Micro Pulse Lasers

[Black_Knyght]

Looking over Clan Micro Pulse Lasers, they seem like yet another pointless weapon (like MRMs, LGR's, and such).

Is this a common consensus, or do they actually have some kind of worthwhileness I'm just not seeing?

I'm curious what Clan weapons are worthwhile, and which are generally considered white elephants?

[Crimson Dawn]

DO they have additional effects on infantry like small pulse lasers?

[Kit deSummersville]

I'm curious what Clan weapons are worthwhile, and which are generally considered white elephants?

Only LPL connected to Targeting Computers.

[Arkansas Warrior]

DO they have additional effects on infantry like small pulse lasers?

Yes.

I have rarely, if ever, used the MiPL on anything larger than BA.  They're probably ok there, but I'd usually rather have a flamer.  However, on BA they shine.  The MiPL Elemental makes everything's by that came before obsolete (outside of niche circumstances).  The MiPL is as good vs armor as a small laser (at the same range), plus the pulse bonus, plus it is more effective against infantry like a machine gun.

[(SMD)MadCow]

Ammo-free anti-infantry weapons can always find a use.

[Crow]

Try using the Chrysaor 2. Then you will be enlightened  O:-)

[jklantern]

Looking over Clan Micro Pulse Lasers, they seem like yet another pointless weapon (like MRMs, LGR's, and such).

The MRM isn't pointless!  Its point is to give JKLantern a warm glow when he fires all the missiles!  Even if they don't hit anything anywhere!

[Daryk]

Nor is the LGR... more than two points of damage at 25 hex range?  Yes, please! ;D

[Nebfer]

Their not the most useful of weapons but they do have some uses, their not to bad if you have a half ton left, their bonus vs infantry is useful however.

[(SMD)MadCow]

Dedicated Clan infantry hunting:
http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=57693.msg1327349#msg1327349

[marauder648]

Micro's work well on BA, and are basically a laser machine gun with a pulse bonus so well worth the tonnage spent on them vs a MG. 

[wantec]

DO they have additional effects on infantry like small pulse lasers?

If you're asking if they do more than just the listed damage against infantry, then yes. Actually it's the same, both the Small and Micro Pulse Lasers do 2d6 damage against conventional infantry. That's the same as an AP Gauss and a standard Machine Gun.

Looking over Clan Micro Pulse Lasers, they seem like yet another pointless weapon (like MRMs, LGR's, and such).

Is this a common consensus, or do they actually have some kind of worthwhileness I'm just not seeing?

I'm curious what Clan weapons are worthwhile, and which are generally considered white elephants?

Do you consider Flamers, Machine Guns, or Heavy Small Lasers worthwhile? Those all have the same ranges as Micro Pulse Lasers. The MiPL does 3 damage, so more than the Flamer or MG, but half the HSL. It only costs 1 heat, and it has the pulse bonus, so I'd say it works pretty well in almost any situation you'd consider using the others.

[Frogfoot]

LGR's

Not pointless at all. You can snipe with it at very long ranges, or just use it like it's a 16 hex range LPL. It might not be a top tier weapon but it's certainly viable.

[Sartris]

in the current era with a preponderance of mixed-tech options, the MiPL is an excellent replacement for an MG or SPL on almost any IS design when you need anti-infantry protection.

Not pointless at all. You can snipe with it at very long ranges, or just use it like it's a 16 hex range LPL. It might not be a top tier weapon but it's certainly viable.

i've gained a grudging respect for the LGR over the years - mostly because they're so damn common if you play FWL post-3067 that you have to learn to live with them. With a medium range of 17, you can exploit a 2-3 hex reach advantage and goad an impatient or enthusiastic opponent into charging or over-extending... directly into the minefields you've been dropping or whatever other traps you've got lined up along the way.

[Weirdo]

...pointless weapon...

No such thing. Serious.

[Kit deSummersville]

No such thing. Serious.

Well, the wrecking ball is pointless. And possibly the mace, depending on what style it is.

[Kharim]

Mace is not bad if mechwarrior knows how to pilot properly. And if you use "weight class physical attack modifier" rule from TacOps it really shines on light and mediums.

[sadlerbw]

Mace is not bad if mechwarrior knows how to pilot properly. And if you use "weight class physical attack modifier" rule from TacOps it really shines on light and mediums.

Pretty sure he meant pointless as-in, it has no pointy bits...i.e. smooth. In which case the Gauss slug is supposed to be basically a big, metal orb so it might be pointless as well. Or maybe I just like bad puns too much?

[Weirdo]

It's Kit. When in doubt, always assume he's going for the bad pun. :)

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

No such thing. Serious.

Even B-Pods?  Because a one-shot anti-Battle Armor weapon that barely inconveniences most Battle Armor suits seems pretty pointless.

[Weirdo]

They're still much better than A-pods. I still say that nothing is truly pointless, but if I ever mellow out, then the A-pod will be the first thing to cross over for me.

[Kit deSummersville]

Well, I suppose with iOS available, OS weapons are pretty pointless.

[Weirdo]

Nah, they've still got a use on units that need to fill their tonnage but don't have the crit room or item slots for multiple weapons. Think assault mechs and  big support vees.

[sadlerbw]

They're still much better than A-pods. I still say that nothing is truly pointless, but if I ever mellow out, then the A-pod will be the first thing to cross over for me.

Can't say I've actually tried it, but M-bods seem like they would work better as B-pods than actual B-pods do.

Anyway, there are many weapons that are sub-optimal, but none that are truly pointless. They pretty much all can do SOMETHING. They just might not do it as well as many other weapons. In the case of the MiPL, it isn't 'better' than a machine gun, flamer, ER Small, or small pulse. It is, however, different in some way from all of them.

I've played a few fights recently with a Goshawk II, and while they weren't the best weapons ever, I was able to use the MiPL's and do some useful stuff. Having a pile of them worked well for jumping in behind a tank and trying to park it with crits. Kind of like a laser Cluster weapon. I was also using something else recently, I think maybe a Ti'Tsang, and was wishing for some low-tonnage, low-heat weapons for playing TSM heat games. at only 0.5 tons and one crit, the MiPL's would be a good choice for a weapon meant to fine-tune heat without taking too much away from crits and space for bigger guns.

[Kit deSummersville]

Nah, they've still got a use on units that need to fill their tonnage but don't have the crit room or item slots for multiple weapons. Think assault mechs and  big support vees.

You could armor your OS weapon to use up some weight....  :D

[Cryhavok101]

I have some ATOW players who really don't think the enemy's A and B pods are pointless.

[Weirdo]

You could armor your OS weapon to use up some weight....  :D

Now you're thinking with tonnage! O0

Besides, who wants their emergency salvo critted out before they really need it?

[Daemion]

in the current era with a preponderance of mixed-tech options, the MiPL is an excellent replacement for an MG or SPL on almost any IS design when you need anti-infantry protection.

They're more than that. For someone who made a custom Warhammer modded with TSM, you want a few one-heat generators to fine-tune heat output. Small Lasers are a good starting point, but the MiPL is an obvious upgrade when you come across clan-tech salvage. Who needs the Small-Xpulse when the clan Micro Pulse laser is more readily available, and half a ton lighter?

[GermanSumo]

Looking over Clan Micro Pulse Lasers, they seem like yet another pointless weapon (like MRMs, LGR's, and such).

Is this a common consensus, or do they actually have some kind of worthwhileness I'm just not seeing?

i also - like some others - disagree on the LGR´s and MRM´s being pointless or worthwhileness. The same line of arguement makes Large Lasers pointless with the rise of the Clan ER Medium Laser.

I personally dont like IS ER Weapons in general. Too much heat generation for too little gain for my personal taste. But are they worthless? I do not consider them worthless. I just dont like the offsetting negative facts about them. MRM´s are great weapons imho. IF they hit... you can have 40 missiles flying in your enemies case. Is it probable that its going to happen? NO, because they have a to hit modifier and do bad on the missile hit table. Thats a huge setoff, but they are still viable. Others commented on the Light Gauss Rifle... dude, an IS weapon that throws 8 points of damage further down the line than a Clan ER PPC? Sign me on. Although i personally think that the LGR´s wheight is too high to make me really like them.

Micro Pulse Lasers then. Well... i played in a time when you had only IS gear on your mashines. The Clan mashines were a marvel to behold. Any pulse weapon with their sweet sweet -2 hit modifier makes me cry like im in heaven! Is the range of this weapon an issue? Yes, it is. But i assume any BA would be happy to carry one of these (or two, or three, or heck why not four?) if it has the same range as a flamer. And yes, it can have it uses on many uses. Niche uses maybe. But in my book, a -2 hit modifier is ALWAYS worth it. Especially if you consider the modern rules extra damage on PBI´s (in my time, only the mashine gun had that effect :P deal with it).

The only thing i couldnt really grasp were the Bombast Lasers. Heavy Lasers i can appreciate and understand. All of the weapons above i can understand. But what exactly are the benefits of installing a bombast or binary laser instead of just putting two large lasers in that arm? :) i aint saying its useless... i just dont understand how this weapon might be used and why? :D

[ANS Kamas P81]

But what exactly are the benefits of installing a...binary laser instead of just putting two large lasers in that arm? :) i aint saying its useless... i just dont understand how this weapon might be used and why? :D

Guaranteed headcap potential with the 12-point hit, compared to two 8-point shots that both need to hit, let alone land on the same location.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

The only thing i couldnt really grasp were the Bombast Lasers. Heavy Lasers i can appreciate and understand. All of the weapons above i can understand. But what exactly are the benefits of installing a bombast or binary laser instead of just putting two large lasers in that arm? :) i aint saying its useless... i just dont understand how this weapon might be used and why? :D

Blazers are useful for the IS because they're a headcapper.  If the HPPC hadn't been added to the game two years earlier, we'd probably all have a more positive view of them.

Bombast lasers, OTOH, are rather pointless.  They're a Solaris weapon and really aren't worth using anywhere else.

[Cryhavok101]

Blazers are great in their era, since they are available in 3025. Heavy PPCs weren't available until 3067. During the succession wars, the Blazer's only competion as a headcapper was the AC/20.

If you don't play in the Succession Wars era, the blazer isn't very good.

The bombast laser is a great weapon to sell your enemy on.

[Luciora]

The Bombast was MS's idea for MW4 that got canonized, unfortunantly.  Great for console gaming for that big energy bang, but otherwise......

[Weirdo]

Anything that can take a mech's head off is by definition not pointless. It may be inefficient as all hell, but that's not what we're looking at. The question is if it has a job, not if anything else does the job better.

[GermanSumo]

gotcha. thanks for the answers, everybody. got it now! :D

[Hellraiser]

Looking over Clan Micro Pulse Lasers, they seem like yet another pointless weapon (like MRMs, LGR's, and such).

Is this a common consensus, or do they actually have some kind of worthwhileness I'm just not seeing?

I'm curious what Clan weapons are worthwhile, and which are generally considered white elephants?

If you consider MRMs & LGRs pointless then I'd say you haven't been using them correctly :)
Niche for sure, but pointless..... OH NO.

Micropulse are fine for Battle Armor, Vehicles, & Light Mechs that need to deal w/ infantry.
I might not put them on my Direwolf but that isn't saying much.

I have very little use for Heavy-Small Lasers.  (Firemoth-H I'm looking at you)
They are super cheap for BV, but I'm not a fan of the results I get having to be so close to get a decent to-hit #

[Col Toda]

The Battle Armor and anti-infantry use for the micro pulse laser has been addressed , I will move on to the MRM and Light Gauss Rifle . The MRM before Apollo FCS you would be correct but after in conjunction with C3 it shines . It is meant to be used with C3 as evidenced by the stock Shugenja, with 1 MRM 30 and the Catapult model with 2 MRM 30s , 2 med pulse lasers and a C3 slave clearly shows this. As for the Light Gauss Rifle it shines in Aerospace combat as it has an extended range bracket and does enough damage to break the threshold number of 90 percent of aerospace fighters armor. Throw that in with pocket warships and Navel C3 a warship with a bay of 5 LGR gets ugly . For ground units you are mostly correct as to it's utility for the tonnage , but I have seen a few fast units with Stealth Armor and targeting computers that make a modest argument for them . 1 Brackets permit you to be in medium range while the enemy is at long and the weapon tonnage is evenly divided by 4 for computer weight purposes and a single ton of ammo is normally enough while a standard Gauss Rifle requires 2 tons of ammo minimum . It has it's niche any era it exists for ground combat before the Dark Age ERA . The Dark Age ERA tends to have as common practice designs with a single Clan tech spec weapon so the Light Gauss Rifle is less of a win tonnage wise .

[Nightsong]

I'm not a FWL fan, but I actually rather like the Light Gauss, especially as a refit for older AC/10 carrying units, giving them a role as cheap direct fire support units. Take a few CN9-As with some surplus Imperator IIs replacing the old Luxor-Ds and you've got a nice group of snipers.

I rather like MRMs as well but that's because I'm a long time C3 player. If not playing with C3, though I'd prefer to have them on units with high mobility. (imagined a salvaged Blitzkrieg with an MRM40 and a Supercharger to put the fear of Itano into someone...)

[JadeHellbringer]

I'm not a FWL fan, but I actually rather like the Light Gauss, especially as a refit for older AC/10 carrying units, giving them a role as cheap direct fire support units. Take a few CN9-As with some surplus Imperator IIs replacing the old Luxor-Ds and you've got a nice group of snipers.

I rather like MRMs as well but that's because I'm a long time C3 player. If not playing with C3, though I'd prefer to have them on units with high mobility. (imagined a salvaged Blitzkrieg with an MRM40 and a Supercharger to put the fear of Itano into someone...)

This guy? He gets it.

Remember, the LGR is a Marik weapon. VERY few Marik units are designed to just be fantastic right out of the box- they're meant to work as part of a group. So what looks often like an underwhelming weapon, or platform for that weapon, becomes a part of a larger picture- one that can become absolutely terrifying if built and used right.

So yeah, the LGR is a big, heavy, clumsy weapon that only does eight points of damage. It has great range, yes, but still, eight points. Four of them though from the Centurions mentioned above? That's a little worrisome- that's four hits coming in at ranges where you may not even be able to respond, or at least where their medium range bracket starts where your long range is still going on. That adds up fast, even on an assault Mech. Now back that with signature Marik LRM support, some close-range muscle in case things get in under the umbrella... and a company with an LGR lance becomes a very tough nut to crack.