Author Topic: Wolverines? Where are they now?  (Read 22715 times)

RABIDFOX50

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Wolverines? Where are they now?
« on: 13 August 2017, 11:49:16 »
Any speculations? Are they out there? Are they going to return? Is there a future for my favorite Clan?
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Bren

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #1 on: 13 August 2017, 12:00:53 »
Any speculations? No speculations. Are they out there? No they are not. Are they going to return? Never to return. Is there a future for my favorite Clan? No future.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #2 on: 13 August 2017, 12:05:37 »
Only in your campaigns. Whatever you come up with you don't have to worry about the TPTB throwing wrench into your plans as they said they are not going to answer what happened to them.

Me, they might have settled a world they call Steadfast a couple jumps south of Erod's Escape. Or the similarities to the Wolverines / Minnesota Tribe is a coincidence.

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Tyler Jorgensson

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #3 on: 13 August 2017, 15:33:40 »
They could be some settlers in The Nuevo Castille area .... they could be the Blood ... they could be Blakists.... they could be Ghost Bears.... they could be Periphery Travellers.... or they could be dead.

We all hope they return, hopefully to mess with Nicholas Kerensky an bit more: and with luck Blaine can write a sequel to Betrayal of Ideals in the future. Maybe we'll get Clan Wolverine dice, or other merch.

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #4 on: 13 August 2017, 17:18:19 »
We don't know, and anyone who says they do is selling something. 

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #5 on: 13 August 2017, 18:18:51 »
They say that the Wolverines are the Minnesota Tribe, and became the foundation of the Word of Blake.

All we know is that they call them the Not Named Clan
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Stormlion1

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #6 on: 13 August 2017, 20:09:31 »
FASA said there off beyond the rim fighting Aliens. I like to think that is the case.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #7 on: 13 August 2017, 20:15:34 »
FASA said there off beyond the rim fighting Aliens. I like to think that is the case.

No, a manuscript submitted to FASA said that. FASA laughed it out of the office
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #8 on: 13 August 2017, 20:18:42 »
actually IIRC it was an joke comment by one of the FASA writers, never meant to be taken seriously.


They say that the Wolverines are the Minnesota Tribe, and became the foundation of the Word of Blake.

All we know is that they call them the Not Named Clan
well we know they were the minnesota tribe for sure. what happened to them after they did their multi-planet crawl through combine space is unknown.

honestly i suspect that if they didn't end up joining comstar like is claimed, they probably just kept going into the deep deep periphery until they found somewhere to settle. and no longer care about the innersphere or the clans.

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #9 on: 14 August 2017, 15:17:58 »
The best proof that the WoB and the Wolverines have nothing in common is the absolute abscence of proof. Not one genetic tie, not one from any WoB acolyte, mechwarrior, anyone with any ties to Comstar or WoB ever popped up. You don't think at least one descendant of the Wolverines would join the Comguards and fight on Tukkayid? Not one would have a career as a HPG Tech and just happened to be in the Invasion corridors?
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #10 on: 14 August 2017, 15:34:31 »

I think that the Wolverines split into different groups during & after Barbados. This would explain most things.
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Mendrugo

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #11 on: 14 August 2017, 16:15:42 »
Any speculations? Are they out there? Are they going to return? Is there a future for my favorite Clan?

What we know:

Most of Clan Wolverine died - either when its evacuation staging point was nuked in the Clan Homeworlds, or when most of its ships and personnel were caught in the Barbados Deep Periphery system.  There were, however, some survivors.

Two scouting groups missed the big fracas, and reunited afterwards.  They added a late-arriving contingent of Wolverine sibcadets, and then headed for the Inner Sphere.  They became the Minnesota Tribe.

A third scouting group failed to link up, but was not recorded as being destroyed.  There's an outside chance they became the Umayyads.

A few Wolverine WarShips fled during the Barbados fight, with Steel Vipers in hot pursuit.  One of those ships later turned up in service to the Word of Blake during the Jihad.  Did ComStar find it derelict in the Deep Periphery and mothball it for later, or did they meet up with that ship and grant them sanctuary (forming the basis for the rumored "Cabal" inside ComStar/Word of Blake)?

As to the Minnesota Tribe, we have what appears to be concrete evidence that the Tribe circled clockwise around the Inner Sphere and built a base on a world about one jump coreward of the non-Tribe-related world of McEvedy's Folly.  At some point, that base was abandoned - possibly with violence involved.  By the latter part of the 31st century, unknown forces using Manei Domini equipment were guarding the world, exterminating an Interstellar Expeditions team on the surface.

What happened, and where'd they go? 

My theory:  The crew of the Zughoffer Weir did indeed meet up with ComStar and gain sanctuary - either on Mars, or on at least one of the Hidden Five.  (Perhaps both).  Their descendants were the ones pushing for the anti-Clan Jihad, and also the ones responsible for the "visions" of monstrous beasts descending from the Periphery (triggering the formation of the Explorer Corps).  A member of the cabal was also responsible for the leak of the purported "Wolverine Journal," which contains a few nuggets of true data, but mostly false information.  (Based on the disconnect between Blaine Pardoe's story and the journal narrative).

Meanwhile, the Tribe seems to have lived in secrecy until at least the early 3000s on their base rimward of the Magistracy of Canopus.  At some point, they made contact with the Magistracy, offering tech.  (MoC from the earliest sourcebooks boasted of a source of technology from somewhere beyond the Periphery.)  When parties unknown smashed their base, the survivors Exodused again to the Magistracy.  The MoC went from having to write its army manuals down to a fifth grade reading level in 3025 to having high-tech cyborg super agents in the Ebon Directorate circa 3040.  That's a lot of progress in 15 years.  Did I mention the last director of the Wolverine Watch was Trish Ebon?

Meta theory - because the unknown anti-IE force at the Tribe baseworld was using advanced WoB tech, my guess is that the Cabal Wolverines discovered and had a falling out with the Tribe Wolverines in the early 3000s, and the Cabal massacred the Tribe, leaving the survivors to flee to the Magistracy, promising tech for sanctuary.  This could explain why the fiction shows that there was a shadow war between the Manei Domini and the Ebon Directorate in the WoB-occupied Magistracy during the Jihad - a continuation of the Tribe/Cabal conflict.

Anyhoo - the theory fits the existing facts, but is by no means airtight or in any way canon.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #12 on: 14 August 2017, 16:27:53 »
Beat me to it Mendrugo! And better written than what I had. My money is the Zughoffer Weir met up with Trish Ebon's force but the Battleship was too damaged to continue on and was abandoned. The task force continued on to the edge of the Magistracy and set up a outpost that was later abandoned and they continued on deeper into the Periphery. The Wolverines never had contact with the Inner Sphere or the Periphery and the WoB force in 3095 was just as interested in the world as Interstellar Expeditions were. Both to figure out a long standing mystery of the long lost Clan, to find and destroy a Clan which was the original purpose of the Manei Domini, to look for usable tech or caches they may have left behind. From the story the Wolverine Mechs .

The above mentioned outpost was noted to be several levels deep and had discarded mech hulls and tech left behind but no sign of damage other than a landslide hiding the buildings surface. Probably the world was unstable and abandoned.
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Robroy

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #13 on: 14 August 2017, 16:42:31 »
The thing about the visions that, I think it was Simons, of the 19 clans when the Wolverines left she named 4 clans that would invade.

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Stormlion1

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #14 on: 14 August 2017, 16:56:57 »
The thing about the visions that, I think it was Simons, of the 19 clans when the Wolverines left she named 4 clans that would invade.

Primus Sim's. She created the Explorer Corp that would eventually come in contact with the Clans decades later. The visions included a "metallic viper", the "emerald birds of death", the demon horses and a "six-legged bear".
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #15 on: 14 August 2017, 16:57:15 »
Mendrugo, do you recall the sourcebook where you read about the Magistracy receiving the unknown technology?
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #16 on: 14 August 2017, 17:42:54 »
Primus Sim's. She created the Explorer Corp that would eventually come in contact with the Clans decades later. The visions included a "metallic viper", the "emerald birds of death", the demon horses and a "six-legged bear".

Yeah. What I did such a poor job of conveying was that if the Wolverines did contact Comstar, she managed to pick the right ones. Some people don't like the sixth sense thing saying it is luck. If it  was me just guessing I probably would have picked Widow Maker and Burrock.

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Mendrugo

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #17 on: 14 August 2017, 18:06:54 »
Mendrugo, do you recall the sourcebook where you read about the Magistracy receiving the unknown technology?

MechWarrior 1st Edition, MechWarrior 2nd edition, and an oblique reference to ComStar investigating it in Guide to Covert Ops.  All it says is that the Magistracy has been receiving technology from a "mysterious source beyond the Periphery."
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

Stormlion1

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #18 on: 14 August 2017, 19:27:15 »
Another issue I had with Comstar/Wolverine connection is if there was one the last thing they would be doing is sending jumpships out in that general direction. Every other one, but not towards the Clans no matter how many Divisions they had discovered on Terra. They know where the Homeworld are after all.
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Mendrugo

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #19 on: 14 August 2017, 19:37:33 »
Unless that was the the point - to draw the Clans and the Successor States into a giant game of "Let's you and him fight," to get revenge on the entities that destroyed their Clan and the entities that destroyed the Star League.

Quite a coincidence that the Outbound Light just happened to pop in over Huntress only after the ComGuard was formed and capable of resisting the Clan toumans.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #20 on: 14 August 2017, 19:47:42 »
MechWarrior 1st and 2nd Edition basically say the same thing. "Spies from the IS claim that the MoC has a source of supply for its Mech units that lies 'somewhere beyond the Periphery.'"

It doesn't say technology, both books say "for its 'Mech units."

Brush Wars (I think) and Guide to Covert Ops don't say "supply of technology," but something along the lines of "resource-rich worlds beyond explored space.'

Guide to Covert Ops speculates alot, with suggestions of a Germanium rich world, or a Star League depot or something. It also suggests that the Magistracy Intelligence Ministry's newfound success could be because of the Dragoons joining the organization, or co-opting it for some reason.

TR3075 has the Magistracy suddenly utilizing pristine-condition Dictators starting around 3075, whose providence is unknown.

And XTRO Periphery gives us the Vengeance-Class Pocket WarShip Prototype the MCS Danai Centrella, whose origins are unknown.

So there are a few oddities out there tied to the Magistracy. Whether they're all linked, or some of them even true, is still up in the air.

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #21 on: 14 August 2017, 20:09:17 »
What happened, and where'd they go? 

Meanwhile, the Tribe seems to have lived in secrecy until at least the early 3000s on their base rimward of the Magistracy of Canopus.  At some point, they made contact with the Magistracy, offering tech.  (MoC from the earliest sourcebooks boasted of a source of technology from somewhere beyond the Periphery.)  When parties unknown smashed their base, the survivors Exodused again to the Magistracy.  The MoC went from having to write its army manuals down to a fifth grade reading level in 3025 to having high-tech cyborg super agents in the Ebon Directorate circa 3040.  That's a lot of progress in 15 years.  Did I mention the last director of the Wolverine Watch was Trish Ebon?

Meta theory - because the unknown anti-IE force at the Tribe baseworld was using advanced WoB tech, my guess is that the Cabal Wolverines discovered and had a falling out with the Tribe Wolverines in the early 3000s, and the Cabal massacred the Tribe, leaving the survivors to flee to the Magistracy, promising tech for sanctuary.  This could explain why the fiction shows that there was a shadow war between the Manei Domini and the Ebon Directorate in the WoB-occupied Magistracy during the Jihad - a continuation of the Tribe/Cabal conflict.

Its an interesting theory, and you're not the first to notice the naming similarity between Trish Ebon and the Ebon Magistrate.  I do think a few things are off. Unless I'm missing something, we don't have any evidence of the Ebon Magistrate existing in the 3040's. Guide to Covert Ops calls the The Ebon Magistrate section "a recent development." The 3040's was when the overhaul of the MIM started, but unless I'm missing details, we don't have any indication of the Ebon Magistrate active before the 3060's.

The survivors offering tech is an interesting theory, but that doesn't explain why the Magistracy was so hungry for knowledge and technology in the 3050's and 60's, enough so that they got into the bed with the Capellan Confederation on the promise of having tech and educators. If they had a source of it from the outside, they wouldn't have needed the Capellans...or atleast not as much as they did.

Unless that was the the point - to draw the Clans and the Successor States into a giant game of "Let's you and him fight," to get revenge on the entities that destroyed their Clan and the entities that destroyed the Star League.

Quite a coincidence that the Outbound Light just happened to pop in over Huntress only after the ComGuard was formed and capable of resisting the Clan toumans.

On the other hand, the ComGuards were just enough to resist the few Clans that showed up, and really only because they bid poorly, spurred on the by machinations of the Wolves.

Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #22 on: 14 August 2017, 21:43:28 »
It's entirely possible that ships like the Outbound Light may have been scouting for the Clan homeworlds,  and just got unlucky about getting away without getting caught.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #23 on: 15 August 2017, 02:10:11 »
Unless that was the the point - to draw the Clans and the Successor States into a giant game of "Let's you and him fight," to get revenge on the entities that destroyed their Clan and the entities that destroyed the Star League.

Quite a coincidence that the Outbound Light just happened to pop in over Huntress only after the ComGuard was formed and capable of resistring the Clan toumans.

About 80 years between the formation of the Comguards and Outbound Light as appearing over Huntress and Sims hated the idea of the Comguards. That was her predecessors initiave. That's a very long game there if it's true.
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Mendrugo

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #24 on: 15 August 2017, 05:59:28 »
About 80 years between the formation of the Comguards and Outbound Light as appearing over Huntress and Sims hated the idea of the Comguards. That was her predecessors initiave. That's a very long game there if it's true.

But only a decade or so after the Com Guard was publicly revealed and deployed across the Inner Sphere, giving it time to gain field experience fighting bandits.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #25 on: 15 August 2017, 07:24:39 »
Mendrugo, do you recall the sourcebook where you read about the Magistracy receiving the unknown technology?
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #26 on: 15 August 2017, 12:02:10 »
I do reject the WOB theory as there is no evidence and no genetic proof as well.

 Thank you for the the experienced suggestions.

One would hope that CGL will revisit them in the future and not make the mistakes FASA did so long ago.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #27 on: 15 August 2017, 12:45:46 »
I do not think that TPTB has a detailed story developed so far what has happened to them.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #28 on: 15 August 2017, 12:48:13 »
Ann Arbor.
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Re: Wolverines? Where are they now?
« Reply #29 on: 15 August 2017, 13:10:00 »
I do reject the WOB theory as there is no evidence and no genetic proof as well.

What do you call the SLS Zughoffer Weir, then?  How did it end up in the WoB fleet during the Jihad?  In terms of genetics, we've seen Clan renegades take extremes to cover their genetic tracks (the Jaguars in Surrender Your Dreams using flamers to scour battlefields clean of the remains of their fallen, for example).  Also, if the Cabal Wolverines were relocated to a hidden community on one of The Five, there'd be no opportunities for genetic mixing with the general ComStar populace.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

 

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