MotW: Gyrfalcon

[UnLimiTeD]

I think we've found the perfect target for a Celerity CLR-05-X... maybe the Republic should give that Celerity variant the nickname "Bird Dog".

I've been thinking that through the entire thread.
"So there's a mech with reflective armour that wants to have 25 hexes clear line of fire.....  Works for me!"
Of course, they'd still be hard to hit. And the TC version would probably waste the drone before it gets there; BT doesn't simulate inertia well.
Beautiful mech, looks aside.

[Caedis Animus]

I mean, the look on the Gyrfalcon Mechwarrior's face would be priceless in the instant before the Celerity hit.

What, mouthing "Oh fudge" right before they realize why the Falcons should make like Clan Wolf and wear brown pants? Or screaming in classic super-villain fashion? "This cannot be!"

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I think that the Falcons deliberately breed warriors for the screaming phenotype.

[misterpants]

Sadly, that phenotype was meant to be the other half of a weapons program but Scientist Anderson botched the late Scientist Herbert's original weirding module prototype beyond recognition.

[sadlerbw]

I've been wondering how a fight between this mech and a Vulpes would go. They both have double clan ERLLs as their primary and are fast for their size. They have different backup weapons, and the Vulpes can't jump, but has stealth armor, while the Gyr has reflec. I'm thinking the Gyr has the advantage, taking only half damage from the dual ER larges, but the Vulpes should have slightly better to-hit mods at range. The other thing that leans in the gyrfalcons favor is the huge IS XXL engine in the Vulpes.

Still, both are surprisingly similar mechs that do about the same job. They just picked very different 'flavors' along the way.

[Scotty]

The Gyrfalcon has a significant advantage in heat dissipation that will let it keep up better firepower over time.  I think that will be the deciding factor.

[marauder648]

Or screaming in classic super-villain fashion? "This cannot be!"

Like this chap here - https://youtu.be/LQSxOACu2gA?t=60

But the Gyrfalcon is a mean lil thing, and if played right, an absolute nightmare.  Its weird though that the Falcons with their four Totems seem to have gone for a very deliberate Long range/short range mix.  Both the Jade Hawk and the Eyrie are built to go KA-KAW MOTHER HUBBARD!!!!  Whilst punching and kicking you to death at point blank or closer range, whilst the Shrike and Gyrfalcon engage you when they are but a blip on the horizon.  (although i'm not too sure on the Shrike...Hellbie will you be doing a review on the big IMMA BURD! Mech of the Falcon totem range?)

[Kojak]

You know what I'd send to fight these, actually? The Scarabus 9T. It can run circles around it, and the combo of melee attacks and TAG-guided artillery will totally shred a Gyrfalcon.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Given the change made to the rules with Homing artillery shells, you still would have to anticipate which direction it's likely to go.

Since Homing rounds deal all their damage to a single hit location, are they still considered an AoE attack for the purposes of Reflective Armor?

[Firesprocket]

Since Homing rounds deal all their damage to a single hit location, are they still considered an AoE attack for the purposes of Reflective Armor?

I can't see why they wouldn't be.  Arrow IV homing rounds still do 5 damage to anything else located in the hex which would be AE.

[Caedis Animus]

Actually, is reflective armor's AoE weakness also considered in Ammo Explosion AoEs and M-Pods, or is it artillery only?

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

IIRC it's attacks that strike the entire hex.

[Scotty]

Damage from falls, physical attacks, moving through buildings, and area of effect weapons (such as artillery).  If the weapon has the AE tag on it, it deals double damage to Reflective Armor.

[Caedis Animus]

But ammo explosions aren't weapons. But IIRC they still deal AE damage, at least under some special rule somewhere.

[Terrace]

Ok, so check my math here.

-C3 Berserker with TSM activated. That's 40 damage swings. Count the double damage from Reflective Armor, and that Berserker will be outputting enough damage from it's Hatchet to kill a Gyrfalcon with one hit to the center torso, right?

[Liam's Ghost]

Ok, so check my math here.

-C3 Berserker with TSM activated. That's 40 damage swings. Count the double damage from Reflective Armor, and that Berserker will be outputting enough damage from it's Hatchet to kill a Gyrfalcon with one hit to the center torso, right?

It'd be a kill even without reflec. The existing Gyrfalcons all have no more than 39 armor and internal structure points in the center torso.

[Terrace]

It'd be a kill even without reflec. The existing Gyrfalcons all have no more than 39 armor and internal structure points in the center torso.

Oh, my. And if it doesn't hit the center torso, something's getting lopped off?

Of course, if you manage to get a Berserker into melee range with a Gyrfalcon, either you've done something right, or your opponent has done something very, very wrong. Either way, why don't you punish him for it?  >:D

[Liam's Ghost]

There's no greater argument in favor of the Gyrfalcon's armament than giant Lyran mechs wielding axes.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Oh, my. And if it doesn't hit the center torso, something's getting lopped off?

Quite possibly multiple somethings are getting lopped off.  The arms have 15 points of armor with 9 points of structure while the side torsos have 16 armor and 13 structure.  A 40 point hit to an undamaged arm will transfer all the way to the center torso and strip more than half the armor off it.

[SteelRaven]

Hell, one unnoticed Urbanmech or Hollander will be the start of a very bad day for a Gyrfalcon.

[Scotty]

Neither of those things can one-shot a Gyrfalcon without doing it the old fashioned way, so neither of those things is particularly terrifying.  Once they've been identified, it's 7-hex jumps until long range, and then pick off with ER Larges.

Then again, that's basically the modus operandi for Gyrfalcons against anything, because they can do it reliably against 90% of the units in the game.

[SteelRaven]

I didn't say one shot it, just hurt it. Bad enough, the next mach's chances are looking aloot better.


 

 

[wantec]

Ok, so check my math here.

-C3 Berserker with TSM activated. That's 40 damage swings. Count the double damage from Reflective Armor, and that Berserker will be outputting enough damage from it's Hatchet to kill a Gyrfalcon with one hit to the center torso, right?

Not quite. The double damage only works for the armor, not the internal structure too (unless it's composite IS, which it isn't in this case). Every point of damage from that 40-point TSM hatchet strike will cross off 2 points of armor, but only one point of IS. If you have an odd number of armor points it doesn't carry over to the IS. For example, 19 points of reflective armor and 5 points of IS will cost 10 points of physical damage. Also, 20 points of reflective armor and 5 points of IS will cost 10 points of physical damage as well.

[mbear]

This marks the first time anyone has said anything positive about a Mjolnir.

They'd be great on Jim Henson's Berzerker Babies cartoon.  ;) Though if they'd fitted Endo Steel or XL to free some weight and install a Supercharger, they'd be better.

I think that the Falcons deliberately breed warriors for the screaming phenotype.

Battlefields are loud, and you don't always remember your ear protection. So you'd need to scream and shout to get someone's attention. Noise Induced Hearing loss is a pain.

Of course, if you manage to get a Berserker into melee range with a Gyrfalcon, either you've done something right, or your opponent has done something very, very wrong. Either way, why don't you punish him for it?  >:D

It's a BattleTech Teachable Moment that you'll talk about for years. Like Hellbie dice and punching VTOLs.

But back on topic, the Rommel Howitzer would seem to be a good counter to this unit. You don't need to be too accurate, and even a nearby hit is going to inflict some damage. Speaking of which, if the artillery shell lands in the hex next to the Gyrfalcon, does the shell inflict double damage? I assume so because

In ground combat, Artillery Cannon attacks may be resolved normally or using the rules for indirect LRM fire (see p. 111, TW), but deliver damage to both the target’s hex and all adjacent hexes in accordance with the standard rules for artillery damage

And

Artillery Cannons may only use standard Artillery Cannon munitions. As area-effect weapons, Artillery Cannons cannot benefit from the use of a Targeting Computer.

[JadeHellbringer]

There's no greater argument in favor of the Gyrfalcon's armament than giant Lyran mechs wielding axes.

Dig up Aleks Hazen and draw him a picture explaining this, would you?  [madflame]

(Seriously, I'm not sure any moment in a BT/MW novel has infuriated me as much as that. There's NO WAY he's that stupid. You spent the entire book showing that he's a master tactician, expert Mechwarrior, etc.- and he allows a slower, smaller, shorter-ranged Mech to get an AXE KILL on him? Try that fight in Megamek as the Hatchetman, even the bot won't let you play that game with it.)

[Terrace]

Dig up Aleks Hazen and draw him a picture explaining this, would you?  [madflame]

(Seriously, I'm not sure any moment in a BT/MW novel has infuriated me as much as that. There's NO WAY he's that stupid. You spent the entire book showing that he's a master tactician, expert Mechwarrior, etc.- and he allows a slower, smaller, shorter-ranged Mech to get an AXE KILL on him? Try that fight in Megamek as the Hatchetman, even the bot won't let you play that game with it.)

People can have moments of uncharacteristic stupidity for a variety of reasons. Maybe he was overconfident from riding a combat high. Maybe he was enraged to the point of stupidity by something the Hatchetman pilot said about his lineage. But I've never read that novel, so I can't say.

[Empyrus]

Funny thing is that people are more demanding about fictional things than real things. If someone were to write WWII as a story, people would complain how unrealistic it is due to massive amount of stupidity and other stuff.

Considering how crazy Malvina is, Aleksandr letting his guard down at a crucial moment is kinda believable. The same crazy-gene...

[Kidd]

That's war innit, one is not always on the favourable end of rock-paper-scissors. And high-performing people, especially those that enjoy challenges, do push their luck too far.

[Iron Mongoose]

Is it more foolish than the repeated instances of warships ramming one another in spite of the vastness of space?

The fact is, while one on one there is never ever ever a reason for a Gyrfalcon to close with a Hatchetman.  But in a larger battle, there can be.

One weakness of mechs like the Gyrfalcon and the Vapor Eagle and others have is that while they're invincible dualists, some times in a battle you need to take a mech down fast, and sniper mechs just don't have the concentrated punch to do that.  So if you need to kill some mech that's threatening to break your lines or finish off a damaged member of your star or lance, sometimes you do have to close in to ensure maximum accuracy, to draw fire away from a damaged comrade onto the probably undamaged sniper.  Now, its been forever since I read that book (which was it?  I'll go take another look) and I don't think Alex had a good reason, but that's not to say that there aren't good reasons in the context of a larger battle when your Gyrfalcon is the mech you have available to throw in at the last second to turn the tide, and being safe is no longer an option.

[JadeHellbringer]

That was Flight of the Falcon, I believe. (Pretty sure)