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Author Topic: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!  (Read 114599 times)

SeeM

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #120 on: 14 December 2014, 16:11:27 »
Okay, here's another discussion. As proud and true Falcons, what is your emotional favourite 'Mech in a weight class, and why?

I like Hellbringer F. If used in open terrain it moves 6-7 hexex per turn and can fire everything with little overheat. If stationary Helly can be easly destroyed. It feels like a light mech with two times more weapons.
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SeeM

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #121 on: 14 December 2014, 16:17:58 »
Green Pigeons, sell me on your clan.

Falcons are the bad guys done right, much like House Kurita in late '80. Not space nazi type like Blakists, or Jaguars, that were designed basically to get their asses kicked.
« Last Edit: 14 December 2014, 16:21:54 by SeeM »
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Archangel

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #122 on: 14 December 2014, 17:38:42 »
Falcons are the bad guys done right, much like House Kurita in late '80. Not space nazi type like Blakists, or Jaguars, that were designed basically to get their asses kicked.

Well the Falcons are rapidly being turned into a faction meant to get its ass kicked with their extremist Mongol Doctrine.  Devastating several planets on their way to launching their assault on Hesperus II simply because they (I should say she) was furious in the way the Battle of Tharkad turned out because of Wolf intervention?  They are being set up to either be redeemed or destroyed.
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Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #123 on: 14 December 2014, 19:32:28 »
Horses and Adders will take care of that; the Falcon arse kicking that is.

worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #124 on: 14 December 2014, 22:54:16 »
Don't know that the Horses will be around to deliver. And frankly I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Adders or Lions or whatever, oh my!

No, the doom of the Falcons is, and will always be ... the Falcons.

And I wouldn't have it any other way O0
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Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #125 on: 14 December 2014, 23:27:08 »
Don't know that the Horses will be around to deliver.

Depends what happens with our leadership and/or lack of it in the current timeline.  I am always happy to stand and deliver, even if that is a FWL tactic.

...frankly I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Adders or Lions or whatever, oh my!

Stop teasing Cold1  >:D

No, the doom of the Falcons is, and will always be ... the Falcons.

But how many petty civil wars can you guys have?  Talk about story recycling...  :P

worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #126 on: 14 December 2014, 23:32:27 »
But how many petty civil wars can you guys have?  Talk about story recycling...  :P

Face it, only a Falcon is good enough to oppose a Falcon.

(We only did the Lyrans so that the fledgelings got an easy start ...)
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #127 on: 15 December 2014, 00:27:41 »
Face it, only a Falcon is good enough to oppose a Falcon.

(We only did the Lyrans so that the fledgelings got an easy start ...)

Especially Falcon scientist.  Good thing we gave you some more.  :P

Rtifs

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #128 on: 15 December 2014, 09:12:03 »
Black Lanner E is among my favorite.  An ATM 12 on a fast platform.  What’s not to love?

SeeM

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #129 on: 15 December 2014, 15:45:17 »
Well the Falcons are rapidly being turned into a faction meant to get its ass kicked with their extremist Mongol Doctrine.  Devastating several planets on their way to launching their assault on Hesperus II simply because they (I should say she) was furious in the way the Battle of Tharkad turned out because of Wolf intervention?  They are being set up to either be redeemed or destroyed.

I believe we deserve more than just that. :( And it would be "let's unite against the Mordor" thing all over again.

And I totally agree: the only faction that should end Falcon story is themselves. Wolves are curently busy beeing ilClan, Bears are enjoying their dominium, Lyrans can't find their ass with both hands without Davions help (and Davions are screwed), home clans will be too scared beeing IS tainted by the Falcon warrior gaze. Seriously, who's left?
« Last Edit: 15 December 2014, 15:46:48 by SeeM »
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Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #130 on: 15 December 2014, 17:03:51 »
Seriously, who's left?

WoB remnants, Wolverines, couple of WoR scientists?

jklantern

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #131 on: 15 December 2014, 20:35:13 »
I believe we deserve more than just that. :( And it would be "let's unite against the Mordor" thing all over again.

And I totally agree: the only faction that should end Falcon story is themselves. Wolves are curently busy beeing ilClan, Bears are enjoying their dominium, Lyrans can't find their ass with both hands without Davions help (and Davions are screwed), home clans will be too scared beeing IS tainted by the Falcon warrior gaze. Seriously, who's left?

The Sea Foxes, who have secretly built fifty fully loaded Night Lord's in the Deep Periphery.
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DarkSpade

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #132 on: 15 December 2014, 21:03:30 »
With so many factions already wiped out(or close to it) recently, it would be cool to see a redemption story of some kind.  I'd miss the green bird, but Clan Phoenix has a nice ring to it.
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jklantern

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #133 on: 15 December 2014, 21:06:58 »
E. Icaza's description of the Falcons may have done the impossible; it may have changed my mind about the Falcons in general.

When you look at the Falcons as, basically, the Frank Grimes of the Battletech Universe, they suddenly become a whole lot more sympathetic and interesting.  You can basically think of Malvina's rampage as them going, "I DON'T NEED SAFETY GLOVES BECAUSE I'M HOMER SIMPSON!"
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Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #134 on: 15 December 2014, 23:04:52 »
"I DON'T NEED SAFETY GLOVES BECAUSE I'M HOMER SIMPSON!"

Hence the glow-in-the-dark falcons

Deadborder

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #135 on: 15 December 2014, 23:58:56 »
Question for anyone who has the Falcon Phonebook...

Do you recall what unit (or even jsut what Galaxy) the Atlas II was in? I know there was one, I just don't remember where.
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Diplominator

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #136 on: 16 December 2014, 00:19:57 »
Question for anyone who has the Falcon Phonebook...

Do you recall what unit (or even jsut what Galaxy) the Atlas II was in? I know there was one, I just don't remember where.
I think there might be two in there somewhere but...

Peregrine Galaxy, Peregrine Eyrie Cluster, Binary Alpha, Alpha Beak, Star Captain Divvurn, Atlas II (KIA)

Yeah, y'know, I just got no idea why they don't make books with this level of detail anymore!

Archangel

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #137 on: 16 December 2014, 01:11:12 »
Yeah, y'know, I just got no idea why they don't make books with this level of detail anymore!

Two main reasons probably:  costs of producing it outweighs the expected profits (same reason they will stop releasing faction specific sourcebooks) and its a pain to go into such detail only to have the effort be deemed outdated with the next major conflict or next TRO release not to mention people nitpicking how this mech doesn't belong in that type of star, that mech variant is wrong for the star, why does that warrior have a bloodname while that one doesn't, etc.
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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #138 on: 16 December 2014, 02:28:12 »
Two main reasons probably:  costs of producing it outweighs the expected profits (same reason they will stop releasing faction specific sourcebooks) and its a pain to go into such detail only to have the effort be deemed outdated with the next major conflict or next TRO release not to mention people nitpicking how this mech doesn't belong in that type of star, that mech variant is wrong for the star, why does that warrior have a bloodname while that one doesn't, etc.

(I was joking. Going into that level of detail on all the myriad factions and units we've got these days would be insane)

Tyler Jorgensson

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #139 on: 16 December 2014, 15:34:37 »
(I was joking. Going into that level of detail on all the myriad factions and units we've got these days would be insane)

Challenge Accepted!

Trajan Helmer

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #140 on: 18 December 2014, 01:12:17 »
Catching up on the thread:

Quote
Okay, let's go green for a bit - for Falcons, who would buy into the Mongol doctrine?
I have a strained relationship with the Mongol Doctrine. I see its effectiveness but to use it on other Clans and your own Clansmen especially is...unsavory.  Honorless dogs can taste and see that the Mongol Doctrine is bitter. An honorable opponent should be accorded Zellbrigen as befits tradition and skill.

Quote
Okay, here's another discussion. As proud and true Falcons, what is your emotional favourite 'Mech in a weight class, and why?

It used to be the Summoner M, with which I have made the most kills against the most 'mechs. After the 2012 Masters & Minions Tournament at GenCon, the Hellbringer E has claimed that crown. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVEit!  Thanks to my teammates, I was given first pick of isorla for my performance in that match...while wearing that oversized but good Jade Falcon Dress Uniform.  Best thing of that fight was Paul congratulating me on the play while shaking my hand saying, "You're probably the LAST Jade Falcon fan I'll ever shake hands with."  These things are what give the Hellbringer E a nice edge on all others.
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worktroll

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #141 on: 18 December 2014, 01:34:49 »
Catching up on the thread:
I have a strained relationship with the Mongol Doctrine. I see its effectiveness but to use it on other Clans and your own Clansmen especially is...unsavory.  Honorless dogs can taste and see that the Mongol Doctrine is bitter. An honorable opponent should be accorded Zellbrigen as befits tradition and skill.

As someone who finds the Mongol doctrine emotionally appealing, I have to ask - "who is an honorable opponent?" Surely not the lapdog Wolves, or care Bears. Nor those of the Horses who prefer being saddled ponies. The rime stoats? Hardly. And even within the Clan, there are those who do not deserve the term "honorable".

[OOC - it's a self-fulfilling prophecy in a way. The Falcon Way is right. Malvina defines the Falcon Way. If you oppose Malvina, you are not following the Way. Therefore fair game. "If you are not with us, you are against us" writ large with WarShip-sized craters.]
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

Fletch

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #142 on: 18 December 2014, 03:31:33 »
So the Way is the Way, unless there is another Way which becomes the Way unless those of the Way are able to discredit the Way or find another Way to follow the Way  :D

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #143 on: 18 December 2014, 08:39:40 »
[Keanu] No Way... [/Reeves]
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rebs

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #144 on: 18 December 2014, 09:42:56 »
The rime stoats

The Way is awfully hard to follow without a supplier of harjel.  Or Hellbringer parts.

Do not mind these ramblings of a humble old rime stoat.  ;) The Mongol Doctrine seems like a great way to roll from the supply end of things.

Rainbow 6

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #145 on: 27 December 2014, 08:41:00 »
Quick question, what equipment are the Falcons producing in 3050?

I have got a rough list but figured I would ask on here to check I had not missed anything.

Trajan Helmer

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #146 on: 27 December 2014, 16:40:18 »
Scytha
Visigoth
Elemental BA
Summoner
Hellbringer
Kit Fox


...that's all I have off the top of my head.
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Deadborder

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #147 on: 27 December 2014, 18:28:54 »
Quick question, what equipment are the Falcons producing in 3050?

I have got a rough list but figured I would ask on here to check I had not missed anything.

There's never been a full accounting of clan Homeworld production, and likely never will be either. Trajan Helmer's list is pretty complete, however for what we do explicitly know.

They probably produce the Vixen, Hellhound, Rifleman IIC, Marauder IIC and Kraken based on bits and pieces of info from various (admittedly dubious) sources. Likewise, it's possible that they produce the Vulture and Ryoken, as both of them simply have "various" listed as their manufacturers and are pretty much universal across Clan space.
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Diplominator

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #148 on: 27 December 2014, 21:15:48 »
I've been listening to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History podcast on the (historical) Mongols and it's been interesting to compare their exploits with the Falcons under Malvina. They've certainly got the unstoppable conquerors thing down, as well as the penchant for thoroughly murdering people who don't surrender when they think they should. The Mongols also had more advanced warfare techniques than a lot of their victims because they'd been fighting China for so long. That's sort of like the Clan's tech advantage, although the Mongols had tactical and strategic brilliance that is sort of the exact opposite of the Clans.

The main thing I found interesting, though, is a point Carlin makes about what makes Genghis Khan's empire so interesting: it survived after he died. Instead of fragmenting after the death of the figure who made it, they had many other effective rulers and went on to even greater conquest.

So, now I'm wondering if that's what we'll see with Malvina. I've been sort of expecting the Falcons to get obliterated after pissing so many people off, but what if that doesn't happen? What if Malvina dies and someone just as effective takes the reins. Malvina differs from Genghis in that he wasn't batshit loco, but the comparison holds in a lot of other ways.

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Re: Clan Jade Falcon Thread II: Falcon Harder. I SAID HARDER!
« Reply #149 on: 27 December 2014, 21:28:29 »
I've been listening to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History podcast on the (historical) Mongols and it's been interesting to compare their exploits with the Falcons under Malvina.

I had written up a little bit on Malvina before - but I found more similarities to Timur than Genghis.

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/novel-and-sourcebook-reviews/bonfire-of-worlds-a-comparison-of-malvina-and-timur/




Merciless villain, peasant, ignorant
Of lawful arms or martial discipline!
Pillage and murder are his usual trades:
The slave usurps the glorious name of war.

          — Tamburliane the Great, 1.IV.i (Marlowe)

      Early in his career Timur gained the wounds that gave him the name Timur-i Lenk—Timur the Lame; two arrow wounds to his right arm and right leg. He lost the use of his elbow as well as losing his fourth and fifth fingers.  His hip seized, causing his leg to remain rigid and forever shorter than the left. Biographers such as the 14th century’s Ahmad ibn Arabshah state that Timur became a vengeful monster after these crippling wounds.

      Malvina Hazen also suffered grievous, life-altering injuries to the very same limbs—her right arm and right leg. After a defeat by Republic forces on Skye in 3134 her injured leg, arm and eye were replaced with cybernetic prosthetics. Like Timur, Malvina—already vicious and somewhat unhinged—turned into a sadistic fiend after suffering her injuries.

--------------------

      Near Tashkent in 1365 the forces of Timur and Husayn met an invading force led by the former governor of Mawarannahr, Ilyas Khoja. During the battle a terrific storm began and the battlefield turned to thick mud. Pressing hard in the mired and confused battle, Timur seized the upper hand and signaled for Husayn—nominally his commander—to bring forward his men and finish the enemy. Yet Husayn held back. The Moghul forces rushed to take advantage of this fatal mistake and swarmed through, cutting men down on all sides. Ten thousand were killed. Timur and Husayn fled the battlefield and across the Amu Darya. It was an ignominious ending, to say the least.
      For Timur, who had ambitions on a scale far beyond this small theatre of war, this battle sowed the seeds of doubt into his alliance with Husayn. How reliable was a man who refused to fight alongside his partner in battle when the fighting was at its most critical? In Timur’s mind, he had been betrayed.

          The situation was similar—or so Malvina felt—for the Falcon desant. The three Falcon Galaxies had gained numerous victories and an invaluable foothold in Republic space. However, Khan Jana Pryde held the Falcon touman back. Requests for resupply were ‘essentially unanswered’. Requests for much-needed reinforcements and replacements were met with a trickle of dregs and solahma. Malvina questioned Jana’s ability to lead the Clan and her motives for sending the desant deep into enemy territory.

--------------------

      The alliance between Timur and Husayn had been sealed with the marriage of Timur to Husayn’s sister Aljas. Her death around this time, which represented the final severance of family ties, now looked like a harbinger of destiny.

          This was somewhat mirrored by Malvina’s situation. Her brother Aleksandr’s death at the time of the perceived betrayal removed the only thing grounding her as a Clan warrior. In her mind, this also signified a final severance from Jana’s Jade Falcon proper and represented a harbinger of destiny.

--------------------

      In 1370 Timur rode south over the Amu Darya, his sights set on removing the last obstacle to supreme power in Southern Mawarannahr; Husayn. After a long fight, his former ally was defeated and executed. In deference to the traditions of Genghis Khan, by which only a man of royal blood could aspire to supreme command, Timur installed a puppet Chagatai Khan, Suyurghatmish, as nominal ruler. This was no more than a formality. All knew that power lay with Timur alone. Ahmad ibn Arabshah recorded: ‘Under his sway were ruler and subject alike … and the Khan was in his bondage, like a centipede in the mud …’
      The realities of this power sharing arrangement were underlined in a dramatic ceremony of enthronement where Timur crowned himself imperial ruler of Chagatai.
      Additionally, one of the more important spoils gained by Timur was Saray Mulk-Khanum, the wife of Husayn, who he now made his own. Daughter of Qazan, the last Chagatai Khan of Mawarannahr, she was also a princess of the Genghis line. Taking her as his wife bolstered Timur’s legitimacy. From this point on, he styled himself Timur Gurgan (son-in-law) of the Great Khan.

      Malvina performed a similar feat, defeating and slaying Jana Pryde in personal combat. She installed her fellow Galaxy Commander and advisor, Beckett Malthus, as Khan of Clan Jade Falcon. As with the Chagatai, all knew who held the reins of power despite the title. Here Beckett was very much the ‘Khan in bondage, like a centipede in the mud …’
      Malvina also gave herself a title for her new position, also in homage to the past; Chingis Khan, Emperor of all Mankind.


--------------------

      Timur’s name has gone down in history and legend as a synonym for cruelty. His string of constant battlefield successes and almost inevitable massacres that followed are the hallmark of his legacy in most of the world.
      This is in somewhat of a contrast to his ancestors. Whereas Genghis and his sons also indulged in massacres, these were usually carried out dispassionately and with a coldly calculated purpose—to terrorize foes into submission. Timur’s massacres were more frequent, more obviously sadistic and often served no apparent purpose.
      Historian John Joseph Saunders wrote succinctly: ‘Till the advent of Hitler, Timur stood forth in history as the supreme example of soulless and unproductive militarism’.

      Malvina, as we are all aware, is certainly in this league of cruelty. Like Timur, her savage massacres greatly exceeding in number and in viciousness those contributed by her predecessors.

 

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