Death of the Ghost Bears?

[Sjhernan3060]

IF the homeworld clans ever do invade and if they come the same way wouldn't the Ghostbears be the logical target of their aggression? As I would assume the strongest invader but who has also integrated the most with the IS aren't they the most " tainted" of clans?

[snewsom2997]

I would say yes, They would be the logical choice for the 3050 HW Clans, however for the 3150 HW Clans, I don't think they are seeking honorable combat, just genocide. In which case they would bypass the strongest Clan and hit the Weakened Lyrans, and the Denuded DCMS Border, then surround and suffocate the Bears, Falcons and Horses.

Clans Wolf, Sea Fox and Snow Raven being quite removed from the invasion corridor, would take longer if ever.

[Natasha Kerensky]

If any strategic planner has half a brain, they'll invade and run redundant supply lines through unoccupied systems, bypassing the enemy units, strongpoints, borders, and populations they don't care about.  Especially after the Blakies repeatedly showed how to do it during the Jihad.

And even if no one takes that page out of the Blakie playbook again, I doubt we'll see Operation Revival Mk. II.  The Adders are (supposed to be) smarter than that.

I would also not be surprised to find out that the Homeworld Clans never invade the Inner Sphere.

The Bastion and Aggressor ideologies are diametrically opposed on the question of invasion but the Aggressors are open to the use of total warfare.  If those factions went to war over whether to invade and pulled out the WMDs, there would be no invasion.  They'd knock each other back into the Stone Age.

And if the Bastion ideology continues to be dominant in the Homeworlds and subjugates the Aggressors (bloodlessly or otherwise), there will also be no invasion.  The Bastions are isolationists.

The only way there is an invasion is if the Aggressors gain the upper hand in the Homeworlds.  Last we knew, they did not have it, and the effort necessary to gain it may forestall invasion forever.

Like the Outbound Light falling into Jaguar hands, I think it will take a deus ex machina to get the Homeworlds to mount an invasion without falling into another round of crippling internecine warfare.  And maybe that's what Banacek had planned.

FWIW...

[Tyler Jorgensson]

Plus someone should remember not to poke the Bears: sure the Bears are human like everyone else but you don't want to be on the receiving end of their fury. Ask the Combine, the Blakists, and the Nova Cats.

The Bears make the logical choice only if they want to target one of the larger Clans. If they want to target weaker clans they target the Horses or Falcons. They smash apart Foxes in the Isles and the Scorpions in the Imperio first.

Of course this is all predicated on what Natasha said: if the Bastions and Agressors don't murder each other first and IF they have scouts telling them the status of the Sphere

[Wrangler]

I'd like point out something.  Having read more recent information about the Ghost Bears /Ghost Bear Dominion/Rasalhague Dominion.  The Clan itself is for the most part intact despite it's Inner Sphere outer coating.  Warriors political culture got more Conservative as later Dark Ages hit.  Thus why Omega Galaxy was not pursued when it went "native" in the short lived Vega Protectorate.  If one the Clans has stayed more or less what they were, it's Ghost Bears.  Their not dead, their  Armageddon waiting to happen should someone try to poke them in the side.

If the IClan thing happens and there invasion from Clan Home Space, these guys could be vulnerable should the it be powerful invasion while the Frontline troops of the Bears is focused to core of the Inner Sphere.

[Nightgaun7]

It's gonna be really sweet when one of those Levs suffers a misjump.

[Jellico]

Total Warfare in BT is terrifying and arguably no one has done it yet. That includes WoB.

The realistic space defences of a world like Alshain is 150 ASF. If the attacker is notably larger than that mukes are the only logical response. The defenders will have the time to make that decision.

[Sjhernan3060]

I agree - my question was if the Aggressors attack would they see the Bears as the most " tainted" 

I'd like point out something.  Having read more recent information about the Ghost Bears /Ghost Bear Dominion/Rasalhague Dominion.  The Clan itself is for the most part intact despite it's Inner Sphere outer coating.  Warriors political culture got more Conservative as later Dark Ages hit.  Thus why Omega Galaxy was not pursued when it went "native" in the short lived Vega Protectorate.  If one the Clans has stayed more or less what they were, it's Ghost Bears.  Their not dead, their  Armageddon waiting to happen should someone try to poke them in the side.

If the IClan thing happens and there invasion from Clan Home Space, these guys could be vulnerable should the it be powerful invasion while the Frontline troops of the Bears is focused to core of the Inner Sphere.

[Sharpnel]

I agree - my question was if the Aggressors attack would they see the Bears as the most " tainted"

Yes. No exposition needed.

[Wrangler]

I agree - my question was if the Aggressors attack would they see the Bears as the most " tainted" 

Yes. No exposition needed.

Before my keyboard went haywire, I totally agree with Sharpnel.  Way the Clans were behaving after the last of the Invaders where kicked out painted the picture of anyone who had gone to the Inner Sphere was considered to be tainted.

I believe the Star Adders (lead Home Clan), kept the later (insane) Steel Vipers mentality of taint to unify the last of the Home Clans and steel them up for long recovery and reconstruction effort they had all faced in the decades to come.

[Maingunnery]

I don't think that the HW Clans will ever return to the IS, they might expand into the Imperio, but then again they might decide to have another exodus to get even farther away (and find better worlds).

[Jellico]

It all depends on how hard they come back.


Sneak WMD planet depopulating attacks. Yep. They will wipe out the Dominion's ability to respond and the Dominion will go down.

That is not much of a game or story and ends with the rest of the Sphere going on a snake hunt.

If they don't it gets interesting. If the defender knows what is coming they can respond in kind. Provided that they are not distracted the Dominion can probably survive it. If push comes to shove the Rasalhagians will be willing to fight and can be militarized in numbers the Homeworlds can't match. The Dominions credit is good so even the loss of factories is meaningless. The neighbors will be happy to keep the Dominion fighting.

The end result is ugly beyond anything we have seen but the Homeworlds will go down in a sea of Rasalhagian blood.

Of course the other option is that the Homeworlds aren't as hardcore as they pretend and there will be the usual back and forth and return to status quo.

[Stormlion1]

The Ghost Bears are the largest Inner Sphere based Clan and even after the Jihad they could easily counter the largest Homeworld Clan, the Star Adders. And the Star Adders would be fighting the Bears in there home territory so I think they would get chewed up and spit out very quickly.

[Foxx Ital]

Didn't the bears spend sime time helping set uo their periphery boarder with mini casle brians or something? I also remember doing some weird stuff in the peperiphary post jihad where a warrior had to apologize to a wanna be clan ruling family.

[Stormlion1]

When did Vega join the Dominion? I'm not sure how I missed that.

[Jaim Magnus]

When did Vega join the Dominion? I'm not sure how I missed that.

It was part of the update in FM and ER 3145. Absorbed into the Dominion on 6 June 3144.

[Gaiiten]

I don't think that the HW Clans will ever return to the IS, they might expand into the Imperio, but then again they might decide to have another exodus to get even farther away (and find better worlds).

This would be something I would like to see:
A new and mighty Deep Space power, an evolution of the Homeclans.

And then the Inner Sphere goes nuts and attacks them - big mistake and the beginning of an interstellar deep space war.

[Stormlion1]

It was part of the update in FM and ER 3145. Absorbed into the Dominion on 6 June 3144.

Thanks, I have some rereading to do.