Register Register

Author Topic: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier  (Read 1905 times)

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« on: 22 August 2021, 14:08:47 »
i managed to fit a mech bay into a small craft.

Quote
MekPod small craft Base Tech Level: Standard (Clan)
Tech Rating: D/X-X-X-D 
Weight: 200 tons
BV: 116
Cost: 5,267,100 C-bills 
Movement: 2/3
Heat Sinks: 6 [12]
Fuel Points: 400 (5.0 tons)
Structural Integrity: 3
Armor: 44
Carrying Capacity: Mech (1 door) - 1 unit   
Crew: 5 in steerage berths

CVB

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 1376
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #1 on: 22 August 2021, 15:55:59 »
Hmmm, assuming a spheroid I get 210t (Aerodyne: 217.5t):

Code: [Select]
  1.5 SI (3)
 24.5 Engine
  1.5 Control Systems
  5.5 Fuel/Pumps
  2.0 Armor: 44 (Standard Aerospace)
150.0 Mech Bay
 25.0 Crew quarters: (5 Steerage)

And at 2/3 thrust it won't be able to leave a standard planet...
"Wars result when one side either misjudges its chances or wishes to commit suicide; and not even Masada began as a suicide attempt. In general, both warring parties expect to win. In the event, they are wrong more than half the time."
- David Drake

I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, but I'm not willing to hang it by the neck until it's dead, dead, dead!

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #2 on: 22 August 2021, 16:05:24 »
That's the problem.  The SBF rules let you get out of the atmosphere with 3 thrust but TW requires 4, meaning you actually need a 3/5 engine to do it.

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #3 on: 22 August 2021, 19:36:27 »
getting off the planet is less of a concern than putting the mech and its service facilities on the ground but yeah, the anemic thrust is a problem.

i feel like it might be better to just go with a 100t cargo bay and develop a light mobile field base that can hitch a ride with the lighter mechs.

CVB

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 1376
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #4 on: 22 August 2021, 19:46:35 »
And to reiterate, even at 2/3 thrust, it's already ten tons overweight...
"Wars result when one side either misjudges its chances or wishes to commit suicide; and not even Masada began as a suicide attempt. In general, both warring parties expect to win. In the event, they are wrong more than half the time."
- David Drake

I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, but I'm not willing to hang it by the neck until it's dead, dead, dead!

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #5 on: 22 August 2021, 20:29:05 »
If you're not planning on leaving the atmosphere, a 1/2 thrust profile would give you enough tonnage to fit a cubicle, and being able to fly sub-orbital is still faster than just about anything else.

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #6 on: 22 August 2021, 20:31:57 »
And to reiterate, even at 2/3 thrust, it's already ten tons overweight...

switch to clan tech, where the engine is about 1.5t lighter, put the crew in steerage berths, and that 10 tons is frees up.

after looking at your thing i see you have five crewmen. small craft only need 3 as per the tech manual.

switch to a clanner engine and take off those two superfluous crew berths and you no longer have that over mass issue.
« Last Edit: 22 August 2021, 20:53:34 by Emcha »

Giovanni Blasini

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 5861
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #7 on: 22 August 2021, 21:41:01 »
Why five crew?  Seems a bit high for a small craft with no weapons.
"“Eternity is a long time, especially towards the end.” -- Stephen Hawking

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #8 on: 22 August 2021, 21:53:16 »
Good point... minimum crew for Small Craft is 3 IIRC.

CVB

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 1376
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #9 on: 23 August 2021, 06:47:41 »
I commented on the original design:
Crew: 5 in steerage berths

It works when you go with three crew members.
"Wars result when one side either misjudges its chances or wishes to commit suicide; and not even Masada began as a suicide attempt. In general, both warring parties expect to win. In the event, they are wrong more than half the time."
- David Drake

I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, but I'm not willing to hang it by the neck until it's dead, dead, dead!

AlphaMirage

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2105
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #10 on: 23 August 2021, 09:39:44 »
I believe the extra crew are included because the mech bay brings 2. 3 SC crew + mech team

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #11 on: 23 August 2021, 11:35:20 »
The 'mech bay personnel are allowed to use the bay quarters that come with the bay.  No need to install Steerage for them.

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #12 on: 23 August 2021, 14:13:45 »
I believe the extra crew are included because the mech bay brings 2. 3 SC crew + mech team

what Daryk said; transport bays include berthing and life support for all personnel associated with the unit in question, which makes me wonder why mech bays only have 2 crew when a mech needs about six; the mechwarrior, the tech, and the Atech team of 4-5. unless that's just implied and those 2 crewmen are just there to support the extra machinery.

Giovanni Blasini

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 5861
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #13 on: 23 August 2021, 14:21:23 »
I'm able to just make it work, though you're limited to 0.5 ton of armor for IS tech, or 2.0 tons for Clan tech, an SI of 3, 2/3 thrust, and 5 tons of fuel.  Seems doable, but not practical.
"“Eternity is a long time, especially towards the end.” -- Stephen Hawking

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #14 on: 23 August 2021, 14:47:19 »
Tech Teams are actually 1 Tech and 6 AsTechs.  No idea why bays don't include racks for the AsTechs.  The Tech isn't much use without them.

That said, bay quality quarters for eight (MechWarrior, Tech, 6 AsTechs) is less than two tons, so could easily be accounted for in the 150 tons of 'mech bay.

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #15 on: 23 August 2021, 15:13:04 »
Tech Teams are actually 1 Tech and 6 AsTechs.  No idea why bays don't include racks for the AsTechs.  The Tech isn't much use without them.

That said, bay quality quarters for eight (MechWarrior, Tech, 6 AsTechs) is less than two tons, so could easily be accounted for in the 150 tons of 'mech bay.

i broke down the mass of a mech bay once, because i'm that sort of nerd, and i think it boiled down to 100 tons of "allocated" space that is really just empty space/tonnage for a mech to occupy, about 20 tons for the scaffolding and support structure to secure the mech, about 3 tons for the mechwarrior and his tech staff, 7 tons for tools, and 20 tons for consumable storage like grease, coolant, fuel, and drop pod parts.

i based these  on the tonnage of comparable parts like the mobile field base and infantry bay.

mobile field base being 20 tons and infantry bay being 5 tons. since you have 5 tons for 28 dudes it makes sense that for 3 tons you could fit seven comfortably into a mlitatry barracks style bunkroom and a spartan office/stateroom for the mechwarrior, literally just a bunk and a desk.

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #16 on: 23 August 2021, 15:31:12 »
It's 30 troops these days.  TPTB finally acknowledged the Taurians exist...  ^-^

Emcha

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 127
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #17 on: 23 August 2021, 15:51:40 »
It's 30 troops these days.  TPTB finally acknowledged the Taurians exist...  ^-^
cool but that's kind of a moot point. 3 tons is plenty to berth a mech crew.

Red Pins

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3289
  • Inspiration+Creativity=Insanity
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #18 on: 23 August 2021, 21:22:13 »
i managed to fit a mech bay into a small craft.

Did this for a previous project.  But it's still a cool idea.
...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
Glitter - the herpes of the craft supply world.

Atarlost

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 523
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #19 on: 24 August 2021, 00:30:23 »
I'm able to just make it work, though you're limited to 0.5 ton of armor for IS tech, or 2.0 tons for Clan tech, an SI of 3, 2/3 thrust, and 5 tons of fuel.  Seems doable, but not practical.

You add your SI to your armor per facing on small craft and due to rounding an SI of 5 is only a half ton heavier than an SI of 3 so unless you're using ferro-aluminum you can get the same amount of armor as on the IS version by having an SI of 5.  In this way it can barely survive an Inner Sphere large pulse laser with one point of SI remaining instead of dying to a plain vanilla large laser. 


wolfgar

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 1477
  • Wolfson's Heavy Raiders: 3058-3092
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #20 on: 22 January 2022, 21:56:02 »
remembered this when i was working on some things for my "Where's the (KF)Boom" AU and did my own version

Code: [Select]
M-1 Drop Pod Small Craft
Type: Military Spheriod
Mass: 200 tons
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Introduced: 2750
Mass: 200
Battle Value: 170
Tech Rating/Availability: E/D-F(F*)-D-D
Cost: 6,302,550 C-bills

Fuel: 2.5 tons (200)
Safe Thrust: 2
Maximum Thrust: 3
Heat Sinks: 6
Structural Integrity: 5

Armor
    Nose: 16
    Sides: 16/16
    Aft: 16

Cargo
    Bay 1:  Mech (1)                1 Door   

Ammunition:
None

Escape Pods: 0
Life Boats: 0
Crew:  1 officer, 2 enlisted/non-rated, 2 bay personnel

Notes: Mounts 2.5 tons of ferro-aluminum armor.

Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
None


Wolf wins every fight but one, and in that one he dies, his fangs locked on the throat of his opponent.

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #21 on: 23 January 2022, 06:15:59 »
At 2/3, that craft can only get a 'mech to the surface.  2/3 isn't enough to exit the atmosphere again.

Red Pins

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3289
  • Inspiration+Creativity=Insanity
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #22 on: 23 January 2022, 10:16:07 »
At 1.5G? Still, there was a reason mine was an aerodyne with really thin armor.  I'll see if I can find it.
...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
Glitter - the herpes of the craft supply world.

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #23 on: 23 January 2022, 10:22:12 »
2/3 is enough to take off as an Aerodyne, but not enough to exit the atmosphere, unfortunately.  Here's the answer to my rules question about this: https://bg.battletech.com/forums/rules-questions/answered-exiting-airspace-interface-hexes/

wolfgar

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 1477
  • Wolfson's Heavy Raiders: 3058-3092
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #24 on: 23 January 2022, 19:40:07 »
which means that while this is a good reusable drop pod and mobile base for reloading and maintenance, it would need a carrier type dropship capable of carrying small craft to get it back to orbit, where it could move back to its general carrier on its own, not exactly a huge problem.
Wolf wins every fight but one, and in that one he dies, his fangs locked on the throat of his opponent.

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #25 on: 23 January 2022, 19:47:57 »
Making it a "win or die" asset.  Nations generally aren't too keen on those...

Red Pins

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3289
  • Inspiration+Creativity=Insanity
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #26 on: 23 January 2022, 20:16:46 »
The equivalent of the WWII German glider?  That won't work for me.  Maybe a vehicle bay, then.

Hmm.  Xotl pointed out the second option was part of the battlefield rules.  so four thrust points.
...Visit the Legacy Cluster...
The New Clans:Volume One
Clan Devil Wasp * Clan Carnoraptor * Clan Frost Ape * Clan Surf Dragon * Clan Tundra Leopard
Now with MORE GROGNARD!  ...I think I'm done.  I've played long enough to earn a pension, fer cryin' out loud!  IlClan and out in <REDACTED>!
Glitter - the herpes of the craft supply world.

idea weenie

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3526
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #27 on: 23 January 2022, 20:27:08 »
Making it a "win or die" asset.  Nations generally aren't too keen on those...

Depends on the nation and the unit, plus the supporting forces.

6.3 million C-Bills per Mech to be able to deploy a Mech unit intact to a planet's surface instead of dropping them and having the unit wind up scattered?  Some formations might prefer to do this, and have the Small Craft fly to a landed Dropship after the mission is complete.

So the Dropship can land somewhere relatively safe while the Mech units are deployed in a better location.  The Mech units perform their strike mission, then return to the Dropship.  The Small Craft would drop off the Mechs and return directly to the Dropship's landing spot (no need for radio, just watch for the giant fusion exhaust signature on the passive sensors).

Could this design also be used for sub-orbital deployment of Mechs on a planet?  I.e. a pirate raid occurs and you have the troops get into the Small Craft, and the Small Craft formation heads to the pirate attack location.  This would allow you to tailor the response force to the size of the pirate raid, and prevent you from having a case of 3 Pirate Leopards vs 2 Unions deploying troops (where no matter what you choose, one location is going to have pirate Mechs having lots of fun)

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24271
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #28 on: 23 January 2022, 20:30:59 »
They're totally useful suib-orbitally... they just can't exit the atmosphere at the moment.

NomadicChronicler

  • Recruit
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: I think i made the smallest possible mech carrier
« Reply #29 on: 23 January 2022, 23:53:07 »
I really dislike the (still) half-finished nature of battletech in these areas.
You don't do "maintenance" on your vehicle in the Landing Craft; you do it at the bloody mother (drop)ship where you and others are basing from and yet, as per rules written you have only 2 official options... I can go on and on grumble grumble

If you want to stay purely within the official material, Emcha, use the second option.
Put the Mech into a specialty cargo container (weight: 3% of the cargo mass carried) that allows the mech to be hooked up to craft's life support during loading and put that into a 40 ton cargo bay.

 

Register