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Author Topic: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW  (Read 1205 times)

Daryk

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Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« on: 20 June 2022, 06:16:06 »
Thanks again to Craig Reed for writing these up, and to Malwys for the tip as to which issue they were in!  :thumbsup:

The Regulans win something for getting a Shotgun out to 2/4/6 TW range.  The Capellans somehow managed to make one WORSE than the Davion underbarrel breaching shotgun.  The Taurians have a quite respectable entry with the Daystar VM, which is only slightly edged by the Morrigan Stormsweeper from Canopus (which isn't a burst fire weapon, despite expectations raised by the name).  The clanners are the only ones to get into free Heavy Burst territory, and that only with their "elemental" version (the SGS-9E).  The Ravens win the "weirdest" weapon with their "tri-barrel".  Yes, it will hurt if you fire all three at the same time.  Buy Issue #7 for the full AToW details!

As is usual by now, I include a column for damage with an extended magazine for those weapons limited by reload factor.  Of course, that still leaves a number of them short of "full damage" for their ammunition type (looking at you, Wrangleman Tri-Barrel!).

Code: [Select]
TW XCap AToW TW
Name Aff TL Shots AP BD Burst Dmg Dmg Range Range Wt Cost Notes
Risen-15 DC C 8 3 4 1 0.22 0.27 5 0 3.9 250
Risen-15 (Both Barrels) DC C 4 3 8 1 0.22 0.32 5 0 3.9 250
Dokuhebi DC C 5 4 5 1 0.23 0.34 3 0 2.4 420
DPS-305 FWL C 10 3 4 3 0.33 5 0 3.5 350
Marburg-20 Reg C 10 4 4 1 0.36 40 1 4.3 500
Marburg-20M Reg C 14 4 4 1 0.36 50 2 3.9 600
SD Type-41 CC D 10 4 5 1 0.45 20 1 3 450
CWI Jiānhùrén CC D 4 2 3 1 0.05 0.08 15 1 2.7 225
AMI Keymaster-15 FS C 4 4 3 1 0.08 0.13 0 0 1.2 250 Underbarrel breacher (no splash)
AWA AS-105 FS D 10 4 4 3 0.44 20 1 2.9 350
AWA SS-112 FS D 7 4 4 1 0.25 0.36 20 1 2.8 300
Byron 15S LC D 6 5 5 1 0.34 0.51 25 1 3.5 600
Duckett A-5 LC D 8 4 4 1 0.29 0.36 25 1 2.9 400
Daystar I/IIM TC C 12 3 3 4 0.25 15 1 2.9 200
Daystar I/IIC TC C 12 3 3 1 0.20 15 1 2.8 250
Daystar III/IVM TC C 15 4 4 5 0.44 20 1 2.7 400
Daystar III/IVC TC C 15 4 4 1 0.36 20 1 2.6 350
Daystar VM TC C 18 4 5 6 0.55 25 1 2.5 600
Daystar VC TC C 18 4 5 1 0.45 25 1 2.4 450
Morrigan Stormsweeper MoC C 20 5 5 1 0.56 30 1 4 800
Wrangleman Tri-Barrel RA C 9 4 3 1 0.24 0.27 20 1 3 750
Wrangleman Tri-Barrel (all 3) RA C 3 4 9 1 0.24 0.36 20 1 3 750
Hastari III MH D 15 4 3 3 0.33 15 1 3.5 800
SGM-3 SL C 12 3 3 4 0.25 20 1 2.9 1,000
SGS-9 Clan C 14 4 4 3 0.44 25 1 2.7 1,200
SGS-9E Clan C 21 5 5 3 0.69 35 1 4.5 1,500

Maelwys

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #1 on: 20 June 2022, 10:31:41 »
That is an impressive number of shotguns. Until I saw it listed out like that I didn't realized how many there were. Of course, it could just be the Daystar padding things out.

As for the Morrigan, it is listed as "5BS" but no burst rating. I assume from the fluff describing it as "Semi-automatic" that it should be "5S" instead. Ii might be time to go through them and maybe throw up a errata/ask for clarification of the various weapons. Have you been keeping notes on any other errors?

Actually, looking at it, alot of the non-burst capable units are listed as BS. I'm not making a mistake on the rules? B for Burst, S for Splash?

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #2 on: 20 June 2022, 11:52:15 »
I went entirely by the Notes section (where Burst value is stated if there is one): no burst value there, no burst value factored into TW damage.

I didn't think to ping Craig about these, as I was too :o about the laser weapons this morning.

Maelwys

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #3 on: 20 June 2022, 12:27:08 »
I'm also completely confused on how the Daystar is supposed to be.

Is it literally IM and IC all the way to V? It seems really odd to have so much duplicated stats.

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #4 on: 20 June 2022, 12:32:08 »
I agree, but I tried to convert the stats as presented.  I suspect Craig meant for the I/II to be the M/C versions (i.e., IC, IIM, IIIC, IVM, VC, VI M) but that's not how it came out.

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #5 on: 21 June 2022, 02:20:48 »
the Morrigan Stormsweeper from Canopus (which isn't a burst fire weapon, despite expectations raised by the name). 

Its inspiration isn't burst capable either.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Liam's Ghost

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #6 on: 21 June 2022, 03:03:14 »
Also, is it just me or do a lot of these shot guns have really high armor penetration? Are they assuming slugs?
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #7 on: 21 June 2022, 03:26:36 »
Not with the S code on there...

Maelwys

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #8 on: 21 June 2022, 10:04:01 »
That was the other thing that was floating around in my mind. Solid slugs would add +3 to the AP of the round and remove the S classification.

Which would up the penetration factor but reduce the damage factor assuming I'm not missing any errata.

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #9 on: 21 June 2022, 18:30:14 »
AToW page 285 for that, btw.  And I should probably post the table with the damage adjusted for slugs.  It'll be a bit different.  Splash adds a +1 to one of the factors in the DF equation.

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #10 on: 21 June 2022, 18:33:37 »
And that was easier than I expected!  :)

Code: [Select]
Combat Shotguns with Slugs TW XCap AToW TW
Name Aff TL Shots AP BD Burst Dmg Dmg Range Range Wt Cost Notes
Risen-15 DC C 8 6 4 1 0.34 0.42 5 0 3.9 250
Risen-15 (Both Barrels) DC C 4 6 8 1 0.34 0.50 5 0 3.9 250
Dokuhebi DC C 5 7 5 1 0.31 0.46 3 0 2.4 420
DPS-305 FWL C 10 6 4 3 0.54 5 0 3.5 350
Marburg-20 Reg C 10 7 4 1 0.49 40 1 4.3 500
Marburg-20M Reg C 14 7 4 1 0.49 50 2 3.9 600
SD Type-41 CC D 10 7 5 1 0.61 20 1 3 450
CWI Jiānhùrén CC D 4 5 3 1 0.11 0.16 15 1 2.7 225
AMI Keymaster-15 FS C 4 4 3 1 0.08 0.13 0 0 1.2 250 Underbarrel breacher
AWA AS-105 FS D 10 7 4 3 0.63 20 1 2.9 350
AWA SS-112 FS D 7 7 4 1 0.34 0.49 20 1 2.8 300
Byron 15S LC D 6 8 5 1 0.42 0.63 25 1 3.5 600
Duckett A-5 LC D 8 7 4 1 0.39 0.49 25 1 2.9 400
Daystar I/IIM TC C 12 6 3 4 0.41 15 1 2.9 200
Daystar I/IIC TC C 12 6 3 1 0.32 15 1 2.8 250
Daystar III/IVM TC C 15 7 4 5 0.63 20 1 2.7 400
Daystar III/IVC TC C 15 7 4 1 0.49 20 1 2.6 350
Daystar VM TC C 18 7 5 6 0.79 25 1 2.5 600
Daystar VC TC C 18 7 5 1 0.61 25 1 2.4 450
Morrigan Stormsweeper MoC C 20 8 5 1 0.70 30 1 4 800
Wrangleman Tri-Barrel RA C 9 7 3 1 0.33 0.37 20 1 3 750
Wrangleman Tri-Barrel (all 3) RA C 3 7 9 1 0.33 0.50 20 1 3 750
Hastari III MH D 15 7 3 3 0.47 15 1 3.5 800
SGM-3 SL C 12 6 3 4 0.41 20 1 2.9 1,000
SGS-9 Clan C 14 7 4 3 0.63 25 1 2.7 1,200
SGS-9E Clan C 21 8 5 3 0.90 35 1 4.5 1,500

Maelwys

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #11 on: 21 June 2022, 19:30:29 »
And the results are as scary as I suspected...

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #12 on: 21 June 2022, 19:46:35 »
Even the civilian Taurian Mark V gets the Heavy Burst special! Yet more evidence the recent infantry weapon nerf wasn't so smart...  ^-^

Maelwys

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #13 on: 21 June 2022, 20:13:10 »
The 0.60 one or something else?

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #14 on: 21 June 2022, 21:06:53 »
Even the civilian Taurian Mark V gets the Heavy Burst special! Yet more evidence the recent infantry weapon nerf wasn't so smart...  ^-^

I... uh... honestly think this is more a case of the shotguns being broken.

Seriously, this is some Rifts level power creep with these weapons.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

Daryk

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Re: Shrapnel Issue #7 Combat Shotguns for TW
« Reply #15 on: 22 June 2022, 03:15:48 »
The 0.60 one or something else?
The Daystar VC is 0.61, breaching the infantry nerf limit.  That means when used as a primary weapon, it's limited to 0.60 damage, but gains the Heavy Burst special.  I suspect the weapons were designed before the nerf was a thing.