Author Topic: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards  (Read 2104 times)

Lone-Wolf

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Hello,

I have a question:
I know it involves a lot of handwavium and changes etc, like

1) no Jihad or a very very smaller Jihad
2) a lot less destruction
3) Manei Domini die much faster

We all know that according to Canon Zeta Battalion and Davion Assault Guards have the biggest mechs in their inventory.
So, what if all the above conditions (and some more) would have happened:

Would Zeta Battalion / Davion Assault Guards have Super Heavy mechs in their inventory and what weight?
If I take the Canon literally then ZB / DAG would be composed of only 200 ton mechs.

Or would they go like one lance of 200 ton mech, two lances of 150 ton mechs and the rest composed of 100 ton mechs?

(And yes silently I am asking the question if LAMs or the Revenant drone mech would be more common and maybe some planets would be defended by entire regiments of drone mechs).

So, what do you think?

Moonsword

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Re: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards
« Reply #1 on: 13 February 2017, 15:43:58 »
LAMs, Revenant drones, and super-heavies could easily be significantly less common in that scenario.  The Jihad's length was the main reason the Word had time to finish the research and get prototypes into the field.  They only see service in 3075 (Wasp LAM, experimental Revenants) or later (3076 Omega, 3077-3078 Spectral LAMs).

What you want sounds more like the Jihad should start later, so they have more hardware at a more mature state of development or closer to front-line readiness.  That would make it easier for other factions to more rapidly introduce versions of their own.  Of course, that also potentially makes the Word harder to bring down in the end depending on how effective the hardware is.
« Last Edit: 13 February 2017, 15:46:28 by Moonsword »

Iron Mongoose

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Re: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards
« Reply #2 on: 13 February 2017, 20:02:46 »
I suppose the point of "no Jihad" is to imagine that the Fed Suns and Dragoons (and any number of other assault heavy units, too, like the whole of the LCAF) are in much better shape to expand, rather than contract as in the actual post Jihad environment, but that somehow someone is doing all the same R-D for some reason and the tech comes out all the same.

I would tend to guess that one might see a few lances or companies in each, but most all assault units still take pride in "surprising mobility for such a heavy unit" or something like that.  With a mix of 4/6 and 3/5 designs, its outwardly plausible.  With nothing under 125 tons, you just loose too much flexibility, even for a unit like the Zetas or the Assault Guards. 

Rather, I imagine a battalion with a core company of super heavies, another company of conventional assaults like Awesomes and Dire Wolves, and perhaps another of more mobile assaults, heavies, and those light and medium mechs that tend to sneak into many "all assault" units. 

But, its whatever works for you world.  If 200 tonners are as easy to acquire as Awesomes and Dire Wolves, then its plausible that some crazy someone might design a battalion or regiment of nothing but Orcas or whatever.  Such a unit would have even fewer tactical options than even Zeta battalion, of course, but unless the other side had either a comparable unit or a full heavy/assault regiment of their own, other than just get out of the way what could they do to resist? 
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Moonsword

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Re: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards
« Reply #3 on: 13 February 2017, 23:41:16 »
Basically you pull every dirty trick out of the book and do anything you can other than engage those monsters head-on in an open-field battle until after you've already done enough damage to put them to rout.  Massed artillery and air strikes on concentrations, assault isolated units to encourage concentration (so you can do more artillery and air strikes), heavy minefields to force them to detour or slow them down with actuator damage, infantry snipers assaulting any personnel exposed outside of their 'Mechs, etc.

Because they can't use any sort of bay for expedited loading and unloading or do assault drops, super-heavies require specialized DropShips.  Target them early, either in the descent phase or while they're on the ground unloading.  Those 200 ton death machines don't do you a lot of good if the DropShip blows up and they're trapped inside or get scattered around like candy out of a pinata from five miles up.

You also hope you have enough conventional resources, time, and distance between them and their target to pull any of that off.  Super-heavies usually take a lot of firepower to bring down, which takes time to apply.  If they get to their target before you wear them down far enough to defeat whatever shows up, you lose.
« Last Edit: 13 February 2017, 23:43:42 by Moonsword »

Arkansas Warrior

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Re: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards
« Reply #4 on: 14 February 2017, 09:52:47 »
One that's no more than 130 tons could make a good commander's ride.  You can still go 3/5, there's extra space/tonnage for C3, communications equipment, a Command Console, etc.  Even more true of a tripod, with their crew arrangement making it easier on a dedicated commander.  Sprinkle a few in as company/battalion commanders, maybe form one or two Superheavy lances just for the shock value.  But I can't see mass deployment of a full battalion of Orcas as ever being viable.
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Lone-Wolf

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Re: What-If: Super Heavy Mechs, Zeta Battalion, Davion Assault Guards
« Reply #5 on: 14 February 2017, 15:17:16 »
Basically you pull every dirty trick out of the book and do anything you can other than engage those monsters head-on in an open-field battle until after you've already done enough damage to put them to rout.  Massed artillery and air strikes on concentrations, assault isolated units to encourage concentration (so you can do more artillery and air strikes), heavy minefields to force them to detour or slow them down with actuator damage, infantry snipers assaulting any personnel exposed outside of their 'Mechs, etc.

Because they can't use any sort of bay for expedited loading and unloading or do assault drops, super-heavies require specialized DropShips.  Target them early, either in the descent phase or while they're on the ground unloading.  Those 200 ton death machines don't do you a lot of good if the DropShip blows up and they're trapped inside or get scattered around like candy out of a pinata from five miles up.

You also hope you have enough conventional resources, time, and distance between them and their target to pull any of that off.  Super-heavies usually take a lot of firepower to bring down, which takes time to apply.  If they get to their target before you wear them down far enough to defeat whatever shows up, you lose.

Hello Moonsword,
I hate to break the news to you, but the planets in the Battletech game are not defended by such big armies.
I refer to my own thread about the In-game explanations for no defense
http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=54396.0
But yes, you are right. Enough artillery, air attacks etc will bring them down - eventually.

Thank you Iron Moongoose for pointing out the limitations of Super Heavy units. I forgot them.

(But still - I would like to play a game where you can build a mercenary unit with ALL options open.
Something like a cross between Battleforce (Amiga) and Mechcommander 2. But that will be a dream.)