Author Topic: Aviation Pictures Part Trois  (Read 194555 times)

Sharpnel

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #120 on: 18 August 2017, 04:36:43 »
Amusingly, I just fixed that.  Alas, the legend of Star Commander Zed of Clan Scarlet Nappy is no more.
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ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #121 on: 18 August 2017, 07:01:46 »
Is that from Spice and Wolf
It is indeed.

Hey!   Aviation!

Ah, what could have been.
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Sharpnel

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #122 on: 18 August 2017, 07:06:07 »
Speaking of what could have been

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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #123 on: 18 August 2017, 08:40:01 »
It's hard to think of an aircraft that combined such eye-catching beauty and jaw-dropping failure as the RAH-66.

But I'll put a picture of a competitor in that category here anyway- the Bristol Brabazon airliner.

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I am Belch II

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #124 on: 18 August 2017, 08:44:22 »
The Ah-66 Comanche was a cool looking helo. I don't know how stealth could help a close in battle like a normal help fight.
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wantec

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #125 on: 18 August 2017, 10:05:39 »
The Ah-66 Comanche was a cool looking helo. I don't know how stealth could help a close in battle like a normal help fight.
The same way it does on a Wulfen...on the way in & out of the battlefield. The other possibility is in making it harder for missiles and other electronic targeting systems to lock on.
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #126 on: 18 August 2017, 11:04:42 »
The big thing to remember on the Comanche is that it wasn't an attack helicopter- at least, not as a primary role. It carried a few Hellfires inside (Stinger, as I recall, was looked at as well), along with the nose-gun, but its weapons were meant to assist the Apaches, not replace them. Comanche was intended instead to replace the Kiowa as the Army's recon chopper, with attack as a secondary role- and in a scout/spotting role, being difficult to detect on radar was considered to be vital. It's safe to expect that in service the aircraft would have received a mast-mount sensor suite similar to what the Apache-D got, allowing it to peek from behind cover to find targets for itself and other aircraft. In addition to its stealth construction, the aircraft was intended to use a version of the Black Hole IR-suppression system the Apache got (cooling engine exhaust with outside air before being ejected to reduce the heat blossom for shoulder-launched missiles to track).

Comanches would have been extremely useful as a rotary-wing 'Wild Weasel' aircraft, hunting enemy mobile anti-aircraft systems down and destroying them while being difficult to target in return... or anyway, as a concept they would have been good at it. The actual aircraft was the textbook example of throwing good money at a bad project, and that it lasted as long as it did without a viable test airframe (one that could be reliably tested in combat scenarios rather than just flying around its test facility for cameras) is really quite staggering.

Sometimes a troubled program can still turn out well (the V-22, for example). This one belongs in the musty file cabinets of forgotten history.
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ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #127 on: 18 August 2017, 12:35:54 »
It was honestly a good idea for a need.  A low-observable moderately-armed light helicopter that could sneak all over the place as a recon element, and have a few good heavies on hand for when it found a target of opportunity.  The biggest killer of the RAH-66 was its pilot - specifically, having to have one sitting in what would have been a forward-deployed and likely mostly-unsupported helo flitting about trying to find the bad guy and risking his life to do it.

Especially as this little thing was maturing quite nicely and stealing the Comanche's job.  Hell, didn't a big nail in the coffin for the RAH-66 program hit when the first Predator dropped a Hellfire successfully?  That was late-90s, IIRC...

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Ruger

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #128 on: 18 August 2017, 18:40:18 »
It is indeed.

Hey!   Aviation!

Ah, what could have been.

I really loved the Cheyenne's look...

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #129 on: 18 August 2017, 21:42:50 »
Not to mention her capability mix.  Grenade launcher, minigun, 30mm cannon, and six stations for rockets & TOW, and an exceptional top speed as well as frighteningly effective low-level flight?  She'd have been a CAS monster.  During testing against air-defense troops, those choppers could race in fast and, because of the stable flight from the fixed wings, repeatedly were on top of said infantry/mechanized units before being spotted. 
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I am Belch II

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #130 on: 18 August 2017, 21:54:53 »
The Cheyanne was huge also, just a big Heli and probably would of been hard to hide. The single engine design also a problem. I like the pusher prop attached to it to give it the speed. The X-97 Raider Heli has the pusher with the dual main rotors and has incredible speed.
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Bedwyr

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #131 on: 18 August 2017, 22:14:55 »
None can possibly hold a candle to the greatest helicopter prototype ever developed though.

Alas poor Photobucket. I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy.

Feenix74

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #132 on: 18 August 2017, 22:36:52 »
How about:

Incoming fire has the right of way.

The only thing more accurate than incoming enemy fire is incoming friendly fire.

Always remember that your weapon was built by the lowest bidder.


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Feenix74

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #133 on: 19 August 2017, 02:57:40 »
I do like the sleek look of the Raider

Incoming fire has the right of way.

The only thing more accurate than incoming enemy fire is incoming friendly fire.

Always remember that your weapon was built by the lowest bidder.


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I am Belch II

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #134 on: 19 August 2017, 05:25:36 »
When the Life Flight Helicopterf flew over I would always call it Airwolf because it was a Bell 222 model just like Airwolf. People around me would get it or look at me like I was crazy. Most of the later.
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Kidd

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #135 on: 19 August 2017, 06:40:14 »
When the Life Flight Helicopterf flew over I would always call it Airwolf because it was a Bell 222 model just like Airwolf. People around me would get it or look at me like I was crazy. Most of the later.
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HobbesHurlbut

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #136 on: 19 August 2017, 08:07:38 »
Damn it you said the A**W*** word, now the theme's in my head for at least 15 minutes ;D
I had the toy as a kid  ;D
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Bedwyr

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #137 on: 19 August 2017, 08:25:36 »
Damn it you said the A**W*** word, now the theme's in my head for at least 15 minutes ;D



Please repeat it in your head for another 15. Thank you. - Archangel
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Feenix74

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #138 on: 19 August 2017, 09:25:07 »
Ok lets move away from AirWolf for a minute (sorry Kidd, another 15 mins I guess  :D )

The Sikorsky S-67 Blackhawk, no not that one, this was the original Blackhawk, a tandem, 2-seater attack helicopter. Armed with a 30 mm cannon and could carry 16 TOW missiles, 2.75-inch (70 mm) rockets, or AIM-9 Sidewinder air-to-air missiles.




Incoming fire has the right of way.

The only thing more accurate than incoming enemy fire is incoming friendly fire.

Always remember that your weapon was built by the lowest bidder.


                                   - excepts from Murphy's Laws of Combat

Kidd

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #139 on: 19 August 2017, 10:06:37 »
*triggered* dum de dum, DAH DAH DE DAH, DAH DAH DE DAH, dum de dum dum ;D

I admit to being a sucker for the Eurofighter Typhoon, probably the next best fighter in the world after the F-22.


Bedwyr

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #140 on: 19 August 2017, 13:03:07 »
*triggered* dum de dum, DAH DAH DE DAH, DAH DAH DE DAH, dum de dum dum ;D

My work here is done.
Alas poor Photobucket. I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy.

Ruger

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #141 on: 19 August 2017, 13:14:02 »
Not to mention her capability mix.  Grenade launcher, minigun, 30mm cannon, and six stations for rockets & TOW, and an exceptional top speed as well as frighteningly effective low-level flight?  She'd have been a CAS monster.  During testing against air-defense troops, those choppers could race in fast and, because of the stable flight from the fixed wings, repeatedly were on top of said infantry/mechanized units before being spotted.

Yeah...she had a bit of everything, didn't she? And she was FAST...her top speed was over 60 mph faster than the Apache's...and range? She had over FOUR TIMES the range of the Apache...Not quite the service ceiling, but close...

She was a sexy well built amazon warrior...too bad she never got to prove herself...

Ok lets move away from AirWolf for a minute (sorry Kidd, another 15 mins I guess  :D )

The Sikorsky S-67 Blackhawk, no not that one, this was the original Blackhawk, a tandem, 2-seater attack helicopter. Armed with a 30 mm cannon and could carry 16 TOW missiles, 2.75-inch (70 mm) rockets, or AIM-9 Sidewinder air-to-air missiles.





Hmm...never seen that one before somehow...the Wikipedia entry says she was also supposed to be able to carry 15 troops...

Um...where? She looks awfully thin to carry 15 people inside her body... ???

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DoctorMonkey

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #142 on: 19 August 2017, 13:31:51 »


Um...where? She looks awfully thin to carry 15 people inside her body... ???

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #143 on: 19 August 2017, 15:51:07 »
Underwing pylons. :)
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glitterboy2098

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #144 on: 19 August 2017, 16:54:03 »
probably someone confusing it for the UH-60.

the S-67 was designed with a (cramped) space for up to 6 troops (8 with light gear.)

Bren

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #145 on: 20 August 2017, 10:26:51 »
Underwing pylons. :)

I'll raise you an overwing bag.


JadeHellbringer

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #146 on: 20 August 2017, 10:41:28 »


And now, a quick stop over the night skies of Paris.
"There's a difference between the soldier and his fight,
But the warrior knows the true meaning of his life."
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marauder648

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #147 on: 20 August 2017, 11:41:08 »
A nice collection here;

http://imgur.com/gallery/z0QxA
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Daryk

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #148 on: 20 August 2017, 16:56:25 »
The caption on #9 is PERFECT!  8)

glitterboy2098

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Re: Aviation Pictures Part Trois
« Reply #149 on: 20 August 2017, 17:08:14 »
It was honestly a good idea for a need.  A low-observable moderately-armed light helicopter that could sneak all over the place as a recon element, and have a few good heavies on hand for when it found a target of opportunity.  The biggest killer of the RAH-66 was its pilot - specifically, having to have one sitting in what would have been a forward-deployed and likely mostly-unsupported helo flitting about trying to find the bad guy and risking his life to do it.

Especially as this little thing was maturing quite nicely and stealing the Comanche's job.  Hell, didn't a big nail in the coffin for the RAH-66 program hit when the first Predator dropped a Hellfire successfully?  That was late-90s, IIRC...
http://www.armadninoviny.cz/domains/0023-armadninoviny_cz/useruploads/images/raper.jpg
(Yes I know what the filename says, it's a czech site so I'm allowing for a weird translation/typo fail)

actually i need to chime in here..
the Comanche project ended in 2004, but it had been pretty much dead from when the first prototype rolled out in 1995. with the End of the cold war hitting right aound when the project started in 1988, the question of whether an expensive new attack helicopter was even needed had been looming over the project from day one, and by 1995, it was clear to everyone involved that the soviet union was gone and the massive super-power vs super-power conflict it was designed for wasn't going to happen.
when it was shown that that upgraded versions of the AH-64 Apache (the AH-64D Apache Longbow), AH-1 Cobra (the AH-1Z "viper" Supercobra) and the OH-58 Kiowa Warrior (the OH-58D) offered similar operational capabilities at a far cheaper price, the project lost steam.


the first predator to employ a weapon was on 16 February, 2001. the first deployments of the MQ-1A armed versions occurred later that year, but were considered a stopgap until the larger more capable MQ-9 Reaper could be deployed (which it was, in 2007)

so no, the predators did not kill the Comanche. at most, they were a final nail in the coffin.



interesting bit, did you know that the predator drone's origin actually dates back to the 80's? the CIA had the Leading Systems Incorporated "Amber" UAV developed to spy on hostile countries, though it had its funding killed in early 1989 as fallout from attempts to consolidate numerous drone projects into a coherant development program. that bankrupted the company that built it, because they had sunk a lot of funds into work on improved models..

Leading Systems Incorporated would be bought up by General Atomics, who would update the Amber into the "Gnat 750" in late 1989, using the LSI plans as a start.


both of these drones lacked sattelite comms (which at the time were really bulky unless you had the cutting edge military gear the CIA didn't want to risk on a drone), though the i-Gnat that the CIA used in the early 1990's, featured a dorsal satellite comm, various airframe improvements, and a turboprop engine to get the extra power to handle the extra weight.


the I-Gnat 750 is the predecessor of the GNAT 750-45, better known as the MQ-1 Predator, which started development in 1994 and the first prototype flew in 1995, and the first deployment was in 1996 to the Balkans. (where interestingly enough, it was operating alongside the CIA's I-Gnat 750's)


« Last Edit: 20 August 2017, 17:11:08 by glitterboy2098 »