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Author Topic: What's the most important factor for building a lance/star/lvl II unit?  (Read 3532 times)

Dropkick

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The few games I've played would lead me to believe speed is the most important factor.  I find the temptation to maneuver is to great and when the difference in speed is more than say two inches some mechs just get left behind. 

What say you?

Savage Coyote

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I think speed, in terms of staying together and supporting each other.  I've played a few games of quick strike (and did the initial play-testing for it) and in that one, it tended to be staying power (as in std engines and lots and lots of armor.)  I think in the one big Alpha Strike game I was in, it was support.  And the only way to support your buddies was being together in the same range bracket/cover to combine firepower.

You don't necessarily have to be able to actually maneuver.  Small 'mechs who loose their range shield tend to die to larger 'mech.  In the AAR I posted, my Lyran Pursuit and Cavalry lance stuck together for the most part and did well blunting two 160 point forces while my Assault lance backed them up.  There was some speed different, but only one inch or so.  While they hung tough, they were a pain.  But after numbers got whittled down and they struck out, they all died in two turns due to big guys overkilling.  I think that team work is way more important in this version of the game than in TW. 

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,32568.0.html

(as a side note, I rearranged my forces organization (aka the Lyran Alpha Strike company from AS) and put the Assault lance + Hollander as a "star," all of the jumping 'Mech (Nightsky, Battle Hawk, Vulcan, Falconer,) and the three non-jumpers (Bushwacker, Wolfhound, Commando.) and ran like that.  In theory if it had broken out more, thats how I would have tried to run them anyway, but Pursuit lance and Cavalry lance just ended up holding the line while the Hollander sat up in a tower raining down gauss slugs.  I felt the Hollander fit more with the Assault lance as it's 2/2/2 bracket matched their better while the Falconer and it's mobility and armor made it a natural anchor for the faster jumpier guys.)
« Last Edit: 02 September 2013, 20:03:02 by Savage Coyote »

glitterboy2098

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speed can be, and i prefer to use units with similar movement profiles myself, but i'd say role. i'd say at least half the units should share the same role.. be it recon, fire support, close in combat, ranged combat, whatever. personally i think 3 out of 4 is better if your in a bigger unit (say a company or larger sized force), but in smaller games lances need to do more things.

the other units should be something that augments the main focus of the unit. so a fire support unit could have a bodyguard, or an integral scout, etc. it depends largely on what size of game your playing. it is often a good idea to have the other units in a lance be once that can 'pinch hit' in the main role.. for example, if a fire support lance, you might want to pick bodyguards that have some long range firepower or LRM's, so they can help boost the lance's performance in it main role.

mixed movement profiles can work if the unit can synergize for its intended role.. but units that share a movement rate aren't going to be very useful together if they are all doing completely different things.

SCC

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The few games I've played would lead me to believe speed is the most important factor.  I find the temptation to maneuver is to great and when the difference in speed is more than say two inches some mechs just get left behind. 

What say you?
Well BT is fundamentally a game of maneuver

Savage Coyote

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Well BT is fundamentally a game of maneuver

Havn't played much Alpha/Quick Strike have you?  ;)

clansittingducks

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Havn't played much Alpha/Quick Strike have you?  ;)

trust me, study manuever warfare tacticts and apply it to Alpha Strike
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Savage Coyote

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trust me, study manuever warfare tacticts and apply it to Alpha Strike

Or park your fast stuff in great terrain and profit.  Move your fast stuff out into the open or up close and personal "maneuvering" and get blown away.

Atlas3060

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Terrain and speed help keep the modifiers up, bonus points if you have Jumpers because "I don't care about terrain costs" then you make whooshing noises to impersonate jump jets.

This game really does show how the Star League forces can shine due to their armor and numbers. I'd say when building a force go with some basic SLDF tech at first and then modify from there based on what you want to do. Also it does help to dedicate a star or lance to one critical idea for construction. Make the lance/star for just speedy guys, heavy hitters, armored bricks of doom, etc. Sometimes folks try to put a little of something in one lance, but in this game that won't hold on too well.

Savage Coyote said it best with group fire, supporting your buddies, and the rest. I'll modify what I said in his AAR to reflect the contributions in this thread:
Where Total Warfare praises the individual warrior and his/her luck, Alpha Strike is perfect for the group mentality. In this game scale the group is the individual.

That helps when trying to think upwards into Battleforce, where that becomes the reality for sure.
Stone wasn't cryo frozen. He just got stuck in a freezer Hans Moleman style and we felt bad about it. So we made up this lie.

Dropkick

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Make the lance/star for just speedy guys, heavy hitters, armored bricks of doom, etc. Sometimes folks try to put a little of something in one lance, but in this game that won't hold on too well.


So in the lance of speedy guys it's all speedy guys?  Nothing like three jenners and a hunchback just all jenners for example?  In my limited exp. AS seems to work better this way.

Atlas3060

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So in the lance of speedy guys it's all speedy guys?  Nothing like three jenners and a hunchback just all jenners for example?  In my limited exp. AS seems to work better this way.
You can make a lance with three jenners and a Hunchback. In some situations it will probably work well, so long as their firing ranges are close enough to the target for group firing.
The problem with some players is they'll take those three Jenners and use full speed to traverse across the map while Hunchback tries to keep up.
Hunch will probably have enough punch in the short and medium ranges to assist with Jenner's trolling abilities.  ;)
With that lance though you notice the big factor is the speed of the Jenners. The lances I'm urging people avoid are the type like 1 ultra slow brawler/1 front line trooper/1 speedster/1 missile launcher happy design.

A talented player could make that work under certain circumstances, but when those fail you effectively have four individual mechs that don't compliment each other well in a fluid fight.

Jenner/Hunch combo works fairly well because the Jenners don't need to go the full speed to attain the modifiers. Technically they could keep in pace with their slower brother until enemy makes contact. Then they use their speed to flank and rear shot the enemy while Hunchback throws down some respectable firepower.

Edit:
I just noticed I should have said "Sometimes folks try to put a little of everything in one lance, but in this game that won't hold on too well."
I didn't read over my post that time.  :-\ Sorry if I confused folks.
Stone wasn't cryo frozen. He just got stuck in a freezer Hans Moleman style and we felt bad about it. So we made up this lie.

Dropkick

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Re: What's the most important factor for building a lance/star/lvl II unit?
« Reply #10 on: 03 September 2013, 16:15:07 »
okay...I see what you're getting at.

 

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