Author Topic: What if IS and Clan equipment were instead invented by the other?  (Read 2195 times)

Suralin

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So I've done a bit of musing on this subject, particularly for the Vaults AU. Basically I wanted to have a lot of things that originated with the Clans in canon (Protomechs, Heavy Lasers, ATMs, etc) be IS in origin, with appropriate stat changes. Admittedly I haven't done as well with the whole "vice versa" part. Blame my IS bias. :p

So I'm curious what other people would do (or have done) with this idea. Clan-origin VSPs? An inferior IS Ferro Lamellor? Primitive Snub-nose PPCs? Go ahead and post your ideas here.

Empyrus

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Some notes:

ProtoMechs don't really work with IS tech. Or at least they'd be poorly armored and armed, not really worth it perhaps. This assuming there'd be appropriate stat changes like heavier armor and heat sinks, etc.
That said, i like this idea, and if you go digging, you'll find that people have come up with variety of ideas already.

Heavy Lasers wouldn't work well with IS tech due to heat sink size issues. The Blazer is kinda of a proto-Heavy Laser as it is.

ATMs would be wasted for the Spheroids as they make extensive use of special munitions so MMLs are natural fit for them. YMMV if MMLs would be wasted for Clans though, they can use special munitions as well after all.

Clan VSPLs would be kinda hilarious, assuming they get proportional range and damage boost. Though unless their weight is also lowered, they don't really offer that much over standard pulse lasers and targeting computer combo (though this same applies to Spheroids pulse lasers).

Spheroid Ferro-Lamellor is pretty easy: Slightly heavier (12 points per ton rather than 14) and bulkier (14 slots rather than 12), reduce damage reduction to 1 per 6 damage (about 17% damage reduction compared to Clan FL's 20%). Or something like this.

Dragon Cat

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Streak MRMs ring a bell from one of the MechWarrior games

A Streak MRM40 would be mental in game
My three main Alternate Timeline with Thanks fan-fiction threads are in the links below. I'm always open to suggestions or additions to be incorporated so if you feel you wish to add something feel free. There's non-canon units, equipment, people, events, erm... Solar Systems spread throughout so please enjoy

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,20515.0.html - Part 1

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,52013.0.html - Part 2

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,79196.0.html - Part 3

Empyrus

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Streak MRMs ring a bell from one of the MechWarrior games

A Streak MRM40 would be mental in game
Yeah...

Let's see: ClanTech managed to halve LRM and SRM weight, so logically they should be able to do the same for MRMs. Streak adds 50 to 100 percent weight to a launcher. For balance purposes, we'll keep the weight the same as IS versions like Streak LRMs do. Size is presumably identical as well. Also for balance purposes, i'd keep the +1 to-hit penalty, though ultimately it has little effect, especially since Clan gunners are better. I most certainly wouldn't upgrade the range like Clan Streak SRMs do.

What a monstrous weapon. 40 guaranteed damage at 15 hexes... Even if it is applied in clusters, even with to-hit penalty it is ridiculous. The HAG-40 weights more and has less ammo and explodes, so i'd say this hypothetical Streak MRM-40 is a viable option.

Dragon Cat

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Viable yes but still a world of hurt

The drawback for the Streak MRM being that its ammo explodes, the launchers are weighty and low ammo (something Streak would eliminate)

So you might be right it could work in some ways

The Clan Light PPC would essentially replace the ER Medium Laser in some ways though weight would mess it up while the Heavy PPC could be a monster particle weapon matching or exceeding the Heavy Laser
« Last Edit: 27 April 2017, 17:44:36 by Dragon Cat »
My three main Alternate Timeline with Thanks fan-fiction threads are in the links below. I'm always open to suggestions or additions to be incorporated so if you feel you wish to add something feel free. There's non-canon units, equipment, people, events, erm... Solar Systems spread throughout so please enjoy

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,20515.0.html - Part 1

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,52013.0.html - Part 2

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,79196.0.html - Part 3

Red Pins

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Tagged.
...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Work-in-progress; The Blake Threat File
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
TRO: 3176 Hegemony Refits - the 30-day wonder

Suralin

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ProtoMechs don't really work with IS tech. Or at least they'd be poorly armored and armed, not really worth it perhaps. This assuming there'd be appropriate stat changes like heavier armor and heat sinks, etc.
That said, i like this idea, and if you go digging, you'll find that people have come up with variety of ideas already.

I know, the rules thread's linked in my sig. :P I was just using IS Protos as an already-existing example to spur people's imagination.

As for their effectiveness, I dunno, I think these little things could be reasonably successful, even with their drawbacks. There's actually a little stack of scraps of register tape with hand-written theorycrafting on them right next to my monitor, and about 1/3 of them are IS Protos of various flavors, mostly using the 60 SFE, 120 SFE, and 45 TFE engines. Most of them seem like they're comparable (albeit inferior) to Clan stuff of the same tonnage. I just never got around to putting them into the computer is all.

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Heavy Lasers wouldn't work well with IS tech due to heat sink size issues. The Blazer is kinda of a proto-Heavy Laser as it is.

Mreh, I've kind of taken a shine to them myself ;)

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ATMs would be wasted for the Spheroids as they make extensive use of special munitions so MMLs are natural fit for them. YMMV if MMLs would be wasted for Clans though, they can use special munitions as well after all.

Maybe the Clanners would wind up being the ones to use lots of special munitions, then?

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Clan VSPLs would be kinda hilarious, assuming they get proportional range and damage boost. Though unless their weight is also lowered, they don't really offer that much over standard pulse lasers and targeting computer combo (though this same applies to Spheroids pulse lasers).

I dunno, I guess the weight *would* be lowered a bit. Maybe 1.5/3/8 tons? At the cost of adding a bit of extra heat over the IS version, of course.

Red Pins

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So I've done a bit of musing on this subject, particularly for the Vaults AU. Basically I wanted to have a lot of things that originated with the Clans in canon (Protomechs, Heavy Lasers, ATMs, etc) be IS in origin, with appropriate stat changes. Admittedly I haven't done as well with the whole "vice versa" part. Blame my IS bias. :p

So I'm curious what other people would do (or have done) with this idea. Clan-origin VSPs? An inferior IS Ferro Lamellor? Primitive Snub-nose PPCs? Go ahead and post your ideas here.

Ok, this is the third re-write, so its going to be bare bones.  I wanted to create a IS-ProtoMech using the 10-15 ton Mechs from the old days.  Remember the Roadrunner?  Tasmanian Devil?

They use a mix of IS/Clan tech, a mix of Battlearmor/'Mech construction rules, and some of the ProtoMech rules like the near miss on a 2 or 12, and need to stay heat neutral.  I had a bunch of other stuff, too.  This was to be the Table of Contents when I was still working on it;

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PG 182 Unique Technology, 34 pages;

  New Unit Types

    Heavy- and Assault Components (H-AC)  (6-8 legged, 150-200 ton units)

    Permanent AirMechs (Only AirMech-mode LAMs.  Think B-1B Bombers.)

    FighterShips (twin engine small-craft)

    Extra-Light ‘Mechs (ProtoMech equivilants)

    Portable Turrets (Tank turrets without the tank, 5-10 ton Anti-Infantry or 15-20 ton Anti-Armor/Mech/AA)

  New Construction Equipment

    Hardpoints (A primitive Omni-system of attachment points and pods)

    Limb Extensions (Drywaller Stilts for arms and legs to increase ground speed or physical attack damage.  Useable on ELMs, too)

    Armor Rescue Pods (A armored component system.)

  New Weapons

    Extended-Range TAG

    Cassette Missile System (Think RL-launcher; fire 1 or all of a 1/3 of a ton of missiles, drop the box, load another one.  Took a variable amount of time depending on how many crew survived.  Used SRM, LRM, MRM, ELRM, anything that doesn't need electronics like Artemis or Streak.)

    AP Gauss Repeater (More capacitors - it was a HAG for BA.)

    Naval Gauss Repeater (More capacitors - it added a second shot but used the Ultra AC rules, needing a 7 or better to hit with the second shot with a separate location roll.)

    Arrow V Artillery Missile (Used a T-C warhead, had the TacOps missile types.  10 Damage to armor, 10 damage to the internals.  It was intended to kill H-ACs.)

    Thunderbolt-TOW Missile (Wire-guided Thunderbolts, 10-15-20 point warheads only.  Open vehicles like trucks only, stationary to fire, could use aimed fire while out of LOS.)

    Improved-Autocannons (Google 'Metal Storm'.  Electrically fired bullets with solid propellant.  Used all ammo types in a set order; LB, Precision, AP, whatever.  Fired one or every bullet in the gun with a penalty to aim depending on the size and number of bullets.)

  New Equipment

    Armor Skirts (Armor system for the Hasty fieldworks position.  Worked well with trailer systems or tanks.)

    Point C3 System (Joined two vehicles or ASF into a linked C3 network.  Adapted to battlefield losses.  Not used for Mechs.)

    Enhanced-Jump Core (Never finished.  It was supposed to be a slightly bigger, faster-charging K-F Drive that Jumped 50-60 LYs.  I got into Primitives instead.)

...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Work-in-progress; The Blake Threat File
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
TRO: 3176 Hegemony Refits - the 30-day wonder

Dragon Cat

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Quote
Ok, this is the third re-write, so its going to be bare bones.  I wanted to create a IS-ProtoMech using the 10-15 ton Mechs from the old days.  Remember the Roadrunner?  Tasmanian Devil?

Well Roadrunner is now an accepted design it was in XTRO Republic I although it is built on a Clan frame so still not IS tech.



My three main Alternate Timeline with Thanks fan-fiction threads are in the links below. I'm always open to suggestions or additions to be incorporated so if you feel you wish to add something feel free. There's non-canon units, equipment, people, events, erm... Solar Systems spread throughout so please enjoy

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,20515.0.html - Part 1

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,52013.0.html - Part 2

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,79196.0.html - Part 3

Red Pins

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Yeah, this is over a decade old, from about 2002-5.
...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Work-in-progress; The Blake Threat File
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
TRO: 3176 Hegemony Refits - the 30-day wonder