Author Topic: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST  (Read 44894 times)

Sartris

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #690 on: 28 July 2017, 08:56:49 »
The following units are listed as 'Standard' tech. Looking at the record sheets, they should be classified as 'Introductory'

Darter Scout Car
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/836/darter-scout-car-standard
Korvin Tank KRV-3
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1817/korvin-tank-krv-3
Marsden MBT II
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2084/marsden-mbt-ii
Marsden MBT II-A
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2086/marsden-mbt-ii-a
Merkava Heavy Tank Mk VIII
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2176/merkava-heavy-tank-mk-viii
Sabaku Kaze Heavy Scout Hover Tank (Standard)
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2761/sabaku-kaze-heavy-scout-hover-tank-standard

The Cobra Transport VTOL (Original) has no rules level, but the record sheet classifies it as introtech
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3971/cobra-transport-vtol-original

The Darter Scout Car (SRM 2) lacks a BV (167) and a Rules Level (record sheet tags it as introtech)
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/4050/darter-scout-car-srm2

NCKestrel: corrected, thanks.  random trivia... The MUL started with 3075 units, back when it was first a spreadsheet and handed to me when I joined the MUL team.  And at the time, Introductory was limited to 'Mechs only (as only 'Mechs were in the Intro Box Set). Eventually Intro tech was broadened to include vehicles, but it looks like these 3075 vehicles never got caught up....

TigerShark

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #691 on: 01 August 2017, 17:28:25 »
After setting up a complete set of factories for our online campaign, I did notice that there was a notable lack of advanced tech in the RWA, despite the language of FR:2765:

Quote
Intelligence Command reports also show that, since the Twentieth Army left Republic space [2755], each of these divisions has been slowly cycling older BattleMechs out of its ranks, replacing them with models normally seen only from Hegemony sources.

This seems to indicate that, for 12 years, the Imperial Divisions were modernizing with SLDF equipment. Feels like some of the TRO:2750 designs would be listed in the "Rim Worlds Republic: Home Guard", such as those listed in 2765 on page 18 (Black Knight, Excalibur, Highlander, King Crab) and on page 19 (Atlas).

Surely, these advanced designs went with the Liberation Army to Terra, but for those 12 years, they were in the Republic proper. I'm sure it's come up before, but just asking if you guys can take a look. The list feels a bit "anemic" for a force capable of defeating the SLDF on its home ground. :)
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Sartris

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #692 on: 03 August 2017, 23:31:51 »
The Titan TI-1Aj and Titan TI-1Ar have intro dates of 3023, but Late Republic Era badges. The -1Aj contains a number of advanced technologies that do not exist at the time. The -1Ar. while using strictly Star League tech, is quite out of place in the 3020s as well.

Solution: Was the intro date for these supposed to be 3123?

---------------

The Victor VTR-9B (Li) from OTP: Death to Mercenaries is listed as Standard tech. I can't see any advanced tech on the sheet.
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3402/victor-vtr-9b-li

edit: Same with the Annihilator ANH-1E
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/36/annihilator-anh-1e

NCKestrel: Yep, both Titan's are supposed to be 3123.  That and the two intro tech units corrected. Thanks

Alexander Knight

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #693 on: 05 August 2017, 00:13:53 »
Hachiwara HCA-6P had incorrect Armor value (208 points of Hardened Armor is 14 AV, not 10).  Was missing CR from specials list (Hardened Armor), OV should have been 1, not 2.  (5 Medium Lasers + ER PPC w/Capacitor = 3.25 damage, adjusted by heat to 2.32), PV should have been 48.

Card adjusted.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #694 on: 14 August 2017, 22:57:56 »
Cauldron-Born X lacking long range damage value (The RAC is a Clan model, not Inner Sphere) and has CASE instead of CASEII special.  Both errors corrected.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #695 on: 16 August 2017, 21:39:05 »
Sunder SD1-OR had an incorrect LR damage value of 1.  Changed it to a 3 (The Large Pulse Lasers are Clantech)

Hayden.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #696 on: 04 September 2017, 13:57:01 »
Panther PNT-9ALAG (from CM: Kurita, Pg. 54)  does not come in up in searches.  There is an entry in the clan invasion section for House Kurita for a PNT-10LAG (which seems to be the unit described in FM: Kurita, pg. 94), but this does not appear in searches either. 

Also, no card is provided for the extant PNT-10LAG (I'm assuming that this and the PNT-9ALAG are the same machine?)

Also, I wonder about the 3054 entry date on the PNT-10LAG's MUL entry.  The description on Pg. 54 (last paragraph of main body text) of CM: Kurita suggests that the modifications for the PNT-9ALAG are such that it would be possible to field the design during the Late Succession Wars (Renaissance).

NCKestrel: Adding PNT-9ALAG.  PNT-10ALAG is a different unit, but there has never been a record sheet or any other details for it.  It's not showing in searches because it has no BV (due to no details to calculate BV from).
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:38:05 by nckestrel »
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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #697 on: 04 September 2017, 17:32:59 »
To my knowledge, none of the combat manual only entries have been added to the mul. Without a record sheet, it is unknown if the 10ALAG is based upon the 9R or the 10K.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #698 on: 04 September 2017, 18:10:10 »
I was wondering:  Would it be possible to add an option to download Alpha Strike cards as "one card per page", with the the circles able to be filled in while being read in the pdf?  I would like to not have to print out all these cards every time I want to play, and adding a few simple things to a pdf will make it easy to use on a small screen like a phone or tablet.

Here is an example of what I mean:  https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8kqPO6A6VFgR0FtclY0Mm5qdGs

The dots and heat scale can be manipulated in adobe reader for Linux, Windows, iOS, or Android but not the pdf viewer in the Google drive app.

It would also not be hard to program a pdf to recalculate the inches of movement based on the number of MP hits, the damage based on Weapons hits, or to alter the cost based on the base to hit target (skill level).  It might be better to put that on a legal size page instead of letter, since most screens are 16:9 instead of 4:3

NCKestrel: Thanks for the suggestion, but we do not have the resources at this time to make any new development on the MUL.
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:35:14 by nckestrel »
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TigerShark

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #699 on: 05 September 2017, 12:21:02 »
Screamer LAM has availability of Star League Regular, Royal, Terran Hegemony, and Unique. Should also have "Rim Worlds Republic - Terran Corps", since no other faction actually fielded one.
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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #700 on: 05 September 2017, 12:43:10 »
It also appears that several factions need to be updated for availability of Land-Air 'Mechs in the SL era.

Draconis Combine
Field Report: 2765 (DCMS), page 15
Quote
The First Rasalhague Regulars are the showpiece of the Rasalhague District. Based on the SLDF striker regiments, the First has light- to medium-weight BattleMechs, a dedicated aerospace fighter wing, and a company of Land-Air ’Mechs. It also contains a significant number of Star League-designed BattleMechs, produced both within the Combine or purchased from SLDF surplus. The First Rasalhague’s LAMs are thus one of the most advanced tools in the Combine’s arsenal, produced by LexaTech Industries on Irece.

Outworlds Alliance
Field Report: 2765 (Periphery), page 9
Quote
Positions in the WarShip training programs are the most highly sought after in the RSSCO, but the largest classes focus on aerospace fighter and small craft programs, which also includes training for the Alliance’s few Land-Air ’Mech pilots.

Rim Worlds Republic
Field Report: 2765 (Periphery), page 21
Quote
In addition to these assets, each division’s lighter weight ’Mech assets includes of a full battalion of Land-Air ’Mechs, spread out unevenly between each of the division’s nine regiments. These LAMs are used as highly effective scouts, to help direct larger Lancers formations towards their targets. Due to this tactical maneuverability, the Amaris Lancer brigades are often the first to be deployed against bandit forces on offensive missions.
...
The most common under-strength elements in the Lancers are their LAM formations. Intelligence Command shows evidence that the Republic is developing its own Land-Air ’Mech production lines somewhere within its territory, as the realm cannot presently secure enough of these flexible machines to keep up with the Lancers’ demand through Hegemony-source imports alone.


There are more in the other reports, but I don't have them in front of me ATM. :)
  W W W . M E K W A R S - D O M I N I O N . C O M

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Wraithcannon

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #701 on: 12 September 2017, 11:35:36 »
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2186/minotaur-standard

Errata had already been issued for the Record Sheet, but the Unit Card doesn't match the TRO entry (TRO3060 p.203)

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=4021.msg272449#msg272449

Per the ASC p.90-141
Weapon Values should be 2/2/0 [0.7x2 or 1.4/1.4/0 for 2 ERML]
PV should increase to 12 PV (a +3 increase from the change in damage)
...everything else looks good.

Is this a correct change that needs to be made?
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GoldBishop

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #702 on: 12 September 2017, 19:15:50 »
Is this a correct change that needs to be made?

Research into the Record Sheet confirmed the omission of the 2nd ERML on the Minotaur [Standard] that exists in TRO3060.

My calculation is unofficial, but it is based on the current methods.  Someone else with the proper authority is welcome to check against it and make the appropriate correction


**EDIT** I revisited my calculations...

Minotaur [Standard] with 2 ERML (per the TRO entry)
OFV = 6.5  (2+2+0+2 Damage + 0.5 Size)
DFV = 4.75
  DIR = 3.5 [(1 armor x 2 + 1 structure) x 1(1+ 1 TMM/10); Round to nearest half]
  MF = 1.25 (6 / 8 + 0.5 jump)
GFB = +0

Total PV = 11.25 ~ 11 (rounded down)

Proposed changes on the MUL:
Change PV to 11
Change Damage to 2/2/0
« Last Edit: 12 September 2017, 19:32:16 by GoldBishop »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #703 on: 14 September 2017, 09:54:43 »
The following entries are not in the MUL as of this posting.

  • Hosiryokou (DropShip) from Handbook: House Kurita (pages 191-192, 202) is still not included in the mul.
  • Gaajian System Patrol Boat (DropShip) - Handbook: House Kurita, PDF pp.192-193, 204 - it and it's Gaajian System Patrol Boat (3060) variant  Still not in the MUL
  • Dragonstar Passenger Transport (PT) from Handbook: House Kurita (pages 190-191, 201)- and it's Dragonstar Assault Transport (3060) variant are not listed as well. Both have BV2! (
« Last Edit: 14 September 2017, 15:37:52 by Wrangler »
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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #704 on: 17 September 2017, 07:14:13 »
Goblin Medium Tank (Standard) in  Civil War Era is available only for St. Ives Compact. Isn't it an error?

NCKestrel: yes, corrected, thanks.
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:34:20 by nckestrel »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #705 on: 20 September 2017, 10:38:03 »
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6631/zeus-x-zeu-x
The Zeus-X ZEU-X is given an introduction date of 3054, though it has reactive armor which has a prototype date of 3063(DC), production ~3083(DC) (IO, p. 35; this date is unchanged from TO, 282).

NCKestrel: short answer, it's a mess but correct.  longer answer: The ZEU-X is a very complicated case, since it was introduced to the universe in MaxTech Which had an in-universe date of 3059, so it couldn't have been 3063 or later. And it was the cover of MaxTech (ie. not exactly easy to ignore).  And until RS 3085? (and/or MWDA) or so, it had no other existence in canon. So making it not exist in 3055 would mean removing it from it's only existence in canon to that point. Officially, the ZEU-X existed in 3054. There are many Solaris designs that have equipment prior to the TO/IO prototype date.  The general directive has been that Solaris prototypes doesn't always count toward IO/TO prototype dates, as those dates are when the major militaries, ie, not Solaris only, use them.  Above my pay grade to do anything about. But there was a ZEU-X in 3054.
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:24:15 by nckestrel »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #706 on: 24 September 2017, 08:47:18 »
GRF-2N Griffin

MUL indicates this variant is in Record Sheets: Operation Klondike; there is actually no mention of the GRF-2N.

GoldBishop

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #707 on: 25 September 2017, 20:01:09 »
GRF-2N Griffin

MUL indicates this variant is in Record Sheets: Operation Klondike; there is actually no mention of the GRF-2N.

The -2N appears in my PDF copies:
Operation: Klondike page 159  (pdf page 161) right hand column between Sentinel and Shadow Hawk.
Record Sheets: Klondike page 37

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Thunder

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #708 on: 27 September 2017, 02:51:14 »
http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/4643/minotaur-p2

Alpha Strike damage is incorrect.

Short should be 2, Medium should be *

2 x iHeavy Small.  6 damage each.
SRM-4 with 8 ammo.   4.5 damage  (6 for SRM-4.  X .75 for less then 10 ammo)
Total is 16.5 at short and 4.5 at medium.

This will also reduce the PV by 2 making it 10.

NCKestrel: updated, thanks
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:10:40 by nckestrel »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #709 on: 27 September 2017, 16:58:38 »
The -2N appears in my PDF copies:
Operation: Klondike page 159  (pdf page 161) right hand column between Sentinel and Shadow Hawk.
Record Sheets: Klondike page 37

I've got the mention in the sourcebook, but, oddly, not the record sheet. Thanks for the exact page number: mine show's the HOP-4Bb. Fortunately, I bought that thru DriveThru, so I can check to see if there's an update available.

I appreciate the double-check, GoldBishop.

Edit: DriveThru shows it was last updated March 2010, so either CGL didn't decide to update DriveThru or they removed it the -2N. GoldBishop: would you please check p. 3 of the RS, under "Credits"? See if there is a version number I can report to DriveThru?
« Last Edit: 27 September 2017, 17:06:58 by Revanche »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #710 on: 27 September 2017, 22:09:46 »
I've got the mention in the sourcebook, but, oddly, not the record sheet. Thanks for the exact page number: mine show's the HOP-4Bb. Fortunately, I bought that thru DriveThru, so I can check to see if there's an update available.

...GoldBishop: would you please check p. 3 of the RS, under "Credits"? See if there is a version number I can report to DriveThru?

My copy of RS:OK appears to be the unmodified version (no update/revision number).
Under credits, I also have 2010, but no month.
Looking directly at the file, my copy was installed/downloaded in August 2016, but last modified in March [2016].

91 total pages, with the Griffin -2N in between the Sentinel STN-3Lb on page 36 and the Hoplite HOP-4Bb p.38

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #711 on: 28 September 2017, 09:53:18 »
My RS OK is showing the GRF-4N, not 2N.  However I have in my MUL email "The KLONDIKE GRF RS should be labelled GRF-2N, not -4N, it was a typo in that RS volume."  Historical Operation Klondike calls it the 2N.
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Revanche

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #712 on: 28 September 2017, 10:05:41 »
Looking directly at the file, my copy was installed/downloaded in August 2016, but last modified in March [2016].

91 total pages, with the Griffin -2N in between the Sentinel STN-3Lb on page 36 and the Hoplite HOP-4Bb p.38

My RS OK is showing the GRF-4N, not 2N.  However I have in my MUL email "The KLONDIKE GRF RS should be labelled GRF-2N, not -4N, it was a typo in that RS volume."  Historical Operation Klondike calls it the 2N.

Thank you, gentlemen. It looks like it was modified (GoldBishop) but possibly not submitted to DriveThru. I'll have to figure out how to make the note that nckestrel provided (so I don't lose it). I submitted the error to DriveThru, and their publisher relations team will be attempting to reach CGL.
« Last Edit: 28 September 2017, 10:36:20 by Revanche »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #713 on: 10 October 2017, 10:53:18 »
XTRO RetroTech tells us that the Star Dagger was an obsolete fighter from the Terran Hegemony brought back into production in the Jihad. Clearly the intro date of 3077 in the MUL needs to be updated, though to exactly when I'm not totally sure.
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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #714 on: 10 October 2017, 18:29:01 »
I’m not where I can check, but the 3077 is for the S-2, and the presumed S-1 was the origanal Terran model that we have listed as unknown intro date (and no model number).
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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #715 on: 12 October 2017, 07:51:36 »
The MUL lists both the FS9-K and FS9-A as extinct from the early SW yet TRO3039 states that -H was the main production model not the only production model and it further clarifies it by stating the -M version was done just before the factory was destroyed.

Given the -A and -K were produced and are simple weapon swaps I think the MUL should reflect that it would be available.

The -K model looks like the inspiration for the omni model that came out later on.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #716 on: 12 October 2017, 11:36:07 »
*bump*

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=47774.msg1325687#msg1325687

NCKestrel: minotaur has been updated, thanks
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:06:35 by nckestrel »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #717 on: 25 October 2017, 01:57:22 »
The MUL lists both the FS9-K and FS9-A as extinct from the early SW yet TRO3039 states that -H was the main production model not the only production model and it further clarifies it by stating the -M version was done just before the factory was destroyed.

Given the -A and -K were produced and are simple weapon swaps I think the MUL should reflect that it would be available.

The -K model looks like the inspiration for the omni model that came out later on.

I just read TRO Succession Wars and it stated the only model that ceased production was the -A variant. So the -K model should still have limited availability as the -H model was the dominant production model not sole.

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #718 on: 03 November 2017, 19:25:39 »
http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2065/marauder-iic-standard

The Marauder IIC is listed in the MUL as being worth 29,469,333 C-Bills.
As the MAD-IIC does not carry an XL engine, the cost should not be so overly inflated.

According to Record Sheets 3055-3058, the cost of the MAD-IIC Standard is supposed to be 9,913,534 C-Bills.

NCKestrel: cost updated, thanks
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:05:33 by nckestrel »

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #719 on: 11 November 2017, 15:47:39 »
I'd like to request that the Goblin Infantry Support Vehicle (Standard) (http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1222/goblin-infantry-support-vehicle-standard) be made available to the Free Worlds League beginning in the Clan Invasion period.  This is based entirely on the following lines from Field Manual: Free Worlds League:


Page 64.  20th Marik Militia's infantry component, 23rd Andurien Heavy Infantry, states:

Quote
The mechanized battalions use modern infantry vehicles like the Goblin, providing the unit with mobility and firepower.

Page 82.  Protectorate Steel Guard's infantry component, 67th Independent Infantry Brigade, states:

Quote
The 381st [regiment of the brigade] makes extensive use of Maxim and Goblin infantry fighting vehicles.

NCKestrel: Added FWL to Civil War and Jihad availabilities for Goblin IFV
« Last Edit: 14 November 2017, 15:04:39 by nckestrel »


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