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Author Topic: Bulldog Variants  (Read 672 times)

Coldstone

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Bulldog Variants
« on: 09 June 2022, 08:48:18 »
Well. We all know the Bulldog. Kinda cheap, with decent firepower. But it needs a whole lot of sinks, while only having an ICE Engine.

I thought of a Variant which replaces the Large Laser with an AC 10. More Firepower with the same range. To make room for the slightly heavier Turret, the Machine gun had to be sacrificed. (Or if you want to keep the Machine gun, you would have only a single ton of AC Ammo). Also the second SRM ammo bin had to be removed.
To make up for that, the Armor is slightly increased. Especially at the turret.

Code: [Select]
Bulldog Medium Tank AC10

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Motive Type: Tracked
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Age of War/Star League
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/C-D-D-C
Production Year: 2673
Dry Cost: 1.168.000 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1.207.000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 649

Power Plant: Bulldog 240 I.C.E.
Cruise Speed: 43,2 km/h
Flanking Speed: 64,8 km/h
Armor: Bulldog Standard Armor
Armament:
    1 Armstrong Buster Autocannon/10
    2 Hovertec Quad SRM-4s
Manufacturer: Bulldog Enterprises, Quikscell Company
    Primary Factory: Proserpina (Bulldog), Ares (Quikscell)
Communications System: Xilex-2000
Targeting and Tracking System: Xilex-2000

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      30 points                6,00
Engine:             I.C.E. Engine                240                      23,00
    Cruise MP:  4
    Flank MP:   6
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             0                         0,00
Control Equipment:                                                         3,00
Lift Equipment:                                                            0,00
Turret:                                                                    2,00
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 112                  7,00

                                                      Armor     
                                                      Factor     
                                               Front     25       
                                          Left/Right   21/21       
                                              Turret     25       
                                                Rear     20       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat     Spaces     Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 SRM-4s                                     T         6         2         4,00
Autocannon/10                                T         3         1        12,00
@SRM-4 (25)                                  BD        -         0         1,00
@AC/10 (20)                                  BD        -         0         2,00

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      4    Points: 6
4t         3       3       0       0      3     0   Structure:  3
Special Abilities: EE, TUR(3/3/0, AC 1/1/0, SRM 1/1/0), AC 1/1/0, SRM 1/1/0


Then I had the idea to make a modern Variation of this old warhorse. To keep up with the lowcost Idea, I used a Fuel cell engine instead of an fusion or even XL fusion. We still need a ton of sinks, but I think that it is worth it. New Main Weapon is a LArge VSPLm which has the same overall range as the Large Laser or autocannon 10, but becomes deadlier as the Tank closes. Both SRM 4s are replaced with MML 5, which make the tank more flexible. The machine gun, allthough a light version (cause of the longer reach) returns here. Armor is replaced with Heavy Ferro and the crews cries in joy, since the designers also included CASE.

Code: [Select]
Bulldog Medium Tank Modern

Mass: 60 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Motive Type: Tracked
Rules Level: Advanced Rules
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-E-D
Production Year: 0
Dry Cost: 2.927.200 C-Bills
Total Cost: 2.984.450 C-Bills
Battle Value: 713

Power Plant: Bulldog 240 Fuel Cell Engine
Cruise Speed: 43,2 km/h
Flanking Speed: 64,8 km/h
Armor: Bulldog Heavy Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  Large VSPL
    2  MML-5s
    1  Light Machine Gun
    1 Unknown CASE
Manufacturer: Bulldog Enterprises, Quikscell Company
    Primary Factory: Proserpina (Bulldog), Ares (Quikscell)
Communications System: Xilex-2000
Targeting and Tracking System: Xilex-2000

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      30 points                6,00
Engine:             Fuel-Cell Engine             240                      14,00
    Cruise MP:  4
    Flank MP:   6
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        9,00
Control Equipment:                                                         3,00
Lift Equipment:                                                            0,00
Power Amplifiers:                                                          1,00
Turret:                                                                    1,50
Armor:              Heavy Ferro-Fibrous          AV - 138                  7,00

                                                      Armor     
                                                      Factor     
                                               Front     30       
                                          Left/Right   26/26       
                                              Turret     30       
                                                Rear     26       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat     Spaces     Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Light Machine Gun                            FR        0         1         0,50
2 MML-5s                                     T         6         2         6,00
Large VSPL                                   T         10        1         9,00
CASE                                         BD        -         1         0,50
@MML-5 (LRM) (24)                            BD        -         0         1,00
@MML-5 (SRM) (20)                            BD        -         0         1,00
@LMG (1/2) (100)                             BD        -         0         0,50

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      5    Points: 7
4t         3       2       1       0      3     0   Structure:  3
Special Abilities: CASE, EE, TUR(3/2/1), IF 1

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tomaddamz

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #1 on: 16 June 2022, 19:38:26 »
Well. We all know the Bulldog. Kinda cheap, with decent firepower. But it needs a whole lot of sinks, while only having an ICE Engine.

I thought of a Variant which replaces the Large Laser with an AC 10. More Firepower with the same range. To make room for the slightly heavier Turret, the Machine gun had to be sacrificed. (Or if you want to keep the Machine gun, you would have only a single ton of AC Ammo). Also the second SRM ammo bin had to be removed.
To make up for that, the Armor is slightly increased. Especially at the turret.

Call me crazy, just use the twin AC/2 variant and replace with an AC/10, it's a one-for-one (ok, 2 AC/2s FOR A Single ac/10)
Saying that because the equipment isn't up-to-the-minute, bleeding-edge tech therefore not a threat is like saying an M2 Browning isn't dangerous to modern infantry because it is 100 years old.

kaliban

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #2 on: 21 June 2022, 07:28:07 »
One simple modification that makes sense to me is to replace one of the SRM4s for a LRM-5 and make it a poor-man Manticore with weapons to all ranges. 

glitterboy2098

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #3 on: 21 June 2022, 17:52:18 »
honestly the fact we've not gotten a canon "large laser for large AC" swap is odd, at least during the succession wars. the AC2 swap was an antiaircraft variant, but with the lower tech rate of the late succession wars i'd have expected a switch to an AC10 would be common. even if it meant having to drop an SRM or some armor.

also you don't have to drop any MG's or ammo if you swap the twin SRM4's for a single SRM6. this would let you fit in 4 tons worth of ammo.. so you could go with two tons of each for 20 AC and 30 SRm shots, or 3 tons of AC and 1 of SRM for 30 and 15 respectively.
« Last Edit: 21 June 2022, 18:12:12 by glitterboy2098 »

VhenRa

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #4 on: 23 June 2022, 04:15:39 »
also you don't have to drop any MG's or ammo if you swap the twin SRM4's for a single SRM6. this would let you fit in 4 tons worth of ammo.. so you could go with two tons of each for 20 AC and 30 SRm shots, or 3 tons of AC and 1 of SRM for 30 and 15 respectively.

Done that mod myself actually.

Atarlost

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #5 on: 23 June 2022, 07:39:36 »
honestly the fact we've not gotten a canon "large laser for large AC" swap is odd, at least during the succession wars. the AC2 swap was an antiaircraft variant, but with the lower tech rate of the late succession wars i'd have expected a switch to an AC10 would be common. even if it meant having to drop an SRM or some armor.

AC-10s are only easy if you assume you can freely change turret weight.  The Bulldog has a 1 ton turret for 9 tons of weapons.  An AC-10 is 12 tons requiring a 1.5 ton turret even if you cut the SRMs to avoid them pushing it to 2 tons.  I'm not sure what the refit rules say these days, but I suspect when the TROs with variants of 302x era tanks were being written the writers were winging it on what seemed sensible and I'm sure many thought changing turret weight in a variant was a bridge too far. 

Hptm. Streiger

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #6 on: 23 June 2022, 08:00:23 »
AC-10s are only easy if you assume you can freely change turret weight.  The Bulldog has a 1 ton turret for 9 tons of weapons.  An AC-10 is 12 tons requiring a 1.5 ton turret even if you cut the SRMs to avoid them pushing it to 2 tons.  I'm not sure what the refit rules say these days, but I suspect when the TROs with variants of 302x era tanks were being written the writers were winging it on what seemed sensible and I'm sure many thought changing turret weight in a variant was a bridge too far.
You have to set a predefined weight for the turret only when you are making an Omni Vehicle. And even if this would be an issue - the AC2 Bulldog already uses two AC2 and two SRM4 in the turret so worst case the AC10 bulldog uses the AC2 turret design.

From functional perspective two AC2s instead of the Large Laser is slightly more complicated - (ammo feed rather then energy coupling and heat sinks)





kaliban

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Re: Bulldog Variants
« Reply #7 on: 23 June 2022, 09:52:56 »
honestly the fact we've not gotten a canon "large laser for large AC" swap is odd, at least during the succession wars. the AC2 swap was an antiaircraft variant, but with the lower tech rate of the late succession wars i'd have expected a switch to an AC10 would be common. even if it meant having to drop an SRM or some armor.

also you don't have to drop any MG's or ammo if you swap the twin SRM4's for a single SRM6. this would let you fit in 4 tons worth of ammo.. so you could go with two tons of each for 20 AC and 30 SRm shots, or 3 tons of AC and 1 of SRM for 30 and 15 respectively.

different from PPCs, there is a good number of LL manufacturers during the Succession Wars. An AC/10 gives more damage for slightly less weight (even counting the a heavier turret) but the LL does not depend on ammunition making logistic easier

 

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