Author Topic: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support  (Read 4751 times)

Alsadius

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Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« on: 24 November 2017, 14:27:54 »
I find that when I'm messing with Mech design, I tend to go down the same pathways as I've always gone unless something makes me change it up. I suspect some of you may feel the same way. So, I think I want to start a series of design challenges here. They might be based on a bit of fluff, or on a particular weapon, or on something else entirely, but I'll try to keep them interesting and a bit out of the ordinary. Then I'll come back and dole out bragging rights judge the responses.

So, for challenge #1, your task is to make the best fire-support mech you can for under 5,000,000 C-bills. Any tech base, any weapon system, any era, but keep it cheap.

[Forward to Challenge #2]
« Last Edit: 14 May 2022, 12:58:19 by Alsadius »

Speedbump

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  • Posts: 322
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #1 on: 24 November 2017, 16:25:45 »
To be clear are we supposed to only submit one mech each?

Andras

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #2 on: 24 November 2017, 17:36:44 »
Do I get to sell a whole lance if the 4 mechs are less then 5mcb total?  >:D


Sabelkatten

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  • Posts: 6959
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #3 on: 24 November 2017, 20:22:44 »
You can make it cheaper, but this should be pretty good value for the money... You can almost get four of them for 5 million. ^-^

Code: [Select]
Tweenie TW-I1

Mass: 20 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 1 375 000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 576

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 100 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54,0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86,4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Heavy Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  ER Medium Laser
    3  LRM-5s
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    33 points                1,00
    Internal Locations: 4 LT, 3 RT, 4 LA, 3 RA
Engine:             Fusion Engine                100                       3,00
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0,00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               XL                                                     0,50
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Heavy Ferro-Fibrous          AV -  69                  3,50
    Armor Locations: 6 LT, 6 RT, 4 LA, 5 RA

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     6            9         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  3         
                                           L/R Torso     5            8         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     3            6         
                                             L/R Leg     4            8         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER Medium Laser                              HD        5         1         1,00
LRM-5                                        LT        2         1         2,00
LRM-5                                        RA        2         1         2,00
LRM-5                                        LA        2         1         2,00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  RL        -         1         1,00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  LL        -         1         1,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 2

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 6
5          1       2       1       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, IF 1

casperionx

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #4 on: 24 November 2017, 21:07:11 »
Here ya go.

Missile support: The "Cheap Fire Support" mech.

Code: [Select]
Cheap Fire Support

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 4,991,375 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,369

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 250 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor w/ CASE
Armament:
    1  LRM-20
    2  Medium Lasers
    1  Small Laser
    1  C3 Computer (Slave)
    1  Guardian ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    83 points                2.50
    Internal Locations: 5 LA, 5 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             Fusion Engine                250                      12.50
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             10(20)                    0.00
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 168                 10.50
    CASE Locations: 1 RT                                                   0.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     16           24       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  7         
                                           L/R Torso     12           18       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     8            16       
                                             L/R Leg     12           24       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LRM-20                                       RT        6         5        10.00
2 Medium Lasers                              LT        6         2         2.00
Guardian ECM Suite                           LT        0         2         1.50
C3 Computer (Slave)                          CT        0         1         1.00
Small Laser                                  HD        1         1         0.50
@LRM-20 (18)                                 RT        -         3         3.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 18

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      6    Points: 14
5          2       3       2       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: C3S, ECM, CASE, MHQ1, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 1/1/1, IF 1


Andras

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #5 on: 24 November 2017, 21:09:12 »
You can make it cheaper, but this should be pretty good value for the money... You can almost get four of them for 5 million. ^-^


That's pretty close to the one I was going to offer. I've posted it before as Light Support Mech, 20t, 5/8 SFE, LRM10 and a ML, 1.16mcb. Three of those and one with a HPPC (1.5mcb) is under 5mcb (4.98)


I'll go with this, a Swayback w 2 Artemised LRM15s, plenty of ammo, and 4 JJs to get into and out of a good vantage point quickly. Narc ammo for blind IDF if an allied mech has a NARC launcher.

Code: [Select]
Swayback SWBK-2LRM

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 2750
Cost: 4,274,500 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,370

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 200 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor w/ CASE
Armament:
    2  LRM-15s w/ Artemis IV FCS
    2  Medium Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    83 points                2.50
    Internal Locations: 1 HD, 2 CT, 2 LT, 1 RT, 4 LA, 4 RA
Engine:             Fusion Engine                200                       8.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LL, 2 RL                                         2.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             10(20)                    0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 152                  9.50
    CASE Locations: 1 LT                                                   0.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     16           23       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  6         
                                           L/R Torso     12           19       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  5         
                                             L/R Arm     8            14       
                                             L/R Leg     12           19       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Medium Laser                                 RA        3         1         1.00
Medium Laser                                 LA        3         1         1.00
2 LRM-15s                                    RT        10        6        14.00
    Artemis IV FCS                           RT        -         2         2.00
@LRM-15 (Narc) (16)                          LT        -         2         2.00
@LRM-15 (Artemis) (16)                       LT        -         2         2.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 8

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 14
4j         3       4       3       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, IF 2

« Last Edit: 24 November 2017, 21:19:20 by Andras »

fallen

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  • Posts: 357
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #6 on: 24 November 2017, 22:37:52 »
I have always wondered where the idea for the Locust 1M originated, so I came up with a primitive design that would fill a similar role.  The name Mysore comes from a region in India whose inhabitants successfully fought the British East India company with rockets.

Code: [Select]
Mysore MYE-1

Mass: 35 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere (Primitive)
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Era Specific
Era: Age of War/Star League
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/E-X-X-A
Production Year: 2490
Cost: 2,589,300 C-Bills
Battle Value: 538

Chassis: 1A Type 2 Primitive Structure
Power Plant: DAV 255 Primitive Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 64.8 km/h
Maximum Speed: 97.2 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: StarGuard I Primitive
Armament:
    1 ChisComp 10 Prototype Medium Laser
    2 Federated-5 Shot LRM-5s
Manufacturer: Achernar BattleMechs
    Primary Factory: Achernar
Communications System: Achernar Electronics HICK-1
Targeting and Tracking System: Federated Gatherer

Overview:
The Mysore was an early fire support design deployed with the Federated
Peacekeeping Forces (predecessor of the AFFS).


Capabilities:
The Mysore was designed to be a fast fire support platform.  Designers
envisioned detached lances of Mysores moving quickly from formation to
formation as battlefield needs dictated.


Battle History:
The Mysore was used in the Davion Civil War of 2525, providing long range
capibility to both sides.  After the 15 year war ended, the newly reorginized
AFFS took a long look at their inventory of battlemechs.  Primitive designs,
like the Mysore were used for training and planetary militia duty, or even
warehoused for spare parts.  Soon enough, the Mysore would be deployed again
for front-line combat.


Deployment:
The Mysore found new life, and new users during the Reunification War.  Along
side the services of the Pitcairn Legion, several obsolete battlemechs, including
the Mysore, found their way into the formations of the Outworlds Alliance
Militia.  The Outworlds Alliance made good use of the Mysore in their desperate
stand against the Star League.


Variants:
While the Mysore is now an extinct design, it's abilities and role of fast fire
support would be duplicated in the smaller and faster Locust 1M.


================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Primitive Structure           58 points                3.50
Engine:             Primitive Fusion Engine      255                      13.00
    Walking MP: 6
    Running MP: 9
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Primitive                                              5.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Primitive                    AV -  48                  4.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            6         
                                        Center Torso     11           6         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  2         
                                           L/R Torso     8            6         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     6            4         
                                             L/R Leg     8            5         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LRM-5                                        RA        2         1         2.00
LRM-5                                        LA        2         1         2.00
Prototype Medium Laser                       CT        5         1         1.00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  CT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 47

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 5
6          1       2       1       0      1     0   Structure:  3
Special Abilities: SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, IF 1

« Last Edit: 27 November 2017, 08:02:08 by fallen »

Liam's Ghost

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  • Miss Chitty finds your honor rules quaint.
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #7 on: 24 November 2017, 23:27:10 »
I went a little off book, but you did say "Fire Support", not "Missile Support".  :P I named it after an Elizabethan cannon.


Basilisk BSL-1K
IS advanced
50 tons 
BV: 1,302
Cost: 4,619,500 C-bills

Movement: 4/6
Engine: 200
Heat Sinks: 10 [20]
Gyro: XL Gyro

Internal: 83 (Endo-Steel)
Armor: 152/169
                     Internal    Armor
--------------------------------------
Center Torso               16       23
Center Torso (rear)                  8
Right Torso                12       18
Right Torso (rear)                   6
Left Torso                 12       18
Left Torso (rear)                    6
Right Arm                   8       16
Left Arm                    8       16
Right Leg                  12       16
Left Leg                   12       16

Weapon                         Loc  Heat
----------------------------------------
Long Tom Cannon                RT/RA    20
ER Medium Laser                 LA     5
ER Medium Laser                 LA     5

Ammo                           Loc Shots
----------------------------------------
Long Tom Cannon Ammo            LT     5
Long Tom Cannon Ammo            LT     5
Long Tom Cannon Ammo            LT     5

Equipment                      Loc
----------------------------------
CASE                            LT
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Daryk

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  • Posts: 37301
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #8 on: 25 November 2017, 00:54:38 »
I did this one a while back, but I think it fits here for much the same reasoning followed by Liam above.  For less than 3.5M, you get a 4/6/4 Thumper (actual artillery, not a cannon) with 40 rounds in 3025.

Code: [Select]
Arturion CN9-TH

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Advanced Rules
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-D-D-A
Production Year: 3025
Cost: 3,481,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 915

Chassis: Corean Model K7 Standard
Power Plant: Nissan 200 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: McCloud Specials
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: StarGuard III Standard Armor
Armament:
    2 Photec 806 Medium Lasers
    1 Defiance Industries Thumper
Manufacturer: Corean Enterprises
    Primary Factory: New Avalon
Communications System: Corean Transband-J9
Targeting and Tracking System: Corean B-Tech

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      83 points                5.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                200                       8.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LL, 2 RL                                         2.00
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 2 LT
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 168                 10.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     16           21       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  10       
                                           L/R Torso     12           18       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     8            16       
                                             L/R Leg     12           24       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Medium Lasers                              CT        6         2         2.00
Thumper                                      RT/RA     6         10/5     15.00
@Thumper (40)                                RT        -         2         2.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 24

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      6    Points: 9
4j         3       1       0       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: ARTT, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Nightsong

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 556
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #9 on: 25 November 2017, 05:09:53 »
I did this one a while back, but I think it fits here for much the same reasoning followed by Liam above.  For less than 3.5M, you get a 4/6/4 Thumper (actual artillery, not a cannon) with 40 rounds in 3025.

I like it. Only complaint I’d have is the jump jets seem a touch superfluous on an artillery piece. I mean I can see uses, but 2 more MLS might be a good deterrent against the kind of harrassers that might be up to counterbattery work. Wouldn’t mean I wouldn’t use them as is though.

Something I threw together. For those who get the name reference, forgive me. :)

Code: [Select]
Hoopak HPK-1X

Mass: 45 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 4,379,290 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,230

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 225 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Heavy Ferro-Fibrous w/ CASE
Armament:
    1  LRM-20
    2  ER Medium Lasers
    1  C3 Computer (Slave)
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      75 points                4.50
Engine:             Fusion Engine                225                      10.00
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             10(20)                    0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Heavy Ferro-Fibrous          AV - 138                  7.00
    Armor Locations: 2 CT, 5 LT, 3 RT, 4 LA, 3 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
    CASE Locations: 1 RT                                                   0.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     14           20       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  5         
                                           L/R Torso     11           17       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  5         
                                             L/R Arm     7            13       
                                             L/R Leg     11           17       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
C3 Computer (Slave)                          HD        0         1         1.00
LRM-20                                       LT        6         5        10.00
ER Medium Laser                              RA        5         1         1.00
ER Medium Laser                              LA        5         1         1.00
@LRM-20 (24)                                 RT        -         4         4.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 10

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 12
5          2       3       2       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: C3S, CASE, MHQ1, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 1/1/1, IF 1
« Last Edit: 25 November 2017, 05:45:12 by Nightsong »

Sabelkatten

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 6959
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #10 on: 25 November 2017, 05:52:15 »
Upgraded version of a tried and tested variant:

Code: [Select]
Longbow RFL-LB1B

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Age of War/Star League
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/C-E-D-A
Production Year: 2750
Cost: 4 548 800 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1 114

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 240 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43,2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64,8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    2  Medium Lasers
    8  LRM-5s
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      99 points                6,00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                240                      11,50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             15                        5,00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               3,00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 136                  8,50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            8         
                                        Center Torso     20           21       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  5         
                                           L/R Torso     14           16       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  5         
                                             L/R Arm     10           15       
                                             L/R Leg     14           15       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Medium Lasers                              CT        6         2         2,00
4 LRM-5s                                     RA        8         4         8,00
4 LRM-5s                                     LA        8         4         8,00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  HD        -         1         1,00
@LRM-5 (48)                                  RA        -         2         2,00
@LRM-5 (48)                                  LA        -         2         2,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 30

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 11
4          2       3       2       0      3     0   Structure:  5
Special Abilities: SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 1/2/2, IF 2

And a simple SL-tech upgrade:

Code: [Select]
Longbow RFL-LB1B2

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Age of War/Star League
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/C-F-D-A
Production Year: 2750
Cost: 4 852 800 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1 316

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 240 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43,2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64,8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor w/ CASE
Armament:
    2  Medium Lasers
    9  LRM-5s
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      99 points                6,00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                240                      11,50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             10(20)                    0,00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT
Gyro:               Standard                                               3,00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 152                  9,50
    CASE Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT                                             1,00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            8         
                                        Center Torso     20           23       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  5         
                                           L/R Torso     14           18       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  5         
                                             L/R Arm     10           17       
                                             L/R Leg     14           18       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Medium Lasers                              CT        6         2         2,00
LRM-5                                        RT        2         1         2,00
4 LRM-5s                                     RA        8         4         8,00
4 LRM-5s                                     LA        8         4         8,00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  HD        -         1         1,00
@LRM-5 (24)                                  LT        -         1         1,00
@LRM-5 (48)                                  RA        -         2         2,00
@LRM-5 (48)                                  LA        -         2         2,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 29

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 13
4          3       4       3       0      3     0   Structure:  5
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 1/3/3, IF 3

Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 37301
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #11 on: 25 November 2017, 08:07:34 »
I like it. Only complaint I’d have is the jump jets seem a touch superfluous on an artillery piece. I mean I can see uses, but 2 more MLS might be a good deterrent against the kind of harrassers that might be up to counterbattery work. Wouldn’t mean I wouldn’t use them as is though.
*snip*
Thanks!  The jump jets are there because the best defense against vehicles (especially fast ones) is to go someplace they can't get to.  VTOLs would be facing flak...

Alsadius

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 926
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #12 on: 25 November 2017, 08:18:40 »
To be clear are we supposed to only submit one mech each?

Yes, one mech each.

Do I get to sell a whole lance if the 4 mechs are less then 5mcb total?  >:D

Heh. I only want one design, but I'll give an arbitrary number of bonus points for it being cheap enough to afford multiples.

Sharpnel

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13414
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #13 on: 25 November 2017, 12:27:23 »
I went all out and just got in under the 5 million limit. It's a Trebuchet with Endo-Steel chassis and twin Clan LRM-20s with 6 tons of ammo.

Code: [Select]
Trebuchet TBT-5G

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Mixed
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Dark Ages
Tech Rating/Era Availability: X/X-X-X-A
Production Year: 3132
Cost: 4,961,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,810

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 250 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor w/ CASE
Armament:
    2  (CL) LRM-20s
    3  (IS) ER Medium Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    83 points                2.50
    Internal Locations: 1 HD, 2 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LA, 2 RA, 1 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             Fusion Engine                250                      12.50
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         (IS) Double Heat Sink        10(20)                    0.00
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 144                  9.00
    CASE Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT                                             1.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     16           21       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  8         
                                           L/R Torso     12           16       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     8            13       
                                             L/R Leg     12           18       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(CL) LRM-20                                  RT        6         4         5.00
2 (IS) ER Medium Lasers                      RA        10        2         2.00
(CL) LRM-20                                  LA        6         4         5.00
(IS) ER Medium Laser                         LA        5         1         1.00
@LRM-20 (18)                                 RT        -         3         3.00
@LRM-20 (18)                                 LT        -         3         3.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 15

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 18
5          4       4       2       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 2/2/2, IF 2

Consigliere Trygg Bender, CRD-3BL Crusader, The Blazer Mafia
Takehiro 'Taco' Uchimiya, SHD-2H Shadow Hawk 'Taco', Crimson Oasis Trading Company

"Of what use is a dream, if not a blueprint for courageous action" -Adam West
As I get older, I realize that I'm not as good as I once was.
"Life is too short to be living someone else's dream" - Hugh Hefner

Wildonion

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 741
  • I'm just a few onions short of a patch.
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #14 on: 25 November 2017, 14:22:36 »
A little design I cooked up, with the rough idea that it was a Nova Cat produced 'Mech that serves within Combine forces more often than in their own Touman. The Arquebus is supposed to be quick enough to get where it needs to be, tough enough to take a couple big hits, and engage in combat with good reach and battlefield endurance. Plus I've always been fond of Clan LRMs, though for the life of my I just can't imagine why. :P

Code: [Select]
Arquebus ARQ-1A

Mass: 45 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3085
Cost: 4,883,890 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,818

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 270 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 64.8 km/h
Maximum Speed: 97.2 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 180 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  LRM-20 w/ Artemis IV FCS
    2  ER Medium Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    75 points                2.50
    Internal Locations: 3 LT, 2 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA
Engine:             Fusion Engine                270                      14.50
    Walking MP: 6
    Running MP: 9
    Jumping MP: 6 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL                             3.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             10(20)                    0.00
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 153                  8.00
    Armor Locations: 2 LT, 1 RT, 2 LA, 2 RA
    CASE Locations: RT                                                     0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     14           21       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  7         
                                           L/R Torso     11           17       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  5         
                                             L/R Arm     7            14       
                                             L/R Leg     11           22       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LRM-20                                       RT        6         4         5.00
    Artemis IV FCS                           RT        -         1         1.00
2 ER Medium Lasers                           CT        10        2         2.00
@LRM-20 (Artemis) (18)                       RT        -         3         3.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 17
« Last Edit: 25 November 2017, 18:17:24 by Wildonion »

Speedbump

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #15 on: 25 November 2017, 16:22:11 »
Up until yesterday I hadn't realised that Clantech doesn't actually cost any more than IS gear. So here's my attempt at a long ranged budget clan mech for use in second line units:

Code: [Select]
Atatl ATL-1A

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Dark Ages
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-D-D-A
Production Year: 3132
Cost: 4,181,500 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,778

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 200 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  Large Pulse Laser
    8  LRM-5s
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                    83 points                2.50
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 1 RT, 2 LA, 2 RA
Engine:             Fusion Engine                200                       8.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         2.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             13(26)                    3.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 2 RT, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 169                  9.00
    Armor Locations: 2 LT, 1 RT, 2 LA, 2 RA
    CASE Locations: LT, RT                                                 0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     16           24       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  8         
                                           L/R Torso     12           18       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     8            16       
                                             L/R Leg     12           24       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Pulse Laser                            CT        10        2         6.00
LRM-5                                        RT        2         1         1.00
LRM-5                                        LT        2         1         1.00
3 LRM-5s                                     RA        6         3         3.00
3 LRM-5s                                     LA        6         3         3.00
@LRM-5 (72)                                  RT        -         3         3.00
@LRM-5 (72)                                  LT        -         3         3.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 3

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      6    Points: 18
4j         4       4       4       0      2     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, LRM 2/2/2, IF 2


Sabelkatten

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #16 on: 26 November 2017, 02:38:47 »
Well, the reason clantech doesn't cost more is because the costs are complete nonsense and nobody's bothered to do anything about it...

Chaeronea

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  • Posts: 270
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #17 on: 26 November 2017, 06:00:56 »
Something I threw together. For those who get the name reference, forgive me. :)


Oh, I get the reference.  #P

More seriously, seeing as the hoopak works like a staff-sling which  'can achieve very steep trajectories for slinging over obstacles', maybe replacing the LRM-20 with an Inner Sphere Mech Mortar 8 would be suitable to keep with the hoopak theme of throwing a single arcing projectile?

Nightsong

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #18 on: 27 November 2017, 03:11:51 »
A 2X model could have a straight swap, since the LRM20 and MM8 are perfect matches crit/weight-wise. A snoozefest for a couple techs and a Mechbay to convert between the two.

Feign

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #19 on: 27 November 2017, 13:30:56 »
I made this quite a while ago for a campaign, but never did post it here.  A special little nightmare waiting in the wilderness of a hidden world.  As a side effect of exposing Mercenaries to these things, it was very quickly apparent that they're not just a creepy kind of boogyman unit, but also only cost 50% more to build from scratch as it does to hire the same firepower manned by infantry and they cost a whole lot less to feed :P .

Spook

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Quad
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Dark Ages
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-F-A
Production Year: 3132
Cost: 2,942,500 C-Bills
Battle Value: 294

Chassis: Composite Structure
Power Plant: 100 Compact Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 21.6 km/h
Maximum Speed: 32.4 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Commercial (BAR 5)
Armament:
    2 Thumpers

Code: [Select]
Overview:
Though the mech itself isn't entirely interesting or difficult to fight, the very existance of the Spook autonomous defense
platform is one that tacticians find deeply troubling.  On the surface, the mech is a laughably slow and fragile artillery
platform with relatively shallow ammunition bins.  However, the fact that the mech-based platform is fully robotically
controlled means that it can be left on standby in a planet's wilderness for years (possibly decades) before springing to
life and bombarding targets.  A capability that a manned unit simply does not have.

Capabilities:
Once a Spook reveals itself, it's not too difficult to deal with.  It barely keeps pace with infantry and has laughably thin
armor that seems more suited to shrugging off damage from weather and fauna than from combat.  One good hit from a
competent counter-battery Long Tom is often enough to destroy or at least cripple it.

If it detects that it will be captured, the Spook self-destructs as best it can.  Usually this is by shutting down its heat sink
system in an attempt to detonate the final few rounds in the bin and destroy the mech outright.  Otherwise it attempts
to overload its reactor as it opens the reactor's and the computer's magnetic shielding, completely erasing any data the
robotic system might have on board, and sometimes creating a cascade reaction that destroys the mech.

Needless to say, there have been no Spook units successfully captured in good enough condition for reverse engineering.

Battle History:
There are very few confirmed Spook incidents, though there are often rumors of their interference, they either retreat
into the wilderness or self destruct so effectively that they can't be identified.  The first encounter being in the former
Chaos March and the most remote being as far as the Marian Hedgemony.  Usually, the combat involved is much too
chaotic to investigate sudden enemy (or ally) artillery joining the fray.

Deployment:
The primary thing about the Spook is that there is no known factory making them, no known units deploying them and
no apparent command structure sending them orders.  The forces they appear to be defending almost always have no
knowledge that the mechs are on the planet until they start firing.  Other incidents involving the mech follow the same
pattern, where they activate when a combat is detected and seem to randomly choose a side to favor.

There are some pretty obvious theories on who originally made the Spooks, especially with the similarities they share
with the Revenant chassis.  Until one is captured "alive", there is no way to confirm them, however.
================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Composite Structure           91 points                2.50
Engine:             Compact Fusion Engine        100                       4.50
    Walking MP: 2
    Running MP: 3
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             12                        2.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 2 FLL, 2 FRL, 2 RLL, 2 RRL
Gyro:               Compact                                                1.50
Cockpit:            Robotic                                                5.50
    Actuators:      L: H+UL+LL+F    R: H+UL+LL+F
Armor:              Commercial (BAR: 5)          AV -  48                  2.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            8         
                                        Center Torso     16           7         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  1         
                                           L/R Torso     12           7         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  1         
                                       L/R Front Leg     12           4         
                                        L/R Rear Leg     12           4         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thumper                                      CT/RT     6         3/12     15.00
Thumper                                      CT/LT     6         3/12     15.00
@Thumper (20)                                CT        -         1         1.00
@Thumper (20)                                HD        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      1    Points: 3
2          3       0       0       0      2     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ARTT, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA
All that is born dies,
All that is planned fails,
All that is built crumbles,
But memories continue on,
And that is beautiful.

Alsadius

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #20 on: 29 November 2017, 20:10:23 »
Okay, so it's judgement time. There's a total of 11 entries, and I'll make comments on each as I go:

Sabelkatten: Tweenie TW-I1 - 20t, 5/8/0, 69 armor, 10 HS, 3 LRM-5(2t), ERML. $1,375,000(=3x for $5M).
A nice little mech, and the only one to be cheap enough to deploy in multiples. Slower than many of the units it'd be likely to support, but that can be okay in a fire support role. (Note: Sabelkatten actually made four entries, but since I said one per person, I'm ignoring the others.)

casperionx: Cheap Fire Support - 50t, 5/8/0, 168 armor, 20 HS, LRM-20(3t, CASE), 2 ML, SL, C3 Slave, Guardian ECM. $4,991,375.
Not the most imaginative name, but the mobility fits well with its likely compatriots, and C3 systems are always really nice when you're sitting at long range. The punch is a bit light for its weight, but otherwise not bad at all.

Andras: Swayback SWBK-2LRM - 50t, 4/6/4, 152 armor, 20 HS, 2 Artemis LRM-15(4t, CASE), 2 ML. $4,274,500.
Probably the most straightforward design submitted, it does its job pretty straightforwardly. Probably best in rough terrain, between the indirect fire and the jump jets. I'm not a fan of Narc ammo in an Artemis-equipped mech, though - maybe one ton, but two is excessive. If I'm loading a second ton of specialty ammo, it should probably be frag, or maybe Thunder. (Fortunately, ammo loadout doesn't need to be locked down in the design, so this is quibbling)
   
fallen: Mysore MYE-1 - 35t, 6/9/0, 48 armor, 10 HS, 2 LRM-5(1t), Prototype ML. $2,589,300.
Obviously weak by the standards of the other units, but given the Age of War tech that's fine. From my knowledge of AoW tech, this seems to fit the era pretty well. Shame it couldn't be a hundred grand cheaper, though.

Liam's Ghost: Basilisk BSL-1K - 50t, 4/6/0, 152 armor, 20 HS, Long Tom Cannon(3t, CASE), 2 ERML. $4,619,500.
Interesting. A weapon you don't see much, but it has LRM-style range, and it packs a real punch. Against grouped enemies, this can be nasty. A touch slower than most mechs of its size, but again that's not a huge problem in fire support.

Daryk: Arturion CN9-TH - 50t, 4/6/4, 168 armor, 10 HS, Thumper(2t), 2 ML. $3,481,000.
Putting arty on a Mech frame, with all the usual features of a Mech designed for close-in combat, seems over-engineered to me. It falls a bit between two stools - you could have the same Thumper and similar mobility and armour in an ICE vehicle for less than a quarter of the cost, and if something gets in close, 2x ML won't do much. I see the appeal, in some ways, but I'm not sure it'd work well.
   
Nightsong: Hoopak HPK-1X - 45t, 5/8/0, 138 armor, 20 HS, LRM-20(4t, CASE), 2 ERML, C3 Slave. $4,379,290.
Very similar to the "Cheap Fire Support" - somewhat cheaper, at the cost of no ECM. The ammo bins are surprisingly deep as well - this is one of the few LRM-20 designs where I could happily dedicate ammo to things other than the basic rounds guilt-free, but of course that does limit the secondary weapons some(a third ERML might be more powerful than the last ton of ammo, for one). These are close.
   
Sharpnel: Trebuchet TBT-5G - 50t, 5/8/0, 144 armor, 20 HS, 2 Clan LRM-20(6t, CASE), 3 IS ERML. $4,961,000.
Mixed-tech designs always feel a little bit cheesy, but in this case it's strictly worse than a pure Clantech design would be, so I won't judge it too harshly. Other than that, though, this is a pretty good all-arounder mech. Good mobility, very good firepower for the challenge, and solid ammo and overall protection.
   
Wildonion: Arquebus ARQ-1A - 45t, 6/9/6, 153 armor, 20 HS, Artemis LRM-20(3t, CASE), 2 ERML. $4,883,890.
The fastest entry in the contest, and it packs decent firepower too. You could have a lot of fun kiting in this mech.

Speedbump: Atatl ATL-1A - 50t, 4/6/4, 169 armor, 26 HS, PLL, 8 LRM-5(6t). $4,181,500.
The Clan PLL may be the single best all-around weapon in the whole of BT, but that does leave it with a slight whiff of cheese. Still, use it if you've got it. The LRM-5s are an interesting choice, because the weight you save on the launchers you lose on the heat sinks, but it does spread out the damage a bit more, and minimize the effects of luck. I tend to think the larger launchers are a bit more realistic, but not so strongly so that I'll turn my nose up at this.

Feign: Spook - 50t, 2/3/0, 48 BAR-5 armor, 12 HS, 2 Thumper(2t). $2,942,500.
Props for being the only one to include any substantial fluff, but weird Blakist troll tech is not usually my scene. (*cough*Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!) I don't think it would be all that effective in most contexts, but it's sure evil.

Results
A lot of good entries overall. I'm somewhat surprised to see so little direct-fire weaponry - not a single AC/5 or PPC or Gauss in the whole collection - but that's fine. Still, I need to pick winners, so without further ado...

Third Place: Nightsong's Hoopak HPK-1X. It was close between this and the Cheap Fire Support, but it felt like saving 600,000 C-bills was a better choice for this challenge than the ECM, and the use of a real name(even if it's one where I don't get the reference) helps too.

Second Place: Wildonion's Arquebus ARQ-1A. This one feels like it suits some more interesting play styles than most others with the 6/9/6 move, and it still does the job well.

First Place: Liam's Ghost's Basilisk BSL-1K. The thought of this thing lobbing shells into a melee makes me happy, and it'll leave a real mess when it does. Needs to be used carefully, but I can see it being really rewarding, and singlehandedly changing enemy strategies in the process.

Feel free to keep making submissions, but they won't be judged. I'll post the next contest in a couple days, depending when I have time.

Daryk

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #21 on: 29 November 2017, 20:51:23 »
*snip*
Daryk: Arturion CN9-TH - 50t, 4/6/4, 168 armor, 10 HS, Thumper(2t), 2 ML. $3,481,000.
Putting arty on a Mech frame, with all the usual features of a Mech designed for close-in combat, seems over-engineered to me. It falls a bit between two stools - you could have the same Thumper and similar mobility and armour in an ICE vehicle for less than a quarter of the cost, and if something gets in close, 2x ML won't do much. I see the appeal, in some ways, but I'm not sure it'd work well.
*snip*
As I pointed out up thread, the jump jets enable you to emplace the Thumper where a vehicle simply can't go.  And as for in close, on-board artillery fire has a place.  That said, I'm glad to see Liam's design come out on top! O0

Andras

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #22 on: 29 November 2017, 21:27:43 »
I had considered a unit with an AC5, but for the weight involved, you can have a LRM15 and get triple the firepower.

Here's a sample with PPCs, a modified Rifleman under 5mcb
Code: [Select]
Rifleman RFL-46P

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-E-D-A
Production Year: 3025
Cost: 4,756,800 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,276

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 240 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    2  PPCs
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      99 points                6.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                240                      11.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             20                       10.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 HD, 2 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA    R: SH+UA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 200                 12.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     20           31       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  8         
                                           L/R Torso     14           21       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  7         
                                             L/R Arm     10           20       
                                             L/R Leg     14           28       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PPC                                          RA        10        3         7.00
PPC                                          LA        10        3         7.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 34

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      7    Points: 13
4          2       2       2       0      3     0   Structure:  5
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA



Wildonion

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  • Posts: 741
  • I'm just a few onions short of a patch.
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #23 on: 29 November 2017, 21:48:44 »
Congratulations, Liam's Ghost!

Liam's Ghost

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  • Posts: 7907
  • Miss Chitty finds your honor rules quaint.
Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #24 on: 30 November 2017, 07:04:35 »
Yay me!
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Alsadius

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #25 on: 30 November 2017, 09:19:27 »
I had considered a unit with an AC5, but for the weight involved, you can have a LRM15 and get triple the firepower.

Here's a sample with PPCs, a modified Rifleman under 5mcb (snip)

Yeah, it wasn't a big deal either way. I wasn't expecting nearly so much arty, and the AC5 is known to be rather a weak weapon. Though as you just showed, PPCs can be perfectly good long-range weapons. Just thought it interesting that every long-range weapon in the entire contest except the one PLL was capable of indirect fire. It's interesting to me to see where people's brains go sometimes.

Yay me!

Yay you!

Speedbump

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #26 on: 30 November 2017, 14:12:19 »
Yay me!
Congrats, nicely done.

Speedbump: Atatl ATL-1A - 50t, 4/6/4, 169 armor, 26 HS, PLL, 8 LRM-5(6t). $4,181,500.
The Clan PLL may be the single best all-around weapon in the whole of BT, but that does leave it with a slight whiff of cheese. Still, use it if you've got it. The LRM-5s are an interesting choice, because the weight you save on the launchers you lose on the heat sinks, but it does spread out the damage a bit more, and minimize the effects of luck. I tend to think the larger launchers are a bit more realistic, but not so strongly so that I'll turn my nose up at this.
The LRM5s are actually a cost thing. It's not massive on the scale of the whole mech, but a pair of LRM20s would cost a bit over twice as much as the 8 LRM5s. As for the PLL I don't disagree with your assessment. In a couple of draft versions I played about with alternative energy weapons in the CT, but this version came out on top.

Alsadius

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #27 on: 30 November 2017, 14:15:44 »
The LRM5s are actually a cost thing. It's not massive on the scale of the whole mech, but a pair of LRM20s would cost a bit over twice as much as the 8 LRM5s.

Okay, that's kind of weird. BT's costs don't always make sense, because I would not expect that - if anything, they ought to be pricier, because you need four independent firing systems, guidance systems, etc.

Nightsong

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #28 on: 30 November 2017, 15:39:30 »
Very similar to the "Cheap Fire Support" - somewhat cheaper, at the cost of no ECM. The ammo bins are surprisingly deep as well - this is one of the few LRM-20 designs where I could happily dedicate ammo to things other than the basic rounds guilt-free, but of course that does limit the secondary weapons some(a third ERML might be more powerful than the last ton of ammo, for one). These are close.

Now that it's over and it won't prejudice my case anymore.. (heh) A hoopak is the staff-sling traditionally carried by the Kender of the Dragonlance setting. Kender are.. well, think of them as skinny kleptomaniac hobbits, and considered one of the more annoying races ever created to be PCs. On the other hand, the concept of a staffsling was fairly effective for its day, and most of the other names for historical siege weaponry had been taken already so I branched out a bit.

Feign

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Re: Design Challenge #1 - Cheap Fire Support
« Reply #29 on: 02 December 2017, 08:39:57 »
Feign: Spook - 50t, 2/3/0, 48 BAR-5 armor, 12 HS, 2 Thumper(2t). $2,942,500.
Props for being the only one to include any substantial fluff, but weird Blakist troll tech is not usually my scene. (*cough*Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!) I don't think it would be all that effective in most contexts, but it's sure evil.
Normally, yeah, weird Blakist tech is sort of disheartening, but in this case, the Robotic cockpit realistically gives no game advantage, and it could be pulled and replaced with a small cockpit, giving you an extra 3.5 tons to devote to actually giving it armor.  (Interestingly, according to SSW, this raises the price by 400k)

All the other criticisms are totally valid though, I didn't expect to win this one.
All that is born dies,
All that is planned fails,
All that is built crumbles,
But memories continue on,
And that is beautiful.