Author Topic: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser  (Read 20972 times)

Death by Lasers

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #30 on: 26 May 2017, 16:06:00 »
Great article.  I love the keg-like look of the Cruiser, it's a simple reminder that in space ships need not be streamlined like vehicles built to travel in the ocean or in the air. 
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ckosacranoid

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #31 on: 26 May 2017, 16:45:22 »
i can see someone using the ship with a mini kegger for the ship on the table since it looks like it would be funny to put a few down for a group to go agaist.

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #32 on: 26 May 2017, 20:40:55 »
Fun fact: it occurs to me that the Behemoth class DropShip is roughly the same length as a Cruiser class (250 meters to 243 meters), and while one's a cylinder and the other's an egg, the Cruiser class doesn't have five times the volume of the Behemoth class.  The Cruiser is also significantly shorter than nearly any other JumpShip or WarShip published so far.  It's significantly denser than any of the other Battletech large spacecraft, which is kind of trippy.v
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #33 on: 26 May 2017, 21:04:16 »
I wish we knew what was being used from the Cruiser and it's other ship at the time.

I know that they've had gotten away from Primitive Dropships and JumpShips by the time the Cruiser was around.
However it does have those DropShuttle, there isn't alot we know about them.   Nothing under 5k anyways.  #P
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #34 on: 26 May 2017, 22:09:47 »
I wish we knew what was being used from the Cruiser and it's other ship at the time.

I know that they've had gotten away from Primitive Dropships and JumpShips by the time the Cruiser was around.
However it does have those DropShuttle, there isn't alot we know about them.   Nothing under 5k anyways.  #P

The Saturn patrol ship had been around for a while, and would work as a supplemental assault/patrol craft.  The Combine released the original Vulture in 2312, which was probably similar enough to contemporary transport DropShuttles from other states to use it as a stand-in.
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VhenRa

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #35 on: 26 May 2017, 22:27:33 »
I got the impression both were probably true: the Dreadnought was certainly a scary beast, and I was always under the impression that it was rammed through procurement on the force of McKenna's personality, which implied to me he was probably already a powerful political force before he turned his ship's guns planetside.

That interview of James McKenna back in SLSB honestly is so damned loaded, I get the feeling he was planning his coup already.

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #36 on: 27 May 2017, 03:39:39 »
That interview of James McKenna back in SLSB honestly is so damned loaded, I get the feeling he was planning his coup already.

What interview or what book?
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Maingunnery

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #37 on: 27 May 2017, 04:15:00 »
The Saturn patrol ship had been around for a while, and would work as a supplemental assault/patrol craft.
The Saturn is more like a police/customs ship.
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VhenRa

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #38 on: 27 May 2017, 06:04:03 »
What interview or what book?

He gives an interview to Good Morning Canada in 2313, in a side-note in the original Star League Sourcebook.

It ends with.

Quote
Deans: How do you balance your personal beliefs with your duty to the Alliance?
McKenna: It isn't easy, and there are times when I seriously consider chucking all this for the Canadian wilderness.
Deans: What keeps you here, then?
McKenna: I think the main reason for sticking around in case fate steps in to give me and these ships an opportunity for action, or to do something that would improve life back on Terra and the other Alliance worlds.
Deans: What would you do, given this opportunity?
McKenna: Now that depends on the situation, don't you think?
« Last Edit: 27 May 2017, 06:05:42 by VhenRa »

marauder648

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #39 on: 27 May 2017, 06:47:29 »
ooh I'll have to find that interview, thank you :) Also great write up on the space keg. 
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I am Belch II

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #40 on: 27 May 2017, 07:53:17 »
And they say the "FOX" is ugly?? I think the Cruiser class is along that same lines.
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marauder648

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #41 on: 27 May 2017, 08:30:24 »
She's not ugly so much as just...well..keg.  She has a dumpy kind of charm to her, to the point that she probably has a tuba playing when ever she moves.
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Maingunnery

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #42 on: 27 May 2017, 09:16:52 »
And they say the "FOX" is ugly?? I think the Cruiser class is along that same lines.
Utilitarian Space Keg vs Badminton Birdie.
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #43 on: 27 May 2017, 09:35:47 »
Quote from: Maingunnery
Utilitarian Space Keg vs Badminton Birdie

Now the real trip? Despite being less than half the mass of the Cruiser, the Fox is nearly twice as long.
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HobbesHurlbut

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #44 on: 27 May 2017, 17:07:11 »
Great article.  I love the keg-like look of the Cruiser, it's a simple reminder that in space ships need not be streamlined like vehicles built to travel in the ocean or in the air.
They're "long" because that's the nature of the KF drive core which is a massive rod  :D
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Death by Lasers

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #45 on: 28 May 2017, 13:27:47 »
  I honestly don't pay attention to the canon dimensions of warships.  At stated volumes and masses the things are zeppelins covered in tinfoil.
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #46 on: 28 May 2017, 13:35:43 »
Well, maybe there are. Except the beer keg. Which, as we've established by now, is a beer keg. 8)
Has anyone actually ever calculated which dimensions/weight the ships should have? Isn't that the same case as an ASF's exhaust gasses exceeding lightspeed?
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #47 on: 28 May 2017, 13:45:42 »
Well, maybe there are. Except the beer keg. Which, as we've established by now, is a beer keg. 8)
Has anyone actually ever calculated which dimensions/weight the ships should have? Isn't that the same case as an ASF's exhaust gasses exceeding lightspeed?

I think it was Cray and I who proposed during the StratOps editing process to cut all WarShip lengths to a third what they are published, but that then created the potential issue of having to cut DropShip lengths, too, after which the worry was how much retconning would be needed, after which it was decided that way led to madness, and far too much retconjuration.

For your home game, a simple option would be going something comparable to the density of water, somewhere in the ballpark of 1000 kg/m^3 as a ballpark limit, since real-life "wet" ships have to be at least slightly less dense not to sink, then factor in their fuel tonnage at 70 kg/m^3, since liquid hydrogen isn't very dense.
« Last Edit: 28 May 2017, 13:56:29 by Giovanni Blasini »
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Death by Lasers

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #48 on: 28 May 2017, 15:51:28 »
  I did some rough estimates of ship masses just to see how dense some Btech warships are.  I also put an illustration showing an Aegis at canon size compared to it at tank and naval ship densities.  I'm thinking they could either be built like Tanks since they don't need to be buoyant or like naval ships if they need to be roomy enough for light but bulky equipment and crew quarters. 

  Even at only 243 meters in length the Cruiser has about the same density as most Btech ships.  It looks tiny but that compact frame holds a lot of volume. 

Cruiser
Weight: 500,000 tons
Volume (est.): 4,294,164 m^3
Density: 116 kg/m^3

Aegis
Weight: 750,000 tons
Volume (est.): 9,639,000 m^3
Density: 78 kg/m^3

Nimitz
Weight: 97,000 tons
Volume (est.): 415,000 m^3
Density: 233 kg/m^3

Abrams
Weight: 62 tons
Volume (est.): 51 m^3
Density: 1,208 kg/m^3
“I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.”

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Death by Lasers

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #49 on: 28 May 2017, 15:57:33 »
Oops, I forgot to include the Cruiser :D.
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #50 on: 28 May 2017, 17:18:13 »
Yeah, that's about what I came up with, too.  It's still low density, but having to store 5000 tons of liquid hydrogen while also having space for up to 10,000 tons of DropShuttle, which includes potentially 5,000 ton aerodynes, will do that, and it's also significantly more dense than most canon WarShips.
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Maingunnery

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #51 on: 28 May 2017, 17:55:20 »

Just a few thoughts about salvaging a Cruiser.

1. Where are we likely to find such derelicts?
2. How useful would it be?
3. What would be needed to make it more useful in current era?
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #52 on: 28 May 2017, 18:11:56 »
Draconis Combine were using them during the early Succession Wars but there no details of their actions. I do think i remember reading in passing of one being deployed.  It's mentioned in the Field Manual 2765 Draconis Combine they had couple.  1st Succession Source book doesn't mentioned them in use thou. It's likely the few Cruiser-Class ships they did have properly died in the background or on in the that big fleet engagement with the Davions at Cholame in 2788ish.
« Last Edit: 28 May 2017, 18:19:33 by Wrangler »
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #53 on: 28 May 2017, 19:05:02 »
The Cruiser class is also one of those classes where even the Houses were on their way to dumping them by the 28th Century.  They sound ungainly to fly, the supply of DropShuttles has probably nearly dried up, leaving them inconvenient compared to, say, a 2372 Aegis.  With how quickly they were rushed out of service, I suspect many were in mothballs or scrapped before the 28th Century.
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #54 on: 28 May 2017, 19:24:27 »
The Cruiser class is also one of those classes where even the Houses were on their way to dumping them by the 28th Century.  They sound ungainly to fly, the supply of DropShuttles has probably nearly dried up, leaving them inconvenient compared to, say, a 2372 Aegis.  With how quickly they were rushed out of service, I suspect many were in mothballs or scrapped before the 28th Century.
The combine was desperate for warships, They were stuck only build destroyer size Warships.  They only had handful of old Hegemony Ships to fill in the gaps in their fleet's capital ship ranks.
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marauder648

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #55 on: 29 May 2017, 01:23:24 »
Just a few thoughts about salvaging a Cruiser.

1. Where are we likely to find such derelicts?
2. How useful would it be?
3. What would be needed to make it more useful in current era?

1.  The best possible one would be a misjumpped vessel just drifting dead in space, little more than a tomb for her crew.  Finding one left over from a battle would probably result in maybe a large chunk of it being found, or a mangled wreck thats little value more than scrap.

2.  Depends on the period and setting.  If she was say in Dragon Cat's universe she'd be a useful oddity if found by a house, or an important asset if located by one of the Periphery powers.  If she was found during the succession war she could be a potential treasure trove.  Until Comstar come along and wreck it all A TOTALLY UNFORSEEN ACCIDENT. SIMPLY HIGHLIGHTING THE DANGER OR WORKING ON MACHINERY YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND.  Or in the modern era where WarShips are basically extinct (BOO! HISS!!) then if she can be reparied, hugely important.

3.  In reality not much would be needed to make her more useful.  The big six gun batteries for the NAC-10s mean she can bracket fire and she's got  lots of missiles.  Change the dropshuttle hangars into fighter bays or shuttle bays/cargo to help with the ships fluff balance issues, maybe add a dropship collar and some AMS and you'd be fine.
« Last Edit: 29 May 2017, 02:06:15 by marauder648 »
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #56 on: 29 May 2017, 01:35:32 »
I was going to say that would be an insane number of fighters. Then I realizes it's only 73 fighter bays.  That's actually a reasonable number.
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #57 on: 29 May 2017, 02:01:15 »
I was going to say that would be an insane number of fighters. Then I realizes it's only 73 fighter bays.  That's actually a reasonable number.

i'd say call it 72 bays. 12 squadrons is a fairly respectable compliment. though would the cruiser have enough fuel/cargo to sustain that many fighters for a campaign?

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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #58 on: 29 May 2017, 02:07:28 »
How about replacing two of the shuttle bays with fighters and keeping the 3rd for cargo space or as dedicated supplies for the fighter group?
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Re: WarShip of the Week: Cruiser
« Reply #59 on: 29 May 2017, 02:30:14 »
Ship still has over 90 kilotons of cargo. Should be fine.
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