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Author Topic: Aero mobile BA question/request  (Read 2989 times)

Cyk0

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Aero mobile BA question/request
« on: 01 November 2019, 05:30:53 »
Your task should you accept it, is to come up with ideas, opinions or even a design for battle armor intending to work in tight cooperation with a specifically designed aerospace fighter.

What would you deem as important design considerations?
VTOL or jumpjets? Advantages/Disadvatages? (Maybe there should be one space and one land variant?)
How fast should it be?
What would be important weapons/equipment?
Armour requirements?

Any specific requirements desirable in the fighter?
« Last Edit: 01 November 2019, 05:38:20 by Cyk0 »

Natasha Kerensky

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #1 on: 01 November 2019, 08:49:28 »

Even with long jumps or VTOL movement, BA cannot move in tight formation with aerospace fighters.  The fighters are much too fast.

That leaves dropping BA from fighters, like the Kirghiz C.  Jump jets are obviously an asset there.

It also leaves calling in and spotting for airstrikes, for which Light TAG is the only useful equipment I can think of and that assumes the fighters are carrying Arrow IV.  Otherwise the BA need to maintain distance to avoid collateral bombing and strafing damage.

Marine duty is another area of cooperation, but it’s not close-knit.  Usually the marines wait until the fighters have crippled the target vessel and only then do they make a boarding attempt.
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Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #2 on: 01 November 2019, 10:10:21 »
Yea insertions either in space or on planet and fire-support would be the primary means of cooperation.

If we limit us to planet for now:

I have been led to believe that VTOL battle armor would offer some kind of advantage when it comes to dropping from aero space fighters, but I cant seem to find that in the rules.

grimlock1

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #3 on: 01 November 2019, 10:48:40 »
Yea insertions either in space or on planet and fire-support would be the primary means of cooperation.

If we limit us to planet for now:

I have been led to believe that VTOL battle armor would offer some kind of advantage when it comes to dropping from aero space fighters, but I cant seem to find that in the rules.
Maybe under deploying VTOLs from dropships?

Even with long jumps or VTOL movement, BA cannot move in tight formation with aerospace fighters.  The fighters are much too fast.

That leaves dropping BA from fighters, like the Kirghiz C.  Jump jets are obviously an asset there.

It also leaves calling in and spotting for airstrikes, for which Light TAG is the only useful equipment I can think of and that assumes the fighters are carrying Arrow IV.  Otherwise the BA need to maintain distance to avoid collateral bombing and strafing damage.

Marine duty is another area of cooperation, but it’s not close-knit.  Usually the marines wait until the fighters have crippled the target vessel and only then do they make a boarding attempt.
TAG + Semiguided LRMs too. What about Battle Armor C3? 

Also, aren't there rules for aerofighters to VTOL for themselves?  If that's the case, then it's possible for a fighter to recover a squad of BA, possibly including a small haul from a smash & grab.
Picture this:  Hit a target with a Leopard.  2 fighters flying CAP, while mechs hot drop.  Fighters would probably be Omnis, set up with 2 tons of BA space and 1 ton of cargo. Wait until the enemy scrambles their QRF, then the fighter's blitz the enemy base, suppressing any heavy assets left behind, and dropping  2 squads of BA. The BA do a smash & grab, taking intel related booty.  Paperwork, hard drives, senior officers, etc.  Move away from the base, wait for pickup from the fighters, which rejoin the dropship on the way out of atmo.
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Weirdo

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #4 on: 01 November 2019, 11:22:14 »
My advice would be for suits with BADCs and a high ground speed, paired with fighters well-equipped for air-to-mud shooting. You drop the suits a safe distance from the target, they sneak up and kill the AA defenses, then the fighters return and smash.

As for the birds, go for ballistic or missile weapons. Stuff with good smash, but can also cluster hit if you feel the need to bust tanks. Keep energy weapons to a minimum, to avoid giving your pilots delusions of strafing.
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Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #5 on: 01 November 2019, 11:43:27 »
Several good suggestions here, IL try digging deeper into the rules when I get home tonight.

I am exploring small footprint forces so mechs are of the table since I hope to avoid landing dropships for pickup.

Smash and grabs or backline command decapitatio
 Type of stuff. (But to a certain degree it's not nreresting to ponder to what degree well the concept can scale to battle conventional forces)

Weirdo

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #6 on: 01 November 2019, 12:48:02 »
It's not really reflected in the rules, but if you want to go for the stealthy specops kind of operation, I'd avoid jump jets. Nothing points you out to the enemy like a roaring plume of light and heat and noise. Also avoid suits with myomer boosters like the Elemental II, they put out enough internal heat that they can never use the hidden units rules.

And small groups like this can absolutely be useful in larger conventional games in addition to small scenarios - after all, how happy are you going to be as a company commander of you're engaged in battle and a platoon of hostile suits suddenly drops into your backfield?
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"It's just that the Hegemony had one answer to every naval problem. 'I kills it with my battleships.'" - Liam's Ghost
"...finally, giant space panties don't seem so strange." - Whistler
"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
"...I was this many years old when I found out that licking a touchscreen in excitement is a bad idea." - JadeHellbringer
"We are the tribal elders. Weirdo is the mushroom specialist." - Worktroll

Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #7 on: 01 November 2019, 14:23:42 »
It's not really reflected in the rules, but if you want to go for the stealthy specops kind of operation, I'd avoid jump jets. Nothing points you out to the enemy like a roaring plume of light and heat and noise.

Agreed, but you also don't have to "go loud" immediately once stuffstarts exploding a little bit of jump jet plumes ardent a dealbreaker

grimlock1

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #8 on: 01 November 2019, 14:48:42 »
My advice would be for suits with BADCs and a high ground speed, paired with fighters well-equipped for air-to-mud shooting. You drop the suits a safe distance from the target, they sneak up and kill the AA defenses, then the fighters return and smash.

As for the birds, go for ballistic or missile weapons. Stuff with good smash, but can also cluster hit if you feel the need to bust tanks. Keep energy weapons to a minimum, to avoid giving your pilots delusions of strafing.

I imagine quads might be a good option for what your describing. They tend to be on the quicker side.
It's not really reflected in the rules, but if you want to go for the stealthy specops kind of operation, I'd avoid jump jets. Nothing points you out to the enemy like a roaring plume of light and heat and noise. Also avoid suits with myomer boosters like the Elemental II, they put out enough internal heat that they can never use the hidden units rules.
Were you advocating for fast running suits over jumpers primarily from this stylistic point or did you have another reason to go that route?


One point that I feel is important if there is any attempt to RP a faction. Troops feel a lot better about going into combat if they know that you can pull them out if things don't go according to plan. As you're developing a doctrine, perhaps a faction-flavored one, ask how they value the individual.  For the Clans, Combine, and perhaps Confederation, a good "Victory or Death!" speech might be enough.  Fed Suns, Lyrans, and Free Worlders will want to know how they are getting home. Wobbies won't care.
I'm rarely right... Except when I am.  ---  Idle question.  What is the BV2 of dread?
Apollo's Law- if it needs Clan tech to make it useable, It doesn't deserve those resources in the first place.
Sure it isn't the most practical 'mech ever designed, but it's a hundred ton axe-murderer. If loving that is wrong I don't wanna be right.

Weirdo

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #9 on: 01 November 2019, 15:26:09 »
Were you advocating for fast running suits over jumpers primarily from this stylistic point or did you have another reason to go that route?

There's also the fact that fast runners are far superior to far jumpers once the suits enter a building. Something to keep in mind if you're ever going to use this group for objective raids where destroying everything isn't quite the mission goal, such as missions to grab a VIP or data core out of a secret lab or intel analysis center.
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"It's just that the Hegemony had one answer to every naval problem. 'I kills it with my battleships.'" - Liam's Ghost
"...finally, giant space panties don't seem so strange." - Whistler
"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
"...I was this many years old when I found out that licking a touchscreen in excitement is a bad idea." - JadeHellbringer
"We are the tribal elders. Weirdo is the mushroom specialist." - Worktroll

Daryk

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #10 on: 01 November 2019, 16:12:39 »
The designs I did here may be of interest to you.  Granted, they're based on original Star League tech, but still...

Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #11 on: 02 November 2019, 02:58:53 »
The designs I did here may be of interest to you.  Granted, they're based on original Star League tech, but still...
Thats a cool suit, It is one of the ways I could approach it.

The other one I am playing around with now Osama raid style thing. Go in hard and fast an then extracate the squads quickly.

Daryk

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #12 on: 02 November 2019, 05:27:33 »
Glad I could help!  Also, the most recent StratOps errata restores the Mark VII Landing Craft's ability to land and take off vertically without destroying itself, and that expands what you can carry (i.e., a Small Craft can mount a Light Vehicle Bay).

Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #13 on: 02 November 2019, 12:06:24 »
Glad I could help!  Also, the most recent StratOps errata restores the Mark VII Landing Craft's ability to land and take off vertically without destroying itself, and that expands what you can carry (i.e., a Small Craft can mount a Light Vehicle Bay).
Well, I was thinking about a WiGE BA pairing... I could do that as the combat element (utilizing the great dropping potential of the WiGE) And then have a small craft dedicated to dropping them and picking them up...  Though initially I wanted to do that with a 100t omni figher which would have been even cooler.

Daryk

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #14 on: 02 November 2019, 12:25:35 »
Hmmm... a Leopard size hull could carry four Small Craft and have a 100 tons left for personnel.  Each small craft could carry a WiGE, and each WiGE could carry however many BA you were looking for.  The Small Craft would be able to recover the WiGE under combat conditions, and WiGE can be off loaded in the atmosphere without having to land.  It sounds complicated, but workable...  :thumbsup:

Weirdo

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #15 on: 02 November 2019, 14:34:19 »
Take a look at the Aurora(BA). No small craft, but it carries loads of BA and light vehicle bays, so it can drop those WiGEs itself, then find a nice clear field or highway to land and recover them when everything is done.
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"It's just that the Hegemony had one answer to every naval problem. 'I kills it with my battleships.'" - Liam's Ghost
"...finally, giant space panties don't seem so strange." - Whistler
"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
"...I was this many years old when I found out that licking a touchscreen in excitement is a bad idea." - JadeHellbringer
"We are the tribal elders. Weirdo is the mushroom specialist." - Worktroll

Daryk

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #16 on: 02 November 2019, 14:35:13 »
Intruders could work with a little work too...

Cyk0

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Re: Aero mobile BA question/request
« Reply #17 on: 02 November 2019, 19:19:49 »
Take a look at the Aurora(BA). No small craft, but it carries loads of BA and light vehicle bays, so it can drop those WiGEs itself, then find a nice clear field or highway to land and recover them when everything is done.
If the battle armours have VTOL movement they can be picked up by the WiGEs without doing a landing so they could do the inital extracion to a safer landing spot.

For some reson the dismounting part of the rules don't mention WiGEs explicitly only VTOL (were as in mounting they have a special paragraph together with VTOLs) That being said the general dismounting rules work for WiGEs as long as I run them with VTOL packs... (they just lack anything making normal jump packs worhwhile)

 

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