Author Topic: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?  (Read 6274 times)

Siegfried Marcus

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Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« on: 02 April 2017, 11:44:37 »
This one.  https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/3966/succession-wars

I only played one real game of it long ago, but it it had some cool aspects.  The fact that you needed jump ships to move anything gave it a distinct feel from most wargames.  That went a long way toward making it feel like a space game despite the 2D map.  I also liked the fact that industrial centers were so vulnerable and constantly being crippled.  Elite mech regiments could really shine, especially when you were interdict, but they needed fodder and couldn't be produced at will.  I was never familiar with particular regiments' lore, but I'm sure that would add to the fun.  Overall, I feel like it had some good BattleTech flavor.  It also offered a unique strategic perspective on the BTU.

On the negative side, I remember thinking that mercenaries were way too fickle (maybe I was playing it wrong).  If I had Wolf's Dragoons, the first thing I would do is kill off 2/3 of them to make them a less tempting target for "contract ends."  The house leaders were also suicidally fickle.  Anyone with a 9 or less loyalty could be turned, and you were sunk if all (both) your perfect-loyalty leaders were captured.   Even Micheal-Hasek Davion would be loyal if he were the last one remaining.  I never got enough play time to have an opinion on game balance and things like that.  It seemed like a good candidate for house rules, and I remember tinkering a bit.

So, is it something that people like, or is it a forgotten step-child of BattleTech?
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Mendrugo

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #1 on: 02 April 2017, 12:14:02 »
I played several games of Succession Wars.  We had fun with it, but found a number of flaws upon repeated plays:

1) Mercenary contract-ends cards are far too common, and make having mercs almost not worth the hassle.  More than once I saw intense bidding wars drain the bank account of the winner, only to have another player put out the same card immediately afterwards and pick up the mercs for a song.  I resorted to sending my faction's mercs on suicidal assaults as quickly as possible, just to burn them off, and then sticking with House forces for the rest of the game.

2) I agree that it didn't make any sense for the last House leader to be susceptible to bribes.  Once the last non-corrupt leader is captured or killed, other players can take out a foe just by throwing money at them. 

3) The double-sided tiles were a bit of a hazard.  Once you amassed large strike groups, you ended up with a teetering stack of tiles.  One game had to be cancelled when the stack got knocked over by a rogue swipe of an elbow, and we couldn't be sure what the active side of each one had been.  We also started keeping the tiles off board, and using the counters from the 2nd Edition box as army-markers to prevent a repeat of the earlier disaster.  In fact, when a Combine army launched an assault on New Avalon and failed, the FedSuns player declared that he was keeping the flag marker as a battle trophy.

Improvements I would have liked include:

1) Independent tracking of unit stats - so you could beef up any unit you like rather than just flipping over.
2) Eliminating "contract ends" cards and changing the mercenary betrayal system to being something like the Leader bribery rules.  Rather than relying on luck-of-the-draw cards, you could throw money at a target merc unit in exchange for an attempt to make them switch sides. 
3) Making the "Death Commando" cards non-faction specific.  Instead of the Capellans getting two one-shot attacks, having them in general circulation would allow DEST, Rabid Fox, Loki and the Eagle Corps to be represented. 
4) Adding the Taurian Concordat, Magistracy of Canopus, Tortuga Domains, and Marian Hegemony as co-optable Periphery factions.
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Dmon

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #2 on: 02 April 2017, 12:31:01 »
Always wanted to give this a go.

Always found it curious that some of the units do not appear anywhere else in BT lore.

elf25s

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #3 on: 03 April 2017, 09:22:12 »
had seen it did not play it tho and wanted to get my claws on one for few years.
also i did come across a web browser succesion wars game about 2 years back but lost the link
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #4 on: 03 April 2017, 09:28:37 »
I've been curious about Succession Wars for a while now... I have always assumed ISAW (Inner Sphere At War) was an attempt to replace it and I'd love to get a good comparison between the two games.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #5 on: 03 April 2017, 09:41:16 »
A couple years ago CGL mentioned working on a new Succession Wars board game, but it's been long enough that clearly that didn't work out.
http://bg.battletech.com/news/battleblog/a-new-succession-wars-boardgame/

I wrote an update last year, in the hopes that it might get picked up at some point in the future, but it's nothing more than my proposal (among all my other crazy ideas, and all the other proposals from other people).  And I know I'm not the only one that has proposed new versions.

Scrapyard Armory made an online playable version. They've had to clear up a lot of rules, and added some more rules options and scenarios.
http://www.scrapyardarmory.com/successionwars/
« Last Edit: 03 April 2017, 09:42:48 by nckestrel »
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #6 on: 03 April 2017, 09:47:00 »
I've been curious about Succession Wars for a while now... I have always assumed ISAW (Inner Sphere At War) was an attempt to replace it and I'd love to get a good comparison between the two games.

ISaW is far more detailed than Succession Wars.  With the resulting increase in amount of time necessary to setup and play, and a huge increase in the work involved in tracking a game.
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #7 on: 03 April 2017, 10:00:15 »
Always wanted to give this a go.

Always found it curious that some of the units do not appear anywhere else in BT lore.

Like which ones? You may have to dig a little deep but I think almost all of them should.
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nckestrel

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #8 on: 03 April 2017, 10:34:42 »
Like which ones? You may have to dig a little deep but I think almost all of them should.

There were several that weren't anywhere else during the FASA era, but Fanpro and/or CGL fixed that :).  (York and Odessa Regulars, Hesperus Guards, Matar Militia).
A couple of the Kurita militia aren't mentioned anywhere else.  Chian, Kessel, Samarkand.
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #9 on: 03 April 2017, 11:09:04 »
There were several that weren't anywhere else during the FASA era, but Fanpro and/or CGL fixed that :).  (York and Odessa Regulars, Hesperus Guards, Matar Militia).
A couple of the Kurita militia aren't mentioned anywhere else.  Chian, Kessel, Samarkand.
Yup, still a handful we have to sneak into the 3rd Succession War. Tamar Jagers top o' the list.
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #10 on: 03 April 2017, 11:19:54 »
I've still got my copy in the attic (sitting on top of the Solaris VII box), and it's been over a decade (closing in on two) since the old gaming group played it, but I'm keeping it.

As pointed out, there were some flaws, particularly the mercenaries being almost counter-productive.  It actually helped to exterminate them in senseless attacks as quickly as possible, to do as much damage as you could while losing them.  Once the cards started coming into play, your mercenaries were as dangerous to you as to your opponent.  There really needed to be about a 2 turn "contract length" before they became vulnerable to renegotiation: hire them at the start of your turn, and at the end of your NEXT turn, flip their "card" over; at that point, they become vulnerable.  There should also be a (generally low) "Loyalty" rating, where if you win the bidding for them, there's still a small chance that they won't change sides.  Some units should have a high enough Loyalty rating to serve as "slightly questionable" House troops for whoever hired them, rather than practically guaranteed traitors.  As it stands, no sane player would pay to rebuild a mercenary unit.

I also think the Liao Death Commandos cards were slightly overkill, where they should be split evenly between Liao-only and those usable by any faction.  As for bribing leaders, since so many of the House Lords could be bribed, it seriously paid to keep one of the 100% loyal ones back at the capital, and generally give the best troops to the most loyal leaders.

You could only rebuild a few of the units back up to original strength (if you got the cards), and in most games, I ended up with far more armor units, which were often stronger than the depleted House 'Mech units, and cheaper to replace if you lost them.  The idea of choosing which unit to suffer casualties to may have worked from a purely gameplay perspective, but wasn't very "realistic".

The real clincher was that the game with all those little counters took hours to set up, and then you didn't have a whole lot of time left to play before having to mark everything down so you could set it back up again.  That's assuming you didn't have a secure place to leave it overnight or until next week.  For those of us with little brothers, pets, or parents who didn't want it sitting there for a week, it was a problem.  I suspect that a computerized game would solve most of the issues, where you could quickly reload a campaign in progress whenever you wanted, and unit stats could be depleted (or rebuilt) a bit more gradually and losses randomized between units.  I'd just about kill for a good BT-universe strategic-level game on PC, particularly with both single-player and multi-player options.  Succession Wars was a good first attempt, but a major rethink might be a better plan.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #11 on: 03 April 2017, 16:48:07 »
Yup, still a handful we have to sneak into the 3rd Succession War. Tamar Jagers top o' the list.

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bigmac

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #12 on: 03 April 2017, 18:39:57 »
Always wanted to give this a go.

Always found it curious that some of the units do not appear anywhere else in BT lore.

The reason why is because the game was published before the House Sourcebooks were created.  They only had a rough idea of the order of battle for the Successor states and a vague outline for the Periphery nations.  That is why some of the house and mercenary units listed in the game do not appear in the books.  It is also why some of the house and mercenary units listed in the books do not appear in the game.

I played several games of Succession Wars.  We had fun with it, but found a number of flaws upon repeated plays:

1) Mercenary contract-ends cards are far too common, and make having mercs almost not worth the hassle.

The quick fix for that is the die role of 12.  This was a house rule my group did many years ago playing the game.  Each player had a print out of the order of battle for their Successor state.  The second someone played a End Mercenary contract card on another player, that player would make a die role for each mercenary unit starting at the top of the list on even turns and from the bottom of the list on odd turns.  The first mercenary unit that had a die roll of 12 would be the one for the players to bid on.  The winner of the bids would make a second die role of 12 with 2 thru 11 having the mercenary command appearing in their capital system the next turn and with 12 giving the option to the winner of leaving the mercenary command in place and possibly seizing control of the territory the unit is stationed in. Of course, the winner would add the name of the mercenary command to his list.


Adrian Gideon

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #13 on: 03 April 2017, 18:44:02 »
wait is that a product reveal
nope.
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elf25s

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #15 on: 15 April 2017, 19:20:53 »
http://www.scrapyardarmory.com/successionwars/
found the link to teh browser based succession wars
took me a while
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #16 on: 16 April 2017, 20:26:03 »
To me, a very nice little feature was in the rulebook.  I think the last page.  A plain version of the 3025 map.  Copies were great for tracking campaign borders.  The only problem was the print was so small, I had to use the big poster map to verify planet names. 

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #17 on: 17 April 2017, 17:44:33 »
Played many a fun  game of it. But you really had to clear a day or two for a proper completion.

Slowest detail is the movement phase. So many counters so little time.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #18 on: 17 April 2017, 18:00:05 »
Never got to play it but watched a game at o-Dark-thirty during a gaming convention in San Antonio.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #19 on: 18 April 2017, 20:12:45 »
I got this game for free from a game store trying to clear out a number of gaming materials that they could not sell (such as the 1e DMs guide in not so great shape).  I am not sure I have all of the pieces but I took it anyway because I saw it in an old catalogue for FASA in a Star Trek combat tactical simulator box.  Since I always liked Battletech I figured take it home.  Perhaps I will play it someday.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #20 on: 18 April 2017, 23:41:44 »
I still have my copy from the 80's.  O0
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #21 on: 21 April 2017, 12:20:29 »
The real clincher was that the game with all those little counters took hours to set up, and then you didn't have a whole lot of time left to play before having to mark everything down so you could set it back up again.  That's assuming you didn't have a secure place to leave it overnight or until next week.  For those of us with little brothers, pets, or parents who didn't want it sitting there for a week, it was a problem.  I suspect that a computerized game would solve most of the issues, where you could quickly reload a campaign in progress whenever you wanted, and unit stats could be depleted (or rebuilt) a bit more gradually and losses randomized between units.  I'd just about kill for a good BT-universe strategic-level game on PC, particularly with both single-player and multi-player options.  Succession Wars was a good first attempt, but a major rethink might be a better plan.

I also enjoyed the game even though I only played through a few times.  And yeah, setup was a little bit of work.

There is an option for eliminating some of the perils of real live play.  There is a virtual board game engine that you can use to play you favorite board games online.  It's called Vassal and someone put together a module for The Succession Wars.  I never tried it, but it looks cool.

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #22 on: 01 May 2017, 14:12:15 »
If anyone has any questions about the online adaptation, feel free to drop me a line.

The game is still under active development with a five person steering committee that meets monthly to discuss issues, bugs, new features, and growth of the game.

elf25s

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #23 on: 02 May 2017, 13:38:53 »
If anyone has any questions about the online adaptation, feel free to drop me a line.

The game is still under active development with a five person steering committee that meets monthly to discuss issues, bugs, new features, and growth of the game.
glad that its still alive and breathing...
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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #24 on: 02 May 2017, 15:29:00 »
There were several that weren't anywhere else during the FASA era, but Fanpro and/or CGL fixed that :).  (York and Odessa Regulars, Hesperus Guards, Matar Militia).
A couple of the Kurita militia aren't mentioned anywhere else.  Chian, Kessel, Samarkand.

Yep, and the map is goofy too, Donegal is in the wrong place, Andurien, Tamarind and Stewart provinces missing,  Coventry missing etc.
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Jimmy the Tulip

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Re: Does anyone remember the Succession Wars board game?
« Reply #25 on: 02 May 2017, 18:43:47 »
Scrapyard Armory made an online playable version. They've had to clear up a lot of rules, and added some more rules options and scenarios.
http://www.scrapyardarmory.com/successionwars/

I'm an Admin and Scenario Designer over at SYA's Succession Wars game. In addition to the board games 4th and 1st Succession War scenarios we've developed around 14 other scenarios on a range of maps. I've put together a Scenario Guide providing info on the various games you can play. If anyone's interested in taking a look PM me with your email address. It's too big to upload here.

 

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