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Author Topic: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!  (Read 124354 times)

MarauderCH IIC

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1230 on: 30 October 2020, 18:04:32 »
I never scrolled down far enough to see there was a page 2...    ???

Trajan Helmer

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1231 on: 22 November 2020, 15:52:40 »
I posted this in the Canon WarShip list thread in Aerospace Combat but I'd like to see a little more discussion here.  Being a WarShip fan, I'm intrigued by the possible implications.
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Based on Children of Kerensky, we have an Emerald Talon II being built.  What are the odds that she will be a new Nightlord or a different class of ship? Is it possible we may end up with Leviathan Prime-type situation?


Wait a moment, is Geneva safe with this thing being around?
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truetanker

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1232 on: 22 November 2020, 17:38:40 »
Probably a Texas class with new tech, HAGs and such.

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rebs

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1233 on: 22 November 2020, 17:51:02 »
You mean an NHAG.

That N is very important ;D

Tyler Jorgensson

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1234 on: 22 November 2020, 19:03:34 »
But yet if you paint a Mad Cat in anything but Wolf colours the Wolf fanboys will explode

I mean come on you guys have Aiden Pryde and his Timber Wolf

truetanker

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1235 on: 22 November 2020, 19:07:06 »
You mean an NHAG.

That N is very important ;D

Still surprised no naval cluster rounds for them either!

I'd expect SLDF to at least explore this. . .

TT
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Savage Baron

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1236 on: 09 December 2020, 10:56:28 »
https://fs.battletech.com/fiction/hour-of-wolf/

That map for 3151 doesn't bode well.
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MarauderCH IIC

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1237 on: 09 December 2020, 22:29:51 »
After reading Children of Kerensky, I basically gave up hope of the Jade Falcons winning and excepted that Hour of the Wolf is just going to be another session in Clan Wolf can do no wrong fiat bus fiction. The Jade Falcons are just there to be the mustache twirling bad guys that look silly and can't do anything right or smart. I never really expected to dislike a character more then Phelan Kell but Alaric is just about there.

Trajan Helmer

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1238 on: 10 December 2020, 00:00:11 »
After reading Children of Kerensky, I basically gave up hope of the Jade Falcons winning and excepted that Hour of the Wolf is just going to be another session in Clan Wolf can do no wrong fiat bus fiction. The Jade Falcons are just there to be the mustache twirling bad guys that look silly and can't do anything right or smart. I never really expected to dislike a character more then Phelan Kell but Alaric is just about there.

I was really hoping for more detail on Malvina's reasoning than was given.  So much of it looked like a cardboard cutout rather than a nuanced view of her plans,  failed and otherwise, and her depth of thinking beyond what was apparent to others' perception.  Instead, it was the Alaric Superficiality Show for most of the book.  I call it that because while logistics were chatted about, nothing so serious as a battle plan past percentages of expected losses was given. Yeah, I know the Wolves have decided on a broad front approach to their campaign vs a more traditional Clan planetary attack but logistics are the Achilles' Heel of a broad front campaign (witness the Allies crossing France in 1944-45)  There were no serious challenges to Alaric politically or militarily as the story progressed (nothing weighty that made you feel like Alaric and his plans were ever in danger). 


Perhaps the political, logistical, and character/personal detail I crave will come up in Hour of the Wolf and the disappointment in Children will fall away like so many Kentarans after the Summer of '96. 
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Cannonshop

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1239 on: 10 December 2020, 00:39:00 »
After reading Children of Kerensky, I basically gave up hope of the Jade Falcons winning and excepted that Hour of the Wolf is just going to be another session in Clan Wolf can do no wrong fiat bus fiction. The Jade Falcons are just there to be the mustache twirling bad guys that look silly and can't do anything right or smart. I never really expected to dislike a character more then Phelan Kell but Alaric is just about there.

Don't you hate seeing what you predicted several years ago happen?  I predicted this when we first got to see Malvina do the Max Liao back in MWDA's period.

It's kind of expected, really.  okay, not 'kind of'.  For all the claimst at BT being a gray morality setting, the fact is, the fiction and line are starkly black-and-white, and it's easy to see who's going to be the designated heel, because they always follow a set pattern.

and this kinda shows it.  a few early successes (usually against inferior opponents) to establish they're 'threatening', followed by increasing levels of crazy/stupid actions, followed by a couple more cosmetic victories that don't really mean anything because they're meant to increase the nonexistent tension, followed by defeat at the hands of the designated (steiner-davion) hero.  Alaric's a Steiner-Davion hero, the Falcons are the designated Heel, and so it goes.
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worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1240 on: 10 December 2020, 05:07:02 »
Mind you, genre fiction is genre fiction. You go to a Wendys, you order a burger, you're not expecting Heston Blumenthal.

Ilsa Bick is probably a good writer. I happen to think she is a poor genre fiction writer, and that the two things are interrelated.

CS, you know I admire your writing greatly. But I suspect you would be a poor contributor to a genre pool. Imagine if all the factions & states got clever. It'd make the storyline enormously harder to manage for the game line. Yes, some of us would lap it up until all the logical contradictions inherent in the base imploded.

The best we can hope for is that the writers give us a good ride along the way, have some twists and some humourous interludes, and don't forget major plot elements along the way (black boxes, anyone?) The enormous pause in novel production kinda damages that.

If we Falcons are going out, let us do so in the biggest, most casualty-ridden blaze of angst possible! "Better to burn out, than to fade away!" quoth Star Captain Kurgan ;)
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Jellico

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1241 on: 10 December 2020, 07:44:02 »

If we Falcons are going out, let us do so in the biggest, most casualty-ridden blaze of angst possible! "Better to burn out, than to fade away!" quoth Star Captain Kurgan ;)


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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1242 on: 10 December 2020, 07:57:00 »
I would remove the Steiner part of Steiner-Davion as the designated hero. When the character turns "steiner-like" it becomes a moron or a villain or both. Only by following the Federated Suns bloodline you get to be a real Battletech hero. Even if sometimes you are a stupid hero you are still the designated hero (you know who I am talking about).

Savage Baron

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1243 on: 10 December 2020, 18:35:49 »
I'm just terrified we're surrounded by competence...

I'm very much of the mindset the Falcons are gonna get the sledgehammer of retribution and not the scalpel of justice. If they do, I'd almost hope if the our emerald turkeys get eaten by the wolves, they choke to death on the carcass.

Well, we still have the early invasion days.
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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1244 on: 10 December 2020, 21:58:25 »
I don't mind if the Falcons die, so long as it's a good death. Y'know, kicking, screaming, and more kicking.

I'm primarily a FWL fan. Faction death is just something you take in stride, and wait.
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rebs

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1245 on: 10 December 2020, 22:10:04 »
I don't mind if the Falcons die, so long as it's a good death. Y'know, kicking, screaming, and more kicking.

I'm primarily a FWL fan. Faction death is just something you take in stride, and wait.

Agreed.  We have seen faction death before.  It's not always permanent.

CJC070

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1246 on: 10 December 2020, 23:30:12 »
Agreed.  We have seen faction death before.  It's not always permanent.

And may Malvina Hazel die in her bed and not in a battle (the most dishonourable curse I can think of).

MarauderCH IIC

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1247 on: 10 December 2020, 23:56:26 »
I don't mind if the Falcons die, so long as it's a good death. Y'know, kicking, screaming, and more kicking.

I'm primarily a FWL fan. Faction death is just something you take in stride, and wait.


Judging by the Wolfnet Radio podcast interview with Brent Evans where he states that the Jade Falcons have been saddled with plot elements not really fitting to them and will see themselves getting back to more traditional roles in the ilClan era, it's probably likely the Falcons survive.


I hope that Clan Wolf can't win the battle without the Falcons smashing the hardest Republic defenses and softening up Terra for them. That way, Clan Wolf cannot say they won Terra without the help of the Falcons.

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1248 on: 10 December 2020, 23:58:03 »
And may Malvina Hazel die in her bed and not in a battle (the most dishonourable curse I can think of).

Ghengis Khan died in bed, and his final command to his army was to burn a rebellious province to the ground, which they did.  A Malvina bed-death might result in similar orders for Terra.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

rebs

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1249 on: 11 December 2020, 00:08:08 »
Ghengis Khan died in bed, and his final command to his army was to burn a rebellious province to the ground, which they did.  A Malvina bed-death might result in similar orders for Terra.

The more you know...

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1250 on: 11 December 2020, 02:40:01 »
Ghengis Khan died in bed, and his final command to his army was to burn a rebellious province to the ground, which they did. A Malvina bed-death might result in similar orders for Terra.
This would not  be a bad thing.
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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1251 on: 11 December 2020, 05:24:58 »
Ghengis Khan died in bed, and his final command to his army was to burn a rebellious province to the ground, which they did.  A Malvina bed-death might result in similar orders for Terra.

And then the Falcons come in guns blazing only to see Terra already burned by it's defenders and Stone grinning "Sorry I was faster then you!"
To be honest I somehow think that Stone has actually such plans just in case the Republic falls completly. Though I bet Alaric already knows all of them. He is basically the Mary Sue of Battletech. Though if we take the Steiner-Davion alliance from the 4th succesion Wars we all know how the Iclan era will end. Civil war 3.0 baby!

Mendrugo

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1252 on: 11 December 2020, 05:35:32 »
I am Alaric, Khan of the Wolves, Defender of the Legacy of Kerensky.  This is Tassa, my fearless friend.

Fabulous secret powers were revealed to me the day I held aloft my genetic codex and said "By the power of Steiner-Davion, I have the power!"

Tassa became the mighty Anastasia, and I became Alaric Ward, the most powerful man in the universe!

Together we defend Terra from the evil forces of Malvina.
"We have made of New Avalon a towering funeral pyre and wiped the Davion scourge from the universe.  Tikonov, Chesterton and Andurien are ours once more, and the cheers of the Capellan people nearly drown out the gnashing of our foes' teeth as they throw down their weapons in despair.  Now I am made First Lord of the Star League, and all shall bow down to me and pay homa...oooooo! Shiny thing!" - Maximillian Liao, "My Triumph", audio dictation, 3030.  Unpublished.

worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1253 on: 11 December 2020, 05:36:32 »
I'm wondering - Absorption. Don't we see Falcon bloodnames in some of the "future" intros in some recent work?

Does it happen from a genuine Trial, is it a rejection of Malvina, or is it ham-handed? Time will tell.
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marauder648

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1254 on: 11 December 2020, 06:17:30 »
I'm wondering - Absorption. Don't we see Falcon bloodnames in some of the "future" intros in some recent work?

Does it happen from a genuine Trial, is it a rejection of Malvina, or is it ham-handed? Time will tell.

I'm guessing that following the Battle of Terra and the rise of the ilClan, the Falcons will be in a terrible position. Lets assume Malvina gets offed, either by her Spheroid 'pet', that Galaxy Commander who hates what she's done to the Falcons, a named character from the Wolves or Republic or Random Mechwarrior 9518/c with a lucky headshot, either way she's out of the picture.

We can also assume that the Falcons are going to take fearsome losses in the battle and the survivors who run and get out of the system are then hugely over extended in their OZ trying to defend it with absolutely minimal forces. At which point the Lyrans and Horses jump on them to get more worlds/get breathing space.

This will either lead to the Falcons being crippled and absorbed/annihilated. Some will flee and end out in the IlClanate.
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worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1255 on: 11 December 2020, 14:42:01 »
I'm thinking more "hostile takeover", mebbe not so hostile - the non-Malvinas accepting it as a fate better than death. Expecting brown falcon logos (eg Jade Wolf).

And I'm seeing the leadup to a total-drama Trial between Anastasia & Malvina, which gets derailed when the pet betrays/kills Malvina, and exposes Malvina was going to cheat anyway.

Or not! Let's take another sip of that export-quality Necrosia and see what happens :)
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
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* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

MarauderD

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1256 on: 11 December 2020, 14:58:00 »
Or not! Let's take another sip of that export-quality Necrosia and see what happens :)

Export quality Necrosia is the only thing keeping me alive in 2020.  That and the kickstarter.  Now that 2021 is coming, with the promise of a novel and sourcebook (and a vaccine, one can hope) we've been waiting 10 years for, I'm thinking I can cut down my Necrosia intake.  A bit.

worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1257 on: 11 December 2020, 16:33:24 »
Testify, brother!
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

truetanker

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #1258 on: 12 December 2020, 01:29:28 »
I am Alaric, Khan of the Wolves, Defender of the Legacy of Kerensky.  This is Tassa, my fearless friend.

Fabulous secret powers were revealed to me the day I held aloft my genetic codex and said "By the power of Steiner-Davion, I have the power!"

Tassa became the mighty Anastasia, and I became Alaric Ward, the most powerful man in the universe!

Together we defend Terra from the evil forces of Malvina.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZ5LpwO-An4

TT
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