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Author Topic: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?  (Read 2645 times)

elf25s

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lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« on: 17 September 2021, 07:10:25 »
after the invasion by clans how relevant is the lost tech?
you sure cannot out run death...but sure as hell you can make that bastard work for it!

klarg1

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #1 on: 17 September 2021, 07:27:29 »
after the invasion by clans how relevant is the lost tech?

By the mid 3080's I don't think any military tech is still considered "lost" in the Inner Sphere. The concept probably still applies in parts of the deep Periphery.

Some of the large scale terraforming and megaengineering technology still seems to be a thing of the past.

Elmoth

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #2 on: 17 September 2021, 07:51:43 »
Inthinknthat.might be because of how profits are distributed in the IS more than because there is a technical problem doing that. The Hegemony had infinite resources, it seems (and very easily bribed military contractors, hence so many mech designs) but the current powers are somewhat more grounded if that.

RifleMech

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #3 on: 17 September 2021, 08:38:24 »
after the invasion by clans how relevant is the lost tech?

It depends on the tech and who's buying it. It's also hard to say since there's a lot of tech we don't have rules for.

To guess, I'd say that weapons that had been replaced by 2300 by more modern versions would not be relevant post Clan Invasion. Then again if a party couldn't build or buy Gauss Rifles they may be interested in Rail Guns.

Plans for LAMs, I think, would been relevant at any time. Plans for the Thorizer maybe not so much. I think Terraforming and Medical Equipment would always be relevant. Find a way to make stasis pods and you're rich. There could also be odd prototypes that got lost. It all depends on the needs of your story.

Zraver

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #4 on: 17 September 2021, 08:56:59 »
AS others said, the terra forming and medical tech, the mega structures that were the orbital habitats. Military tech, nullsig is still mostly lost, maybe all lost with the end of Comstar/WoB. LAM's are lost, unless the DC has a secret database somewhere. When the last LAM crashes, there will be no more. Warship tech seems on its way out, so if not lost, very very rare. WoB cybernetics is a candidate as well.

Colt Ward

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #5 on: 17 September 2021, 10:09:43 »
after the invasion by clans how relevant is the lost tech?

I am going to state a couple of the assumptions my reply is built upon . . .

We are talking about military lostech.
We are talking about a campaign where some players/characters might find a lostech cache in 3080s?  or at least the rumor of one?
You are wondering if it is still going to be the emergency rush if someone gets word.

So of course the first answer to your question about lostech is going to remain the same no matter the timeframe- It depends.

Recovered Star League weapons, or even earlier ones, are not going to be paradigm shattering like they were in 3020s.  Lol, if you played HBS Battletech, remember what it was like to swat enemy mechs with a gauss rifle and that huge advantage it gave you?  In the 3080s, that will not be the case- in fact the Star League equipment (if it is not older) is not going to be as good as some of what you can possibly find if you can get past Stone's Koolaid.  A stash of Star League built Medium Pulse Lasers?  Valuable, but not as valuable as finding a missing Clan shipment of their Med Pulse Lasers.  Or VSPLs.  Or X-Pulse.  The question comes down to, did you spend more in the effort to get to & find the cache than what it saves you on the gray market or instead of spending to acquire the same resources from normal channels.

And that is if the cache is Star League.  Rim Worlds Republic, Taurian, or even Star League retired equipment caches (New Dallas?) might not contain equipment that is even up to Star League standards . . . but that would still be profitable since you found a source of equipment that gets around Stone's clamp down on equipment, as long as you did not blow more than the value of the find.  You can easily end up in a situation like the guy who says he went to the casino and won $30!  Only to find out he spent $150 . . . yeah, you won $30 but you are still in the hole $120.

Of course that does raise one other problem . . . you find a Blakist cache from when a formation went to ground to blend into the population.  You cannot just sell the equipment off if it is clearly identifiable.

Yeah, this Grigori is a bit used but it is in great condition.  According to the black box it fought for a few years before being put into storage.  Dude, it is a Omnimech- think of the possibilities that can get your force in the next contract.  Yeah, the cockpit is really a tight fit, but with a bit of work your techs can get you some more room.  Wait . . . who are these guys?  Republic Intel?  You want to ask me some questions . . .

Even parting out something that was Blakist could be trouble depending on how you want to deal with the Republic ending up with all the production records from Krupp or other places on Terra.  Really think Republic Intel does not have a large presence on Galatea?

With all that said, any cache that might have a data core cannot be ignored.  Find a data core that has the information on how to cure diseases the Star League vanquished- like leukemia- and I imagine you can buy your own dukedom in the Lyran Commonwealth.
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glitterboy2098

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #6 on: 17 September 2021, 11:15:45 »
AS others said, the terra forming and medical tech, the mega structures that were the orbital habitats. Military tech, nullsig is still mostly lost, maybe all lost with the end of Comstar/WoB. LAM's are lost, unless the DC has a secret database somewhere. When the last LAM crashes, there will be no more. Warship tech seems on its way out, so if not lost, very very rare. WoB cybernetics is a candidate as well.
Nullsig is available across the IS by the 3130's. It still isn't common since it is specialized equipment, but it isn't lostech post-jihad.

And going by lore. Warship technology is not lost, there are just only a few warship capable shipyards left, and warships are an expense that few of the factions have been willing to invest in compared to the cheaper pocket warships and such. (Many of which on the higher end like the castrum, can go toe to toe with any warship smaller than a heavy cruiser.)
« Last Edit: 17 September 2021, 16:33:21 by glitterboy2098 »

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #7 on: 17 September 2021, 13:17:48 »
At this point, the real money in SL caches might be in taking just enough to prove what it is, then going to the NAIS, IE, or some other group willing to buy the coordinates and send an archeological team.
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elf25s

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #8 on: 17 September 2021, 17:37:49 »



And that is if the cache is Star League.  Rim Worlds Republic, Taurian, or even Star League retired equipment caches (New Dallas?) might not contain equipment that is even up to Star League standards . . . but that would still be profitable since you found a source of equipment that gets around Stone's clamp down on equipment, as long as you did not blow more than the value of the find.  You can easily end up in a situation like the guy who says he went to the casino and won $30!  Only to find out he spent $150 . . . yeah, you won $30 but you are still in the hole $120.



ah more along these lines
i can see them still being valuable from historic point but not military lost tech stuff
highly unlikely to find a terraforming stuff still valuable still
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Colt Ward

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #9 on: 17 September 2021, 17:49:07 »
Terraforming database would be more useful than much of the 'stuff' since it would be engineered microbes and plants IMO.
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RifleMech

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #10 on: 17 September 2021, 17:54:24 »
To clarify my earlier post about LAMs being Lostech, unless the WoB did something, LAMs are more like Forgotten Tech than Lostech. They're only lost in that practical experience with them was lost. At least until WoB started using them. Everything else about LAMs was still available though so if someone wanted to they could build a new LAM factory and start producing new LAMs. That said, if you showed up at a manufacture with plans for a LAM I think they'd be valuable. Even the Scorpion LAM ended up being a valuable find.


In regards to selling WoB equipment, I think who comes after you and how hard depends on where you're selling it. Some groups may grill you, pay you for your find, and the location it was found and that's it. Others may do that and then recommend a new line of work. Others might just make you and the equipment disappear.
It'd be like finding a cache of Wolverine equipment. Some will think it's a great historical find and demand access to study the site. Others will be dusting off the nukes.


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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #11 on: 17 September 2021, 21:34:31 »
By the end of the 3050s, not only had all mech-scale lostech weaponry been put back into full production across the Inner Sphere, they'd also started producing weaponry that the Star League never had, like ER medium and small lasers and LB-X and Ultra autocannons of all sizes.  By the early 60s, the Inner Sphere was widely producing weapons and equipment that was never done by the Star League, like Rotary autocannons, Stealth Armor, and Light Engines.
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Colt Ward

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #12 on: 17 September 2021, 21:38:56 »
By the end of the 3050s, not only had all mech-scale lostech weaponry been put back into full production across the Inner Sphere, they'd also started producing weaponry that the Star League never had, like ER medium and small lasers and LB-X and Ultra autocannons of all sizes.  By the early 60s, the Inner Sphere was widely producing weapons and equipment that was never done by the Star League, like Rotary autocannons, Stealth Armor, and Light Engines.

Which is why I say it still has value, but it is not the 'OMG, amazeballs!  That gun just took the side off a heavy mech in one shot!' of 3020s.
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #13 on: 17 September 2021, 22:01:34 »
A cache/construction data of Headhunter missiles might still be highly desirable ( if they actually are/were real).
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #14 on: 18 September 2021, 03:27:23 »
Regarding LAM, I am quite surprised the Outworlds alliance has not secured at least the stinger lam (the one with most recent production) for their forces. I know thebnova cata were adamant about them being ansthema so they razed irece, but that read as bollocks to me as in "we fear a lawsuit" not anything that had to do with clan doctrine.

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #15 on: 18 September 2021, 04:48:42 »
By the end of the 3050s, not only had all mech-scale lostech weaponry been put back into full production across the Inner Sphere, they'd also started producing weaponry that the Star League never had, like ER medium and small lasers and LB-X and Ultra autocannons of all sizes.  By the early 60s, the Inner Sphere was widely producing weapons and equipment that was never done by the Star League, like Rotary autocannons, Stealth Armor, and Light Engines.


There could be weapons that that were being researched and developed but were lost to even Kerensky.



A cache/construction data of Headhunter missiles might still be highly desirable ( if they actually are/were real).

 :thumbsup:


Regarding LAM, I am quite surprised the Outworlds alliance has not secured at least the stinger lam (the one with most recent production) for their forces. I know thebnova cata were adamant about them being ansthema so they razed irece, but that read as bollocks to me as in "we fear a lawsuit" not anything that had to do with clan doctrine.


I am surprised by a lot of things regarding LAMs. I understand why we didn't see them for so long. I don't understand why more couldn't be done with them now. There should be other variants and Successor State upgrades with recovered tech and newly created tech. There should have been at least attempts to create new LAM factories. Not just after the 4th Succession War but ever since then. I don't think LAMs should be extinct at all really. Sure, advanced tech has stolen a lot of their spotlight, but they're still effective in their roles. LAMs can still do things the others can't, like fly away and get into orbit on their own. And for the price tag, they're a bargain.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #16 on: 18 September 2021, 10:39:29 »

There could be weapons that that were being researched and developed but were lost to even Kerensky.

Theoretically, but that's vanishingly unlikely.
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #17 on: 18 September 2021, 16:37:42 »
Theoretically, but that's vanishingly unlikely.
Didn't the Royal PXH have a snubnose PPC?  That may have been lost to Kerensky, since it was so rare and never showed up as a Clan weapon.

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #18 on: 18 September 2021, 16:42:23 »
Didn't the Royal PXH have a snubnose PPC?  That may have been lost to Kerensky, since it was so rare and never showed up as a Clan weapon.

The ‘Special Royal’ had one and extra armor.

It was on his Orion, so it’s not like he didn’t know about it. I imagine it just got left by the wayside with how good they made their regular (er) PPCs

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #19 on: 18 September 2021, 17:02:58 »
It also showed up on at least a few SLiE Falcons.

Combined with just how good the Clans managed to do with their ER PPCs, Nikky's influence on preferring longer ranged combat might have also lead to the abandoning of the SNPPCs.
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nova_dew

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #20 on: 18 September 2021, 17:34:33 »
Other than civilian tech like people have mentioned the only thing I can think of is clps that even WoB had to reinvent as void sig
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #21 on: 18 September 2021, 17:52:33 »
Other than civilian tech like people have mentioned the only thing I can think of is clps that even WoB had to reinvent as void sig
CLPS is used on multiple mechs in the IS by the 3100's.

and the WOB developed the Void Signature System as a way to get CLPS and Nullsig type abilities in a cheaper and easier to make fashion. they still had CLPS and null sig tech, it was just harder for them to manufacture those than Void Sig.

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #22 on: 18 September 2021, 18:03:07 »
I think more so that scarity of military tech between 3085 to 3145.   You have remember that the Republic of the Sphere pushed a Inner Sphere why military down build.

Much of the armies of the Inner Sphere did not rebuild in same way they were.  Mercenary units, especially smaller ones went extinct with not much work or not ability recap gear.  It was hard times, but not necessary unusual hard to get military grade gear, especially Mechs.   

Star League Cache, even Succession Wars Era grade gear can be made to rebuild units and be refitted to modern standard.

I can't imagine there much out there, but they're maybe some.  Perhaps in the Periphery or dead worlds.
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #23 on: 18 September 2021, 19:01:22 »
While 'lost tech' would no long be considered 'lost,' it's defiantly still reliant considering how many machines still carries those weapons and tech. The SCG-WF1 Scourge is primary tech you would find in the SL era, the Actuator Enhancement System is the only more advance piece of tech on the model.

So would something like a Brain Cache be valuable? It's still a bunker full of guns and supplies so defiantly, we are still talking about a universe where salvage rights are usually part of a mercs contract, good equipment is good equipment.
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #24 on: 18 September 2021, 19:26:07 »
If they ever reintroduce LAMs, I will  assume that it’s ray signaling that he has been kidnapped

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #25 on: 18 September 2021, 19:47:01 »
Is this a subtle hint for LAM fans?  ;D
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #26 on: 18 September 2021, 19:51:52 »
No inside information but I feel like the WoB LAMs were that ex you never got over that drunk dialed you years after breaking up only to ghost you again

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #27 on: 18 September 2021, 23:27:30 »
It also showed up on at least a few SLiE Falcons.

Combined with just how good the Clans managed to do with their ER PPCs, Nikky's influence on preferring longer ranged combat might have also lead to the abandoning of the SNPPCs.

Even for the Clans I believe it was still Experimental technology, too.
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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #28 on: 19 September 2021, 00:22:49 »
the PHX-HK1R created several headaches regarding the SNPPC, none of which have been officially resolved.

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Re: lost tech how relevant is it after 3085?
« Reply #29 on: 19 September 2021, 04:19:31 »
Theoretically, but that's vanishingly unlikely.


That's true but we could always be surprised.


Other than civilian tech like people have mentioned the only thing I can think of is clps that even WoB had to reinvent as void sig


Some one could have created fully working Heavy LAMs and Quad LAMs. Or Star Empire Shield Generators. Or something else. It's unlikely but it could have happened.



If they ever reintroduce LAMs, I will  assume that it’s ray signaling that he has been kidnapped

Fortunately for Ray, LAMs can mount enough com equipment to cut through a lot of jamming.

I also don't know that LAMs would disrupt thing's that much. They've been nerfed into submission, and there's enough advance tech to give them a run for their money even if they weren't. Plus there's QuadVees. I think it'd be interesting to see them paired up.



 

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