Author Topic: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!  (Read 251497 times)

JadeHellbringer

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1230 on: 15 January 2018, 12:46:58 »
I never noticed the boat landing 'deck' at the waterline on the stern before. Random note.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1231 on: 15 January 2018, 14:28:19 »
I'm assuming the aft flagpole would be taken down during actual flight operations.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1232 on: 15 January 2018, 14:41:47 »
That's obviously the first arresting wire ;)

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1233 on: 15 January 2018, 16:28:13 »
I'm assuming the aft flagpole would be taken down during actual flight operations.
Underway, the flag only flies from the mast.

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1234 on: 15 January 2018, 19:08:37 »
That's obviously the first arresting wire ;)

Oh, right. I keep forgetting that F-35Bs are single-use only.
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I am Belch II

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1235 on: 15 January 2018, 21:06:06 »
The two tower bridge on the QE looks so weird. I'm glad the Ford didn't try that approach.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1236 on: 15 January 2018, 21:17:58 »
The two tower bridge on the QE looks so weird. I'm glad the Ford didn't try that approach.
I'm sure the crew will tell the tale of two towers once the ship gone on deployment.

I'm not sure how well F-35B will.  I wish they had gone to catapult, but i think costs were factor.  I think they would had been better off with more selection of fixed wing aircraft at their disposal.
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Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1237 on: 15 January 2018, 21:38:02 »
The Two Towers also allow for a little redundancy, so there is that.

I'm not sure how well F-35B will.  I wish they had gone to catapult, but i think costs were factor.  I think they would had been better off with more selection of fixed wing aircraft at their disposal.
The UK practically wrote the book on STOVL ops, remember? They should be fine.

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The issue with going F-35C is that there are actually going to be less C variants than B, and the UK would forego the tactical option of cross-decking Marine -35Bs and vice versa.

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1238 on: 16 January 2018, 01:42:20 »
I'm assuming the aft flagpole would be taken down during actual flight operations.

Both the Jack staff and Ensign staff will be struck prior to sailing, and only erected again prior to entry or coming to anchor/buoy.

As Daryk notes, the ensign only flies from the main mast while underway, and due to naval tradition, you may not fly two ensigns at once, so need to coordinate the lowering of one with the breaking of the other. :-)

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1239 on: 16 January 2018, 02:38:21 »
I'm sure the crew will tell the tale of two towers once the ship gone on deployment.

I'm not sure how well F-35B will.  I wish they had gone to catapult, but i think costs were factor.  I think they would had been better off with more selection of fixed wing aircraft at their disposal.


I'm told the issues with CATOBAR wasn't so much the cost of alterations to the carriers or changing the F-35 order but the cost of training and maintaining carrier capable pilots and the infrastructure to support that


I think the aim is to not normally deploy with too many F-35s aboard the QE but have an ability to surge as needed but for them to spend most of their time at RAF Marham
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1240 on: 16 January 2018, 09:12:18 »

I'm told the issues with CATOBAR wasn't so much the cost of alterations to the carriers or changing the F-35 order but the cost of training and maintaining carrier capable pilots and the infrastructure to support that


I think the aim is to not normally deploy with too many F-35s aboard the QE but have an ability to surge as needed but for them to spend most of their time at RAF Marham

From what I under stand they can normally hold 40 aircraft but can surge up to 60 in a wartime need.
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DoctorMonkey

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1241 on: 16 January 2018, 09:19:12 »
From what I under stand they can normally hold 40 aircraft but can surge up to 60 in a wartime need.


Something like that
I think there may be some variation depending on how big a deck park they use and so quite what is being carried
I think I heard the normal deployment will be with only about 12 F-35Bs aboard though
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1242 on: 16 January 2018, 09:27:49 »
First deployment (Gulf) expected to be 12 UK F-35Bs and 12 USMC F-35Bs, plus AEW and ASW helicopter package which ought to be another 8-10 helis

Standard air complement is 24 F-35Bs and 8-10 helis for carrier strike, 12 F-35Bs and 20-30 helis for LPH ops

However overload conditions of 48 jets and more are possible, though at the expense of sortie generation and embarked troops... 1 reason how she can stuff in that many aircraft is that part of the hangar is set up as accommodation for troops in LPH mode.

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1243 on: 16 January 2018, 10:09:25 »
So she's semi-Omni, with the Primary config being more of an LPH, and the A config being a full-on CV?

Makes sense given the Royal Navy's need to do more with much less, though the main downsides I can see are reaction time(how long does it take to 'swap out pods'?) and a lack of hull redundancy(a ship in drydock costs you the use of a CV and LPH at the same time). The RN's not being given a choice in this matter though, so I guess the modularity is a smart choice.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1244 on: 16 January 2018, 10:26:48 »
Is QE II's really using actual modules like the US LCS shjps or Danish's StanFlex modules they use?
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1245 on: 16 January 2018, 10:28:43 »
Is QE II's really using actual modules like the US LCS shjps or Danish's StanFlex modules they use?



I haven't heard anything about that
I thought it was just bunks for Marine Commandos to be stored in as apparently they have a longer shelf life if stored horizontally rather than vertically
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1246 on: 16 January 2018, 10:34:37 »

I haven't heard anything about that
I thought it was just bunks for Marine Commandos to be stored in as apparently they have a longer shelf life if stored horizontally rather than vertically

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1247 on: 16 January 2018, 10:49:44 »
"THIS END UP. DO NOT BEND."


Correct, if you want a bent one, you need to look in the 3 PARA mortar platoon apparently
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1248 on: 16 January 2018, 11:04:44 »
I haven't heard anything about that
I thought it was just bunks for Marine Commandos to be stored in as apparently they have a longer shelf life if stored horizontally rather than vertically
I hear they're working on how to quad-pack 4 Gurkhas into the space taken up by 1 Royal Marine... but it'll only work if the MoD shell out for strike-length bunks...

And I'm out ;D
Is QE II's really using actual modules like the US LCS shjps or Danish's StanFlex modules they use?
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1249 on: 16 January 2018, 11:24:28 »
I hear they're working on how to quad-pack 4 Gurkhas into the space taken up by 1 Royal Marine... but it'll only work if the MoD shell out for strike-length bunks...

And I'm out ;DTis a joke mate :D


The problem is that Gurkhas are at risk of being classified as a Weapon of Mass Destruction (very high TB rates) and if we aren't careful about how we pack them they can fall under the cluster bomb ban
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Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1250 on: 16 January 2018, 11:37:49 »

The problem is that Gurkhas are at risk of being classified as a Weapon of Mass Destruction (very high TB rates) and if we aren't careful about how we pack them they can fall under the cluster bomb ban
Don't you know that's the new nuclear deterrence program? The Vanguard SSBNs will be replaced by a fleet of minisubs packed to the gills with angry Gurkhas - the Dementor-class SSG(urkha)Ns :D

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1251 on: 16 January 2018, 12:35:57 »

I'm told the issues with CATOBAR wasn't so much the cost of alterations to the carriers or changing the F-35 order but the cost of training and maintaining carrier capable pilots and the infrastructure to support that


I think the aim is to not normally deploy with too many F-35s aboard the QE but have an ability to surge as needed but for them to spend most of their time at RAF Marham
Lots of reasons given. The one I heard was that with turbine power they couldn't use steam catapults, and when the design was being finalized the EMALS was still in development hell. So they decided to just skip catapults all together (unfortunately, IMHO).

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1252 on: 18 January 2018, 07:38:36 »
The Italian Battleship Caio Duilio, among the last of the capital ship fleet to survive world war II.

She gone through changes during her career which ended in the 1950s as training ship before she was retired.
Earlier picture of the ship where she still retained her central turret and had less anti-aircraft weaponry.



After her refit with better weapons and equipment.

Huge differences in her appearance. I do wonder if how effect she was after refit if she had been deployed with allies, say in the Korean war for example.

EDIT: Sorry, there something wrong with the picture. It won't be enlarged if placed with my post.
« Last Edit: 18 January 2018, 07:42:07 by Wrangler »
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1253 on: 18 January 2018, 08:24:41 »
Interesting note to these ships, the Italians were the only fleet in the interwar refit period to make major main battery modifications. While other fleets' ships saw radical modifications in terms of fire control, AA protection, aircraft carriage, etc. (and enormous changes physically, at a glance), the core elements of the ships usually went unchanged. Ships might upgrade from coal to oil (like the British 'R'-class ships), gain some speed from changes, etc., but the armor and main weaponry tended to remain the same. Putting images from WWI vs. the beginning of WWII next to each other of the Warspite, the Arizona, the Fuso, etc. show very different looking ships at a glance, but if you look at their core elements everything is unchanged- it's funnels, secondary weapons, fire control, etc. that changed.

Italy though? Yeah, no. Removing midships turrets was always a good idea for a number of reasons (no magazine in the midst of your engine areas anymore, no big hole in the middle of the ship to compromise structural integrity, etc.), but it also means a significant loss in raw broadside strength. Boring out the remaining guns a little and drastically increasing their elevation helped mitigate that problem. Was it worth it? Hard to say since they didn't really see a ton of frontline battleship-style action to test them, but certainly 'A' for effort.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1254 on: 18 January 2018, 12:51:26 »
The Italian rebuilds were expensive but it did give them some very useful and capable ships, but they didn't get the chance to prove themselves.  Whilst their guns, speed and AA were all improved, they still only had a 9-inch thick main belt and if the Italians had gotten into a proper slugging match with the RN, then it wouldn't offer much protection against a 15-inch shell.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1255 on: 27 January 2018, 23:25:55 »


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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1256 on: 28 January 2018, 00:37:45 »
I really wish Australia had reinforced their LHA's with F-35B capable flight deck. It must be too costly to do it.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1257 on: 28 January 2018, 02:21:29 »
It's the F35B that's too costly. RAN couldn't afford them when a squadron of six planes is going to cost about US$750+ million.
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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1258 on: 28 January 2018, 08:32:11 »
Behold.


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Re: Naval Pictures Forecastle: Laying siege to the poop deck!
« Reply #1259 on: 28 January 2018, 09:07:48 »
It's the F35B that's too costly. RAN couldn't afford them when a squadron of six planes is going to cost about US$750+ million.
I'm surprised a company hasn't come up with low-cost version of the F35 that's akin to the Harrier.
The soviets did, with their Yakovlev YAK-38


The Soviet's the Yak-141 Freestyle which ironically was where the F-35 came from.  #P
« Last Edit: 28 January 2018, 09:11:46 by Wrangler »
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