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Author Topic: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1  (Read 2631 times)

pokefan548

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Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« on: 04 October 2022, 09:11:10 »
Sartris and Cubby have begged enough, so let's go ahead and drag our wild company box speculation in here.

My first speculation, though I give it a <10% chance of actually coming to fruition, is that it might indicate, if all goes well, that CGL may decide to go ahead and distribute the Inner Sphere Retaliation pack through the CGL store. One of the biggest reasons cited why ISR hasn't been sold at retail before is that the packaging is woefully inadequate next to other BattleTech products if it were to sit on a shelf, and it would be hard to justify creating new packaging with new dimensions for a bunch of duplicates. The UrbanMech Company box is, however, a product containing 12 duplicates, shipped in a fairly plain cardboard box, really not one bit worse than what's been done for ISR.

Now, on the topic of other company boxes: I very much doubt they're going to happen aside from happy box set coincidences like the Mercenaries box set containing the appropriate model count. That said, down the line, I could see merit in faction-themed company boxes that contain a typical company-size force (or three typical lance-sized forces), ideally with a variety of record sheets and force arrangements that meet common BV or PV limits. Throw in a slip with excerpts from the relevant Force Manual, and you've got a box that has a nice, functional, thematic starter army for a new faction. While most of us could get the same just by buying a few Force Packs, I suppose it might help players familiar with 40k and other systems who are more used to buying units that are clearly separated into distinct factions and subfactions; more than a few times I've seen these players get a bit overwhelmed when told "okay, so this faction tends to prefer 'Mechs X and Y, and really strongly favor 'Mechs with Z-type weapons, but you can really use almost anything for them."

For example, for a Draconis Combine box set, you could have a Striker Lance made up of twin Panthers and Jenners, a Command/Direct Fire Lance with at least one Dragon and Grand Dragon, maybe a Crockett and Thug, and filled out with a spattering of fast mediums. Wrap it all up with a two-sided print-out with one side including a ~15k BV/~350 PV force list (and accompanying record sheets) for, say, 8th Dieron Regulars plus some of their information and Special Command Abilities, and the other side a ~20k BV/~450 PV force for the 2nd Sword of Light. Hell, if we're talking wild speculation, you could even include some paints that could be used for either command, to bring back that idea.

Anyways, that's just my two cents. Now cry bias, and let loose the hounds of speculation (in this thread and not in Upcoming Releases please and thank you)!
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bearcat

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #1 on: 04 October 2022, 09:42:55 »
Down the line I could see new campaign book products releasing with accompanying company box sets as a next step product after the the starter Boxed Sets. Enjoy the universe and and gameplay? Here's a ready to go campaign. Keep it 3 separate products so players can pick up exactly what they need/want

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #2 on: 04 October 2022, 10:14:39 »
I doubt we will see another Company product.  If CGL could get them as a tie in to the Force Manuals...  and then sell them as a $120ish force starter box for Alpha Strike maybe....  but I can't see that being preferable than just doing the same thing with three existing Lance Packs.

The UrbanMech one was clearly a joke, and it works in part because you can't buy plastic Urbi's new by any other means.

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #3 on: 04 October 2022, 10:20:01 »
The only way I could see a 'Company' box work is if it were actually a bundle of three existing Lance packs.

thedancingjoker

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #4 on: 04 October 2022, 11:00:42 »
As much as I as a customer would love a release of say a "Davion Company" when we got a sourcebook on the Fedsuns I can see why that isn't very likely to happen, it would likely not sell nearly as well to players of the other factions, and there are so many factions that any one box set probably isn't worth the time and effort. Were they to happen I would probably buy "Army Boxes" for most of the Inner sphere factions and like half the clans if they were sold, 15 / 16 mechs themed to a specific faction seems wonderful to me, maybe throw in some of the extras they made up for the CI kickstarter like a faction pin and dice. Too bad it wouldn't work out.

My one hope is that they take from this that minimal packaging direct sales can work and maybe do the Inner Sphere Retaliation pack or soemthing similar.


Colt Ward

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #5 on: 04 October 2022, 15:25:10 »
My one hope is that they take from this that minimal packaging direct sales can work and maybe do the Inner Sphere Retaliation pack or soemthing similar.

This exists?  It is/was just 10 mechs instead of a company though I do wonder if they are going to get the revision that swaps the second Wolverine for the Vindicator since it is now what is in the Beginner Box.  The Alpha Strike box might get the same treatment in 2 years or so though I think it might end up split- Alpha Strike Star & Alpha Strike Demi-Company.

I do agree that they have given clear indications they will not do generic main faction boxes, but since we got merc boxes that you could easily identify the pilots (please, Ariana Winston is not the ELH Cyclops pilot? The GDL is even more identified) digging back into ye olde vaults.  Pulling companies from old sourcebooks/material, maybe direct sales and maybe retail release . . .

 . . . seriously, put together- a Axman, Mauler, Centurion, Awesome, Summoner, Timber Wolf, Hunchback IIC, Mad Dog, Elemental BA, and . . well, IS Standard sub'd for some Infiltrators.  Would such a set really be identified with the Lyrans or more with the actual source?

The only question for the old source material companies is are they the same variants as available in plastic?
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #6 on: 04 October 2022, 16:00:28 »
As much as I think a Company box would be pretty awesome  I think it might
be better to focus on lances .

There's a lot of variables to consider here .
One of those is that there are a lot of players that have eras that they
tend to stick to . Selling a Company box that contains several mechs that
the end user will have to replace because they are not available in
their preferred era makes the lances more attractive .

My best example-The Wolf's Dragoons Assault Star .
I would have LOVED to have had a 3025 era Wolf's Dragoons Assault Lance
Force Pack . There's plenty of other sources for Timber wolves if I wanted that .

Remove the Timby and you get an Annihilator paired up with the WD Archer and-
2 mechs that don't feel alot like Wolf's Dragoons Assault mechs to me .

Me being a collector as well as a player I had to have it -but the Annihilator and Archer came out
and I'll get to the rest some day .

I imagine I'm not alone in that thinking as I've seen plenty of Annihilators
painted up on the table without the rest of the set .

I think that a company  might not sell as well because instead of players kicking out
1 or 2 , they are more likely to feel the need to replace a lance or more . Making the
buy not worth it .


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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #7 on: 04 October 2022, 16:26:57 »
 . . . besides the CGL exclusive Legends lance pack, which has a TW Pryde, the only other place to get a Timber Wolf Prime (or any TW besides the Prime until they released the TC) was the Dragoons box.  The Rifleman in there was also directly tied to 'Gentleman Jonny' Clavell, late commander of the Black Widows/Wolf Spiders after Natasha left & Mac died.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #8 on: 04 October 2022, 16:44:57 »
Annihilator    100  Tons
Archer            70  Tons
Rifleman          60 Tons
Blackjack         45 Tons
That's 275 tons if I added it correctly .
IIRC the Wolf's Dragoons Sourcebook defines that as a heavy lance . 
If a player wants an earlier era Assault Mech Lance they have to replace one .
Most players I know would replace the Blackjack .  In era the Imp would
have been fantastic -but a heavy common to the unit would have worked as well .

My point overall is that a full company might be a hard sell -but I think a lance would be easier .

Hellraiser

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #9 on: 04 October 2022, 17:13:56 »
This exists?  It is/was just 10 mechs instead of a company though I do wonder if they are going to get the revision that swaps the second Wolverine for the Vindicator since it is now what is in the Beginner Box.  The Alpha Strike box might get the same treatment in 2 years or so though I think it might end up split- Alpha Strike Star & Alpha Strike Demi-Company.
Hmm...
Combine both those ideas......
The Next "Retaliation" box of 10 is the Mercs-8 + NEW Beginners-2.
That might get some traction during a 3rd Kickstarter at some point down the road.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #10 on: 04 October 2022, 17:16:22 »
. . . besides the CGL exclusive Legends lance pack, which has a TW Pryde, the only other place to get a Timber Wolf Prime (or any TW besides the Prime until they released the TC) was the Dragoons box.  The Rifleman in there was also directly tied to 'Gentleman Jonny' Clavell, late commander of the Black Widows/Wolf Spiders after Natasha left & Mac died.
Timby is in the Clan Expansion Box right?
When/Where did Mac die?  What is the source of info on him?
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RanFelsnerAFFS

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #11 on: 04 October 2022, 17:23:36 »
When/Where did Mac die?  What is the source of info on him?

Its in Wolf Pack. He is killed during a Boarding operation to recover mothballed warships. Kicks off the Dragoons Civil War

Scotty

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #12 on: 04 October 2022, 17:44:35 »
I'd much rather see themed two-lance sets designed with a story in mind.

"Gotterdammerung" box with Zeus, Griffin, Wolfhound, and Commando, versus Catapult K2, Dragon, Panther, and Spider.  Or something similar, it doesn't have to necessarily be loaded with faction exclusives.
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Kerfuffin(925)

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #13 on: 04 October 2022, 17:52:45 »
I'd much rather see themed two-lance sets designed with a story in mind.

"Gotterdammerung" box with Zeus, Griffin, Wolfhound, and Commando, versus Catapult K2, Dragon, Panther, and Spider.  Or something similar, it doesn't have to necessarily be loaded with faction exclusives.

I think that would be ideal. That sorta mirrors the new AS box, with Clans vs IS as an obvious choice. Also 4 less mechs makes it easier to throw some cards and whatnot in as well.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #14 on: 04 October 2022, 18:00:13 »
I'd much rather see themed two-lance sets designed with a story in mind.

"Gotterdammerung" box with Zeus, Griffin, Wolfhound, and Commando, versus Catapult K2, Dragon, Panther, and Spider.  Or something similar, it doesn't have to necessarily be loaded with faction exclusives.

And then two (double-sided maps), and some scenarios..
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Kerfuffin(925)

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #15 on: 04 October 2022, 18:17:15 »
Both Scotty and nckestrels points go back to someone in a different thread mentioning a redo of the Wolf and Blake type starter boxes. Which I think thr AS box sorta does, but obviously for AS rather than TW level
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jrvk777

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #16 on: 04 October 2022, 18:48:47 »
And then two (double-sided maps), and some scenarios..

With a cardboard fold-assembly dropship.  :D

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #17 on: 04 October 2022, 19:27:18 »
That's 275 tons if I added it correctly .
IIRC the Wolf's Dragoons Sourcebook defines that as a heavy lance . 
If a player wants an earlier era Assault Mech Lance they have to replace one .

Emphasis mine, but that definition no longer matters, it has been out of date for . . . 8 years?  10 years?  at least when they started using Alpha Strike formations.

My contribution to this on the other thread is if they scale up & make them blind they would need matching (or close) BVs so folks could pick boxes off the shelf and go at it.  To be honest, I would like CGL direct company boxes that lack the fancy packaging.
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five_corparty

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #18 on: 04 October 2022, 21:08:34 »
Honestly, I -never- see CGL "officially" making a faction set.

So, to flashback a minute: in older Army doctrine, you'd find a checklist.  "these are the steps to do this task."  The Army got away from that, and I happened to be assigned to the doctrine writing section at Ft. Lee.  I asked my boss,. "why not bring it back," and he said, because junior leaders - and their evaluators- would slavishly adhere to the doctrine.  Even when terrain or other considerations OBVIOUSLY made Doctrine not work, they'd either adhere to it all, or throw it all out, neither of which is good.  instead, the Army did away with lists, so leaders will think for themselves.

So: I never see CGL making a "Davion" box, or a "kurita" box, because -that- would become the default standard.  It might well become the opposite of the longtime battletech mantras, which really is "anyone can have anything" and "whatever works on your table."

that SAID, I 100% could see -AND I AM ADDING THE SUPER BIG --IF-- THEY EVEN DECIDE TO DO THIS- them doing a famous company per faction.  Sorenson's Sabers, the Fox's teeth, Sommerset Strikers- companies associated with a nation, but NOT an official faction list.  just one famous company from a moment in time.

Coupled with a scenario and some cards, I think it's a GREAT way to introduce players to some lore and give a great deal on something bigger than a lance, but smaller and more diverse than another copy of the Alpha Strike Box set.

totally my thoughts, of course. :-)

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #19 on: 04 October 2022, 22:57:49 »
I am not proud of how quickly I would slam the BUY button on a Rolling Thunder company.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #20 on: 05 October 2022, 00:49:33 »
Its in Wolf Pack. He is killed during a Boarding operation to recover mothballed warships. Kicks off the Dragoons Civil War

I think your speaking of Mackenzie Wolf, Jamie's son.

I thought Colt was speaking of Colin Maclaren, Natasha's 2nd in the Black Widows Command Lance.

2 different "Mac" & I never heard what happened to Maclaren.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #21 on: 05 October 2022, 10:12:46 »
Can we get a company of Fire Moths? With 4 or 6 of them being the D variant?

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #22 on: 05 October 2022, 10:29:28 »
I would love to see company boxes for the great houses, maybe it could be a command, fire and recon lance taken from the new version of the combat manuals. But a Rolling Thunder, Foxes teeth, or Black Widow company would be awesome too!  :thumbsup:
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #23 on: 05 October 2022, 12:00:24 »
Give how the lances are set up & completely ignored faction for AS lance formations, I'm thinking lances are the likely way things keep going.

That said I wish the lance boxes were a bit more "focused".

Seeing a Warhammer & Wasp or Marauder & Stinger in the same lance really lacked "focus" to me, but maybe that's just me.

Nightstar + Bushmaster was even a little off.
3041: General Lance Hawkins: The Equalizers
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Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #24 on: 05 October 2022, 19:47:35 »
I would think you might be able to go with something like a company of bug mechs. 1 lance of Locusts, 1 lance of Wasps, and 1 lance of Stingers.

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #25 on: 05 October 2022, 22:53:44 »
Eww, IDK.
For every person that wants to field entire lances of a single unit or wants to paint up a wasp for every faction, there are probably loads of people that are just happing having 1-2 of some mechs to play with.

I think the most likely "Company" we see is what we already saw the AGoAC box + beginner box as a "Mechs Only" option so that people don't have to keep rebuying a full game box.

Or if we are lucky, the new AS box & NEW beginner box like I mentioned up thread.  But given are both new, I doubt we see that this KS.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #26 on: 06 October 2022, 00:46:47 »
Give how the lances are set up & completely ignored faction for AS lance formations, I'm thinking lances are the likely way things keep going.

That said I wish the lance boxes were a bit more "focused".

Seeing a Warhammer & Wasp or Marauder & Stinger in the same lance really lacked "focus" to me, but maybe that's just me.

Nightstar + Bushmaster was even a little off.

mixes of those sorts were common in the early days of the game though (and often are still in small game play where you only have lance per side), and they help distribute the figures around so that less sought after units (like a stinger) are getting paired with units that are going to be sought after more often (like a marauder), so that you don't end up with box sets that no one buys. if you did a full recon lance with all the classic lights in one place, it isn't going to sell very well because lights aren't particularly popular with players, while a box with the classic heavies would never stay on selves long at all. so spreading things out in a mix helps ensure more even sales.

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #27 on: 06 October 2022, 12:22:29 »
Don't do faction boxes, do unit boxes.  Instead of a Federated Suns box do First Davion Guards and stock it with brand new top of the line stuff from a certain point in history. 

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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #28 on: 06 October 2022, 13:02:47 »
Don't do faction boxes, do unit boxes.  Instead of a Federated Suns box do First Davion Guards and stock it with brand new top of the line stuff from a certain point in history.
While that would be great, faction boxes are already a ghost of a pipe dream. I wouldn't bet on individual combat command company boxes even if Billy Mays himself guaranteed it.
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Re: Company Boxes: Welcome to Speculation Station, Platform 1
« Reply #29 on: 06 October 2022, 14:09:06 »
While that would be great, faction boxes are already a ghost of a pipe dream. I wouldn't bet on individual combat command company boxes even if Billy Mays himself guaranteed it.

And since Billy Mays died thirteen years ago...  O:-)