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Does Anyone Use Them?

Life is Cheap
3 (16.7%)
Professionals are Affordable
5 (27.8%)
Ignorable Medical Bills: Priceless
4 (22.2%)
Hellbie in Surgical Scrubs
6 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 18

Author Topic: Medic!  (Read 2264 times)

Goose

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Medic!
« on: 06 August 2022, 17:50:47 »
I am only slowly realizing “we don’t know what factions use medics in their infantry, habitually.” :-\

It’s so undocumented, I would believe it’s only a Merc thing if told so: Mercs function on their morale, after all. Surely it not just a Canopian thing.
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Empyrus

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #1 on: 06 August 2022, 17:58:27 »
I would assume all factions use medics in infantry (well, maybe not some Clans, kinda uncertain), it is just it is not a thing that matters on tabletop scale so it gets ignored or otherwise goes unmentioned.

I mean, this same question can be extended to logistical support vehicles and combat engineering. It is never mentioned, though we got stats and rules for such.

Also, TRO3085 infantry units are usually available to all or most factions in MUL. Eg the MoC Field Medic is IS General for most eras. Infantry rules are abstract enough "faction units" can be used for nearly anyone.
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AlphaMirage

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #2 on: 06 August 2022, 18:10:04 »
Yeah everyone has medics, TI think it might be Tech manual has rules for paramedics in a formation

Empyrus

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #3 on: 06 August 2022, 18:37:46 »
Yeah everyone has medics, TI think it might be Tech manual has rules for paramedics in a formation
TacOps AUE page 153 or so, along with other special infantry.
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #4 on: 06 August 2022, 19:17:27 »
The problem with infantry vs mechs is that there's frequently not much the medic can do but attempt to identify the body based on x-rays of the feet.
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mikecj

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #5 on: 06 August 2022, 21:51:33 »
Dogtags in the 3150 era are made from Black Boxes (from airplanes).  pity no one thought to make armor from them...
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RifleMech

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #6 on: 06 August 2022, 22:50:13 »
I want to but I usually forget about them.  :-[   Plus, other than TacOps I can't remember where the rules are for calculating how many are needed per unit size.  xp

Daryk

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #7 on: 07 August 2022, 05:52:08 »
I think those rules were in the OG StratOps, but have probably moved to CampOps.

PuppyLikesLaserPointers

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #8 on: 07 August 2022, 09:45:51 »
Why you fight for your captain if you are expected to be left to dead if you are wounded? I think that the exceptional medical support is a must.

Also it would helps you if your enemy is evil enough to bring some biochemical weapons.

RifleMech

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #9 on: 07 August 2022, 19:28:09 »
I think those rules were in the OG StratOps, but have probably moved to CampOps.

Thanks. I'll try there.

Hellraiser

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #10 on: 07 August 2022, 20:04:35 »
Infantry rules are abstract enough "faction units" can be used for nearly anyone. 
This, most any infantry has "similar" clones in other nations.
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Hellraiser

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #11 on: 07 August 2022, 20:09:17 »
I want to but I usually forget about them.  :-[   Plus, other than TacOps I can't remember where the rules are for calculating how many are needed per unit size.  xp

I want to say it was only 1 per platoon.
You replaced one of the support soldier slots w/ a medic.

The Canopus unit is only squad sized & IIRC is more focused on being multiple medics.
The fluff calls it 1/7 men but there are only 5 weapons in the squad, so to me that is 2/7.
They say most armies its 1/20 but again at CBT scale it would be 1/platoon regardless of platoon size.

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five_corparty

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #12 on: 07 August 2022, 21:53:25 »
Yup, EVERY "general" infantry unit is available to EVERY faction, with only stuff like "branth riders" available to specific houses

FWIW, in "Those That Stand High" (available on Amazon in BattleCorps Anthology 7: Kill Zone) there's a medic embedded in a Mountain-infantry company on-screen briefly before, well... let's just say taking Terra was a rough battle and leave it at that.  xp xp

RifleMech

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #13 on: 08 August 2022, 19:02:55 »
I want to say it was only 1 per platoon.
You replaced one of the support soldier slots w/ a medic.

The Canopus unit is only squad sized & IIRC is more focused on being multiple medics.
The fluff calls it 1/7 men but there are only 5 weapons in the squad, so to me that is 2/7.
They say most armies its 1/20 but again at CBT scale it would be 1/platoon regardless of platoon size.


Thanks.  :) That's what I remembered. It's how many for the rest of the unit that I couldn't remember.  :( Daryk had it though. It's in CampOps.  :thumbsup:

Daryk

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #14 on: 12 August 2022, 23:11:02 »
Just glad I could help!  :thumbsup:

Scotty

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #15 on: 12 August 2022, 23:15:51 »
Medics embedded in infantry platoons do exactly dick at the Total Warfare level, both due to the incredible lethality of every weapon involved to a person-sized target, and because the game is over in a minute and change.  Their only practical application is in campaign play, where they have meaningful rules.

I wouldn't even bother trying to represent their effects at Total Warfare level, it's not worth it.
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pokefan548

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #16 on: 12 August 2022, 23:26:12 »
Medics embedded in infantry platoons do exactly dick at the Total Warfare level, both due to the incredible lethality of every weapon involved to a person-sized target, and because the game is over in a minute and change.  Their only practical application is in campaign play, where they have meaningful rules.

I wouldn't even bother trying to represent their effects at Total Warfare level, it's not worth it.
They could potentially have some use in a game where casualties affect victory. Run your match and then make your dead vs. truly dead rolls after, factoring that into total casualties. Even then, though, unless there's a strong narrative reason to do it that way, you're rearranging deck chairs on the titanic. It probably won't make-or-break many matches.
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Scotty

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #17 on: 12 August 2022, 23:30:44 »
I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where "number of truly dead versus number of mostly dead infantry" decides it being a fun scenario to play, tbh.
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pokefan548

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #18 on: 13 August 2022, 03:54:49 »
I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where "number of truly dead versus number of mostly dead infantry" decides it being a fun scenario to play, tbh.
If playing a scenario based around a given conflict, one side could have an objective to try to survive with enough personnel for later events in the conflict to still take place (or could make it an optional objective with a number of victory points).
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #19 on: 13 August 2022, 09:46:51 »
The damage inflicted on Battletech scale would mean that "mostly dead" infantry wouldn't be fit for duty for weeks at the very least.
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Scotty

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #20 on: 13 August 2022, 10:19:24 »
I meant more that the absurdly swingy and generally lethal-in-job-lots quality of anti-infantry weapons in BattleTech either means that the numbers are going to be so far apart that a medic isn't going to help much, or the total numbers of infantry are going to be so low that the you might as well have just skipped straight to the medic checks to see who won without bothering to play the game.

If you're playing with eyes toward another scenario, that's well into "Not Total Warfare" anyway.
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Empyrus

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #21 on: 13 August 2022, 10:29:00 »
Oddly enough, infantry is actually more likely to be wounded than dead. When doing post-game destroyed checks under Campaign Operations rules (page 198), each infantry casualty is actually only wounded on a result of 7+. -2 to TN if "killed" by Tear Gas or other less-lethal weapons. Up to 10 individuals per paramedic equipment or paramedics can add -1 to TN for checks.
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Sir Chaos

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #22 on: 13 August 2022, 12:11:51 »
They could potentially have some use in a game where casualties affect victory. Run your match and then make your dead vs. truly dead rolls after, factoring that into total casualties. Even then, though, unless there's a strong narrative reason to do it that way, you're rearranging deck chairs on the titanic. It probably won't make-or-break many matches.

The presence of medics could also affect the survival chances, or the recovery time, of other wounded - such as mechwarriors. With serious injuries, every minute, even second, can count.

Like, for every uninjured medic on the field at the end of the scenario, one injured personnel (mechwarrior, vehicle crew or infantry) is treated as if they had taken one less hit than they actually did - meaning that seriously wounded personnel will be back sooner, and/or lightly wounded (one pilot hit) will be treated as if they weren´t injured at all and go straight back to service.
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Daryk

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #23 on: 13 August 2022, 12:17:40 »
Minutes are eternities at TW scale.  Campaign play is squarely where Medics belong.

Scotty

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #24 on: 13 August 2022, 16:47:39 »
The presence of medics could also affect the survival chances, or the recovery time, of other wounded - such as mechwarriors. With serious injuries, every minute, even second, can count.

Like, for every uninjured medic on the field at the end of the scenario, one injured personnel (mechwarrior, vehicle crew or infantry) is treated as if they had taken one less hit than they actually did - meaning that seriously wounded personnel will be back sooner, and/or lightly wounded (one pilot hit) will be treated as if they weren´t injured at all and go straight back to service.

This is already beyond the scope of a Total Warfare game, which is my entire point.
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RifleMech

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #25 on: 15 August 2022, 14:27:40 »
Just glad I could help!  :thumbsup:

 :thumbsup:



Medics aren't Tournament Lega but Tournament Legal doesn't deal with the aftermath of the battle. It's mission kill and done. Mostly dead vs truly dead are more for campaigns. Sure you can Tournament your way through linked scenarios but the results will be different when advanced units like medics are included. The change the make up of infantry during the fight as the remove secondary weapons. Their presence can also change the make up of infantry in future fights as they can return mostly dead back to duty. The truly dead stay dead. Or turn into zombies, which is a problem for everyone.  :))



Failure16

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #26 on: 15 August 2022, 19:01:02 »
Medics shouldn't even be tracked as a part of a platoon's combat power (i.e. reducing a squad or platoon slot for the combat medic). It should be a check-box with associated bonuses or rules. Tonnage and seating be damned--the troopers will find Doc a spot in their track, believe me.
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Daryk

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #27 on: 15 August 2022, 19:02:30 »
If you spring for the quarter ton paramedic gear, I'm pretty sure it comes with a free seat for the medic...  ^-^

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #28 on: 15 August 2022, 19:09:12 »
No, the free seat became Lostech during the Succession Wars.
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Daryk

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Re: Medic!
« Reply #29 on: 15 August 2022, 19:12:22 »
Ah, that's where the Rumble Seat must have come from then...  :D

 

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