Game of Thrones- S7: Let the bodies hit the floor (Spoilers)

[Colt Ward]

New season came out tonight, I asked my wife how many bodies was she expecting for the first episode- 5.

We had more than that in the first 5 minutes.

They did some interesting things with the storytelling, not sure I bought into the writer/director's last bit about Dani's return being without dialogue.

Also not sure what they are doing with Jon.  In the books he went back to the 'original' branch of the Karstarks through Alys which he married off to a wildling supporter to bind the Karstarks back to the throne and settle some of the wildlings in abandoned territory while restoring the strength of a depleted supporter.  I am not sure Sansa is being played any longer, she knows Littlefinger has a game (I will let you get in the last word and assume it was something pithy) but the question is has she learned enough from him and Cersi to manipulate others herself?  When Jon goes to Dragon Rock for the obsidian what will happen when she remains in the North?  If they write Jon smartly (unlike his battle against the Bolton forces) he will invest some power in Sansa while tasking her to oppose Cersi . . . though the question is what gets done for a marriage alliance.  Also, Jon needs to consider the same thing- he needs a heir & a spare of his blood though I expect Littlefinger to poison Sansa's ear if that develops- unless she is the one pushing it.

The looming Kraken vs Kraken sea battle will be a fun scene, especially if we get the dragons flying above to burn the more numerous Iron Fleet.

Jaime has gotten to be a more and more interesting character, I would almost say he is finally growing up from the extended boyhood he escaped to among the King's Guard (who are no longer white).  He seems the only realist in Kings Landing who can say anything to Cersei though is still bound by their . . . bond is the safest word I can think of to use. 

Cersi is going to roll out Geoffrey 2.0, with less of the mood swing of crazy, Sansa was dead on her description.  While she leaves the Ironborn to handle Dani's fleet . . . which enemy will she move on?  It seemed Jaime was encouraging her to deal with High Garden as the storehouse to prepare for the coming winter and to get a quick win under her belt.  Both the North & South seem too impractical to march on, especially with the Riverlands in turmoil.

[Tai Dai Cultist]

Cersei Lannister:  Here to love her children and blow **** up.  And she's all out of children.

I'm even more stoked to root for Team Lannister now than before when I knew what was gonna happen.  Not *knowing* they're gonna be winning (in the foreseeable short term) makes rooting more uncertain and fun :D  As for Cersei's future allies, I'm pretty sure the reason we saw Horn Hill last season was not to expose how awful Sam's patriarch is but to begin to familiarize us with House Lannister's next pawn.


Cersei tangent: We got support for the idea that the "little brother" from Maggy's prophecy is neither Tyrion nor Jaime but is going to be Arya Stark.  I was always in that camp ever since she began her training as a Faceless one since they're also called valonquar.

Edit:  Oh and speaking of Arya, I'm calling that a long-anticipated reunion with Nymeria is in the making based on the teaser for next week's episode.

[monbvol]

Arya is awesome.  That is everything anyone needs to know for this episode for reason to watch it.

I have to admit while I knew what was happening in a way I still didn't see it coming.

This is an interesting time.  Us book readers no longer have foreknowledge of what is going to happen.

And yeah if I were a writer I would have changed up Jon's dialogue a bit in his dealing with the Umbers and Karstarks.  I would have had him point out that allowing them to keep their holdings could easily turn into a punishment as they would have to bear the brunt of the army of the dead if it got past the wall.

[I am Belch II]

Arya had the best parts of the whole show. It was a lot of talk and kinda of a let down from all of the hype. Still a good episode. I loved the back and forth between Jamie and Cersei, ruler of the "3 kingdoms" was a great line. The winter fell stuff was good too, Jon and Sansa don't see eye to eye on things and Littlefinger is right dead center stiring the pot.

[Meow Liao]

[quote author=Colt Ward link=topic=58061.msg1335696#msg1335696 date=1500265679
The looming Kraken vs Kraken sea battle will be a fun scene, especially if we get the dragons flying above to burn the more numerous Iron Fleet.
[/quote]

I'm waiting to see what Euron's dragon horn does to the dragons. 

Meow Liao

[Colt Ward]

Did they introduce that in the show?  I cannot remember at this point.

[Nav_Alpha]

Did they introduce that in the show?  I cannot remember at this point.

One presumes that's his "gift". I don't think it's actually been mentioned in the show yet though.

The whole Brotherhood without banners scenes were interesting - the Hound having a vision, etc

[Colt Ward]

I thought the implication of his gift was Tyrion, which does imply he has a plan or expectation to defeat Dani's fleet.

[Kidd]

In a way I'm glad the TV plot is taking a tangent away from the books, so as not to be overly spoilery... though the ultimate spoiler I think is how long its taking to get the next bloody book out! >:( Seriously, if GRRM wants to capitalise on GOT-hype which is already waning, he has to push out Winds Of Winter at least by next year, not swan off on his other pet projects...

/rant

Arya is really asking for Faceless intervention the way she's abusing her newfound powers. The quick cut from her killing-the-queen joke was awkward, I wonder whether she will leave any of these suddenly-human Lannister henchmen (and musical ginger nut ;) ) alive.

Suffrage in the GOT world is a theme, so I'm interested in seeing how Jon and Sansa administrate the North... I hope Jon doesn't run out of lives in the process, and that Sansa doesn't suddenly became oh-so-powerful neither. Well all in all it looks like the Starks are doing well... which is ominous  >:D

Daenerys' vocally silent, orchestral entrance did its job aweing me at least.

Quote of the Ep: "Tell them winter came for House Frey."

[Colt Ward]

I think Arya's monologue might be the theme for the season- when you think you killed them all, make sure.  The circle is turning, Stark and Targareyan children are surfacing with abilities and allies that Cersei will come to regret.

[monbvol]

I'm actually developing a theory that the Faceless ones actually wanted Arya to go on this killing spree.

[Tai Dai Cultist]

I'm actually developing a theory that the Faceless ones actually wanted Arya to go on this killing spree.

I can't imagine they had reason to care one way or the other about the Freys or her personal Kill List, and OTOH we have been shown they do care about taking lives that aren't yours to take.  I kind of expect Arya to ultimately not have a happy ending, thanks to the Faceless Ones, at the end of the series.  A Girl owed three at one point.  I'm not so sure they're just gonna take 50 or so lives on credit.

[monbvol]

Well considering their history in the books it could well be that they are granting Arya her list of names but I suspect you are right that they will extract a not happy price for it in the end.

[Kidd]

I can't imagine they had reason to care one way or the other about the Freys or her personal Kill List, and OTOH we have been shown they do care about taking lives that aren't yours to take.  I kind of expect Arya to ultimately not have a happy ending, thanks to the Faceless Ones, at the end of the series.  A Girl owed three at one point.  I'm not so sure they're just gonna take 50 or so lives on credit.

indeed. It's going far too well for the Starks...

...reminds me of a couple years back when things were going swimmingly, and us Sullied were going round whispering "Red Wedding... Red Wedding..."  :)) and when the fanbase took SO incredibly well to Oberyn Martell  ;D ;D

[Kit deSummersville]

Well, the Northern Starks are at a lull but I don't know that it's going too well, with undead on one side and Lannisters on the other.

[MrJake]

Agreed. There's a difference between "doing well" and "finally won one."

[DEZOAT]

 The only question is what happen to Lord Tully  ???  I wonder if we are going to see him again or will take control of all River Run?

[Tai Dai Cultist]

The only question is what happen to Lord Tully  ???  I wonder if we are going to see him again or will take control of all River Run?

Heh last we heard Edmure was in the dungeons.  With all the Freys dead, he just might die of thirst down there before anyone happens to let him out.

[Colt Ward]

Thought Jamie kept him as a pet after getting River Run back?

[Trajan Helmer]

I'll get a kick out of this season if Jon and Dany die and Cersei is left to save Westeros from the White Walkers, having to team up with Sansa to do so.  Then Sansa revenges herself on Cersei.  And one Dragon is left. 

[Tai Dai Cultist]

Thought Jamie kept him as a pet after getting River Run back?

We got a reference in Walder's last scene with Jaime about how he's keeping him in the dungeon.  He said something like "wouldn't do to kill my son by law now would it!"

[Tai Dai Cultist]

I am no fan of the Starks but I got my YAAAAAAS moment with Arya this week.  It will be quite a crying shame if that's all of the reunion we're ever going to get.  Literally.  I'll cry if that was how they parted forever. :(

And my hopes for Cersei ultimately winning in the end may be bouyed only in an artificial manner, but man was it another good week for Team Lannister.

[Meow Liao]

Euron might have an ego, but it is well deserved.  Freaking military genius that one is.  Hiding his fleet of hundreds in that forest until Asha and Theon sailed right past.   He really is the best captain on the 14 seas. 

Prediction 1:  I think Bronn will find some way to save his girlfriend sandsnake. (I think she survived)  Not necessarily a jailbreak rescue.  Maybe he gets her as a prize in return for her poisoning him in Dorne.

Prediction 2:  I think the dragons might clue people into the idea that the three Targaryens are together on Dragonstone once Jon arrives. 

I was hoping Arya would get to ride her direwolf back to Winterfell.

Meow Liao

[Kidd]

Oh, so is that why we haven't seen Ghost appear yet, not even in the Jon-rides-out scene, because they blew the CGI budget on a dozen other wolves to keep Nymeria company?  >:(

"Edd, the Wall is yours."
"Sansa, the North is yours."

HAH! :D well-played Jon Snow!

[Tai Dai Cultist]

It will be quite a crying shame if that's all of the reunion we're ever going to get.  Literally.  I'll cry if that was how they parted forever. :(

Actually I had to have it pointed out for me that "That's not you" was actually one more of the many call-backs to Season 1.  Arya told Ned "that's not her" when he promised that she'll one day grow up to be a perfumed princess.  It's actually kind of sweet that Arya recognized that Nymeria is being Nymeria rather than submitting back to obedience to her former owner.  It's what she herself would have done.

While that's sweet that she recognizes her former pet as a kindred spirit free to kill to her heart's content, it does raise a flag about just how well Arya's really going to fit in back home now.  Will she turn her back on Sansa just as she just allowed Nymeria to do to her?  I'm guessing yes.  She'll give it a shot at being a Stark, but she's not anymore.  She'll probably head back after Cersei by the time the season is over.

[Nav_Alpha]

I had a similar read on that scene. I think she acknowledging that both wolf and person have changed dramatically.

Gotta say - my favourite in universe lore/story was always the smallfolk whispering of a giant band of wolves led by something big enough to be a dire wolf.
I loved the small, occasional reference... and finally we got to see them!

[Kidd]

more and more pieces taken off the board

and Daenerys being a bit of a tool there

ride's stopping soon fellas

[Colt Ward]

Jaime will end up killing Cersei like he did the Mad King, it will come full circle back to the same point where he first rose above his own personal desires.  Olenna would have been right if she had not told him about killing Geoffry, that piece lets him know that he was right about Tyrion & Sansa being innocent and might cause the rift.

IF they were right on the 'Fire & Ice' meeting thing, its a interesting take on the series name.  Wonder how Dani will react when she hears that Jon was resurrected.

[monbvol]

She mentioned hearing Ser Davros saying that Jon took a knife to his heart for his people.  So it will be interesting when she learns that it was more literal than Tyrion explained.

Things certainly do seem a bit bleak for Jon and Dany.  I expect a dues ex machina soon to keep them in the fight so that we'll even get to the end of season 7.

[Tai Dai Cultist]

well things are hardly over for Jon and Dany.  I mean, I *hope* Cersei wins in the end, and that Dany and Jon are both destined to be nothing more than the next fan favorites to die.  But let's be real... it's really, *really* unlikely that they lack plot armor in the ways that the dead Starks and Oberyn did.  Dany and/or Jon may still die before it's over, but no way would it be very much before the entire season finale.  Early in season 7?  Naah, we'd have to see someone else step in to be the leader who rallies Westeros against the Night King.  Too much narrative wasted in starting over for that at this point.  Besides, they just killed and brought back Jon.  If anyone's unkillable, it's him.


Things are going great for Cersei and terrible for Dany, yes.  Perhaps the trajectories are such that it's going to be diverging fortunes even more sharply before they correct and converge towards one another once again.  Because afterall we've been hearing a ton about how invulnerable the Dragons are.. which pretty much means we're gonna see some more bad news on that front to prove how invulnerable they actually aren't.  And while Cersei's on a high note with paying off the Lannisters' debts to the Iron Bank with the wealth of House Tyrell... it's also just a bit TOO good.  Something bad is due to occur soon.  Perhaps Olenna's revenge from the grave will be souring Jaime on Cersei once and for all.  Or you know, perhaps Euron will just betray the Lannisters.  He's almost singlehandedly responsible for Cersei's successes this season, and if she tries jerking his chain she might not be able to handle him.

Oh I have my own personal meta theory about Tyrion that S7 is certainly supporting thus far:  He's there to ruin the schemes of everyone around him  (so was Cat... they were a great pair early on).  He's been a living monkeywrench in everyone's grand plans ever since season 1, and this season certainly is making Dany look like she would have been better off not listening to him.  Tyrion means well, but he's the source of more chaos than Littlefinger himself...