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Author Topic: Okay, we've got...  (Read 637 times)

Cannonshop

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  • Posts: 8300
Okay, we've got...
« on: 13 August 2022, 23:37:53 »
...challenges for an optimized superiority fighter already.

I'm going to do something different as  the challenge.

Design a fighter that is optimized to play support roles for Other Fighters.

REQUIRED: The design must be lackluster by itself, must be between 20 and 100 tons, but it needs to be somehting that, when it shows up supporting another fighter (or paired with another fighter) causes your opponent to scream "Hell NAW!!" and flip the table.

Now, obviously, this is a very abstract set of requirements, so it is SUGGESTED that you choose a canon design (Or optimized superiority design) to pair it with and contrast it with.

IOW it must be optimized to support a different design.  and, it must be lackluster by itself.

What do I mean? I mean it must be a design you'd look at, and say "nope" if you're trying to solo-duel with it, because something important sucks about it when it's alone, but doesn't suck when you've paired it with something else.

Everybody does duellist designs, can you guys even work out something that works EXTREMELY well only as a team player?
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

  • Lieutenant
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  • Posts: 1503
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #1 on: 14 August 2022, 05:06:02 »
If it were a small craft it won't be that difficult, for you can make an ECM umbrella instead. But for a fighter it's almost impossible due to lack of interaction with the other units.

Well, what I can only think is, an electronic support fighter as well as anti-dogfighter.


Code: [Select]
Pegasus Combat Controller (Standard)

Mass: 100 tons
Frame: Unknown
Power Plant: 400 XL
Armor: Heavy Ferro-Aluminum
Armament:
     2 Small Pulse Laser
     2 Large Pulse Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3080
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-E-E
Cost: 20,186,500 C-bills

Type: Pegasus Combat Controller
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 100
Battle Value: 2,758

Equipment                                          Mass
Engine                        400 XL               26.5
Safe Thrust: 6
Max Thrust: 9
Structural Integrity:         10                       
Heat Sinks:                   12 [24]                 2
Fuel:                         400                   5.0
Command Console                                       6
Armor Factor (Heavy Ferro)    714                    36

                           Armor   
                           Value   
     Nose                   141   
     Wings                191/191 
     Aft                    191   


Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
CASE                    FSLG      0.5      -      -    -    -    - 
Active Probe            FSLG      1.5      -      -    -    -    - 
5 Chaff Pod             FSLG      5.0      -      -    -    -    - 
ECM Suite               FSLG      1.5      -      -    -    -    - 
2 Large Pulse Laser     AFT       14.0     10     9    9    0    0 
2 Small Pulse Laser     AFT       2.0      2      3    0    0    0 


So, it's the idea. Only put the weapons on aft, means you can't attack properly unless the enemy got your six. It would act as the flight's rearguard. Also with Command Console, electronics and and chaffs the stacked fighters are able to be shielded by the pegasus.

Code: [Select]
Pegasus Combat Controller (AMS)

Mass: 100 tons
Frame: Unknown
Power Plant: 400 XL
Armor: Heavy Ferro-Aluminum
Armament:
     2 Small Pulse Laser
     2 Large Pulse Laser
     4 Anti-Missile System
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3080
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-E-D
Cost: 20,780,500 C-bills

Type: Pegasus Combat Controller
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Advanced)
Tonnage: 100
Battle Value: 2,837

Equipment                                          Mass
Engine                        400 XL               26.5
Safe Thrust: 6
Max Thrust: 9
Structural Integrity:         10                       
Heat Sinks:                   12 [24]                 2
Fuel:                         400                   5.0
Command Console                                       6
Armor Factor (Heavy Ferro)    714                    36

                           Armor   
                           Value   
     Nose                   141   
     Wings                191/191 
     Aft                    191   


Weapons
and Ammo                        Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
4 Anti-Missile System             NOS       2.0      1      3    0    0    0 
CASE                              FSLG      0.5      -      -    -    -    - 
Anti-Missile System Ammo (36)     FSLG      3.0      -      -    -    -    - 
Active Probe                      FSLG      1.5      -      -    -    -    - 
ECM Suite                         FSLG      1.5      -      -    -    -    - 
2 Large Pulse Laser               AFT       14.0     10     9    9    0    0 
2 Small Pulse Laser               AFT       2.0      2      3    0    0    0 


This variant is similar with the standard one but instead of chaff it has AMS toward the front, and it would stop the enemy missiles targeting your teammate.

Code: [Select]
Pegasus Combat Controller (Robot)

Mass: 100 tons
Frame: Unknown
Power Plant: 400 XL
Armor: Heavy Ferro-Aluminum
Armament:
     2 Small Pulse Laser
     2 Large Pulse Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3080
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-F-F
Cost: 20,224,375 C-bills

Type: Pegasus Combat Controller
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Experimental)
Tonnage: 100
Battle Value: 2,486

Equipment                                          Mass
Engine                        400 XL               26.5
Safe Thrust: 6
Max Thrust: 9
Structural Integrity:         10                       
Heat Sinks:                   12 [24]                 2
Fuel:                         400                   5.0
Small Cockpit                                         2
Armor Factor (Heavy Ferro)    714                    36

                           Armor   
                           Value   
     Nose                   141   
     Wings                191/191 
     Aft                    191   


Weapons
and Ammo                                          Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
Active Probe                                        FSLG      1.5      -      -    -    -    - 
CASE II                                             FSLG      1.0      -      -    -    -    - 
Shielded Aerospace Smart Robotic Control System     FSLG      8.0      -      -    -    -    - 
2 Chaff Pod                                         FSLG      2.0      -      -    -    -    - 
2 Large Pulse Laser                                 AFT       14.0     10     9    9    0    0 
2 Small Pulse Laser                                 AFT       2.0      2      3    0    0    0 


The more expendable robotic fighter can harrass the pursuiting enemy while the other manned fighters are retreat. Note that shielded smart robotic units are considered as having an ECM suite by default.

Ruger

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  • Posts: 5328
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #2 on: 14 August 2022, 08:03:34 »
Turn the Chippewa into a long range support model by dropping the large lasers for a LRM-20 in each wing and the SRM-6 and it’s ammo for ammo for your new LRM launchers. This leaves the fighter with only a pair of medium lasers and a pair of rear mounted small lasers for real dogfighting, but gives it a deadly punch for the time at long range, but the ammo only lasts for so long.

Ruger
"If someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back." - Malcolm Reynolds, Firefly

"Who I am is where I stand. Where I stand is where I fall...Stand with me." - The Doctor, The Doctor Falls, Doctor Who

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

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  • Posts: 1503
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #3 on: 14 August 2022, 09:03:49 »
Turn the Chippewa into a long range support model by dropping the large lasers for a LRM-20 in each wing and the SRM-6 and it’s ammo for ammo for your new LRM launchers. This leaves the fighter with only a pair of medium lasers and a pair of rear mounted small lasers for real dogfighting, but gives it a deadly punch for the time at long range, but the ammo only lasts for so long.

Ruger

I was think about similar idea as well and it seems good too. While it would be bad at dogfighting, it would provide good covering fire instead and the opponents are have to think twice before bite your teammate's back.

acksed

  • Master Sergeant
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  • Posts: 318
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #4 on: 14 August 2022, 10:22:46 »
The Riever F-700 is an unusually agile variation of a close-attack fighter-bomber but still has zero back weapons. The Backplate is designed to cover those weaknesses, softening-up with ERLL and fending off back-stabbers with its rear-mounted LRM15s and adequate ammo bins.

Code: [Select]
Backplate BCP-1X

Mass: 80 tons
Frame: Unknown
Power Plant: 320 XL
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     3 LRM 15
     2 ER Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3049
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-F-E-D
Cost: 13,290,853 C-bills

Type: Backplate
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Tonnage: 80
Battle Value: 1,877

Equipment                                          Mass
Engine                        320 XL               11.5
Safe Thrust: 6
Max Thrust: 9
Structural Integrity:         8
Heat Sinks:                   15 [30]                 5
Fuel:                         400                   5.0
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  248                  15.5

                           Armor
                           Value
     Nose                    72
     Wings                 62/62
     Aft                     52


Weapons
and Ammo                           Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV
ER Large Laser                       RWG       5.0      12     8    8    8
Artemis IV FCS                       NOS       1.0      -      -    -    -
LRM 15                               NOS       7.0      5      9    9    9
LRM 15 Artemis-capable Ammo (48)     FSLG      6.0      -      -    -    -
ER Large Laser                       LWG       5.0      12     8    8    8
2 Artemis IV FCS                     AFT       2.0      -      -    -    -
2 LRM 15                             AFT       14.0     5      9    9    9
My Fic: [BattleTech] Not Invented Here - Technological progress is hard when you're all alone in the night... so why not send for help?

Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
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  • Posts: 28803
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #5 on: 14 August 2022, 11:49:39 »
I'm thinking of starting with a Stuka, stripping the weapons down to a pair of Medium Lasers and 4 Smalls (two forward and two aft for Point Defense), the Heat Sinks down to the free 10 and stuffing the rest of the tonnage into internal bomb (or you know, anti-shipping missile) bays...  ^-^

AngryButler with a KNIFE!

  • Master Sergeant
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  • Posts: 338
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #6 on: 15 August 2022, 20:49:23 »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't dropping an iNarc onto say, an XL-engine'd Seydlitz, and pairing it with just about any missileboat ASF, immediately make it a support fighter from hell? Only going to get two tons of ammo and can barely squeeze in an ERML/ML, but it'd be an annoyance.

Although if you want one that is at least able to shoot back to at least a minor degree - 'delusions of adequacy' type shooting back - here's one I threw together.

Named after the Greek harpoon-ballista.

Code: [Select]
Harpax Aero

Mass: 35 tons
Frame: Unknown
Power Plant: 245 XL
Armor: Ferro-Aluminum
Armament:
     1 MML 5
     4 ER Medium Laser
     1 iNarc
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-X-D
Cost: 4,762,060 C-bills

Type: Harpax
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Tonnage: 35
Battle Value: 1,092

Equipment                                          Mass
Engine                        245 XL                  6
Safe Thrust: 9
Max Thrust: 14
Structural Integrity:         0                       
Heat Sinks:                   10 [20]                 0
Fuel:                         320                   4.0
Small Cockpit                                         2
Armor Factor (Ferro)          98                    5.5

                           Armor   
                           Value   
     Nose                    29   
     Wings                 25/25   
     Aft                     19   


Weapons
and Ammo              Location   Tonnage  Heat   SRV  MRV  LRV  ERV
MML 5                   NOS       3.0      3      3    3    3    0 
2 ER Medium Laser       NOS       2.0      5      5    5    0    0 
iNarc                   NOS       5.0      0      0    0    0    0 
ER Medium Laser         RWG       1.0      5      5    5    0    0 
iNarc Pods (8)          FSLG      2.0      -      -    -    -    - 
CASE                    FSLG      0.5      -      -    -    -    - 
MML 5 LRM Ammo (72)     FSLG      3.0      -      -    -    -    - 
ER Medium Laser         LWG       1.0      5      5    5    0    0 


If we want to make it more 'meh', drop one of the ERMLs, and give it one more ton of fuel. Even less of a bite, but now the pilot is forced to deal with that his bosses want him to stick around in a fight for that much longer.... :-\

Would be best paired with a Chippewa, Riever, Thunderbird, and/or Ahab.
« Last Edit: 15 August 2022, 21:00:15 by AngryButler with a KNIFE! »

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

  • Lieutenant
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  • Posts: 1503
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #7 on: 16 August 2022, 05:58:34 »
Aerospace units are not able to use Narc-Equipped Missile ammunition. You need the ground support to actually enjoy the benefit.

truetanker

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Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #8 on: 16 August 2022, 23:21:39 »
Everybody does duellist designs, can you guys even work out something that works EXTREMELY well only as a team player?

Would a Shilone SL-17X work?

Twelve shots with only a standard Large Laser and quad clantech ER Mediums to back it up...

TT
Khan, Clan Iron Dolphin
Azeroth Pocketverse
That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
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Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
Nav_Alpha: That THING... that is horrid
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AngryButler with a KNIFE!

  • Master Sergeant
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  • Posts: 338
Re: Okay, we've got...
« Reply #9 on: 21 August 2022, 19:30:55 »
Aerospace units are not able to use Narc-Equipped Missile ammunition. You need the ground support to actually enjoy the benefit.
Thanks, I wasn't sure.

I rarely use NARCs/iNARCs anyways.
I like winning. Don't like doing 'throwing TNT into fish in a barrel' kinds of winning, via a NARCer, and then 3+ missileboats.

Or, in short, I didn't really pay attention to the rules about Narcs/iNarcs, and ASFs.