Author Topic: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)  (Read 1265 times)

wantec

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‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« on: 11 July 2017, 16:26:44 »
Since it appears to have been lost, reposting Part 2


‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)



To begin we’re going to add the special rules for tripods to our Superheavy discussion. Waaaay back in the day, there were two types of ‘Mech, Bipeds and Quads. This goes all the way back to the first TRO, with quads like the Scorpion and Goliath. Quads have never been as popular as Bipeds, but they’ve always been around (in game terms). Quads sacrifice some crit space for more limb armor/structure and a few movement and piloting bonuses. Tripods combine the best of both worlds, adding armor/structure, adding crit-space, adding movement bonuses, and more, all at the cost of some extra structure weight.

Similar to QuadVees, Tripods use special cockpits to add an extra pilot (or two for Superheavies). On standard Tripods, you have a dedicated pilot and a dedicated gunner. This provides a -1 for all piloting skill checks (even physical attacks). Also, a Tripod can target up to 3 primary targets before adding a secondary target modifier. In Superheavy Tripods the third spot is a dedicated technical officer. This grants a +2 mod (benefit) to all rolls to avoid shutdown or ammo explosions and a +1 to all initiative rolls.

When on the move, a Tripod spends 1 MP to change facing to any direction instead of 1 MP per hex side. All Piloting Skill rolls to avoid falling or standing up get a -1 target benefit, in addition to the previously mentioned -1 for the dedicated pilot. Like a Quad, a Tripod can make lateral-shift moves and go hull-down for the same MP costs as a Quad.

In combat, like a QuadVee, a Tripod can torso-twist its whole torso 360° to any facing. If it has all its legs and no hip damage, a Tripod only suffers a +1 to-hit when firing while prone. It can still use any non-leg weapons as well. Only the dedicated pilot will suffer damage from ammo explosions, while all three take damage from head-hits. When falling all three make separate PSR rolls. If the pilot or gunner is killed or unconscious, one of the others can take over with some penalties and loss of benefits.





First up among the Tripod Superheavies, the Poseidon PSD-V2


MUL Image

MUL Link - http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6684/poseidon-psd-v2


Curtesy of CamoSpecs, painted by Psycho


Curtesy of Warrenborn.com

Poseidon Pimp Walk (PPW) – Curtesy of Sentinel373


And the PPW set to music


Behind the scenes, the Republic appears to have been working on designing their own Superheavies and perfecting the technology practically since the fall of Terra. These efforts took place at a small scale until the Blackout, when the Rhodes Project kicked into high gear. When forces under control of a portion of the Republic Senate rebelled, a pair of prototype PSD-X1 Poseidons joined the battle. As is often the case with prototypes, the surprise of a new design, and a new size, helped almost as much as the weapons. Unfortunately, we never see the stats or even a description of the differences between Poseidon versions. With the battle results in hand, changes were made that resulted in the final PSD-V2 Poseidon design.

The Poseidon was the first of the Republic’s regular production Superheavies. It’s the lightest of the canon Superheavies weighing in at a petite 125 tons. It’s also the first, and so far only, fast Superheavy. By that I mean it moves 3/5 speed. While 4/6 speed is theoretically possible, with all the weight saving tech needed, it’s probably better to build an Assault ‘Mech instead of a Superheavy. At least then it could add MASC, TSM, a supercharger, or jump jets to further increase its mobility. With basically two speeds available to Superheavies, you can go with fast and slow as descriptors. As a fast Superheavy, the Poseidon is able to keep up with your regular combat units, at least as well as an AS7-D Atlas, or non-jumping Dire Wolf. That can pay off big dividends, allowing it to take part in some assaults and generally not get left behind.

That fast speed was made possible in part by an XL engine and Endo Steel structure. Armor is the standard variety, 384 points coming in at 88.88% coverage, with a layout of:
12
36/40(12)/55/(21)/40(12)/36
40/40/40

After looking at 150 and 200 ton armored beasts, that seems like nothing, but it’s still more damage than most ‘Mechs can take. The weapons package seems to have learned well from the Omega and Orca, devoting part of the tonnage to defense. Each leg carries a pair of A-Pods and the artwork shows a laser and SRM 2 as well in each leg. Due to the construction rules there’s no way to match this to the record sheet, so a Clan ERSL and an IS SRM 2 were added to each torso location instead. This works fairly well, but I would have preferred the CT ones pointing to the rear for coverage there.

Each side torso adds an LRM 5 and a Clan ERML. The arms carry the main armament (a pattern we’ll see continue on the similar Ares). The right arm packs a TSEMP Cannon and an Apollo-enhanced MRM20 rack and a giant three-fingered fist. The left arm skips the fist for a pair of Clan ERPPCs. While 20 double heat sinks struggle to keep it all running cool. Each side torso is protected by CASE II, 24 shots of LRM and 12 of MRM in the right torso, 50 shots of SRM and 12 of MRM in the left torso.

With only a single ton each of LRM and SRM ammo you must choose wisely if you want to use specialty ammo. I personally would for the SRMs, loading up on infernos for battle armor and infantry. The LRMs I might keep as standard, using them as long-range crit-seekers. An alpha strike will generate 72 heat standing still, so you must choose carefully which weapons to use each turn.

I think the Poseidon is a good overall design. I particularly like the choice of a fast engine, I just wish it had a bit more heat sinks to handle all those weapons. The two ERPPCs alone take 75% of the available cooling a turn. The secondary battery I think is fine, it just gets hot when you need it. It’s probably not as bad as I’m thinking, just drop one ERPPC when you need more stuff. Perhaps someone with some game experience can help me out.

As the Poseidon was finishing its prototype stages, plans were already being made to upstage it with the next and last ‘Mech, the Ares.



Last among the canon Superheavies is the Ares OmniMech.


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MUL Link - http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/6685/ares-ars-v1-zeus


Curtesy of CamoSpecs, painted by Psycho


Curtesy of Warrenborn.com

For some, the Ares Superheavy Omni was their first introduction to ‘Mechs over 100 tons. This came via MechWarrior Dark Age and its 3-pack of Colossal ‘Mechs. At the time, nobody knew where they came from, only that they were bigger than existing assault ‘Mechs (a lot bigger), they were Tripods, and they had lots of special rules and abilities. This also puts them in a category of some of my favorite units, “weird MWDA stuff that CGL ported over to TW play”. The Poseidon falls in this category too, it used the same physical model, but the TRO-style stats it came with were different from the Colossal Tripod three-pack and it came later as a single ‘Mech pack (with some battle armor).

Although many of the stats were set by WizKids, at least for the Zues, Hera, and Hades configurations, I like how they translated over and added extra configurations. I believe they Ares were described in MWDA as separate ‘Mechs of the same chassis, not quite Omnis, but similar. I prefer it as an OmniMech and the additional configurations are nice. Similar to the Poseidon, the legs and torsos of the base chassis carry the same secondary weapons, LRM5s, SRM2s, A-Pods, Clan ER Lasers in the same configuration and locations. This gives a nice base to work from and provides a consistent set of self-defense weapons for all Republic Superheavy Tripod crews to work from.

The Ares differs from the Poseidon in a few ways beyond just being an OmniMech. It goes up in tonnage to 135 tons. The speed drops from fast to slow and the engine changes from an XL to a standard. All that survivability stuff I mentioned about the Poseidon, well it just jumped up with the engine change. Also, the internal structure was changed from Endo-Steel to Endo-Composite. Armor coverage was increased to 28.5 tons, 98.7% coverage in a solid pattern:
12
41/40(16)/60(22)/40(16)/41
56/56/56

All of these changes result in an OmniMech that has a more survivable engine, more armor tonnage and coverage, and 3 more tons for weapons and heat sinks. Each variant has its own focus, but I like the overall direction, even if it is a slow Superheavy. Similar to the Celestial OmniMechs, each variant has its own name, different than simply Prime, A, B, etc.

The Zeus, or Prime variant in many ways looks like a refined version of the Poseidon. The left arm returns the twin Clan ERPPCs, while the MRMs are traded for a trio of Clan Streak SRM6 racks. The missile trade off is a net positive in my mind, you trade concentration of damage and 3 hexes of max range for crit-seeking and Streak lock-on benefits. Heat sinks total at 21 doubles and the added targeting computer will benefit best at long range.

Next is the Hera or A configuration, sporting a big gun. An Improved Heavy Gauss Rifle is mounted in the arm (showcasing the ability of Superheavies to do that) with a whopping 24 rounds to fire and protected by CASE II in the arm. The left arm carries a trio of Clan ER Medum Pulse Lasers, helpful for any fast movers getting close. Total heat sinks are 18 doubles, which seems a bit overkill in most cases. I realize TPTB were trapped by how WizKids statted this version, but I just don’t like those lasers as backup to the big gun, it needs all the range it can get being so slow.

Last of the WizKids statted configurations is the Hades or B. The right arm of the Poseidon returns and the MRM rack has brought a friend for the other arm. Instead of a second TSEMP, a Clan UAC/10 is used, with 4 tons of ammo. Only 12 double heat sinks are carried, this time less than I’d like for these weapons.

The Aphrodite or C configuration is designed to control a C3 network. Featuring a pair of C3 Masters and an Angel ECM suite, this is the way to keep the core of your network active. The remaining weapons package is appropriately undersized, discouraging crews from getting into the thick of a battle. The left arm carries a trio of Clan Streak LRM5 racks, with more than enough ammo for any battle. The right arm sports a Clan RAC5 with 80 rounds of ammo and matching the range of the missiles. In my mind this is a great way to take advantage of the Ares slow speed, putting equipment on it you want to keep out of the thick of the fighting and giving it long range weapons to match.

The last configuration is the Hephaestus or D, coincidentally the same name as a Clan scout OmniTank 105 tons lighter than itself. While the OmniTank is a fast annoying bugger with a 4 ton cargo bay, this Superheavy Omni configuration is an annoying sniper who can also handle its namesake. Some of you might consider this configuration your favorite or the cheesiest of the bunch. The left arm carries a pair of Clan ER Large Lasers and a C3 Slave. The right arm has a Light PPC and a pair of Clan Large Pulse Lasers. The rest of the tonnage went into a total of 23 double heat sinks, enough for the 4 main guns at a run, and a Radical Heat Sink System for the times when you want to fire everything. Honestly, the Light PPC and Radical Heat Sink System seem like fillers, added to avoid putting more Clan energy weapons on it. Just imagine if instead a Plasma Cannon, 2 tons of ammo, and a Clan Medium Pulse Laser used to supplement the backup weapons instead. All I can say is be glad these weapons weren’t on a Poseidon or other fast Superheavy.







So there you have it, a pair of Colossal-sized ‘Mech of the Week articles for all the known Superheavy ‘Mechs. Comments? Questions? Pleas for mercy to get out from under this wall of text and pictures?
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #1 on: 12 July 2017, 21:09:00 »
This (again) was great article.  I still think that these later Superheavies were by far superior to the older ones.  The multi-crew thing with initiative bonus you can share to entire lance if it's commander is great.

A far as being practical machine, I'm not sure. I still see this is a big boss fight machine or objective.
I would have liked to see Aries configuration dedicated to artillery fire.

Movement saves with Tripod leg arrangement gives a small boost in movement which is helpful for the Ares to get around.  I'm curious though when Terra falls to whomever get it's, that the Superheavy Tripods like the Ares and Poseidon will continued to be made.
« Last Edit: 13 July 2017, 12:08:48 by Wrangler »
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #2 on: 13 July 2017, 08:01:18 »

Poseidon Pimp Walk (PPW) – Curtesy of Sentinel373



Until I saw this, I had no idea how the tripods could walk.

I think the only change I'd make to the Ares would be to swap the LRM & SRMs in the torso for MMLs, but that's just me.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #3 on: 13 July 2017, 15:23:36 »
I think the only change I'd make to the Ares would be to swap the LRM & SRMs in the torso for MMLs, but that's just me.

I think that if I was going to go ahead with building a mech that big and expensive, I'd go ahead with 100% Clantech weaponry unless I wanted a variant with an iHGR or Artillery Cannon.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #4 on: 14 July 2017, 07:38:53 »
Seems the details of my other post were lost.  The Tripods are very intriguing mechs.  Really the Poseidon is little better armed than a 100 tonner, with slightly more durability.  But its the soft stats that really make it pop.  The 1 hex direction change is very nice and the +1 to initiative is magnificent.  That alone acts as a potent force multiplier that can come very much in handy.  Otherwise, you can't really argue with twin ER PPCs, especially Clan ones :p  The dual LRM's i'd use to lay thunder or smoke and the other weapons are fine.

The Ares is this, just tougher and slower, very much an anvil for a Republic force.  To me, the Prime's undergunned, twin PPCs, a trio of streaks and a mixbag of mid to short range weapons and some LRM's that are best used as a defensive weapon, a Tommahawk II outguns it, considerably (then again the Tommy 2 tends to outgun anything that's not a Warship).  Its the same with the other variants, they are not overly spectacular, but its the soft stat bonuses that are very nice.  All in one very tough shell.

I like the tripods, they don't go over the top, they a certinally not game breaking god machines, but they are useful, quirky, but potent. 

And if during a battle one does not have this blaring out if its external speakers, I will be dissapointed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObomwH2ztTM&ytbChannel=fyzz08
or
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3GTl9Lrgd8&ytbChannel=Intrinsic%20Audio

Great write up as always :)
« Last Edit: 14 July 2017, 07:41:14 by marauder648 »
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #5 on: 14 July 2017, 10:09:19 »
I really think they did a wonderfully good job in balancing them with normal mech types.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #6 on: 14 July 2017, 10:41:48 »
I really think they did a wonderfully good job in balancing them with normal mech types.

150% agree there, they did a damn good job with that :)
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #7 on: 14 July 2017, 11:42:48 »
And if during a battle one does not have this blaring out if its external speakers, I will be disappointed.

Nice.

(And now I want to set up a battle where one would end up having to take on a wet navy coastal vessel. No reason. Honest!)
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #8 on: 14 July 2017, 16:38:24 »
Until I saw this, I had no idea how the tripods could walk.
Sigh, i see my comment got eaten by the forum crash.

Before, i noted that CGL's rules for Tripods interpret the central leg being forward, whereas all old art and renderings and even a MWDA animation portray the central leg being the rear leg. If the original intent had been used for rules, the Ares and Poseidon could be actually statted more accurately to the original Ares. Namely, the center torso weapons would point backwards and represent the leg-mounted weapons. IE you'd have a small laser, a SRM launcher and A-pod pointing rear, while the forward (side?) legs and side torsos would have same armament pointing forward. (I'm going to ignore the fact here whoever at Wizkids designed the 'Mech, didn't really think things through with that silly and largely wasteful armament and the 'Mechs would be better off without the weapons or at least A-pods in the first place.)

Only the Triskelion, CGL's own homegrown tripod uses the new rules for basis of its art, with central leg forward. Leading to incredibly awkward and somewhat silly appearance.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #9 on: 14 July 2017, 18:44:26 »
Sigh, i see my comment got eaten by the forum crash.

Before, i noted that CGL's rules for Tripods interpret the central leg being forward, whereas all old art and renderings and even a MWDA animation portray the central leg being the rear leg. If the original intent had been used for rules, the Ares and Poseidon could be actually statted more accurately to the original Ares. Namely, the center torso weapons would point backwards and represent the leg-mounted weapons. IE you'd have a small laser, a SRM launcher and A-pod pointing rear, while the forward (side?) legs and side torsos would have same armament pointing forward. (I'm going to ignore the fact here whoever at Wizkids designed the 'Mech, didn't really think things through with that silly and largely wasteful armament and the 'Mechs would be better off without the weapons or at least A-pods in the first place.)

Only the Triskelion, CGL's own homegrown tripod uses the new rules for basis of its art, with central leg forward. Leading to incredibly awkward and somewhat silly appearance.

With the ability to face any direction...basically the torso/legs connection is a 360° turret...could not a Tripod use either one leg forward or one leg backward configuration as it so chooses?

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #10 on: 14 July 2017, 19:23:59 »
With the ability to face any direction...basically the torso/legs connection is a 360° turret...could not a Tripod use either one leg forward or one leg backward configuration as it so chooses?
If we go purely by... realism, i'd say so.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #11 on: 15 July 2017, 04:40:23 »
If we go purely by... realism, i'd say so.

Same here, I'd say that the way we see the Ares/Poseidon depicted with the two legs front one at the back makes more sense than one forwards two back and when I saw the Triskelion I just assumed it was basically looking over its shoulder, and that in a moment it was just going to roll its hip and bring itself into its walking configuration.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #12 on: 17 July 2017, 14:05:07 »
As with others, I don't remember what (if anything) I'd had to say before.  But, my thoughts now (should be better, I suppose, since I've had several weeks to ponder the topic on and off).

blitzy and co mention that the mechs are well balanced with other mechs, and I do tend to agree. They're not insurmountably powerful, they have weaknesses, they bring things to the table as tripods that are a bit different and a bit special; the innitive thing can't be anything but a huge selling point, to the point that one could imagine taking a special artillery Ares and just keeping it way back just for the bonus, even if they never expected it to strike a blow.

But, what they lack (and I remarked on this when the mechs were new) is that aside from their tripod nature, they're not really that special.  When someone takes a superheavy mech, it should be special.  It should be an event.  It should be something that one just can't ignore.  The fluff says as much, that less than a battalion of Omegas threw a shock into a Terran invasion force tens of regiments strong.  The problem with the Poseidon and Ares is that they're just too balanced, in being only slightly stronger than a high end mixed tech assault mech.  Truthfully, innitive bonus aside, it's hard to imagine picking any of these over a high end full Clan tech assault mech.  For a mech that's got to hit penalties and all sorts of other things, and that's class has "super" in the name, to my mind they should be more, have capabilities that assaults just don't have.  The Orca and Omega come a lot closer to that, being heavier, but the Ares is really the standard bearer, and on the board it doesn't offer much that a very well designed Annihilator type mech wouldn't aside from the int bonus (yes, more armor, but one would have to do a lot of math to try and determine if that's a net positive or negative given TN penalties).

Now, that's not to say the mechs are bad.  Far from it.  A fair few of these I can imagine actually using.  But, I wouldn't tend to use them as ultimate boss mechs like an Orca (especially if it actually had artillery as initially envisioned) but rather just as another sort of assault unit in a regular (if very high end) company or battalion that needs an assault anchor and/or command unit.  It's a complement to the designers getting balance right, but I think it let's down the super heavy side a bit.

I'd still like to see a true superheavy monster, with six or seven Clan ER PPCs or 400 LRMs or 100 tons of hardened armor (or 50 tons of LF armor and some outlandish gun package).  I'd like one like the Orca, but even more streamlined and optimized and just so game breaking that you could only use it in very special and very narrowly defined scenarios.  Now, granted, any of us could probably whip one up given half and hour with the rules and a pad of paper (I'll get around to it one day; I'm thinking ER LRMs to counter the speed thing) but it wouldn't be the end of the world to see a Leviathan II of mechs, something that just takes the rules and really shows when you can do when you put your mind to it, even if it comes close to invalidating every other unit.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #13 on: 17 July 2017, 14:47:14 »
I'm with you on that, Iron Mongoose.  Given that Superheavies aren't and hopefully never will be tournament legal, I do wish that TPTB would go hog wild with a design and give us a true monstrosity that actually makes people consider ortillery or saturation Davy Crockett strikes to be legitimate, non-overkill methods of dealing with it.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #14 on: 17 July 2017, 15:53:41 »
Well, I made a 200-ton "Hellstarerer" - 8 cERPPCs and 61 DHS...

But a mixed-tech 200-ton tripod monster with FL armor, twin ArrowIV, multiple ATM3s, TC'd GRs, ERPPC, ERLLs and LPLs (all clantech), and cutting-edge EW would be nice to see.

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #15 on: 17 July 2017, 16:22:14 »
I'd like to see one that's a purpose-built command mech.  Maybe a couple of C3 masters (if you're into that sort of thing), but definitely a lot of "keep the CO alive" gear: AECM, AMS, Bloodhound Probe, hardened armor, really long range guns (ERLRMs, small-caliber ACs, and LGRs maybe, but an actual artillery piece or two isn't out of the question).  If we're only going to have a few and they aren't going to be very mobile, why not put the CO in one?  That way we can keep him back behind the main line, with a command Lance (or more) to protect him from anyone who gets under the range of his weapons officer's guns.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #16 on: 17 July 2017, 19:27:14 »
I dunno, as a CO Mech, I'd say that would be a bad idea.

It's a big, slow, dangerous, heavily armored and armed target, with little mobility-while it makes some sense to put a leader in one, it makes more to put him in the mech behind the big guy.

I'd say it makes a better component to a bodyguard lance while the Commander drives a purpose-built command+generalist design.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #17 on: 18 July 2017, 02:27:29 »
One of the variants of the Ares is in essence a command Mech, the one with the RAC-5 as thats got 2 x C3s onboard.  I suppose you could alter that version.  Also don't forget that the Republic built a BA to go with the Ares. The Aegis variant here
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Angerona#Weapons_and_Equipment

I would imagine that an Ares C would have like 2 squads of those running along with it or one on foot the other carried. 

Also i'd like to see a workable version of the Orca, I just love that things looks.  Whilst, like the Ares its in essence a defensive unit, its a damn good one .  Plant it near something you want to keep and then go "Come at me bro!" whilst the Ares is more flexible and considerably less heavily armed, I would guess things like its lighter weight and smaller size make it easier to transport or manufacture and there's less stresses on the hull requiring less maintenance etc.
« Last Edit: 18 July 2017, 02:40:06 by marauder648 »
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #18 on: 18 July 2017, 06:01:15 »
Honestly a bit sad to know it might come to an end, as those are some rather flavourful machines in a promising faction.
They sure have potential, and the tripods are just better than quads in most ways - probably their saving grace as superheavies are just not really balanced for normal play, far as I could gather in the first part and here before the crash.
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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #19 on: 18 July 2017, 07:36:52 »
As with others, I don't remember what (if anything) I'd had to say before.  But, my thoughts now (should be better, I suppose, since I've had several weeks to ponder the topic on and off).

blitzy and co mention that the mechs are well balanced with other mechs, and I do tend to agree. They're not insurmountably powerful, they have weaknesses, they bring things to the table as tripods that are a bit different and a bit special; the innitive thing can't be anything but a huge selling point, to the point that one could imagine taking a special artillery Ares and just keeping it way back just for the bonus, even if they never expected it to strike a blow.

But, what they lack (and I remarked on this when the mechs were new) is that aside from their tripod nature, they're not really that special.  When someone takes a superheavy mech, it should be special.  It should be an event.  It should be something that one just can't ignore.  The fluff says as much, that less than a battalion of Omegas threw a shock into a Terran invasion force tens of regiments strong.  The problem with the Poseidon and Ares is that they're just too balanced, in being only slightly stronger than a high end mixed tech assault mech.  Truthfully, innitive bonus aside, it's hard to imagine picking any of these over a high end full Clan tech assault mech.  For a mech that's got to hit penalties and all sorts of other things, and that's class has "super" in the name, to my mind they should be more, have capabilities that assaults just don't have.  The Orca and Omega come a lot closer to that, being heavier, but the Ares is really the standard bearer, and on the board it doesn't offer much that a very well designed Annihilator type mech wouldn't aside from the int bonus (yes, more armor, but one would have to do a lot of math to try and determine if that's a net positive or negative given TN penalties).

Now, that's not to say the mechs are bad.  Far from it.  A fair few of these I can imagine actually using.  But, I wouldn't tend to use them as ultimate boss mechs like an Orca (especially if it actually had artillery as initially envisioned) but rather just as another sort of assault unit in a regular (if very high end) company or battalion that needs an assault anchor and/or command unit.  It's a complement to the designers getting balance right, but I think it let's down the super heavy side a bit.
With the Poseidon and Ares, they definitely seem to be designed as more well-rounded than all out assault. Like they were designed to minimize the weaknesses of the Superheavy type. It would be nice to see more combat-heavy versions, although the Ares Hephaestus starts going in that direction.

I'd still like to see a true superheavy monster, with six or seven Clan ER PPCs or 400 LRMs or 100 tons of hardened armor (or 50 tons of LF armor and some outlandish gun package).  I'd like one like the Orca, but even more streamlined and optimized and just so game breaking that you could only use it in very special and very narrowly defined scenarios.  Now, granted, any of us could probably whip one up given half and hour with the rules and a pad of paper (I'll get around to it one day; I'm thinking ER LRMs to counter the speed thing) but it wouldn't be the end of the world to see a Leviathan II of mechs, something that just takes the rules and really shows when you can do when you put your mind to it, even if it comes close to invalidating every other unit.
Speaking of such things, I've been doing a bit of that myself. There's lots of ways to combine the armor, structure, and engine type to produce interesting combos, but it gets a little frustrating that you're basically stuck at two speeds, 2/3 or 3/5. Sure you can reach 4/6 on some lower end designs, but it's not great.

Honestly a bit sad to know it might come to an end, as those are some rather flavourful machines in a promising faction.
They sure have potential, and the tripods are just better than quads in most ways - probably their saving grace as superheavies are just not really balanced for normal play, far as I could gather in the first part and here before the crash.
I'd say like many non-'Mech unit types, Superheavies are a little "overbalanced". By that I mean they have a few too many deficiencies in order to make 20-100 ton 'Mechs the obvious choice. Are there ways to build competitive Superheavies? Absolutely, but as TPTB have stated many times, flawed and interesting is preferred over perfected and boring.
BEN ROME YOU MAGNIFICENT BASTARD, I READ YOUR BOOK!


UnLimiTeD

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #20 on: 18 July 2017, 08:50:25 »
Well, as far as I could tell, their shortcomings aren't really reflected in the BV, while most "interesting" designs of more common proportions more or less pay for their capabilities.
Savannah Masters are the Pringles of Battletech.
Ooo! OOOOOOO! That was a bad one!...and I liked it.

The_Livewire

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Re: ‘Mech of the Week: Superheavy ‘Mechs (Part 2)
« Reply #21 on: 25 July 2017, 16:05:22 »
These articles have been good read of a unit I've never really looked at, and the disco video alone made my day.  O0
Alamo - When you care enough to send the very best.

And Purifiers *still* suck.

 

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