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BattleTech Game Systems => General BattleTech Discussion => Topic started by: Weirdo on 20 February 2016, 11:14:50

Title: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: Weirdo on 20 February 2016, 11:14:50
Working on an undersea scenario. Does anybody know if the record sheets for the Manta, Moray, or non-H-K Neptune subs have been published anywhere?
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: Weirdo on 20 February 2016, 11:34:16
Secondary question: I'm using BV to get the desired force ratios. Does it sound fair to cut in half the BV of any unit that lacks submarine or UMU MP, to represent their very low mobility?
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: scatcat on 20 February 2016, 11:48:26
Doesn't BV take movement into account? Why not recalculate BV using each unit's effective underwater speed? Seems a more accurate solution.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: cavingjan on 20 February 2016, 11:53:18
If you are going that route, I would consider including new weapon calculations unless you are not using weapons that cannot fire underwater.

I'll check this afternoon to see if they were published.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: Weirdo on 20 February 2016, 11:56:42
Doesn't BV take movement into account? Why not recalculate BV using each unit's effective underwater speed? Seems a more accurate solution.

Too much work. I'm hoping for a quick 'good enough' solution.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: GreekFire on 20 February 2016, 12:07:33
I've looked for them before, and I'll save you the trouble of hunting through every product - those sheets don't exist. Bit of a shame. You gotta build them by hand.

As for the BV thing...I'd say do it on a case by case basis. Standard engine 'Mechs with longer-ranged, energy-based weapons (ERPPCs, cERLLs, etc) do fine underwater, although you have to plan around their "turret" locations. They work quite well as a secondary line of defense versus more mobile SRT-spammers, so that makes me feel like 'Mechs such as the Banshee -3Mr should cost more than half of their BV. Then, of course, there's stuff like the Blackjack -OU. It might lack UMUs, but it's still one of the largest underwater threats you can bring to the table. Max BV for that one; its jump jets might be useless, but Harjel doesn't cost any BV and yet is an invaluable asset to any underwater unit.

If you're willing to get a bit nitty gritty, you can use a 'Mech design program to help you out. It's not that hard; drop the engine to the smallest possible (moving them 1/2), ditch any weapons or systems that don't work underwater, then use that new BV. So that Banshee -3Mr, for example, would cost 1308 BV. This isn't perfect, and completely falls apart if you're using 'Mechs that don't have any guns with any range at all, but it's a decent way of getting slightly more accurate BVs. I've done it before and it works well enough.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: Weirdo on 20 February 2016, 12:22:30
Situational makes sense. The units in question so far are an Avatar U, Archangel Eminus, and maybe a pair of Purifier PPC squads, depending on how a rules question gets answered. Probably looking at some sealed Rommels, haven't decided yet.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: cavingjan on 20 February 2016, 12:33:31
Galtor and RetroTech are the only two sources of submarine record sheets at this time.
Title: Re: Submarine record sheets?
Post by: mbear on 22 February 2016, 10:04:30
Too much work. I'm hoping for a quick 'good enough' solution.
Well, energy weapon ranges are reduced to ~2/3 of their non-underwater range so maybe you can reduce the BV of predominantly energy weapon equipped 'Mechs to 2/3?