Author Topic: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette  (Read 47744 times)

Jim1701

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #30 on: 11 April 2012, 15:50:12 »
Interesting, trades specialty ammo for endurance, not a bad idea depending on the mission/usage.

Isn't that a bit ambitious for a Vedette?  Marketing it that way might dupe the crews into thinking they might survive a battle once in a while.   }:)

Diablo48

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #31 on: 11 April 2012, 16:09:18 »
I honestly can say,  I hope we don't.
The investment in retooling the factory to get a slightly better AC for what is supposed to be a cheap garrison unit is a waste of resources IMHO.

I actually like the idea of Dominion units being mixes of clan & is tech.
Front Line Omnimechs & Elementals while still using L1 tech Tanks & PBI for militia/PGC duties.

I know what you mean, and that was the reason I was thinking of sticking with standard components.  That lets you keep using IS production lines and just tacking on Clan made weapons at the end for a major performance boost with minimal cost.


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Colt Ward

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #32 on: 11 April 2012, 16:11:25 »
I honestly can say,  I hope we don't.
The investment in retooling the factory to get a slightly better AC for what is supposed to be a cheap garrison unit is a waste of resources IMHO.

I actually like the idea of Dominion units being mixes of clan & is tech.
Front Line Omnimechs & Elementals while still using L1 tech Tanks & PBI for militia/PGC duties.

Problem here is your wanting them to keep producing a standard IS AC/5 . . . which if something needs a gun, they will not want to mount on anything else.  The Bears are much better served by retooling any line that makes the AC/5 into a Clan LB-5X or Clan UAC/5- which can be podded for Omnis even!- than keep producing AC/5s.

Does this mean the Bears should refit old Vedettes with Clan LB-5X?  No . . . as you said that defeats the purpose.

Then again, I am thinking of having my mercs refit Vedettes . . . particularly to Fuel Cell power, LBX, MML and now the LPPC versions . . . though I only have 2 lances of Vedettes.

It does give me an idea for NPC opposition mercs though.
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Emil

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #33 on: 11 April 2012, 23:19:44 »
The Capellans presumably have a lot of these to go with their Pos.  How do they compare, and if you were an armor commander given a battalion of each, how would you utilize them?

chanman

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #34 on: 11 April 2012, 23:24:25 »
The Capellans presumably have a lot of these to go with their Pos.  How do they compare, and if you were an armor commander given a battalion of each, how would you utilize them?

Pos are the Shermans, Vedettes are the Stuarts :D

glitterboy2098

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #35 on: 12 April 2012, 00:43:07 »
Pos are the Shermans, Vedettes are the Stuarts :D

Po's are the Tiger I's, Vedettes are the Panzer IV's, Scorpions are the Panzer III's... and if you buiy your proxies from GHQ, that can be literal..  :)
« Last Edit: 12 April 2012, 00:46:59 by glitterboy2098 »

sandstorm

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #36 on: 12 April 2012, 01:05:32 »
You know? I started thinking what could be nasty surprise in Bear Vedette IIC.

Some way to stuff a HAG20 in there... Would need to do some serious weight-shavings all over, but it'd sure give some surprise 'Sya Hello to our little Firnds' moment for, say, a Robe unit with several vehicles... :D
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chanman

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #37 on: 12 April 2012, 01:38:29 »
I just want to point out that the 3058 Ultra model IS the one made by Hellespont.
The article seems to imply otherwise.
Though it doesn't look like they made it for long since they swapped to LBX a decade later.


It's not mentioned which variant Hellespont was originally licensed to produce, or if it was licensed to produce all of the existing variants up to that point. TRO3058U specifies that the LB-5x variant is a Hellespont creation sold exclusively to Trinity Alliance members though.

It would make good ranged support for the equally basic Pos. Cluster death!

One other thing I didn't touch on - the SRM-2 on the AC/2 version is good for setting fire to things if you're using the supposedly rare inferno ammo. Aside from that... frag grounds for riot control, I suppose.
« Last Edit: 12 April 2012, 01:40:06 by chanman »

Diablo48

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #38 on: 12 April 2012, 01:51:18 »
You know? I started thinking what could be nasty surprise in Bear Vedette IIC.

Some way to stuff a HAG20 in there... Would need to do some serious weight-shavings all over, but it'd sure give some surprise 'Sya Hello to our little Firnds' moment for, say, a Robe unit with several vehicles... :D

That would work as well, although it might draw more attention than the Vedette can take.  Of course, that does mean your less expendable units are not taking as much fire and it would fit with the typical Clan vehicle strategy of having more guns than sense so I could definitely see it happening.  It would not even take that much effort because the HAG is lighter than the LGR (although the ammo does make up the difference) and we already have a canon LGR variant to work from.


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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #39 on: 12 April 2012, 02:01:36 »
Any guess on why there isn't a LPPC variant yet?

They're all in use on more survivable platforms.  Like the Stinger.
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chanman

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #40 on: 12 April 2012, 02:12:33 »
Standard AC/5s let you use flechette ammo. Oppress your peasantry more efficiently!

Sabelkatten

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #41 on: 12 April 2012, 03:21:58 »
You know? I started thinking what could be nasty surprise in Bear Vedette IIC.

Some way to stuff a HAG20 in there... Would need to do some serious weight-shavings all over, but it'd sure give some surprise 'Sya Hello to our little Firnds' moment for, say, a Robe unit with several vehicles... :D
Heck, replace the engine with a FCE and you should be able to stuff a HAG40 in there! ;D

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #42 on: 12 April 2012, 05:00:15 »
As far as the Vedette goes, I think the LPPC+5HS swap and a bitty power amp is brilliant.  It still leaves you half a ton to use on other things, and since heat isn't a concern for tanks there's no reason NOT to shoot - even on 12s.
Full ton, the turret a half lighter due to the reduced WEAPON weight

Clan variant would use UAC-5, then there would be ammo and parts floating around for it, plus the retooled line could be used for REAL Clan Warrior weapons, instead of having to import them from the homeworlds

Deadborder

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #43 on: 12 April 2012, 06:41:39 »
I tolled up a Vedette variant with a LAC-5 and a trio of RL-15s in the turret. Lost some range, gained some quick and nasty firepower. After all, its dead anyway, so a one-shot sting isn't going to hurt.
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glitterboy2098

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #44 on: 12 April 2012, 10:54:33 »
Problem here is your wanting them to keep producing a standard IS AC/5 . . . which if something needs a gun, they will not want to mount on anything else.  The Bears are much better served by retooling any line that makes the AC/5 into a Clan LB-5X or Clan UAC/5- which can be podded for Omnis even!- than keep producing AC/5s.
in the homeworlds, the clans continued to use unmodified SLDF mechs, vehicles, and fighters in their second line and Solhama units, all the way to the Wars of Rieving. so a clan continuing to produce 'lower tech' IS weapons has a precedent.
for the bears, IS weapons are cheaper and less resource intensive to produce, so leaving some factories to make them actually helps them, since they can continue to support the FRR gear they inherited.

va_wanderer

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #45 on: 12 April 2012, 12:32:25 »
Honestly, the tech "upgrade" the Vedette probably needs are things like the LAC, or for fancy folks the LPPC version mentioned above.

Or a RAC/2. It'd probably last about as long on ammo as the tank armor does.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #46 on: 12 April 2012, 13:13:13 »
Honestly, I wouldn't upgrade the Vedette, I'd just use 50% more fo them.  Given that they have comperitively decent range and speed, they actualy have aged better than many other tanks from the era; they're still about as problematic as they've always been.

In my eye, though, the Vedette is in a way one of the most important tanks, and its role in relation to other tanks that get more table top time is important.  One view, that I tend to hold, is that most of the huge armor formations we see in the 3020s are Vedette-type tanks (or Scorpion types, or Harassers or the like).  The mega hundreds of conventional regements every house fields haven't replaced mechs because they're mostly full of lack luster cannon fodder tanks, and not the Patons and Rommels and Pos and Demolishers and whatever that players actualy tend to use. Depending on what you think the ratio of terrable tanks to good tanks is changes the nature of how things are, and what the place of mechs on the battlefield is.

As for new ones... I don't mind the UAC one, since the UAC is a pretty lack luster weapon and so it feels 'right' on a Vedette.  Plus, its been around a decade longer than the LB (which is more desirable on the whole) and its popularity has fallen off a lot since its introduction (when new toy syndrome propelled it into a lot of unsuitable roles) so it should be pretty common. 

Some of the hyper advanced ones almost seem like that would be fun as supprises, if you hid your record sheets and just told your opponent (in the appropreate senerio-type setting) 'you're facing some Vedettes' and you mixed a few awesome ones into some regular ones.  Supprise!  This one has a pile of armor and a GR or RAC.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #47 on: 12 April 2012, 13:23:15 »
I will be looking forward to a Fuel Cell + Heavy Rifle + MG version in a future XTRO-Militia... particularly for the Capellan Home Guard units facing those hordes of AFFS Battle Armor.  O0

A company of Vedette's mixed with Myrmadon's as command tanks is about adequate to fight off most battlemech lances. A mix of eighteen AC/5, LB/5X, PPCs on regular gunners can be pretty devastating.
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Diablo48

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #48 on: 12 April 2012, 16:57:42 »
in the homeworlds, the clans continued to use unmodified SLDF mechs, vehicles, and fighters in their second line and Solhama units, all the way to the Wars of Rieving. so a clan continuing to produce 'lower tech' IS weapons has a precedent.
for the bears, IS weapons are cheaper and less resource intensive to produce, so leaving some factories to make them actually helps them, since they can continue to support the FRR gear they inherited.

Use and produce are two different things.  The Homeworld Clans have not produced IS-level tech in centuries and only pull it out of storage when they have no other choice so it makes sense that it would come out during the WoR when they need every fighting machine they can get no matter how bad it is.

As for the Bears, they are not maintaining their IS gear any more than they have to as they try to get it all replaced with Clan tech equipment.  The reason they are still using it is because they have been too busy to fully upgrade and need to press everything they can into service to make up for losses during the Jihad.

Honestly, I wouldn't upgrade the Vedette, I'd just use 50% more fo them.  Given that they have comperitively decent range and speed, they actualy have aged better than many other tanks from the era; they're still about as problematic as they've always been.

That was why I was thinking of doing as little as possible with a simple weapon swap.  According to the numbers on Sarna, it should cost about 150,000 to upgrade from the old gun to a Clan LBX model which brings the overall cost from about 725,000 to a bit under 900,000 so you would only be loosing one tank out of every 5 or 6 to get the better gun.  When you consider how much more useful that makes the vehicle, how much easier it becomes to get anti-air rounds, and the fact that it simplifies logistics by eliminating an obsolete IS weapon from use I can easily see the Bears implementing some minimal upgrades to new builds.


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Der Kommissar

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #49 on: 12 April 2012, 20:18:47 »
Certainly, the Bears aren't afraid to invest in (very expensive) upgrades on IS vehicles where they see the merit.  See the Axel IIC.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #50 on: 12 April 2012, 22:06:09 »
Isn't that a bit ambitious for a Vedette?  Marketing it that way might dupe the crews into thinking they might survive a battle once in a while.   }:) 

LMAO !!   Touche my friend  ;)


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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #51 on: 12 April 2012, 22:12:32 »
It's not mentioned which variant Hellespont was originally licensed to produce, or if it was licensed to produce all of the existing variants up to that point. TRO3058U specifies that the LB-5x variant is a Hellespont creation sold exclusively to Trinity Alliance members though.

Directly from the fluff

Quote
     The new Vedette is a simple, cost-effective upgrade that features performance and survivability considerably superior to its progenitor. To increase the tank's survivability, Hellespont gained additional armor tonnage by removing the light machine gun and replacing the standard armor with the locally produced ferro-fibrous Hellespont Lite. This modification provides the tank with 20 percent more armor protection. Hellespont also exchanged the Armstrong J11 autocannon for an Imperator Ultra series gun. This improvement in firepower allows the crew to attack with an increased rate of fire and at greater ranges than previously possible.

Its pretty clear, the 3058 (Ultra) model is a Hellespont creation initially.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #52 on: 12 April 2012, 22:14:42 »
That would work as well, although it might draw more attention than the Vedette can take.  Of course, that does mean your less expendable units are not taking as much fire and it would fit with the typical Clan vehicle strategy of having more guns than sense so I could definitely see it happening.  It would not even take that much effort because the HAG is lighter than the LGR (although the ammo does make up the difference) and we already have a canon LGR variant to work from.

The flaw I see with a HAG version is the same w/ the RAC5 & LGR ones the IS makes,  too much gun, not enough Armor,  glass canons.
Tanks are already destroyed easier & harder to salvage than mechs.
Skimping on the Armor just makes the problem worse.

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #53 on: 12 April 2012, 22:31:22 »
for the bears, IS weapons are cheaper and less resource intensive to produce, so leaving some factories to make them actually helps them, since they can continue to support the FRR gear they inherited.
This is my point.
They already have a factory that produces simple tanks in large #s.
Refitting it stops production, and then the clan tech version is likely produced in smaller #s over all since clan tech is a higher grade of material.
And all the parts are already in production at FRR factories so its not like they are having any issue keeping up w/ replacement "old tech" parts like they would in the Homeworlds.


Use and produce are two different things.  The Homeworld Clans have not produced IS-level tech in centuries and only pull it out of storage when they have no other choice so it makes sense that it would come out during the WoR when they need every fighting machine they can get no matter how bad it is. 

As for the Bears, they are not maintaining their IS gear any more than they have to as they try to get it all replaced with Clan tech equipment.  The reason they are still using it is because they have been too busy to fully upgrade and need to press everything they can into service to make up for losses during the Jihad. 

That was why I was thinking of doing as little as possible with a simple weapon swap.  According to the numbers on Sarna, it should cost about 150,000 to upgrade from the old gun to a Clan LBX model which brings the overall cost from about 725,000 to a bit under 900,000 so you would only be loosing one tank out of every 5 or 6 to get the better gun.  When you consider how much more useful that makes the vehicle, how much easier it becomes to get anti-air rounds, and the fact that it simplifies logistics by eliminating an obsolete IS weapon from use I can easily see the Bears implementing some minimal upgrades to new builds.

The issue I see here is no matter how simple a refit you make it, you've now stuck advanced clan tech on a budget tank assigned to militia.  Which now means that all those militias have to have techs trained to fix a clan tech weapon system.  Where before they could get by w/ the knowledge slightly more than a typical automechanic.  Look at how the Dragoons earned major bank by teaching techs from everywhere how to maintain the small amount of clan tech captured by combat units.  Many units just sold it to the House for advanced IS stuff that they could work on.
Clearly this stuff has some major differences in it if people couldn't fix it that were trained in fixing "similar" models of IS tech.

You mention C-bills but a Clan LB5X & IS LB5X cost the same price.  Or do they ?  Sure the game gives them the same cost but then tells us how Clan tech goes for 4-10x or more on the black market.  Or how the NAIS can duplicate a Clan ERML but it costs MILLIONS to do so instead of a few thousand, or days/weeks to complete a single weapon instead of hours. 

I see this as something that sounds all good OOC but IC the "fluff" would make it a much more complex, time consuming, & expensive.  Sure it will be easier for the Bears but even w/ the knowledge to make something doesn't mean the final production will be as fast.  Maybe the factory takes 2x as long to make the clan version, etc etc.  Which is all fine an exceptable for a MadDog or T-Wolf,  but I'm thinking I want my Vedettes to be as numerous as possible supporting my legions of infantry.
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Diablo48

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #54 on: 13 April 2012, 04:31:42 »
The flaw I see with a HAG version is the same w/ the RAC5 & LGR ones the IS makes,  too much gun, not enough Armor,  glass canons.
Tanks are already destroyed easier & harder to salvage than mechs.
Skimping on the Armor just makes the problem worse.

I fully agree and explicitly mentioned in the post you quoted that I was concerned about the HAG drawing more attention than the armor could take.  Really, the only reason I could see it happening at all is because the Clans have a bad habit of doing that to every tank they make so a suicidally over gunned variant would fit right in.

This is my point.
They already have a factory that produces simple tanks in large #s.
Refitting it stops production, and then the clan tech version is likely produced in smaller #s over all since clan tech is a higher grade of material.
And all the parts are already in production at FRR factories so its not like they are having any issue keeping up w/ replacement "old tech" parts like they would in the Homeworlds.

The thing is, we know the Bears have been trying to shift fully to Clan tech because it is much better and no harder for them to produce or maintain with their knowledge base.

Quote
The issue I see here is no matter how simple a refit you make it, you've now stuck advanced clan tech on a budget tank assigned to militia.  Which now means that all those militias have to have techs trained to fix a clan tech weapon system.  Where before they could get by w/ the knowledge slightly more than a typical automechanic.  Look at how the Dragoons earned major bank by teaching techs from everywhere how to maintain the small amount of clan tech captured by combat units.  Many units just sold it to the House for advanced IS stuff that they could work on.
Clearly this stuff has some major differences in it if people couldn't fix it that were trained in fixing "similar" models of IS tech.

That was within the confines of the IS where no one else knew how to fix it.  That gave the Dragoons a monopoly so they could quite literally charge whatever they wanted and the IS houses would have to pay it if they wanted to be able to maintain Clan tech.  The Bears are Clan so they already have a working knowledge of the equipment and will think nothing of sending out instructions or trainers to bring their techs up to speed on the one or two new weapons they are being issued.  Given that properly trained techs do not have any more difficulty working with Clan tech than IS tech, I think it is very clear that once the extra bit of training has been completed there will be no significant maintenance difference between the two.

Also, I find your comment that the techs working on IS gear can get by with "knowledge slightly more than a typical automechanic" laughably absurd because every combat vehicle has a complex set of fire control electronics, shells filled with dangerous explosives, armor that absolutely must be properly maintained and fitted after being removed to work on the internals, and advanced weapons (yes, even the AC/5 counts).  Even the militia techs need special training to work on combat vehicles, so adding the maintenance of a few basic Clan tech weapons to their training program would not be that hard to do.

Quote
You mention C-bills but a Clan LB5X & IS LB5X cost the same price.  Or do they ?  Sure the game gives them the same cost but then tells us how Clan tech goes for 4-10x or more on the black market.  Or how the NAIS can duplicate a Clan ERML but it costs MILLIONS to do so instead of a few thousand, or days/weeks to complete a single weapon instead of hours.

That is all for IS factions which are making the weapons by hand and have no idea how the Clans manufacture them on assembly lines.  We know the Clans can mass produce their own weapons without too much trouble, and the Bears have a history of refitting IS production lines to produce Clan tech so assuming IS prices is absurd.

Quote
I see this as something that sounds all good OOC but IC the "fluff" would make it a much more complex, time consuming, & expensive.  Sure it will be easier for the Bears but even w/ the knowledge to make something doesn't mean the final production will be as fast.  Maybe the factory takes 2x as long to make the clan version, etc etc.  Which is all fine an exceptable for a MadDog or T-Wolf,  but I'm thinking I want my Vedettes to be as numerous as possible supporting my legions of infantry.

Not really.  You just set up a new 5-X line in parallel to the existing lines so you can switch over the gun once it comes online and scale it to match the vehicle production rate.  Then you go ahead and retool the old AC 5 line to produce UAC 5's so you can mount both weapons and expand the vehicle line to make more tanks to use the new guns, bring in old vehicles for an upgrade, or send them off to be used in other units.  The actual process of changing the vehicle will be very quick because it is essentially a one-for-one swap on the weapons, and if you have a pile of spare UAC 5's or 5-X's lying around you can even switch over the vehicle line before you get the cannon line running to get the improved vehicles coming off the line a bit early.  The result is a plan that is easy to implement with virtually no downtime on the production line, has a series of easy implementation stages, increases overall production capabilities, and does not cost all that much.


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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #55 on: 13 April 2012, 07:26:40 »
One thing on the 'too much gun' argument?

Do you think anyone complains about having too much gun when the Robes are setting stuff aflame with nuclear weapons. An IS Clan like the Bears is one of the prime targets for WoB Temper Tantrum Strategy, so they might find it worth the while to have as much hit-power as possible in the defensive formations. Having a HAG-20 in Vedette also helps with the chronically low-skilled Clan vehicle crews giving them a littl better chance at hitting.

Sure, if I had suggested a Vedette IIC at 100 tons with triple-HAG40 turret and XLFE, it'd be silly. But putting a HAG20 into a defensive vehicle that is likely to be facing WoB units? Makes sense to help the guys hit what they are aiming at and make it count.

One could turn Vedette into a brick, shifting the armor up like crazy, to some 20% of total weight, if one wants. It still wouldn't b that ffective, and the crew would still be major expendable. With more gun, at least they can make themselves somewhat useful.
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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #56 on: 13 April 2012, 07:58:16 »
I agree, it would seem a logical Ghost Bear upgrade. :)

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #57 on: 13 April 2012, 17:32:51 »
This is my point.
They already have a factory that produces simple tanks in large #s.
Refitting it stops production, and then the clan tech version is likely produced in smaller #s over all since clan tech is a higher grade of material.
And all the parts are already in production at FRR factories so its not like they are having any issue keeping up w/ replacement "old tech" parts like they would in the Homeworlds.


The issue I see here is no matter how simple a refit you make it, you've now stuck advanced clan tech on a budget tank assigned to militia.  Which now means that all those militias have to have techs trained to fix a clan tech weapon system.  Where before they could get by w/ the knowledge slightly more than a typical automechanic.  Look at how the Dragoons earned major bank by teaching techs from everywhere how to maintain the small amount of clan tech captured by combat units.  Many units just sold it to the House for advanced IS stuff that they could work on.
Clearly this stuff has some major differences in it if people couldn't fix it that were trained in fixing "similar" models of IS tech.

You mention C-bills but a Clan LB5X & IS LB5X cost the same price.  Or do they ?  Sure the game gives them the same cost but then tells us how Clan tech goes for 4-10x or more on the black market.  Or how the NAIS can duplicate a Clan ERML but it costs MILLIONS to do so instead of a few thousand, or days/weeks to complete a single weapon instead of hours. 

I see this as something that sounds all good OOC but IC the "fluff" would make it a much more complex, time consuming, & expensive.  Sure it will be easier for the Bears but even w/ the knowledge to make something doesn't mean the final production will be as fast.  Maybe the factory takes 2x as long to make the clan version, etc etc.  Which is all fine an exceptable for a MadDog or T-Wolf,  but I'm thinking I want my Vedettes to be as numerous as possible supporting my legions of infantry.

Do the Clans also not make the Zorya?  The only advanced thing on that unit is the weaponry, the rest from the ICE powerplant to the token armor is all standard.
Saying that because the equipment isn't up-to-the-minute, bleeding-edge tech therefore not a threat is like saying an M2 Browning isn't dangerous to modern infantry because it is 100 years old.

Hellraiser

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #58 on: 13 April 2012, 20:51:25 »
That is all for IS factions which are making the weapons by hand and have no idea how the Clans manufacture them on assembly lines.  We know the Clans can mass produce their own weapons without too much trouble, and the Bears have a history of refitting IS production lines to produce Clan tech so assuming IS prices is absurd.

Can they ?  I'm serious.  Think about it.  The entirety of clan society is based on a don't waste anything philosophy.  Only the Warrior Caste sees any extravagance.  Warriors themselves are less than a fraction of 1% of all people in the Homeworlds.  They have training that kills or disqualifies some 95%+ of all trainees.  The other castes are left to die w/o food/medicine as soon as they can no longer keep up their quota at their job.  Warriors fight over the privelage of piloting an Omnimech.  Garrison units are stuck using SLDF tech because they can't outfit everyone with even Standard Clan Tech Mechs, let alone Omnimechs.  And yet, they can mass produce Clan Tech all willynilly better than the IS can produce L1 Tanks ?   Really ?  That makes sense to you ?  That the Bears have mastered producing clan tech compared to the NAIS I can buy.  That they can crank out just as many Clan Versions of something compared to IS-L1/L2 Versions?  Nope, I don't buy that for even a second.  Something is holding them back or they would be sitting around with warehouses full of Timberwolves instead of making SFE anythings.  Yet we constantly see how limited production in the clans really is in the way they have to trial against each other for any production output they can get.  Yes, the Bears moved a few Million of their own people to the OZ and its likely that a few thousand of them are trained in Clan Tech Weapons Maintenance.  But compare that to the BILLIONS of people that live in the FRR/GBD.  Like I said above, I think its a good idea to keep some things totally IS tech based that can be easily maintained by units w/o any access to advanced training techniques.   But hey, opinions vary.


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Jim1701

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Re: Vehicle of the Week: Vedette
« Reply #59 on: 13 April 2012, 22:52:07 »
Don't sugar coat it tell us how you really feel.   O:-)

Seriously though, I would have to agree.  While it may be possible that they could refit Vedettes with Clan tech but I just cannot see them wanting too.  Except for the Hell Horses vehicles are units no khan is going to waste time upgrading unless it is convenient.  I'm sure the Ghost Bears have plenty of other things to concentrate their resources on. 

 

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