chance to give the FWL a snazzy assault 'Mech like I have the other great houses....

[MarauderD]

I do regret that I haven't had the chance to give the FWL a snazzy assault 'Mech like I have the other great houses....

Ok: fess up! What snazzy assaults are you responsible for giving to which houses?

And by snazzy, do you mean Albatross snazzy? Or do you mean Tomahawk snazzy?

[truetanker]

I do regret that I haven't had the chance to give the FWL a snazzy assault 'Mech like I have the other great houses....

Screw Assaults, we need more Lights and backbone Mediums!

We're the Assault capital of the Sphere!

Something like an upgraded Flea-4, maybe a Cicada Omni? A Hunchback Omni? ( Like one that floated around the boards a few years ago. ) Maybe using a shield?

TT

[Kit deSummersville]

Ok: fess up! What snazzy assaults are you responsible for giving to which houses?

And by snazzy, do you mean Albatross snazzy? Or do you mean Tomahawk snazzy?

Well, to the Davions I gave the Atlas 8-D. To the Steiners I gave the Banshee 8S (and 9S). To the Capellans (and the Lyrans managed to sneak in on the action) the Xanthos. To the Kuritans I bestowed the Akuma 2XK. I even managed to slip the RWR the Rampage. But haven't gotten a chance for the FWL. Luckily for Weirdo I was able to slip them some tanks.

[Kidd]

I think the Juliano is waaaay snazzy, it's right up there with the Tenshi as my 2 favourite Assaults of 3145.

But if you're taking ideas, something to carry on the flaming man-made lightning blue torch of the good ol' Awesome might be nice, IMHO 8)