Register Register

Author Topic: Fortunately...  (Read 1279 times)

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Fortunately...
« on: 28 February 2021, 18:50:40 »
...Nobody got this creative during the Succession Wars.  The Savannah Master is a good example, but it was possible to scale it up a bit, and retain the single crew and relatively low price.  Of course, you could also put three Medium Lasers on it and a bit more armor too.  And Fractional Accounting would give it another 0.25 tons of armor for a separate increase in price.  You could also go whole hog and put FOUR Medium Lasers on it (with the requisite 2 HS) if you were willing to shave the armor down...

Code: [Select]
LSM-1

Mass: 15 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Motive Type: Hovercraft
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Age of War/Star League
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/C-E-D-D
Production Year: 2750
Dry Cost: 325,000 C-Bills
Total Cost: 325,000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 430

Power Plant:  65 Fusion Engine
Cruise Speed: 108.0 km/h
Flanking Speed: 162.0 km/h
Armor:  Standard Armor
Armament:
    1  Large Laser
Manufacturer:
    Primary Factory:
Communications System:
Targeting and Tracking System:

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                       8 points                1.50
Engine:             Fusion Engine                 65                       3.00
    Cruise MP:  10
    Flank MP:   15
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
Control Equipment:                                                         1.00
Lift Equipment:                                                            1.50
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  48                  3.00

                                                      Armor     
                                                      Factor     
                                               Front     19       
                                          Left/Right   10/10       
                                                Rear     9         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat     Spaces     Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Laser                                  FR        8         1         5.00

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 4
10h        1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  1
Special Abilities: ENE

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #1 on: 28 February 2021, 19:05:25 »
And of course, with a little advanced technology, it gets a little faster, a little more dangerous, and a LOT more expensive:

Code: [Select]
LSM-AT

Mass: 15 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Motive Type: Hovercraft
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-F-E
Production Year: 3070
Dry Cost: 1,176,500 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1,176,500 C-Bills
Battle Value: 658

Power Plant:  125 Fusion XL Engine
Cruise Speed: 151.2 km/h
Flanking Speed: 226.8 km/h
Armor:  Heavy Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  Snub-Nose PPC
Manufacturer:
    Primary Factory:
Communications System:
Targeting and Tracking System:

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                       8 points                1.50
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             125                       3.00
    Cruise MP:  14
    Flank MP:   21
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
Control Equipment:                                                         1.00
Lift Equipment:                                                            1.50
Armor:              Heavy Ferro-Fibrous          AV -  39                  2.00

                                                      Armor     
                                                      Factor     
                                               Front     10       
                                          Left/Right   10/10       
                                                Rear     9         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat     Spaces     Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Snub-Nose PPC                                FR        10        1         6.00

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      1    Points: 7
14h        1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  1
Special Abilities: ENE

Sabelkatten

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 6039
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #2 on: 01 March 2021, 04:07:12 »
Way back when I started playing the ML version was the "Slidder L-15", and our vehicle forces ("balanced" by tonnage) was basically (total tonnage)/15 Slidders... ::)

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #3 on: 01 March 2021, 18:43:35 »
Nice!  Feel free to post one here...  8)

DevianID

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 489
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #4 on: 02 March 2021, 02:18:10 »
I have had parallel thoughts with you Daryk about 15 ton vehicles for the succession wars.  They also only have 1 crew, which is a big deal for me since training crews is a pain.  I usually go the medium laser/armor 'trident' version you mentioned, as its about the most BV/Cbill/Ton you can get.  Also, same thing is even better on a vtol (why oh why are vtols immune to motive hits... that and the rotor 10x free armor make them statistically the best light vehicle by several margins...)

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #5 on: 02 March 2021, 04:30:00 »
AC/2s with Flak ammo are the solution to VTOLs...

And I did "Medium" APCs at 15 tons (linked in my sig block) too.  The regulars and heavies skip from squads to TWO platoons for some reason.

ringringlingling

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 126
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #6 on: 02 March 2021, 16:28:35 »
how does a 15 ton machine manage to weigh in over 400 BV?  The c-bill price is right though..

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #7 on: 02 March 2021, 20:45:07 »
Simply put: BV is not enough.

Honestly, I'm not sure that system can be saved.

Sabelkatten

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 6039
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #8 on: 03 March 2021, 03:55:06 »
how does a 15 ton machine manage to weigh in over 400 BV?  The c-bill price is right though..
Because it's pretty close to unhittable while still carrying a serious gun and useful amount of armor.

While there are a number of problems with BV, in this case the real problem is that light fusion-engine vehicles are way to powerful for their weight. Take a pair of those hovers against a Fire Javelin (same total weight, close to same BV) and my money would be on the hovers...

kaliban

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 406
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #9 on: 03 March 2021, 14:23:21 »
I would remove all the armor and place the LL in a turret.

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #10 on: 03 March 2021, 19:13:23 »
And what would you do with the rest of the tonnage?  ???

A turret for a Large Laser is only 0.5 ton...

DevianID

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 489
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #11 on: 05 March 2021, 01:37:58 »
Flak is no magic solution to VTOLS btw, not sure if you ever ran the numbers.  Its nice, sure, but so is an equal amount of medium lasers.  More of anything is always more after all.  Long ranged flak has nasty minimum ranges the VTOLs love to exploit in LVL1 btech, so you often trade -2 to hit modifiers for +3 minimum range modifiers.  Plus the other weapons usually dont want to shoot the VTOL, so you almost always end up wasting firepower (See a blackjack, the AC2s loaded with flak seems nice, but now your shooting the mlas at either a secondary penalty or at a +5 TMM vtol.)

kaliban

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 406
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #12 on: 11 March 2021, 14:40:15 »
And what would you do with the rest of the tonnage?  ???

A turret for a Large Laser is only 0.5 ton...

Small lasers?

kaliban

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 406
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #13 on: 11 March 2021, 14:43:52 »
Flak is no magic solution to VTOLS btw, not sure if you ever ran the numbers.  Its nice, sure, but so is an equal amount of medium lasers.  More of anything is always more after all.  Long ranged flak has nasty minimum ranges the VTOLs love to exploit in LVL1 btech, so you often trade -2 to hit modifiers for +3 minimum range modifiers.  Plus the other weapons usually dont want to shoot the VTOL, so you almost always end up wasting firepower (See a blackjack, the AC2s loaded with flak seems nice, but now your shooting the mlas at either a secondary penalty or at a +5 TMM vtol.)

Flak ammo and LB-Xs were not really available during most of Succession Wars. Even if they were, a stupid low-tech barrage of smoke rounds gives all you need to get your swarm of vtols close enough for the slaughter. VTOLs are totally broken if properly used in Battletech.
 

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #14 on: 11 March 2021, 19:22:50 »
Small lasers?
I could get behind Small Lasers.  I've always liked them.  Back in the day, I used to replace LRM-10s with 10 of them...  >:D

DevianID

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 489
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #15 on: 12 March 2021, 03:21:08 »
hmm, probably run out of space on the vehicle for 10 small lasers, as nasty as the hover would be with them.

Dave Talley

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3430
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #16 on: 12 March 2021, 09:05:48 »
And what would you do with the rest of the tonnage?  ???

A turret for a Large Laser is only 0.5 ton...

half a ton plus its armor
Resident Smartass since 1998
“Toe jam in training”

Because while the other Great Houses of the Star League thought they were playing chess, House Cameron was playing Paradox-Billiards-Vostroyan-Roulette-Fourth Dimensional-Hypercube-Chess-Strip Poker the entire time.
JA Baker

Daryk

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 21423
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Fortunately...
« Reply #17 on: 12 March 2021, 19:05:49 »
Armor is also a good choice.  :thumbsup:

 

Register