Dates for BlackThorn BattleTech comic

[Mendrugo]

I just got my hands on the "BattleTech Annual" from Blackthorn comics.

None of the issues are dated, but there are some contextual clues.  Issue #1 and #2 features a Lyran Hatchetman.  Since TRO:3025 said the design was a recent prototype first used in early 3025, that story has to be after that.  The comic adaptation of the Black Widow Company's fight against AFFS cadets can be fairly reliably traced to 3024, based on references in TRO:3025 and the Tales of the Black Widow Company.

In the Annual, a Lyran lance attacks a Kuritan outpost on the world of Mozirje and discovers they've been working on a "bio-mech" - an autonomous 'Mech-sized cyborg monster. 

There's a reference to Trellshire, which means it has to be before the Clan Invasion, when Trellshire ceased to exist.

There's also a very interesting image at the start, showing the Lance's DropShip docked with what appears to be a WarShip, in orbit over Mozirje.  Since the Lyrans don't have any WarShips circa 3025, and Trellshire no longer exists by the time the AFFC starts cranking out capital ships, I would hazard to guess that this story actually takes place during the 2770s - on the eve of the outbreak of the First Succession War. 

At that time, House Kurita would be at its technological zenith - the only time prior to the 3050s that its technology base would support cutting-edge research.  (It was Kuritan researchers, after all, that mutated a vodnik into a hideous monster that lurks in the sewers under Solaris City in the 3050s).  Trellshire would still exist, there would be a basis for Lyran/Kuritan cross-border raiding, and the Houses would still be using WarShips to carry out missions like this.

What do you guys think?

[Frabby]

If your Hatchetman reference is about the BattleForce comics, they're clearly set prior to the 4th Succession War: Michael Hasek-Davion is still alive and Hanse is afraid he might start a war with the CapCon through his actions on Tibolt. (Yes, seriously.) Which kinda narrows it down to between 3025 and 3028.

The "Lance Killer Frost" story from the Annual book... I don't think we're seeing a WarShip here. Not of a type/design we've seen before, anyways. I rather presume it's an aerodyne DropShip of some sort. With a bit of artistic license it could be an Achilles.

[Mendrugo]

The "Lance Killer Frost" story from the Annual book... I don't think we're seeing a WarShip here. Not of a type/design we've seen before, anyways. I rather presume it's an aerodyne DropShip of some sort. With a bit of artistic license it could be an Achilles.

Look at the nose again - that's a Union DropShip as the tiny ball there.  Given the size differential, it's definitely not another DropShip. 

[Frabby]

Hm. Yes, I think you're right.
If that ball is a 81.5-meter Union then the "aerodyne" vessel seems to be easily a kilometer long. That's battleship size. And even if the DropShip Sphinx is just a Manatee, the smallest spheroid I could find that can carry a lance, the other ship is still at least around 700 meters long - way bigger than any DropShip. Not to mention the fact that aerodyne DropShips can only be up to 35,000 tons. The Conquistador is only 182 meters long, a Mammoth just 277 meters wide.

[Mendrugo]

Looking at the Handbook: House Steiner historical maps, Mozirje fell to the Combine in the First Succession War. 

My amended theory is that the Combine took Mozirje early in the First War - it was a minor outpost world and fell quickly, and wasn't worth the LCAF's effort to try to retake with all the other carnage raging elsewhere.

The Combine decided to open up a research outpost for BioMechs on Mozirje, so that if the project went out of control, all that would be threatened was a small outpost world inhabited by conquered Lyrans.

Lyran intel gets word of this and the garrison on Devin dispatches an expendable lance, with a WarShip escort, to investigate.  (This would have to take place before the massive Lyran/FWL fleet battle that wiped out most of both House's WarShips.)  The Kuritan research base is wiped out and, with the general loss of resources and technology, the BioMech project is lost to the annals of history.

I wonder if you could hybridize the creature construction rules and the cybernetics rules to gin up AToW stats for the beastie?

[Mendrugo]

I think I've managed to guesstimate the dates for most of the non-canon BlackThorne comics

BattleTech #3 and BattleTech Annual: 2789 (Early 1st Succession War)
Justification:  The ship that delivers the Lyran lance to investigate Mozirje is at least 50 times the size of the DropShip and was able to move from the jump point to orbit.  To me, that says WarShip.  The early 1st Succession War was the last time any Great House had enough of a WarShip fleet to dispatch one as an escort for a recon lance.  It also makes sense that the DCMS research base seemed to have plenty of LAMs for defense, since those would have been more common back then, too.  Also, it's much more likely that the Combine would be dabbling in genetic engineering and mega-cybernetics at the tail end of 150 years of relative peace and scientific advancement, rather than doing so after 300+ years of technological decline.  (Plus, Combine scientists were the ones that mutated a Vodnik into a Toorima and released the resulting man-eating monster beastie into the sewers of Solaris City, so the interest in that sort of research is demonstrably there, once the technology is available.)

BattleTech 3-D #1: 2896
Justification:  The intro says the setting (Frazer) has been a stronghold of the Federated Suns for 30 years of uninterrupted war.  Frazer fell to the Federated Suns sometime in the 2nd Succession War.  Thus, 2896 is the first subsequent opportunity to mark 30 years of uninterrupted war during which the Federated Suns had control of Frazer - dating from the start of the 3rd Succession War in 2866.

BattleForce #1 and #2: 3015
Justification:  There's a strange notation at the start of the story identifying it as 3015 (albeit immeidately following that with the confusing "Currently 3025").  I take that to mean the story takes place in 3015, but the BattleTech game universe, at the time, had a "now" of 3025, indicating this was taking place in the past rather than moving the timeline forward.  3015 is right when Hanse and Michael were scheming against each other, so the chronology fits.  (Though the worries that this could trigger a new war is somewhat nonsensical and better fits the 3026-3027 timeframe, in the brief interbellum period.)

BattleTech #4: 3024
Justification:  It's an adaptation of a scenario, and the various TRO materials referring to that event place it in 3024

BattleTech #1 & BattleTech #2: 3025
Justification:  It features a Hatchetman, which had its first recorded battle in 3025.

BattleTech #5 and BattleTech #6: 3026
Justification:  All the elements noted in the 3025 House sourcebooks (the Canopian/Andurien alliance, etc.) are present and treated as current, so it can be assumed to be building off those foundations.

[Frabby]

While your guesses are certainly good, I'm always uncomfortable with picking a specific year (eg. 2789, 2896) where the evidence really only provides us with a much bigger time span.

In BattleForce 1 & 2 the time can't be 3015 - there's a Hatchetman seen in the background in BF2 on p. 18. So it has to be 3025, which fits with all the other circumstantial evidence.

[Mendrugo]

While your guesses are certainly good, I'm always uncomfortable with picking a specific year (eg. 2789, 2896) where the evidence really only provides us with a much bigger time span.

In BattleForce 1 & 2 the time can't be 3015 - there's a Hatchetman seen in the background in BF2 on p. 18. So it has to be 3025, which fits with all the other circumstantial evidence.

So what do you suppose that odd "3015" tag on the splash page was about?

[Frabby]

So what do you suppose that odd "3015" tag on the splash page was about?

Back when I wrote the Sarna articles for the Blackthorne comics I couldn't make sense of it.

Perhaps it is a poorly worded attempt to indicate the scene in question (at the temporary 2nd Crucis Lancers HQ on planet Sturtevant, where her COs want to get rid of her) is a flashback scene set in 3015 while the main story is set in 3025. However, Lugosi is shown to take command of Abel Lance later on when they're sent to Tibolt.

It's a stretch, but it could be argued that the initial frame where Lugosi returns to HQ while they're discussing how to get rid of her is set in 3015 and the following scenes from the meeting are actually set ten years later with the situation still unchanged.

[Mendrugo]

I imagine I'll just treat "3015" like the on-panel dates in "The Spider and the Wolf," and ignore it as inaccurate.

The Hatchetman definitely dates it to 3025, at the earliest.

[Wrangler]

I wish there were still Battletech comics, that was one best forms of telling the tail.  :'(  :'(  :'(