Author Topic: Is it high time that...?  (Read 2557 times)

Daemion

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Is it high time that...?
« on: 09 February 2018, 00:57:31 »
So, every now and then, I get these little thoughts and I wonder if it isn't high time X or Y should be done in BT.

We are reaching a point in BT history where factions have definable combat doctrines, and I kinda wonder if it isn't high time that those take a step in the extreme direction.

For example, the discussion on QuadVees brought up the question - why not just allow tanks the full range of stuff that Make Mechs better? That actually sounds like a great idea - for a faction willing to spend the money on that kind of development. There's nothing stopping a tank from being a single-operator machine with all the built-in pilot protection that you can get with a Mech. There might still be some issues with mobility, but maybe something can be done to get around that, for the right price.

When advanced Tech came out, it came as no surprise to me that the FedCom got out the first Battle Armor, and some upgraded tanks. They're very combined arms, and while Mechs are still the general tip of the spear, they have hoards of conventional forces forming the haft, the body of the warrior and so on. Next to Hell's Horses, if anyone were to make and field an honest super tank, it ought to be them.

House Liao has taken to the indirect attack approach since the 4th war, trying to keep as much of their fighting force in fighting trim with as little exposure to counter attack as possible via mines and artillery, and stealth. If any faction were to really look into long-range engagements via large artillery forces, like on Mechs, it would be them.

So, in this regard, do you think it's high time a strong look was put into this kind of thing, this diversification, in BT.

And, for that matter, what else do you think it's high time was tried in BT?

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Orin J.

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #1 on: 09 February 2018, 01:28:43 »
I think it's high time we got protesters on the battlefield.

And i'm pretty sure the reason tanks don't have the complex systems that make battlemechs so durable is because that would make them as expensive as battlemechs and it's a lot more valuable to have cheap tanks you can afford to throw away than good tanks that will protect the pilots you can get more of on any dustball planet.

a 'mech and its pilot is expensive. a light tank and its crew is cheap. a fig newton is fruit and cake.
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monbvol

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #2 on: 09 February 2018, 03:04:32 »
Another factor to consider is conventional vehicles already do get most of the same technology as mechs.

I think fixing anything they are missing would invalidate the point of vehicles.  That they are cheap and more easily replaced than mechs.

But yes I'd like to see some diversification continue.  There are far too many mechs where if I looked at their stats without fluff it'd be damn difficult for me to peg who uses it the most.

glitterboy2098

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #3 on: 09 February 2018, 03:41:16 »
About the only thing they lack is DHS and (iirc) Endosteel. Endo probably isn't worth the cost, and DHS would be ungodly powerful on something that only has to manage heat from energy weapons.

Kidd

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #4 on: 09 February 2018, 03:52:19 »
 People did and will complain about that.

I think it's high time we got protesters on the battlefield.
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mbear

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #5 on: 09 February 2018, 09:47:57 »
People did and will complain about that.
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jklantern

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #6 on: 09 February 2018, 09:59:32 »
A shiny new internet to the person who makes an unruly mob of Catholic Priests bearing signs that say, "DOWN WITH THIS SORT OF THING!"
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massey

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #7 on: 09 February 2018, 10:02:06 »
I think it's high time we got protesters on the battlefield.

I thought the "dumping ammo" rules were just code for taking care of protesters.

Wotan

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #8 on: 09 February 2018, 10:07:58 »
I thought the old Field Manuals with their house specific developments were the road you are asking for. Sadly with the next TROs everything was available to everyone again. I thought the way the FM opened to us was great.

Kidd

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #9 on: 09 February 2018, 10:47:23 »

Simon Landmine

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #10 on: 09 February 2018, 18:39:27 »
A shiny new internet to the person who makes an unruly mob of Catholic Priests bearing signs that say, "DOWN WITH THIS SORT OF THING!"

CAREFUL NOW!
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idea weenie

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #11 on: 10 February 2018, 11:32:17 »
About the only thing they lack is DHS and (iirc) Endosteel. Endo probably isn't worth the cost, and DHS would be ungodly powerful on something that only has to manage heat from energy weapons.

I'd settle for vehs taking normal heat from all weapons, but they just get half benefit from heat sinks.  So a heat neutral PPC on a Mech would mass 17 tons, while on a veh it would mass 27 tons.  DHS would take up more internal slots when used, similar to how DHS on Mechs take up more criticals.

The other option for vehs would be if they run out of internal locations to put stuff, they can put stuff externally, with a half ton (? mass TBD) bracing mount giving the veh 1 external location.  However anything that is external can be destroyed without cracking through the armor.  So an artillery veh without enough internal locations might have various bracings to have the gun itself mounted externally, but the explodey ammo would be mounted internally.


I think it's high time we got protesters on the battlefield.

You might get situations like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE4OM8TE_jQ

Bedwyr

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #12 on: 10 February 2018, 17:01:44 »
CAREFUL NOW!

The moderator team are familiar with this and may say with confidence, we are amused.

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jklantern

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #13 on: 11 February 2018, 13:50:13 »
And here I was worried no one would get that reference.
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StoneRhino

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #14 on: 13 February 2018, 01:36:41 »
...that people stop using these kinds of titles for new threads? The answer is yes.  #P #P #P #P  ;D

Daemion

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #15 on: 13 February 2018, 16:55:44 »
Well, I had left it open-ended, because of the wonderful creative minds that I knew would tackle the particular question and come up with ideas of their own.  ;D >:D
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Daemion

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #16 on: 19 February 2018, 22:12:32 »
Here's another 'It's high time -' thought: Interstellar disasters!

The BattleTech galaxy is just as dynamic as the one we live in, with stars going through their aging cycles, binaries turning into unsuspecting trinaries, and so on.  The break-up of a star system or a body in a system can have implications on Jump Travel since gravity and its nuances play a large part in final destinations.

When's the last time we saw a large solar-sized disaster event in the Inner Sphere? Is it high time something like that happened, kinda like the Yellowstone Caldera is over-due for its mega-eruption?

Not all the garden worlds are in systems with young stars. And, it's a fair bet that there are some chincey systems along well-established trade routes that have nothing more than a recharge and watch station in those larger than 30 Light Year gaps between some systems.

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monbvol

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #17 on: 19 February 2018, 23:38:25 »
Only real problem with that is the warning signs are so obvious that any such pending disasters are trivial to avoid as there is plenty of warning time.  In the thousands of years range warning time.

SteelRaven

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #18 on: 20 February 2018, 02:53:12 »
...that people stop using these kinds of titles for new threads? The answer is yes.  #P #P #P #P  ;D

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Garrand

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #19 on: 20 February 2018, 12:14:40 »
Only real problem with that is the warning signs are so obvious that any such pending disasters are trivial to avoid as there is plenty of warning time.  In the thousands of years range warning time.

Also I'd say that stars that have cycled into their red giant (or supergiant, for that matter) phase may have already consumed worlds that had the resources for colonization, though of course we currently lack a lot of information on solar system evolution as of yet.

I think a bigger concern would be if a nearby star went supernova, since that could cause issues within several LY of the event at the least. Where is Betelguese in relation to the IS map?

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monbvol

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #20 on: 20 February 2018, 13:03:24 »
In the CapCon and inhabited.  At least if the Betelguese on the map is the same Betelguese in reality.

Garrand

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #21 on: 20 February 2018, 13:40:05 »
In the CapCon and inhabited.  At least if the Betelguese on the map is the same Betelguese in reality.

THAT might be a problem. May happen soon or may happen in a few million years. Guessing they're betting on the latter!

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Daemion

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #22 on: 20 February 2018, 13:59:50 »
But, while it may be obvious and avoidable, such an active event would still cause a lot of disruption, and should be news worthy.

Since it hasn't been brought up in the fiction in the past, I have to assume there must be at least one star on the verge of an expansion event that could happen 'any time' in at least one star system along a trade route, if not one that's inhabited.

You gotta think about the constantly in-flux and active nature of nature.

And, I have to wonder if, say, during the 3rd succession war whether there were many systems which would be unable to evacuate should that long anticipated eruption comes, if their system was one of those oddball dangerous yet safe ones.

We still don't know a lot about our own stellar back yard even now, in this 21st century universe. I imagine there's room for all kinds of sudden surprises that nobody saw coming in one that's supposed to be more advanced than our own.



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monbvol

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Re: Is it high time that...?
« Reply #23 on: 20 February 2018, 15:54:38 »
Well true enough we don't actually know how far into their life cycles some of these stars actually are* but from what I understand there is plenty of warning time and warning signs that I doubt an inhabited system is actually in any immediate danger.

I also don't think it would be a good story element to throw into the setting with everything else that is going on.  It'd just have to thread too narrow of a needle of being meaningful without also being some form of dues ex machina.