Author Topic: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder  (Read 10519 times)

Empyrus

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'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« on: 05 May 2017, 10:05:50 »
Removed until further notice.
« Last Edit: 09 March 2018, 18:39:23 by Empyrus »

Iron Mongoose

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #1 on: 05 May 2017, 11:30:15 »
I'll confess that my reaction to the Thunder was (and in many ways is still) the same as that young lady from Victoria: this is a good mech, sure, but not as good as it could or should be.

The key problem with the AC20 models (leaving the artillery aside) is quite simply a nearly total lack of ranged weapons.  If it were a Blitzkrieg or Legionnaire or something at 7/11+ (even 6/9 like the Stormcrow B would be better, though its medium lasers out range the Thunder by 60%) I could accept it's a mech to race in and destroy.  In the Succession Wars maybe 5/8 would have been enough (granted, the Andurian wars are the last experience the CC has with combat, so they haven't learned about real true modern speed and power from the Clans).

Now, sure, once you get to two hexes out the Thunder is a monster.  It's got as much armor as it can, and an AC20 and three MPLs are no laughing matter (unless you're the one firing them).  With three tons of ammo, you can definitely take some shots you might pass on in other mechs, and in the more modern era gives you some options as to special ammo.  Yeah, taking precision ammo just kills you on an AC20, but the idea of having precision ammo and pulse lasers and taking a shot at some fool in a Spider or Ice Ferret who thinks to zoom by is just delightful. 

I do like the stealth upgrade, since it makes closing across an open field a lot easier, and puts a bit of decision making pressure on your opponent: take a shot at the scary AC20 mech that's moving pretty fast and has stealth armor at medium range, or its supporting mechs?  Or if it's supported by stealth Archers and Pillagers and so on, then ouch.  Yeah, it would have been nicer if it had a more Ti Tsang like bevy of small lasers to fine tune the TSM (a 70 AC20 mech closing at 7/11 is, again, nothing to laugh at unless you're doing it), but the idea that it's more a get out of jail free card for when you have to leave the stealth on and fire all your guns has some credence. 

As for the Arrow variants, I don't need that fancy an artillery platform.  The speed is nice, sure, so you can keep up, but you've already got Arrow IV Regulators, which are faster in open terrain, and the jumping Catapults are better in broken terrain. They're not bad, good heavens, but they don't need to not be bad.  They could afford to be bad.  And yet they're really good.  Why?

Lastly the slow one with the jets?  I love jumping, and while I think often IJJs are miss applied victims of new toy syndrome, I like them here.  Big giant guns shine in broken terrain, where you don't have the open lines to make a seven hex run, and IJJs shine in that same terrain.  Let your infantry or Ravens or other scouts find a target, execute a six hex jump to get nearer to the fool, and unleash the beast.  I'd have just stuck to the AC20 here, rather than the Thunderbolt, for reasons already enumerated.  You need a good pilot to pull that off, mind, but if I'm being Canopan I'm probably giving these mechs to better pilots anyway.  As is with the T Bolt I don't know its better, but it is an interesting direction to go and I think it could be refined to be better.

In conclusion, I think it fails as a heavy cavalry mech by mainly being a faster bigger Hunchback.  This isn't a bad thing, but it makes the mech a specialist, and not a generalist like the Falconer or Jinggau or Hercules or the Clan heavies that inspired the genre that can roam around the field dealing death.  The Thunder has to be used with care, held back and unleashed at the right target at the right moment.  It can absolutely excel in that role, sure.  But it is a more limited role than I think the mech was made out to fill or than it could or should have filled.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #2 on: 05 May 2017, 11:48:49 »
Realistically, the Thunder should work reasonably in at least pre-Jihad battlefields, against Inner Sphere opponents. There are a lot of Succession Wars 'Mechs around. In 3055, it certainly would work. Against the Clans, maybe not so much. But fortunately for the Capellans, the Clans were in different direction (if they weren't, there'd be no Capellan Confederation left).

Of course, they don't exist in vacuum and logically are supported by long-range 'Mechs. Whatcha gonna do when the enemy is pounding you with Gauss rifles, ER PPCs and LRMs, while Thunders are running toward you?

I suspect you like the Lao Hu more thanks to its longer-ranged firepower.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #3 on: 05 May 2017, 12:30:55 »
Unquestionably I'm a Lao Hu fan, but I didn't want to derail this discussion too much, given we know it's coming. 

As to the Thunder, sure in 3055 when it was built it was entering an environment in which it would have faced lots of old mechs, since most were going to the Clan front.  But, that just means the mech has aged poorly, since by the modern era it's flaws are evident. Now, mind you I can't think of the last time I played a mid 50s game (probably in the 90s, when the game was in the mid 50s) so I tend to evaluate any post 3050 mech against more or less the 3067 era of mechs, if not the fully modern era.  A flaw of mine, I'll confess.  But the window between the Thunder coming out, and the proliferation of mechs like the magical 3058 mechs, wasn't particularly long, and while all nations had old mechs in service even through the Jihad (seems like the Republic era disarmament was the excuse to cull a lot of the really old mechs, or upgrade them) they were all relegated to back waters.  If the Capellans raid a Capellan March border world, they'll face the best the AFFC/AFFS has to offer, since that's known to be a danger zone.

Now, that's not to say the designer deserves scorn for that.  Yes, when the mech was designed, it was more viable.  It's just that designer's bad luck to be overtaken by progress in mech design.

As to support, sure Thunders will have cover.  But, with a standard Thunder it's an easier choice.  Shoot the Thunder at medium range, or even short range for big guns (where the Thunder is still at long or even out of MPL range) before it can unleash, or take shots at long range against support mechs who are themselves at long range.  I'll let that Catapult take a shot at long range mods next turn, but I don't want that Thunder to make it to short range at any cost.  At short range, though, I can probably get to 50-60% or more odds on the Thunder even if its charging hard, while shooting perhaps 40% or less even against a Catapult if its well positioned (in cover, for example, or having done a lazy 3 hex walk, or both). 

That's why I like the Stealth Thunder, because it complicates that equation.  That +1 at medium range isn't much, but it can make it a lot closer call on shooting that Catapult or Cataphract or Vindicator, at it's utterly unlikely to get shot at long range, since it will be hard to hit (it should be moving) and no threat at long range.  So you're likely to either dodge an extra two or three shots as you close if you draw that fire, or else dodge a turn of fire.  Either way, when you get into range you'll have that much more armor, and get an extra turn of shooting.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #4 on: 05 May 2017, 12:55:21 »
The stealth Thunder is good but suffers from BV bloat :/ Expensive to field.

Also, something i forgot to evaluate and only just realized: The standard Thunder works well in urban combat. No, it doesn't have jump jets but 5 walk is reasonable mobility, and the weapon range limitations are less problematic. It is a big Hunchback as you noted.


One retrofit i'd make to surviving older THR-1Ls would be to coat them with heavy ferro and add a ton of ammo, while replacing the lasers with ER mediums or X-pulses and an extra heat sink. The extra ton of ammo because it would allow more specialty munitions to be carried. Might need to modify the missile launcher as well. It wouldn't make them much better but every little but helps, no?

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #5 on: 05 May 2017, 13:14:29 »
to be honest, i kinda wonder whether the original Thunder wasn't designed around the idea of supporting the CapCon's existing designs, rather than as a true cavalry mech? many of their existing designs were 4/6 longer range platforms (Vindicator, Catapult, Cataphract), so a 5/8 short ranged brawler would have filled a niche.

(also, does anyone else find it ironic that the Cataphract is not a cavalry design?)

Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #6 on: 05 May 2017, 15:06:43 »
Too, I recall that the Hunchback was a Capellan favorite during the Succession Wars, though they couldn't manufacture them on their own (presumably they captured a bunch from the FWL).  Making a native Hunchback II makes a lot of sense, and would surely have been a popular choice with the janshi.  It also makes an interesting comparison with the Victors St.Ives is churning out from the rebuilt HildCo plant.  That may have been an important consideration, considering how heavy the SIMC was, building a big design that could hang with Victors.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #7 on: 05 May 2017, 15:15:36 »
Speaking of new toy syndrome, I'm surprised we never saw an Ultra AC/20 variant. I'm not a fan of Ultras myself, but I could see dropping the LRMs to upgrade the AC.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #8 on: 05 May 2017, 15:39:16 »
Cappies seem to prefer LB-20X to Ultras. There's a Yu Huang variant with an UAC/20 but i can't think of any other native Capellan UAC/20 'Mechs. Makes me wonder if they manufactured them at all.

Tai Dai Cultist

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #9 on: 05 May 2017, 15:51:32 »
A couple of thoughts:

First, the best picture ever of a thunder is that one where the artist postulates where the hell the mech carries the ammo:



Thankfully, subsequent art since the original TRO:3055 entry "clarifies" that giant hole in the end of the forearm isn't actually the AC/20 barrel proper.


Second:  The Thunder (and all Liao contemporary inventions) aren't so much meant to narrow the Clan tech advantages in the way that Steiner, Davion, and Kurita mechs were.  In the 3050s, the only enemy Liao is even contemplating facing is the F-C.  The Clans are a happy distraction, from Liao's POV.  The 9 hex range for the Thunder's main punch isn't so big a deal when it's going to be facing the dregs of Davion's forces rather than the best the Clans have to offer.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #10 on: 05 May 2017, 16:05:27 »
Irrational as it may be, I immediately loved this 'Mech when I first saw it. It's a no-nonsense, rock solid (if unassuming) design in the fashion of Capellan classics like the Vindicator, Thunderbolt, and Cataphract. Hard to kill. Easy to underestimate. And with enough speed, armor and ammo to make the AC/20 work. Somebody used their brain on this one.
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Ruger

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #11 on: 05 May 2017, 18:37:31 »
Ah...the Thunder! The 'Mech the character Ruger ran for the longest period in our old game...of course, mine had a LB-20X, 3 standard medium lasers and a LRM-10 with two tons of ammo, so it was a bit different, but I loved that machine...especially when I took and alpha strike from a Stuka and returned the favor...I remained standing and mobile...it became a 100 ton lawn dart...

IIRC, I hit with almost all (if not all) 20 pellets on that fighter...

 ;D

Then there was the time I and one of my comrades in a Daikyu armed with 2 UAC-2's both hit an Annihilator at 20 hexes...me with a 5 pack (IIRC) of LRM's, and him with 3 or 4 UAC-2 shots...and since we were playing the RPG, we were able to use edge to make all the hits to the head...

 >:D

Yes, I do have some fond memories of this 'Mech...

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #12 on: 05 May 2017, 18:54:07 »
I've thown a couple of Thunders up in the Workshop thread/ A Gauss version and a weird take on a stalth model.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #13 on: 05 May 2017, 19:09:00 »
I adore the thunder for the same reason I adore the 3Q version of the Banshee. It's brutal, aggressive, and borderline irresponsible. It's everything I love in a battlemech. The idea of using smoke munitions to cover its approach is something I never considered, and for that, I am ashamed.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #14 on: 05 May 2017, 21:20:20 »
Knowing capellan tactic preference, and being a Wobbie player myself, I can't help but think that the T-bolt Thunder would be a DELICIOUS part of a city defense team. Hiding in the city while dumping IDF T-bolt 20s with infantry spotting, jumping away to reposition at will... ;)

drakensis

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #15 on: 05 May 2017, 23:23:59 »
One parallel to consider with the Thunder is the Victor, built on St Ives after the 4th Succession War.

It's not unlikely that when Romano Liao was asked what sort of 'Mech should be built with all this advanced technology, she pointed (figuratively) at her sister's realm and their (at the time) native Assault 'Mech and said: "Like that, but better."

As a result you get the Thunder: faster than a Victor, carrying more armour than a Victor, slightly more weapons. The secondary armament of medium lasers and a missile launcher (located in the left shoulder - any bets that at least one version of the design was to have an SRM-4 there but found the Vindie's LRM launchers easier to get hold of?). No jump jets, admittedly, but it's lighter which makes it more manageable to the Capellan's relatively limited factories.

So my feeling is that the Thunder was intended as the CCAF's answer to the VTR-9B. Of course, then they found themselves looking at the VTR-9K... Which may explain the Jinggau. The THR-2L, on the other hand, seems like the start of the thinking that led to the Ti Ts'ang. So in some ways the Thunder could be a response to St Ives' Victors and ended up laying the groundwork for the next generation of Capellan heavy 'Mechs.

Edit: The Lu Wei Bing is very probably a further sign of an obsession by Capellan designers with the Victor.
« Last Edit: 05 May 2017, 23:25:58 by drakensis »
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #16 on: 06 May 2017, 05:20:28 »
You know I think the Thunder is similar to the Po in a couple of respects, first is the name, with the Poyou have people saying the CC couldn't afford a longer name, with the Thunder it feels like half the name is missing. Secondly there's the equipment, when the Thunder was introduced it used a minimum of new/expensive equipment.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #17 on: 06 May 2017, 05:50:04 »
The Thunderer is a good Mech, I like its simplicity.  Run at enemy. BOOOOOOOOOOOOM.  Is enemy still standing?  If yes. Repeat step one.  Against a mixed Cappie force where you've got Stealthed PITA's shooting at you from long range and there's a pair of Thunders' running at you braying and shrieking it becomes a case of "What to shoot at..." because you don't want to let Mr T get within range of that big gun.

Of course the hugely oversized AC looks silly, the newer art did a lot to fix that but still, and I like the Conquistadore helmet design for the head.  Design wise I'd say its a faster victor as was mentioned above, or an even more (if possible) aggressive Hunchback.

Great write up on a pretty damn decent Mech.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #18 on: 06 May 2017, 19:34:07 »
It took me a while to realize the Capellans have a real love for the Class 20 Auto-cannon.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #19 on: 06 May 2017, 23:46:03 »
I will chime in, this is a mech that gets attention- IMO its the 'modern' Hunchback (b/c that slow med could no longer survive the environment), and I have played on the competitive servers where you look over your Capellan opposition to see if they have this . . . if not, its a easier fight.  I always wondered why we never got just a plain field update to putting a LB-20X on the machine.

The design does beg the mercs who buy it to tinker- -1L's simple older tech offers a lot of reliability and options to improve it as a merc players goes along (LBX/GR, FF armor, XPulse or Clan, etc)
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #20 on: 07 May 2017, 16:27:44 »
I'm a frequent user of both the 2L and 4C with my Capellan forces. The 2L is a lovely little mugger that works well even on relatively open battlefields thanks to the combination of just enough speed and stealth armor. And the 4C I like to dole out in full lances when I can; they can hunt assault 'Mechs like nobody's business. Your 3/5 100-ton murder machine ain't so tough when it's taking three or four 20-point hits a turn against opponents that can jump farther than it can run.


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Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #21 on: 07 May 2017, 21:54:31 »
I'm a frequent user of both the 2L and 4C with my Capellan forces. The 2L is a lovely little mugger that works well even on relatively open battlefields thanks to the combination of just enough speed and stealth armor. And the 4C I like to dole out in full lances when I can; they can hunt assault 'Mechs like nobody's business. Your 3/5 100-ton murder machine ain't so tough when it's taking three or four 20-point hits a turn against opponents that can jump farther than it can run.
To be fair, any assault mech is going to have issues with a full lance of seventy tonners.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #22 on: 08 May 2017, 13:46:41 »
Maybe the Thunder was designed to supplement the UrbanMech in defense operations? It sort of feels like someone said "Let's just double the UrbanMech. Twice the firepower, twice the speed. It'll be great."

Also, do we still need to hit exactly nine heat points to activate TSM? My copy of Total Warfare says this (emphasis mine):
Quote from: Total Warfare, p. 143
Triple-strength myomer provides a benefit only when a BattleMech is running hot. If a BattleMech is equipped with triple-strength myomer, for each turn that it ends with a heat level of 9 or higher, the following effects take place the next turn; apply other modifiers that decrease movement, such as heat and damage, normally.

Suddenly that stealth armor is even more useful because it boosts the Thunder's heat, which will eventually boost its speed.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #23 on: 08 May 2017, 14:12:24 »
That's correct.  A lot of people don't like going over 9 because there's detrimental effects on accuracy, possible ammo explosions, etc.  personally, if I've got the crits space, I'm happy to throw on TSM and just use the benefits when I get them, instead of trying to stay at 9 exactly.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #24 on: 08 May 2017, 14:24:28 »
Well . . .

If you hit 10 points you lose 2 MP total which would be -1 overall- so at 10 heat the Thunder would go from 5/8 normal, 6/9 hot at 9 heat, to 4/6 at 10 points of heat.  I think melee mechs must maintain the 9 heat at least until they are in the thick of it.

Fire support?  well . . . its +2 TH at 13 points of heat.  So you could heat up, get a bit more speed and then offset some of the penalties for being hot . . . honestly a fire support design with TC or AES that kept 9 heat would be able to back up faster to keep range open if that was needed without losing accuracy using that TSM.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #25 on: 08 May 2017, 14:27:13 »
Well . . .

If you hit 10 points you lose 2 MP total which would be -1 overall- so at 10 heat the Thunder would go from 5/8 normal, 6/9 hot at 9 heat, to 4/6 at 10 points of heat.  I think melee mechs must maintain the 9 heat at least until they are in the thick of it.

Fire support?  well . . . its +2 TH at 13 points of heat.  So you could heat up, get a bit more speed and then offset some of the penalties for being hot . . . honestly a fire support design with TC or AES that kept 9 heat would be able to back up faster to keep range open if that was needed without losing accuracy using that TSM.
Would 10 not just drop you back down to 5/8?  The TSM doesn't stop being effective above 9.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #26 on: 08 May 2017, 14:34:33 »
Start 5/8 . . . gain 6/9 at 9 heat, technically you gain 2 MP for TSM activation, but you have that -1 MP from 5 heat . . . at 10 heat, you get -2 MP, which off 6/9 becomes 4/6.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #27 on: 08 May 2017, 14:45:55 »
Better than 3/5 for sure...
As it is, the TSM is there to make sure the Thunder doesn't get terribly slow should it be getting some extra heat from some reason.
The Thunder has no real ability to fine tune its heat for exactly 9 heat for running fast consistently, and it is not terribly great at melee with only one real arm and kicks risking falling (i'm not a big proponent of kicking due to this).
If it didn't have stealth, i wouldn't mind the BV cost but with both stealth and TSM, the BV is uncomfortably high for something that cannot be utilized even just reasonably well.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #28 on: 08 May 2017, 14:53:50 »
Well, if your table allows fratricide . . . it lets you take advantage of the Flamers as Heat on allies . . .
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #29 on: 08 May 2017, 15:14:01 »
Start 5/8 . . . gain 6/9 at 9 heat, technically you gain 2 MP for TSM activation, but you have that -1 MP from 5 heat . . . at 10 heat, you get -2 MP, which off 6/9 becomes 4/6.
Sorry, but you're wrong, Arkansas Warrior has it right.

TW, pg. 143
Quote
for each turn that it ends with a heat level of 9 or higher, the following effects take place the next turn; apply other modifiers that decrease movement, such as heat and damage, normally.

• Increase the ’Mech’s Walking MP by 2
and recalculate its Running MP
On the heat scale, 10 overheat is a -2 MP, so a 'Mech with TSM at heat 0-4 and 10-14 moves at it's normal speed. At heats 5-8 and 15-19 it moves at 1MP slower (walking). And at heat 9 only it moves 1MP faster (walking).
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #30 on: 08 May 2017, 15:43:40 »
The C4 is the only Thunder variant I've ever seen on the table.  This was at the GenCon 2016 Masters and Minions event, and when it tried to exchange long-range fire with my BNC-9S, things went badly for it.  One Thunderbolt 20 isn't nearly good enough against a Gauss Rifle, HPPC, and LPPC that are all tied to a TC and on something 25 tons heavier with decidedly thicker armor.
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mbear

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #31 on: 09 May 2017, 06:44:20 »
The C4 is the only Thunder variant I've ever seen on the table.  This was at the GenCon 2016 Masters and Minions event, and when it tried to exchange long-range fire with my BNC-9S, things went badly for it.  One Thunderbolt 20 isn't nearly good enough against a Gauss Rifle, HPPC, and LPPC that are all tied to a TC and on something 25 tons heavier with decidedly thicker armor.

The fact that the Banshee outweighs it by 40 tons probably didn't help either.
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Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #32 on: 09 May 2017, 06:46:52 »
The fact that the Banshee outweighs it by 40 tons probably didn't help either.
Banshees weigh 110 tons?
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #33 on: 09 May 2017, 07:15:35 »
Banshees weigh 110 tons?

*cough* Congratulations AW! You passed my test. Today at lunch collect your cookie to celebrate.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #34 on: 09 May 2017, 07:17:15 »
A Banshee weighs 110 tons when it is using a flatbed truck as club.

Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #35 on: 09 May 2017, 08:32:19 »
Steiner needs to make that happen, though.  "The new and improved Banshee II!  Now even heavier!"
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #36 on: 09 May 2017, 13:23:27 »
I actually checked. It is sadly not possible due to the main selling point often being speed. At least not 110 tons.
Guess we'll have to have a lighter Thunder, then. Though the CC is really not short of 55 tonners, are they?
Speaking of the thunder, the stealth armour would afford it some benefits against a slow long range design. Maybe not enough to offset the firepower discrepancy, sure, but every bit helps.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #37 on: 09 May 2017, 13:33:26 »
Speaking of the thunder, the stealth armour would afford it some benefits against a slow long range design. Maybe not enough to offset the firepower discrepancy, sure, but every bit helps.
You didn't read the article or TRO entries, did you? Because THR-2L and -3L Thunders do sport stealth armor.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #38 on: 09 May 2017, 14:51:04 »
The Thunder may also be a throwback to the ancient Koschei, an early heavy cavalry design that sported an AC/10 in its left arm with massive barrel/cooling shroud (IRL, things may be other way around though, the Koschei being styled after the Thunder).


Hehe, actually the Koschei had artwork done first and was sporting a missile rack instead of an AC. I tinkered around with it a bit and came up with the design as it is today and the artist was gracious enough to tweak the artwork to make it an autocannon. I don't think the Thunder ever came up at all in that process.
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #39 on: 09 May 2017, 14:52:25 »
Huh. Well, it still makes for a nice potential historical connection in-universe.

Kit deSummersville

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #40 on: 09 May 2017, 14:58:02 »
I'm all for that.
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CrazyGrasshopper

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #41 on: 09 May 2017, 20:01:25 »
Hehe, actually the Koschei had artwork done first and was sporting a missile rack instead of an AC. I tinkered around with it a bit and came up with the design as it is today and the artist was gracious enough to tweak the artwork to make it an autocannon. I don't think the Thunder ever came up at all in that process.

The great mystery is resolved. Before, when looking at Koschei's left arm I was asking: "Just why?" It makes sense now.

UnLimiTeD

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #42 on: 10 May 2017, 09:54:21 »
You didn't read the article or TRO entries, did you? Because THR-2L and -3L Thunders do sport stealth armor.
I totally did, which is why I'm posting here.
Even quoted a comment regarding it fighting a long ranged banshee.
I have to admit I have no idea where you're coming from here.  ???
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Demon55

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: THR-* Thunder
« Reply #43 on: 09 June 2017, 04:50:12 »
to be honest, i kinda wonder whether the original Thunder wasn't designed around the idea of supporting the CapCon's existing designs, rather than as a true cavalry mech? many of their existing designs were 4/6 longer range platforms (Vindicator, Catapult, Cataphract), so a 5/8 short ranged brawler would have filled a niche.

(also, does anyone else find it ironic that the Cataphract is not a cavalry design?)

Yes but the name is quite fitting.  Or they could have made a 5/6/x heavy called the Clibanarii and had the Cataphract go 5/8/x.

I could also see the machine replacing the Victor add stated earlier.

Yes the Lao Hu is a better design, IMO.