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Author Topic: F-902 Stingray  (Read 434 times)

Goose

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F-902 Stingray
« on: 04 May 2022, 18:26:16 »
Code: [Select]
                    AeroTech 2 Vessel Technical Readout
                               * CUSTOM WEAPON

Class/Model/Name:  Stingray F-902
Tech:              Inner Sphere / 3062
Vessel Type:       Aerospace Fighter
Rules:             Level 3, Standard design
Rules Set:         AeroTech2

Mass:              60 tons
Power Plant:       300 Light Fusion
Safe Thrust:       7
Maximum Thrust:    11
Armor Type:        *Laser Reflective*
Armament:         
    1 Snub-Nose PPC*
    2 Large Pulse Laser
    2 ER Medium Laser
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
==Capabilities:==
Hard to Pilot -2

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Class/Model/Name:  Stingray F-902
Mass:              60 tons
Construction Options:  Fractional Accounting

Equipment:                                                              Mass
Power Plant:  300 Light Fusion                                          14.25
Thrust:  Safe Thrust: 7  (6 at max bomb load)
      Maximum Thrust: 11  (9 at max bomb load)
Structural Integrity: 7                                                   .00
Total Heat Sinks:    17 Double                                           7.00
Fuel:                                                                    4.00
Cockpit & Attitude Thrusters:                                            3.00
Armor Type:  *Laser Reflective*  (156 total armor pts)                   9.75
                           Standard Scale Armor Pts
   Location:                            L / R
   Nose:                                 62
   Left/Right Wings:                  31/31
   Aft:                                  32

Weapons and Equipment      Loc        SRV    MRV    LRV    ERV  Heat    Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Snub-Nose PPC*           Nose        10     10     --     --   10      6.00
1 Large Pulse Laser        RW           9      9     --     --   10      7.00
1 Large Pulse Laser        LW           9      9     --     --   10      7.00
1 ER Medium Laser          RW           5      5     --     --    5      1.00
1 ER Medium Laser          LW           5      5     --     --    5      1.00
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                                                    Heat: 40     60.00
Tons Left:                                                                .00

External Stores Load:
   5 Fuels                          (5 tons)
   Total Stores Load               5 tons total
   Note: Safe Thrust is reduced from 7 to 6 at max bomb load.

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost:        6,961,170 C-Bills
Battle Value:      1,315
Cost per BV:       5,293.67
Weapon Value:      1,620 (Ratio = 1.23)
Damage Factors:    SRV = 31;  MRV = 26;  LRV = 0;  ERV = 0
BattleForce2:      MP: 7,  Armor/Structure: 4 / 0
                   Damage PB/M/L: 4/4/-,  Overheat: 0
                   Class: FM;  Point Value: 13

Yea, that one MRV is wrong, but I got'a get this bird out'a my system.

… Would it be over the line to give this bird a V-tail, too?
Goose
The Ancient Egyptian God of Frustration

Daryk

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #1 on: 04 May 2022, 19:45:43 »
A heavy bird that takes Threshold critical hits from Medium Lasers?  ???

Goose

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #2 on: 04 May 2022, 20:34:32 »
At 60 tons, it's a medium, and medium pulses don't threshold anywhere. :thumbsup:
Goose
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pokefan548

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #3 on: 05 May 2022, 01:39:13 »
At 60 tons, it's a medium, and medium pulses don't threshold anywhere. :thumbsup:
Your wings and aft will still get thresholded by (R,U,L)AC/5s, LRMs, ATMs, flak, any non-UAC cluster weapon from aerospace, and countless other non-DE sources of 5 damage or more (as well as DE sources dealing 9 damage or more). Laser-Reflective is very nice in the laser-heavy realm of aerospace fighters, but relying too much on it can be a lethal mistake. Besides, once your opponent knows how much you depend on it, expect Long Tom Cannon fighters to start showing up; a single hit to your wings or aft will instantly ablate all the armor in those locations and start going structural, and even your nose can't take that sort of abuse more than once.

Also, you will be at 4 thrust if you bring your max bomb load (max of 12 bombs, 12 / 5 round up is 3, 7 safe thrust - 3 = 4 fully-laden safe thrust).

What do you mean by custom weapon? I don't see any quirks associated, and Snub-Nose PPCs already have their own established rules in canon, as I'm sure you know.

The weapons loadout is impressive, but if you don't mind my saying, this kind of looks like a classic case of trying to do everything badly. Okay, that's a little unfair, it'll do a lot of things well enough, especially against less maneuverable opponents trying to do the ol' reliable large laser spam Succession Wars approach. However, I feel like basically any other approach to aerospace force building will quickly highlight the weaknesses of this fighter. I also tend to be inherently skeptical of 7/11 fast dogfighters; that extra safe thrust comes in handy sometimes, but that's a lot of tonnage spent on a pretty situational advantage. Maybe that's just me though.

Anyways, tl;dr, it's a good shakeup option if you're playing with someone who's gotten stuck in the Succession Wars dogfighter meta, the cult of the large laser, but I feel that outside of that context many elements of the fighter become lackluster, and the whole thing ends up being worse than the sum of its BV.

(The moral of the story is the Dracs had it right all along and AC/10s and LRMs are actually really solid in aerospace regardless of era if you can build around them well.)
« Last Edit: 05 May 2022, 01:42:22 by pokefan548 »
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Atarlost

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #4 on: 05 May 2022, 13:09:53 »
As to the proffered fighter, I'm not liking the heat management.  Everything is medium range so there's no bracketing.  It's too hot to alpha strike at +6 but oversinked for firing the nose and one wing. 

I'm also not keen on an energy boat with reflective armor.  Because if you can build a fighter with reflective armor you know about reflective armor and should put some thought into countering it. 

Others have already said what I'd say about the armor levels other than that by the time reflective armor has spread most potential adversaries have at least one omnifighter and there's nothing stopping them from loading it up with missiles and autocannons if you overcommit to reflective armor. 

(The moral of the story is the Dracs had it right all along and AC/10s and LRMs are actually really solid in aerospace regardless of era if you can build around them well.)

All eras is a bit of a stretch.  AC-10s are pretty severely overshadowed by PPCs in the DHS era until reflective armor starts to show up. 

pokefan548

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #5 on: 05 May 2022, 13:29:24 »
All eras is a bit of a stretch.  AC-10s are pretty severely overshadowed by PPCs in the DHS era until reflective armor starts to show up.
Overshadowed, yes, but still reliable.
I'd say LB-10X would eventually render AC/10s irrelevant if LB-X ACs weren't currently gimped by the rules.
Warheads on foreheads.

#FreeMauser
"Poke is just a figment of our imagination really." - Siam
"Poke isn't a real person, he's just an algorithm programmed by CGL to try and get people to try the aerospace rules." - Phantasm
"I want to plant the meat eating trees and the meat growing trees on the same planet! Watch that plant on plant violence!" - Sawtooth

Atarlost

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Re: F-902 Stingray
« Reply #6 on: 06 May 2022, 00:17:22 »
Overshadowed, yes, but still reliable.
I'd say LB-10X would eventually render AC/10s irrelevant if LB-X ACs weren't currently gimped by the rules.

I would call reliability necessary but not sufficient to be a solid weapon.  Efficiency enters into my definition, especially when looking at multiple guns filling essentially the same role. 

I don't want to bog this down with math, but unless I've figured things wrong the efficiency gap between the PPC and minimum ammo AC-10 in the DHS era is bigger than the gap between the minimum ammo AC-10 and AC-5 in the SHS era.  In the SHS era all the medium range >5 cluster size options are pretty tightly grouped.  In the DHS era the LL and PPC remain tightly grouped, but the AC-10 isn't.