Gen Con 2017 New Releases

[Scotty]

A Tactical Squad is $40 USD.  You might be checking the GW site for the wrong country, though even in AUD it's $65.  A squad of resin marines from Forge World, GW's "charge them extra" division, is "only" $50.

I'm all for lambasting GW for being overpriced, but we should at least be accurate about how overpriced it is. ;)

[I am Belch II]

Lots of people play the Games Workshop no matter the price of it.
It Battletech makes a good product , people will buy it.

[pheonixstorm]

The problem with overpriced plastics is that it goes both ways... CGL may (not final and hopefully not at the intro box price) charge $60 for the new GoAC. In this case of potential overcharging they have the **** job of trying to make money off a box set they cannot hope to order in LARGE volumes. As I said in one of these threads, the actual product is really cheap to produce per mini when you don't account for the cost of the mold. So, in order to make a profit you either have to order in very large numbers or jack up the price. In terms of paying fans BattleTech doesn't have a lot so CGL will either have to try and break even or hope that the profit from a large order will come back to them in a timely manner.

GW on the other hand has a large rabid fanbase that doesn't seem to care that they are being gouged, so the more they sell the more profit they make. Even a small product run will still yield a high profit margin.

[worktroll]

The comment on production prices he made are rubbish. He's just looking at plastic cost. Ignores how much to make the injection plates from solid steel, the purchase price of the machinery handling molten plastic at high pressures, wages for the operator, payment to the sculptor, cost of packaging, etc etc etc.

The old saw "Man who acts as his own legal representative has fool for a client" applies here.

[Colt Ward]

See, I do not see what the problem is with the Lance Pack plastics.  I thought they were very good and I am not sure a more expensive set was required.  I am also interested to see the update to the Catapult, Awesome and Commando because unlike some other though expressed here I did not think those minis were too bad . . .

With that said I think the Cataphract IS a bad looking mini with it being cartoony, definitely prefer the MWO Cataphract as should be obvious.

[sadlerbw]

I updated my album with some extra pics. Got some of the display case at IWM, and the playmats that are being used at the Alpha Strike intro tables. Now, these playmats are NOT for sale. However, I think they look great, and would like it if CGL decided to offer them for sale, or something like them. Here is the link to the album again:

https://1drv.ms/a/s!ApDHaN8p702HggEGRapqSdSGz30Y

Also, I don't have pics up, but the dice for sale are not exactly like those in the picture on the Catalyst site. The colors and logos look the same, but they have pips instead of numbers, and they have heavily rounded corners. These babies like to spin for a while! Also, the anodizing on the dice is decorative, not hard-coat. So, it wears off the edges really easily. If you buy these and actually use them, they are going to end up with silver edges pretty quick. That's sort of the price you pay for the wide range of colors you get with decorative anodized aluminum. Not good or bad, just something to be aware of if you want them to stay pristine.

Also, they had diamond shark dice! Along with some of the more expected factions, they actually had grey diamond shark dice as well. Sure they are back to being the sea foxes in the dark ages, but its close enough for me! Heck, those diamond shark dice helped me win the AS tournament!

[Dark Jackal]

A Tactical Squad is $40 USD.  You might be checking the GW site for the wrong country, though even in AUD it's $65.

Seems like I had New Zealand selected for 75 dollars. Im actually surprised they're not that much cheaper being made over in that part of the world.

[pheonixstorm]

Ok, for those who think injection molds are expensive... It is a yes and no. See this here for a nice explanation on how molds are priced. https://rexplastics.com/plastic-injection-molds/how-much-do-plastic-injection-molds-cost

[tapdancingbeavers]

See, I do not see what the problem is with the Lance Pack plastics.  I thought they were very good and I am not sure a more expensive set was required.  I am also interested to see the update to the Catapult, Awesome and Commando because unlike some other though expressed here I did not think those minis were too bad . . .

I have 3 of the plastic lance packs and I think they are really good.  Multi-part, poseable ones would be nice (even just the arms) but I'm really happy with them and I think I'm pretty fussy.

[pheonixstorm]

I bought A LOT. I had thought 30+ originally but I know at least 20. Need to count all the stacks of cards I have. Most of them are still wrapped so should be easy enough.

[SCC]

More fiction in the works. The room had a fairly equal number of folks who liked anthologies and folks who liked novels. Who knows if that is representative of the feeling outside that room.

Personally, as someone wanting to get into BT fiction, there are more important categories then novel and anthology, like spine (Warrior Trilogy), side-story (Wolves on the Border, Heir to the Dragon), backstory (The most recent anthology, the one about a single Grasshopper) and filler (most of the Grey Death Saga). I'm not interested in this last, a seemingly never ending supply of stories about average Joe's, as long as it doesn't become something, those same Joe's managing to influence a large chunk of the IS (Grey Death #3) is not my cup of tea. Unfortunately it seems to be what half the novels are about judging by their write up on Sarna's list of novels.

I got both Combat Manuals and for me they were not meat or fish. They had very nice background and rules for the units, but without even victory conditions for the missions and pages after pages of list with mechs they gave me the feeling that a newbie would open them and finally put them into the shelve again, cause they looked like far away from the promise of a 'fast paced Alpha Strike' Battletech game. There was too much CBT and MW inside and not enough Tabletop content like a good (sry to say that) Space Marine Codex. AS needs to make a real and final step into a modern, easy to play tabletop game. Then, only then it will stand a chance on the market. Wall of text and lists of factors, mech versions etc. are contra productive.

'Mech bloat is a major issue, but I don't now if/when CGL will be able to address it, for some reason it seems like people will get upset if CGL tries to say that IntroTech units no longer see service with the IS or major Periphery nations.

[pheonixstorm]

That might work for the new era after the dark ages but doesn't work for everything. It is due to the size of the history of the game that the unit bloat will only continue. What worked for the Age of War won't always work for the 3rd Succession War. I believe part of the reason for the MUL is to organize everything and more or less list what is and isn't available for a given era to try and manage the bloat as best as possible.

[SCC]

pheonixstorm, that's correct, to an extent, but the Wasp-1A stays on the IS General list until Early Republic.

[Phobos101]

I have two of the plastic intro boxes (the outscale summoner/hellbringer one and the timberwolf/battlemaster one), and at least one of each lance pack, so I clearly have no gripe with the current plastics. Having said that, the sculpts are tired. They are the ones we have known and loved for three decades, but they are tired. Battletech does not exist in a vacuum, and has to compete for new players with miniature games offering some mind-blowingly good sculpts. Nobody is going to stop us using our tired old miniatures, but tired new miniatures WILL stop new players from buying the game.

Besides, if CGL and IWM are reintroducing the Classics (which look amazing, BTW), what better opportunity to freshen up the rest of the line to drag it (and us) it into the 21st century?

[Scotty]

I like the cut of your gib, sir.

[Major Headcase]

  I have 12 of the lance packs, and for the price I like the plastics in them. But! Would I be willing to pay more for well designed MODERN plastic resculpts? Hell yeah!
  I have written into my forces ALL of the mechs listed in the new sets that I was probably going to have to buy in metal for around $14 each (averaged out), so for $80-$85 I will get new beautiful mechs in plastic (easier to mod and customize, yay!!) Instead of $140 for metal sculpt I don't like as well.
   I am VERY happy with this new product, if it's final version is even close to the preview shown I will most definitely be buying more than one set of both!
   Good job Catalyst! I was getting worried for a while!  :P

[Bedwyr]

I have two of the plastic intro boxes (the outscale summoner/hellbringer one and the timberwolf/battlemaster one), and at least one of each lance pack, so I clearly have no gripe with the current plastics. Having said that, the sculpts are tired. They are the ones we have known and loved for three decades, but they are tired. Battletech does not exist in a vacuum, and has to compete for new players with miniature games offering some mind-blowingly good sculpts. Nobody is going to stop us using our tired old miniatures, but tired new miniatures WILL stop new players from buying the game.

Besides, if CGL and IWM are reintroducing the Classics (which look amazing, BTW), what better opportunity to freshen up the rest of the line to drag it (and us) it into the 21st century?

Miniatures are, after all, actors; they are characters in their own play. What you're describing is emoting and it's something the new images in the GenCon display case have in spades.

[Adrian Gideon]

Shadow Hawk and Catapult prototypes have arrived. I expect photos will trickle out soon.

[sadlerbw]

Here's one!

https://1drv.ms/i/s!ApDHaN8p702Hgg0GRapqSdSGz30Y

[Maingunnery]

Here's one!

https://1drv.ms/i/s!ApDHaN8p702Hgg0GRapqSdSGz30Y

Good picture.

The Catapult looks good, but I think that the cockpit windows need to be a bit deeper or the edge around the cockpit needs to be raised.

[Sentinel373]

Shadow Hawk and Catapult prototypes have arrived. I expect photos will trickle out soon.

Yess... literally handed in the catapult a few days ago so glad they managed to get it printed for the show :)

[Azakael]

Here's one!

https://1drv.ms/i/s!ApDHaN8p702Hgg0GRapqSdSGz30Y

::makes grabby hands::

Give it to us... we needs it we do.

[Dark Jackal]

'Mech bloat is a major issue, but I don't now if/when CGL will be able to address it, for some reason it seems like people will get upset if CGL tries to say that IntroTech units no longer see service with the IS or major Periphery nations.

There is also a Tech bloat along with the Mech bloat that needs to be sorted out. For all of the MegaMek games that I've played they were largely limited to strict Introductory Rules (old Level 1) or Strict Advanced (old Level 2). My buddies and myself refused to play with the Experimental Tech (Level 2+ or 3 depending on what we're talking about) as it ballooned the amount of game management and ruined the way we did campaigns. They exist in the universe but don't have a real fit other than being special which should be done better.

As far as Introductory rules, I feel that a few of the more "intermediate" things in limited doses should be moved to Introductory status where it makes sense and provide a bridge for players to work into Advanced Rules. The sudden jump from Level 1 Tech to Level 2/Clan invasion probably made sense back in the day when it came out as it was something new. Given that we're in 2017, the current Introductory rules and Tech now have to do more by being that bridge for new players to do more interesting strats beyond just learning the game mechanically. This is made more relevant with the Alpha Strike as the mechanics are easier to run someone through it so you could do some bridging without over burdening the player with vast tomes of knowledge. As an example of this bridge, I did like how some "prototype" equipment found itself in Sword and the Dragon. It was a good effort in trying to bridge the old with the new without the shock of Clan Tech being added to the mix. It would have been nice to have some elements of that in Introductory play do the same being limited by certain Mech configurations while expanding on the core gameplay.

[ColBosch]

Yess... literally handed in the catapult a few days ago so glad they managed to get it printed for the show :)

Did...did you give the Catty a waist? Can it finally torso twist!?

[Sentinel373]

Did...did you give the Catty a waist? Can it finally torso twist!?

indeed it does. it has a torso and a separate pelvis.

[SCC]

There is also a Tech bloat along with the Mech bloat that needs to be sorted out. For all of the MegaMek games that I've played they were largely limited to strict Introductory Rules (old Level 1) or Strict Advanced (old Level 2). My buddies and myself refused to play with the Experimental Tech (Level 2+ or 3 depending on what we're talking about) as it ballooned the amount of game management and ruined the way we did campaigns. They exist in the universe but don't have a real fit other than being special which should be done better.

Tech Bloat is a product of Mech Bloat, can't have new 'Mechs without new toys to put in them.

[Phobos101]

Yess... literally handed in the catapult a few days ago so glad they managed to get it printed for the show :)

I'm a fan of the current metal Catapult, so I'll admit I was a little apprehensive about this one. But you've nailed it. It actually looks like it weighs as much as a Thunderbolt now.  My hat off to you, sir.

[Sentinel373]

I'm a fan of the current metal Catapult, so I'll admit I was a little apprehensive about this one. But you've nailed it. It actually looks like it weighs as much as a Thunderbolt now.  My hat off to you, sir.

I cant take all the credit, Anthony Scroggins designed that catapult. i mere turned his 2d design into a 3d model.

[Mech42ace]

That is one beautiful Catapult. While I think that the original designs have their place, and always will, I whole heartedly support this move they're making. I'll probably try to get two of each box, my budget allowing when they release!

[SteveRestless]

See, I do not see what the problem is with the Lance Pack plastics. 

Well I can cite atleast one. None of them were Star Packs.