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Author Topic: Modified extreme and LOS range rules  (Read 661 times)

DevianID

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Modified extreme and LOS range rules
« on: 15 December 2021, 03:56:34 »
Howdy all.  In an effort to somewhat standardize weapon ranges from 'aerotech' and btech, I decided that the extreme and LOS ranges would work wonders.  In a nutshell, if something like a heavy machine gun has a 2 hex range in 'aerotech' (its not 'aerotech' any more, its Total Warfare+Strat ops aerospace rules, but 'aerotech' is my shorthand) I want to have a LOS range that matches it's 'aerotech' range.

To emulate this, using the standard extreme range rules, if a weapon doesn't have a long range it doesn't have an extreme range.  Instead, a weapon that does not normally have a long range have their extreme range damage reduced down an additional tier.
So full -> -1 dmg -> .75 dmg -> 1/2 dmg -> 1/3 dmg -> 1/6 dmg?*.  Round down per usual.  A weapon without the range for a LOS range similarly get a LOS range, but again with their damage reduced down an additional tier.  *I chose 1/6th, but if someone has a better value I will change it, as we only have actual listed damage to 1/3rds.

Thus a medium pulse laser with no normal LOS range will now have a LOS range, but instead of the pulse 1/3 LOS range damage value, it will have a 1/6th damage value as it normally doesn't get LOS range.  Often weapons will do 0 damage with this rule, making them useless against mechs, but those same small weapons often have an anti-infantry damage value that lets them do damage to infantry to LOS ranges.  IE, a small pulse laser with 2 damage, /6 for modified LOS range, rounds to 0 damage to a mech, but the small pulse laser's 2d6 infantry damage will deal between 0-2 damage to infantry out to LOS range.

All weapons LOS range is now equal to their aerotech individual weapon range.  Thus, instead of the LOS range for a medium laser being practically limitless, the LOS range for a medium laser is 12 aerotech hexes (the extreme range for an aerospace medium laser attack using the individual weapons rule), which is about 200 hexes.  In aerotech, this attack would be +6 (extreme range) and +2 (NOE), so the +8 in btech for LOS matches perfectly to the aerotech range penalty.  Damage versus ground targets at LOS range would be lower than air targets, BUT the armor on aircraft is less powerful to begin with (damage threshold) so just like real life, damage is worth more when it hits a flying target.

Weapons that cant be used in 'aerotech' do not get this improved range, as they don't have a corresponding aerotech range to match to, and they must use the normal extreme/los ranges (which they probably dont get).  This should fix some of the issues of things like sprayers shooting too far.  But if it can shoot far in aerotech, then it can shoot far in battletech.

Thoughts?

CVB

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Re: Modified extreme and LOS range rules
« Reply #1 on: 15 December 2021, 07:37:02 »
Interesting approach.
Some unsorted first thoughts:

I'm all for standardizing as much as possible between the game systems, but maybe some weapon classes should behave differently in and out of gravity and atmosphere, e.g. projectiles on a ballistic trajectory move in a curved arc on planet and straight in 0g, while beams move in a straight line but suffer from attenuation in atmosphere and and planetary curvature at extreme ranges.

Why would an explosive warhead lose damage over range?

How would you handle the infantry and light support vee equivalents of heavy weapons (SRMs, Heavy/Support Lasers, MGs etc)?

Sorry if this sounds more negative than I actually mean it, I think most of my questions can be solved.
"Wars result when one side either misjudges its chances or wishes to commit suicide; and not even Masada began as a suicide attempt. In general, both warring parties expect to win. In the event, they are wrong more than half the time."
- David Drake

I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, but I'm not willing to hang it by the neck until it's dead, dead, dead!

DevianID

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Re: Modified extreme and LOS range rules
« Reply #2 on: 16 December 2021, 00:11:46 »
Quote
Why would an explosive warhead lose damage over range?
In the extreme/LOS range rules, missile/cluster weapons instead suffer a cluster penalty instead of a damage reduction--I didn't explicitly mention the cluster portion of the rules for LOS and Extreme ranges, but I would apply the same logic.  Normal LOS cluster penalties are -3, and expanded LOS cluster ranges, for weapons without a normal LOS range like SRMs, would be -6.  If the cluster result is reduced below 0, no damage. (to emulate the rounding down to zero damage direct fire weapons suffer from)

As for in and out of atmosphere, these rules are for the 10 second 'aerotech' in atmosphere low altitude maps.  Im not touching the space range rules/1 minute high altitude rules, as those have a few issues with scaling (namely they were scaled wrong).  The 10 second Aerotech ranges, when you allow for up to 10 seconds of shell flight time, hit fairly reasonable real world distances and muzzle velocities without wrecking physics.

Infantry and light support weapons would follow the same rules, BUT keep in mind they need enough weight of fire to qualify as a cluster weapon.  Thus, 1-3 autorifles with it's .52-1.56 damage would do 0-1 damage at extreme range (.75 damage, rounded down, for by the book extreme range) and 1/3rd LOS damage (expanded LOS range damage for ballistic weapons with less than 13 hexes range).  10 autorifles, with 5 damage in 2 damage clusters, WOULD get a LOS range though, with a -6 cluster penalty per expanded LOS cluster rules.

If this sounds off, real world automatic weapons fire performs in a similar fashion at range, creating an area of effect where the bullets drop/cluster called the 'beaten zone'.  Single or small numbers of small arms cant really get the scale of fire to do this and be effective at range, you would need to drop into the RPG rules for such plucky sniper shots.

CVB

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Re: Modified extreme and LOS range rules
« Reply #3 on: 16 December 2021, 00:48:35 »
Thanks for the replies. Sounds good. I think I'll play with this a bit over the coming holidays.
"Wars result when one side either misjudges its chances or wishes to commit suicide; and not even Masada began as a suicide attempt. In general, both warring parties expect to win. In the event, they are wrong more than half the time."
- David Drake

I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, but I'm not willing to hang it by the neck until it's dead, dead, dead!

 

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