Author Topic: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw  (Read 12979 times)

The Eagle

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MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« on: 15 February 2018, 23:28:08 »

From TRO:3025, TRO:3039, TRO:SW

The QKD-series BattleMech, more commonly known as the Quickdraw, is not in my experience a very popular BattleMech.  It is rarely considered a true stinker like the CGR-1A1 Charger; it does however suffer from trying to do too much with too little.  That being said, when employed properly – like most such “lemons” – the Quickdraw is capable of contributing significantly to a battle.

The Quickdraw first entered service in 2779, and was initially fielded by both the Free Worlds League and the Draconis Combine.  Its exact provenance is actually unknown for certain, but by implication the current manufacturers of the QKD-series – Technicron Manufacturing of Savannah and Luthien Armor Works – were the most likely original manufacturers from the Late Star League era.  This in turn suggests that the Quickdraw was the product of a joint venture between the two corporations.  We are told that the Quickdraw was designed as a replacement for the Rifleman, a claim which at first glance makes little sense.  The RFL-3N, the Rifleman’s standard model of the day, is optimized for long range combat with paired light autocannons and large lasers.  The Quickdraw’s initial production model, the QKD-4G, carried a single LRM-10, giving it less than half of the RFL-3N’s firepower beyond the traditional short range brackets.  The Rifleman is also renowned as an anti-aircraft platform thanks to its famous Garret D2J targeting system; the Quickdraw, by contrast, uses a Dynatec targeting computer.  So why was the QKD-4G considered a replacement for the RLF-3N?

What you have to remember is that in 2779, when the QKD-4G entered serial production, the Amaris Civil War ground to its eventual end in September of that year.  The SLDF had been fighting continuously for almost fifteen years and suffered horrendous casualty rates in both men and machines.  The RFL-3N is notoriously fragile, and would have been forced into front-line duty due to combat losses amongst line combatants such as Warhammers and Orions.  The QKD-4G then was not intended to replace the Rifleman as a fire support machine, but was instead intended to replace it as a front line fighter so that the RLF-3Ns could move back into the fire support role.

So with that little bit of deduction out of the way, let’s get to the mechanics!  The QKD-4G was built on a standard chassis capable of supporting a max of 60 tons, placing it just on the heavy side of the medium/heavy split.  Unlike most heavy ‘Mechs, however, it can reach speeds in excess of 80 kph thanks to its Vlar 300 standard engine.  Adding to its impressive mobility for a heavy ‘Mech, it also mounts five jump jets, giving it even greater agility when operating in close terrain.  Its movement profile gives it the same maneuverability as many medium ‘Mechs such as the Wolverine, a staple of both the FWLM and the DCMS, the militaries that first deployed the Quickdraw.  Looking at protection, its armor is unfortunately light for a heavy ‘Mech at only 8 tons of standard plate, arranged 9/17(8)/14(7)/11/15 (HD/CT(R)/ST(R)/A/L).  This is actually lighter than some medium machines a good fifteen or twenty tons lighter, while comparable designs like the Dragon have as much as two extra tons of armor on it.  Its thinner-than-expected shell means you have to rely on your jump jets to drive up the to-hit numbers, and that comes with its own problems.

Those problems are, of course, the weapon & cooling suites.  The QKD-4G carries thirteen single heat sinks, all in the engine, and if you’re jumping to maximize your movement modifiers than you’re chewing up a significant amount of your heat capacity in the movement phase alone.  Your armaments, however, do have the benefit of operating at all ranges.  These comprise an LRM-10 in the left torso for long-range engagements, supplemented by a pair of arm-mounted medium lasers and a centrally-mounted SRM-4 for knife fighting.  Another pair of medium lasers – yes, two of them – are rear-mounted in the side torsos as well to discourage pursuit or when jumping into the middle of a fur ball.  In all, the -4G’s armaments give it an all-aspect combat ability, but if you’re doing a lot of jumping you have to be able to ride its heat curve.  That curve is surprisingly gentle unless you’re engaging rearward and forward targets with your lasers, in which case you need to be careful.

Like so many TRO3025 ‘Mechs, it’s not much of a duelist.  It wants to play as part of a team.  It can act as a decent bodyguard for a medium fire lance filled with TBT-5Ns and WTH-1s, for example, contributing to the mission with its own LRMs while its short-range battery provides a threat to disruption units that get close.  Alternatively, it can be paired with heavier mediums or other fast heavies like the DRG-1N or WVR-series to provide light fire support.

Variants

QKD-4H: While the QKD-4G didn’t spread to the “IS General” category until the Late Succession Wars, the -4H started there in the Early Succession Wars which makes me wonder if this version was originally intended for export.  In any case, the -4H is functionally identical to the -4G with the minor difference that the SRM-4 is swapped to face rearward (I know, I know, rear-mounted weapons are generally looked down upon, but they’re a feature of the Quickdraw rather than a bug) and the two torso medium lasers are reversed to face forward.  This swap reduces your crit-seeking ability but gives you better concentrated damage; however, this is where the Quickdraw’s reputation for being a heat-hog probably comes from.  For those of you playing at home, the -4H’s full laser salvo is 12 heat on a machine with a 5-hex jump range and only 13 heat sinks.  Learn to the ride the curve, dear friends.

QKD-5A: The QKD-5A is my personal favorite, at least of the Succession Wars models.  It pulls the LRM-10 completely for two more forward-mounted medium lasers and four extra heat sinks.  This version is a pure knife-fighter and is right at home with my WVR-6Ms, mixing it up with enemies at short range.  You’re actually heat-neutral on a jump with your four forward medium lasers, so if you’re planning on bringing the rear weapons or the SRMs into play, plan your heat accumulation accordingly.  Unlike the rest of the Quickdraw’s variants, the -5A isn’t designed from the start as a team player.  This one can actually duel against most ‘Mechs around its weight class as long as it plays cagey with movement and terrain to close the distance, but lacking any weapons that can reach beyond nine hexes puts them at a disadvantage against anything much faster with medium and long range guns, like the HER-4K Hermes II or even the ubiquitous PHX-1 Phoenix Hawk.

QKD-5M: The tech renaissance brought us the QKD-5M which is actually one of the least impressive of the post-Helm Core upgrades. . . while simultaneously being perhaps one of the easiest to accomplish and one of the most sensible.  The -5M is a straight upgrade of the -4G.  The engine remains the more-durable standard type, but the armor is upgraded to ferro-fibrous while remaining at 8 tons laid out 9/18(8)/17(8)/13/16.  Added protection consists of CASE in the left torso to protect the single ton of LRM reloads.  The four standard medium lasers remain – one in each arm, with two in the rear right torso – while the center torso SRM-4 has been replaced with a one-shot version of the same launcher to make up the weight lost for CASE.  So overall it’s a fairly simple conversion to make, the use of 13 double heat sinks solves its jumping death-blossom problem, and the only real problem I have with it is that one-shot launcher (for obvious reasons).  In Early Clan Invasion games, it’s not a terrible upgrade, but as time progresses it ages rapidly and it continues to want to play like its forefather the QKD-4G.

QKD-5K: Also dropping in 3049, the Combine’s take on a first-generation tech upgrade is the QKD-5K.  Rather than basing off the -4G like Technicron, LAW based the -5K on the laser-heavy -5A.  The way the upgrade is made is actually extremely similar to the Marik path; again, the expensive XL engine is avoided, and all seventeen heat sinks are upgraded to double-strength freezers (which I find curious since the Combine had an issue producing high-capacity sinks early on; surely they could have found better designs to use them on?).  Again, the armor is upgraded to ferro-fibrous and remains at eight tons total protection laid out precisely the same as the QKD-5M.  As a -5A upgrade, that variant’s armament is retained: one medium laser in each arm, two more in the left torso, another two in the rear right torso, and an SRM-4 in the center torso with one ton of ammunition in the right torso.  Like the -4G/-5M upgrade, the -5K needs to be played just like the -5A.  It’s a close-range brawler and with those double heat sinks there’s no need to be quite as cautious with your laser usage as before.  Just beware that even with ferro-fibrous, eight tons of armor isn’t a lot so stay mobile to keep those movement mods high.

QKD-C: Entering serial production in 3053, the QKD-C is a simple C3 upgrade of the -5K.  LAW’s engineers pulled one of the rear-facing medium lasers for a C3 slave.  Overall, it’s a fairly simple and effective upgrade.  Since the -5K wants to play up in the enemy’s face anyway, it makes the –C a pretty decent spotter for longer ranged lancemates.

QKD-5K2: Following the trend of “small tweak upgrades” for the Quickdraw, 3057’s QKD-5K2 is similar to how the -4H was altered.  In this case, the QKD-5K’s two rear-facing medium lasers are swapped to face forward and the SRM-4 is reversed in response.  Overall, I have to say that this one I’m not such a fan of; a battery of six medium is nothing to sneer at, but the design’s only crit-seekers are pointing the wrong way.  Sure it can punch holes, but it can’t exploit those holes which makes it less effective in a duel.

QKD-8K: In 3064, LAW brought us the QKD-8K which actually ushers the Quickdraw into its first really high-tech variant. It continues utilizing the same standard engine and jump jets as all of its predecessors.  The skeleton however was rebuilt with endo-steel which when combined with ferro-fibrous armor equates to some good weight savings, although it leaves the -8K a tad short of space.  Speaking of armor, the protection is increased half a ton to 8.5 tons, laid out 9/22(7)/16(5)/15/21.  This scheme thins out the rear sheeting and the side torsos a little to bump up the protection on the arms and legs, while the center torso can finally take an AC/20 round without going internal.  The armaments have also been updated, finally dispensing with the rear-facing guns.  The drum total is four medium lasers, all of the extended range type, with two in the left torso and one each in the arms as usual.  The two missile launchers of the traditional Quickdraw are swapped out for a single MRM-30 in the right torso fed by a two-ton ammo bin that is in turn protected by CASE.  All told, this combination of increased armor, a standard engine, and CASE’d ammunition makes the QKD-8K a decently tough customer for its size, though the loss of the LRMs and the extension of the 9-hex engagement range of the remaining missiles and lasers to a more medium-ranged bracket makes a pretty decent skirmisher.

QKD-5Mr: This variant is a field refit on the League-standard -5M; thanks to the Outreach Accords, -5Ms had been widely exported and apparently Technicron also widely dispensed the plans for this upgrade to its customers.  And this is the high-tech Quickdraw for me!  Entering service in 3070, the QKD-5Mr maintains the same engine, chassis, jump jets, CASE, and armor scheme as the -5M.  The changes are all in armament and special equipment: that useless one-shot SRM launcher is pulled, as are five sinks (bringing it down to twelve doubles).  The four medium lasers (two in the right rear torso and one in each arm, for those following along at home) are exchanged for extended range types and mated to a targeting computer in the right torso.  The LRM-10 isn’t forgotten either, as it receives an Artemis IV FCS, while the ‘Mech as a whole benefits from the addition of a Guardian ECM suite placed in the left torso.  I like this one so much because it can come as a surprise to opponents.  The ECM is good for breaking up Blakist C3i networks, and while four medium lasers and an LRM-10 is hardly frightening to most, the added accuracy from the tarcomp and Artemis actually lets it hit a little harder than its mere warload might otherwise suggest.  With the tarcomp in there and half your laser battery facing backwards, you really have to literally jump into the middle of your enemy formation to squeeze every possible amount of lethality out of this machine.

QKD-8X: Earthwerks of Tikonov decided to take a crack at an experimental model of Quickdraws in the form of the QKD-8X.  Tinkering started in 3073 off a base chassis of the -8K, and it honestly feels like the Capellans just slapped new toys onto the chassis to see what worked.  It continues to utilize a standard engine and jump jets as well as inheriting the endo-steel bones of the -8K.  However, the cockpit is moved out of the head to the torso, and a compact gyro is swapped in to save room.  Triple-strength myomers are utilized to increase speed and physical attack damage; to aid in activating this system, only a dozen single heat sinks are fitted.  The armor package is dramatically upgraded, with a solid shell of twelve tons – in this case, stealth armor – sheathing the ‘Mech and laid out in a 9/30(10)/18(10)/28/16 scheme.  A lift hoist of all things is mounted on the rear left torso, while the head is replaced with a turret.  Most of the “standard” armament was stripped, all except the two right-rear standard medium lasers (say it with me: feature, not bug!).  The head-turret is filled by a standard PPC and a TAG laser, and the Guardian ECM that powers the stealth armor sits near the laser array in the right torso.  The generally anemic firepower is supplemented by a variety of hand-held weapon packages: five 12-ton packages and three 6-ton packages.  These include:
- LRM-20 with one ton of ammo and one ton of armor
- LB-10X autocannon with a half-ton of ammo and a half-ton of armor
- Three Streak SRM-4s with one ton of ammo and two tons of armor
- RAC/5 with 1.5 tons of ammo and half a ton of armor
- Thunderbolt-10 with three tons of ammo and two tons of armor
- LAC/5 with a half-ton of ammo and a half-ton of armor
- Five machine guns and a vehicle flamer with a half-ton of MG ammo, a full ton of flamer fuel, and one ton of armor
 - One medium laser with three heat sinks and two tons of armor
Given the QKD-8X’s extremely varied weapons load – it’s been called a “poor man’s OmniMech” – it’s difficult to describe exactly how to fight it.  Of all the hand-held variations, the one I think does best is the LRM-20.  The extra range lets it squeeze the most out of the stealth armor’s defensive modifiers by keeping the range mods high as well; I had considered the LBX as a good fit, too, as part of a matched set with the PPC (see: Thor/Summoner Prime; CTF-1X Cataphract), but I can’t get over that half-ton of ammunition.


QKD-8P: This is the production model of the -8X, and it does away with some of the more expensive features of the prototype.  The head-turret is gone, with the PPC and TAG now situated fixed-forward.  The stealth armor is also pulled, though the mass and layout remain the same, and the back-mounted lift hoist is also absent.  The torso-mounted cockpit, compact gyro, endo-steel chassis, and TSM all remain.  A Streak SRM-4 is added to the left torso, and the right-rear medium lasers are flipped to face forward.  The stealth armor may be gone, but the ECM suite is still present, and the -8P uses all the same hand-held packages as the -8X.  Given the increase in forward firepower in the -8P and the loss of the stealth armor, I think the trip-Streak package comes into its own here.  It can land a PPC, two medium lasers, and twelve SRMs onto a single target, which is no joke for a 60 ton ‘Mech.

QKD-9M: Appearing in the TRO3145:NTNU record sheet compilation, the QKD-9M is the last Quickdraw to see publication to date.  It has an introductory date of 3086 and context clues indicate that it is an Andurien refit that was exported to that state’s post-Jihad allies (the CapCon and Canopus) as well as the Federated Suns and the Republic.  Unfortunately, I personally do not have access to its record sheet, but the wiki tells us that it upgrades the arm-mounted medium lasers to standard large lasers that are integrated with a targeting computer.  The traditional left-torso LRM-10 is also upgraded, in this case to an LRM-15 with three tons of ammunition protected by CASE II.  The armor type is light ferro-fibrous, and a TAG system is also mounted for artillery spotting.  Without getting a really good look at the record sheet, I can’t say much specifically about this particular design except that it generally seems pretty solid.  Assuming the 5/8/5 movement curve and targeting computer, the lack of extended-range model lasers isn’t a terrible drawback – it has the agility to close with most targets in its weight class and can hit fairly reliably – and I’ve always been a fan of the LRM-15 in particular since it sees heavy use on both FWL and Blood Spirit ‘Mechs (my two favorite factions, for those who never noticed).  I’m most curious about the armor layout and the cooling system, because those I think are what will make or break a jumper that wants to skirmish at medium ranges like this one does.


So there you have it.  I know it took me a while to get this out there and had a few false starts along the way, but that’s life.  So. . . . discuss!
« Last Edit: 15 February 2018, 23:32:02 by The Eagle »
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Wrangler

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #1 on: 15 February 2018, 23:49:09 »
Thank you for the write up, The Eagle.

Did you catch the Design Quirks they gave the Quickstart in the BattleMech Manual? 
It adds Hyper-Extending Actuators; Exposed Actuators.  The Hyper-Extending actuators is good thing since it let's the mech flip arms almost so it can bring it's arm weapons to bare, even if the enemy is behind it.

Exposed Actuators...not so good.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #2 on: 16 February 2018, 00:03:13 »
Since I started playing Megamek, and MekHQ, I've developed a fondness for the 9M. It really goes well with a pair of Archers or Orions, and if you can get an Awesome, Juliano or some version of the Stalker to round out the lance, it's awful hard to go wrong with that. Not that I like playing as a Purple Burd...
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #3 on: 16 February 2018, 00:09:27 »
i have occasionally wondered recently if the Rifleman the Quickdraw was meant to replace wasn't the RFL-3N (which had only been in production for 9 years at that point), but rather the RFL-2N, which had stopped production 9 years earlier, and was a much more ground-combat focused machine, with twin PPC's and 4 ML's (and only 16 SHS. ouch.)

i mean, the Rifleman -3N was first produced in 2770, according to the MUL, the Quickdraw in 2779. 9 years hardly seems enough time for the -3N rifleman to need replacing. (and there is no way the assault weight Rifleman II was the one either)

but the 50 ton RFL-2N, which was first produced in 2556 and didn't stop production until 2770 when the -3N debuted, would have been in real need of replacing, especially as the war heated up.
« Last Edit: 16 February 2018, 00:12:48 by glitterboy2098 »

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #4 on: 16 February 2018, 00:48:33 »
i have occasionally wondered recently if the Rifleman the Quickdraw was meant to replace wasn't the RFL-3N (which had only been in production for 9 years at that point), but rather the RFL-2N, which had stopped production 9 years earlier, and was a much more ground-combat focused machine, with twin PPC's and 4 ML's (and only 16 SHS. ouch.)

i mean, the Rifleman -3N was first produced in 2770, according to the MUL, the Quickdraw in 2779. 9 years hardly seems enough time for the -3N rifleman to need replacing. (and there is no way the assault weight Rifleman II was the one either)

but the 50 ton RFL-2N, which was first produced in 2556 and didn't stop production until 2770 when the -3N debuted, would have been in real need of replacing, especially as the war heated up.

I was just about to post the same thing.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #5 on: 16 February 2018, 01:52:06 »
Never liked the quickdraw.  Either drop the SRM for additional heat, or remove the two rear lasers and add in a 2nd SRM4...  And the lrm-10??  better off with a large laser..
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #6 on: 16 February 2018, 02:35:31 »
Thanks for doing the Quickdraw. I like this Mech purely on its looks for some strange reason, and I'd be happy to field any of the forward-firing variants, usually the 5A and 8K. Less happy about the rear-firing ones, but as a pure flavour brawling redshirt mook... it'll do, it'll do.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #7 on: 16 February 2018, 03:26:41 »
I actually detest these, but it is never bad to get other opinions on something.

Too bad it never got a MML version since a lot of the variants liked to put LRM & SRM on board.  And instead of the ERLL in the arms like the -5Mr, a pair of snubs would be great for a brawler.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #8 on: 16 February 2018, 04:53:58 »
You're saying that all 13 sinks are in the engine, but I thought a 300 rated engine can only hold 12 sinks.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #9 on: 16 February 2018, 06:40:13 »
What do you guys think about the QKD-9M? The Handheld wielding machine?
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #10 on: 16 February 2018, 10:45:59 »
What do you guys think about the QKD-9M? The Handheld wielding machine?

That's actually the 8X or 8P. A neat idea, but the inherent limitations of handheld weapons make it less effective than a purpose built design IMHO.


The Eagle, I have the record sheet for the 9M in front of me. The 9M has an XL Engine to free up weight and 11 double strength heat sinks. The TAG system is mounted in the center torso. Armor layout is 9/25[8]/20[7]/17/24 (HD/CT[R]/ST[R]/A/L), so it's pretty good. Movement is 5/8/5. One thing I find interesting is that the design has no free criticals anywhere.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #11 on: 16 February 2018, 16:07:10 »
The Eagle, I have the record sheet for the 9M in front of me. The 9M has an XL Engine to free up weight and 11 double strength heat sinks. The TAG system is mounted in the center torso. Armor layout is 9/25[8]/20[7]/17/24 (HD/CT[R]/ST[R]/A/L), so it's pretty good. Movement is 5/8/5. One thing I find interesting is that the design has no free criticals anywhere.

Yep, this one is probably my favorite, although it is certainly a bit of a departure from the classic QKD's. It has real armor, but it also has the XL engine which makes it feel sufficiently fragile like the original. The dual large lasers are a solid main armament, and the three tons of ammo for the LRM encourages you to go ahead and bring one or two types of alternate ammo to play with. I think the biggest thing I like about the -9M, however, is that it HAS ITS BIG GUNS IN THE ARMS!!!

I can not adequately express how annoying I find it that a mech named the 'Quickdraw' has so little firepower in its arms, and not one variant with a ballistic weapon of any sort in the arms until you get to the oddball 8X/P. There should have been at least ONE classic Quickdraw with an AC/5 in one of it's arms for crying out loud! Or at least it's laser weapons should have all been located in the arms. As it is, you can blow the arms off of most QKD's and they are still fairly effective. The 8X/P do at least give it a gun that it can hold in its hands, but those two are so warped in other ways that it doesn't much resemble anything else named Quickdraw.

I actually kind of like the quickdraw, in general, even though it has weak armor and excessive rear-firing weaponry in most of its variants. It just bugs me that it took until 3145 or so to get a variant with its big guns in the arms!

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #12 on: 16 February 2018, 16:18:53 »
This 'Mech is one of my favorites.  I'm kind of crazy though...  I also like the Assassin.  I would actually like to see a variant of the 4G that has all of the weapons facing forward.  I found that it's a nice 'Mech to put MechWarriors with good piloting skills in.  It's a fast moving heavy 'Mech, like the OST's, so kicks and punches are going to hurt.

Also, the 4G is awesome in Alpha Strike.  It's one of my go-to 'Mechs.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #13 on: 16 February 2018, 17:46:07 »
Heavy cavalry - succession wars style!

I think the Quickdraw is a salutary lesson in why sometimes you really do need an XL engine.  You can fix the armour by using double heat sinks or weight saving structural elements, but you simply can't couple this kind of mobility with adequate armour and firepower in a heavy chassis without a lightweight engine.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #14 on: 16 February 2018, 18:54:59 »
I know it's not a particularly efficient or impressive mech, but I've always had a lot of fun running quickdraws. Something about a less than ideal mech (with some speed) disconnects the careful part of my brain and I just find myself going super aggressive with them, and it's always worked really well for me.

The quickdraw in particular, with both its rear weapon and its quirk ability to always flip its arms, and the ability to jump, has always been a machine that I've had a lot of luck with getting in over my head, then back out again.
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Empyrus

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #15 on: 16 February 2018, 20:29:44 »
I like the Quickdraw. The basic model, that is. Not really a fan of the later ones.
The laser boats are just... boring. Effective, perhaps, but completely uninteresting.
The Clan Invasion upgrade wastes tonnage by converting ALL heat sinks to doubles, and thereby prevents using a proper SRM-4.
And later ones... well, there are frankly better cavalry 'Mechs.

The basic Quickdraw has some idiotic issues though. Namely the ****** rear-lasers. The art (well, later one at least) and miniature both portray them as front-lasers, and if they were that actually, the machine would be actually pretty damn good: four medium lasers with 13 heat sinks allow for 20 pts damage walking fire without overheating, which is quite impressive for Succession Wars. (Moving the SRM to rear doesn't really help, the SRMs can be either used as a substitution for one laser, for augmenting attack power for slight heat cost, or for utility (smoke, infernos).)
As it is, the rear-firing weapons are completely worthless in the design anyway. It is fast, so it can turn easily. It can jump. It has arm-mounted weapons so it has limited blindspots. And worst of all, its armament being short-ranged and pointing in every direction paints the 'Mech as something intended to fight in middle of enemy lines... yet it really doesn't have enough armor for that!
(I dismiss the ability to flip arms as that is not possible under standard rules for the Quickdraw. Admittedly the quirk is quite useful here.)

The only IRL reasons i can come up with for this is that the design was play-tested without rear-weapons and found to be "too good"; or perhaps the 'Mech was statted based on the art, and rear lasers were tonnage-fillers, but no one noted to the mini-sculptor that the lasers were rear-mounted.


Still, these things aside, i do like the design. It offers reasonable firepower in mobile chassis, more so if i'm allowed to move the lasers to front. Armor's not stellar but combined with its mobility it has OK endurance. It has reasonable heat capacity for its era. And it looks nicely weird, or weirdly nice. It is something of a filler design in its generalist nature if placed outside a cavalry lance/company but it is flexible enough it is reasonable addition everywhere in 3025-era, so i can always find some use for it.

And then there's the question, what else can you bring?
In 60-ton class, in 3025-era:
-The Rifleman, slower design but with greater firepower as long as you can handle the heat.
-The introtech Lancelot is comparable to the Rifleman but
-The Dragon offers similar speed though no jump jets, and generally speaking the Dragon is more oriented for poking the enemy from distance, though thanks to its increased armor it does OK in melee. The Grand Dragon is arguably whole another class, the PPC is just so damn good upgrade over the AC/5.
-The introtech Champion offers good close-range firepower with as poor armor, limited field of fire, and worse cooling.
-The Merlin is slower but jumps, similar to the Grand Dragon though more of a generalist. A Periphery design, so limited factions.
-The Ostroc along with its cousins is a laserboat though otherwise offers similar feature-set otherwise, if you can tolerate the looks.
Depending who you play as and what you need, you don't have many cavalry options. In unknown terrain, high speed and jump capability along with mixed armament is unlikely to be a hindrance, so the Quickdraw is a reasonable option.

grimlock1

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #16 on: 16 February 2018, 21:09:23 »
Given the increase in forward firepower in the -8P and the loss of the stealth armor, I think the trip-Streak package comes into its own here.  It can land a PPC, two medium lasers, and twelve SRMs onto a single target, which is no joke for a 60 ton ‘Mech.
I thought handheld weapons meant you couldn't fire anything but head and leg mounted stuff.
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SD501st

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #17 on: 17 February 2018, 12:28:48 »
I thought handheld weapons meant you couldn't fire anything but head and leg mounted stuff.
Correct, which is why the 8X only had forward firing weapons in it's head(which was also a turret and could fire to the rear). The ML's were rear mounted, too.

I think hand held weapon packages should not be relied upon as the primary firepower of a Mech, but giving a Mech capabilities it otherwise lacks when the situation demands it is a good use of them. A LRM or Thunderbolt package with a few salvos for long range and/or indirect fire before going into the fray, a SRM package loaded with special munitions, an anti-Infantry/BA package, all of these sound useful. A SSRM pack which may have trouble exhausting it's ammo supply and keeps blocking the Mechs other weapons while in use? That doesn't sound like a good idea, unless the Mech has some way of storing it when it becomes more of a hindrance.

And for this purpose the 8X had the lift hoist, where it could also store a spare pack better suited to the situation. The 8X, despite using the packs as main weapons, was quite a good idea because of that. Go into battle using the LBX pack to complement its PPC, then switch to a SSRM or Rotary AC5 pack(stored on the back via the lift hoist) when the LBX exhausts its 5 salvos. Or start out with the Thunderbolt pack and throw two 10 pointers every turn from long range, then switch to the LBX or Streak pack and run in to exploit the breaches you created. Since they're a hand held weapon, the heat isn't a problem and you can run the Stealth Armor the whole time. And if you have to retreat or someone jumps into your rear, your back is covered by the PPC and 2 Medium Lasers. It's a weird concept, but it actually works.

The non-experimental conversion however took out most of the things that made it work(Stealth Armor, Head Turret, Lift Hoist), while adding weapons that couldn't be used if the Mech carried one of the hand held weapons. The worst of these packs is the Light Laser Weapon... 1 Medium Laser, 3 heat sinks, 2 tons of armor which blocks 2 medium lasers and a SRM launcher from being used... what possible use could that have? The only one I can see is in situations where the Mechs other weapons are critted out... but then again, that usually means at least one arm is non-functional, too. Or maybe a sub-optimal damage sink. *shrug*
« Last Edit: 17 February 2018, 12:38:18 by SD501st »

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #18 on: 17 February 2018, 15:35:03 »
One of the biggest problems with the Quickdraw is that it's a medium that's about ten to fifteen tons overweight.
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Empyrus

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #19 on: 17 February 2018, 15:59:36 »
One of the biggest problems with the Quickdraw is that it's a medium that's about ten to fifteen tons overweight.
More like merely 5 tons too heavy. 55-tons is the most efficient class for 5/8/5 movement.
Reducing the 'Mech to 55-ton design would free 1.5 tons, leading to weaker internal structure but if the extra tonnage is placed to armor, it would be a massive benefit overall.

Reducing the Quickdraw's tonnage by 10 would not change anything but require placing two heat sinks and the internal structure would be weaker. All in all worse option, unless cost is an issue.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #20 on: 17 February 2018, 15:59:42 »
One of the biggest problems with the Quickdraw is that it's a medium that's about ten to fifteen tons overweight.

Five tons really. If it didn't jump it'd be at the ideal mass.
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grimlock1

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #21 on: 17 February 2018, 17:50:28 »
Correct, which is why the 8X only had forward firing weapons in it's head(which was also a turret and could fire to the rear). The ML's were rear mounted, too.
The article's section on the 8P mentions being able to put a PPC, 2 ML's and 12 SRMs on target.  Which confused me because the lasers are torso mounts...

I think hand held weapon packages should not be relied upon as the primary firepower of a Mech, but giving a Mech capabilities it otherwise lacks when the situation demands it is a good use of them. A LRM or Thunderbolt package with a few salvos for long range and/or indirect fire before going into the fray, a SRM package loaded with special munitions, an anti-Infantry/BA package, all of these sound useful.
5 AMS, a ton of ammo and a half ton of armor?

And for this purpose the 8X had the lift hoist, where it could also store a spare pack better suited to the situation.
Missed that option.  I always figured that the hoist was there to carry the bigger weapons to and from battle, when TSM might not be active.

The non-experimental conversion however took out most of the things that made it work
Actually a bit odd that this happened.  The Axeman didn't suffer terribly going from the 6X to 6T.  Neither did the Wolfhound when it went from 2X to 2H.  Okay it did loose a quarter of its BV when the AES went away but it's still nasty little bugger.  My point is that while just about everything that was in a faction XTRO that got a version in TRO Prototypes lost some capability, it was generally not a significant downgrade.
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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #22 on: 17 February 2018, 19:30:06 »
Yeah, I forgot about the prohibition against firing torso weapons while carrying a handheld.  My bad.  I'll get that edited.
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VhenRa

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #23 on: 17 February 2018, 23:09:34 »
Yeah, my reaction upon seeing the 9M for the first time was quite simply "Oh god, they actually made a useful Quickdraw?"

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #24 on: 18 February 2018, 04:03:12 »
If RLs are accepted as 3025 tech, a QKD-4H mod that replaces the rear SRM4 with six RL-10s would be pretty nice.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #25 on: 18 February 2018, 07:09:37 »
Yeah, my reaction upon seeing the 9M for the first time was quite simply "Oh god, they actually made a useful Quickdraw?"

That was the general idea when I designed it.  The large lasers are a bit on the quirky side by the time it's built - it's not a Quickdraw without quirky weapons - but they're still useful weapons tied into a TC.  TAG on something fast enough to employ it and tough enough that it doesn't go away immediately when someone glares at you is always handy in a force that uses semi-guided LRMs, homing Arrows, or laser-guided bombs heavily (like the CCAF or the various FWLM successors).  The extra bin of LRM ammo is there for specialty ammunition or to pack in more standard/semi-guided rounds for those longer missions; this was a rear-facing medium laser in the earliest draft version I can locate but apparently someone talked me out of it.  The XLFE isn't great for toughness but I needed to do something to cram all the hardware on.

My favorite of the others is probably the 8K, which I had a lot of fun with in MegaMek a few times.  I don't regard MRMs as good or effective weapons but I find the bigger racks have an amusing missile spam factor.
« Last Edit: 18 February 2018, 07:11:40 by Moonsword »

VhenRa

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #26 on: 18 February 2018, 07:35:34 »
That was the general idea when I designed it.  The large lasers are a bit on the quirky side by the time it's built - it's not a Quickdraw without quirky weapons - but they're still useful weapons tied into a TC.  TAG on something fast enough to employ it and tough enough that it doesn't go away immediately when someone glares at you is always handy in a force that uses semi-guided LRMs, homing Arrows, or laser-guided bombs heavily (like the CCAF or the various FWLM successors).  The extra bin of LRM ammo is there for specialty ammunition or to pack in more standard/semi-guided rounds for those longer missions; this was a rear-facing medium laser in the earliest draft version I can locate but apparently someone talked me out of it.  The XLFE isn't great for toughness but I needed to do something to cram all the hardware on.

My favorite of the others is probably the 8K, which I had a lot of fun with in MegaMek a few times.  I don't regard MRMs as good or effective weapons but I find the bigger racks have an amusing missile spam factor.

Its certainly one of my favourites from RS 3145 NTNU. And honestly don't sweat it on the large lasers, they might be old but they aren't obsolete. Not until you start bolting clantech onto everything... at that point Clan ER Mediums do make em obsolete.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #27 on: 18 February 2018, 08:05:19 »
I enjoy it when a variant is designed that I really want to kitbash.  And have.   O0

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #28 on: 18 February 2018, 14:16:03 »
More like merely 5 tons too heavy.

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Re: MotW: QKD-** Quickdraw
« Reply #29 on: 18 February 2018, 15:41:38 »
If RLs are accepted as 3025 tech, a QKD-4H mod that replaces the rear SRM4 with six RL-10s would be pretty nice.

Prototype rockets are available during the succession wars. Though they have a slight penalty on the cluster hit table on top of the rocket launcher to hit penalty. So... slightly less attractive?
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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