Author Topic: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman  (Read 22845 times)

Dakkagor

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Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« on: 11 March 2016, 08:41:52 »
Hey everybody, did the news get around
About a guy named Butcher Pete
Oh, Pete just flew into this town
And he’s choppin’ up all the women’s meat


History

The Hatchetman is a lot of firsts.  It was the first sign of early cooperation between the Lyran Commonwealth and the Federated Suns, as it was produced and initially garrisoned in Lyran space but designed by the New Avalon Institute of Science and the enigmatic Dr B. Banzai.  It was the first mech designed explicitly for melee combat, with a five ton hatchet as one of its primary weapon systems. (interestingly, as first published in 3025 it had five additional heat sinks and the 'hatchet' had no special rules, meaning it was a melee 'mech before there where rules for being a melee 'mech.)  It was part of a batch of new mechs produced by the various houses before the recovery of the Gray Death Memory Core, making it a 'first in centuries' design, and it is the first Mech to make use of a full head ejection system.  Eventually the design would be deployed on both sides of the Federated Commonwealth, find its way into DCMS service, and even end up being produced in Taurian space.

Butcher Pete’s got a long sharp knife
He starts choppin’ and don’t know when to stop
All you fellas gotta watch your wives
‘Cause Pete don’t care whose meat he chops


Base variant

A 45 ton medium, the Hatchetman makes use of a Chariot type II standard frame and is coated in six and a half tons of Durallex medium plate, which leaves it thinly armoured in more than a few places.  A GM 180 engine provides power and a top speed a smidge below 65 Kph.  Rounding out the base chassis is a set of Luxor 2/Q jump jets, providing 120 meters of jump distance.  Weapons wise it has the eponymous hatchet in the right arm, a medium laser in each arm, and a class ten autocannon tucked snugly into the right torso.  Two tons of ammo in the centre torso are designed for quick reloading just like the Enforcers clip fed system, but mean any ammunition brew up is going to cost you the Mech.  An additional heatsink helps the mech run cool when firing its weapons.

Ever since Pete flew into town
He’s been havin’ a ball
Just cuttin’ and choppin’ for miles around
Single women, married women, old maids and all


Other variants

The hatchetman has seen a lot of tinkering over the years, with ten variants being listed right up to the dark ages.

HCT-5S : This is the lostech upgrade we where 'treated' to in 3050, and its, well, its a bit of a mess. An XL engine frees up space for weaponry upgrades: three medium pulse lasers replace the paired mediums, spread across each arm and the left torso.  The autocannon is replaced with an LBX-10, and the armour is upgraded to 8.5 tons of ferro-fibrous, fixing one of the original complaints of the design.  It loses a heatsink to these upgrades, and a ton of autocannon ammunition.  Case has been added, which atleast means that if the ammo brews up you won't lose the whole machine.
The problems come when you try to use this big ol' pile of lemons.  One ton of reloards for the LBX is punitive, and the pulses do no favours to your heat curve.  In many ways its an even more extreme machine than the 3F, a dedicated mugger that simply cannot operate for too long from supply lines and has to keep a ready eye on both armour and heat.  This is the last design to make use of single heat sinks: all future designs make use of double strength freezers.

HCT-5D and HCT-6D debuted in 3062, and both diverged from the 5S significantly.  The 5D retains the XL engine and replaces all weapons (except the hatchet) with an ultra ten autocannon and an extended range medium laser.  These weapons are linked to a targeting computer.  This design screams 'Davion' at the top of its lungs, and is a nasty piece of work in any firefight. However, it is only protected by 7 tons of standard armour, combined with the XL engine, that means this design has a real glass jaw.  It can dish it out, but just can't take it.  The 6D is an almost complete rebuild: it has an endo steel frame and a XL 225 rated engine, propelling it to 86kph with 5 jump jets to lift it over obstacles.  It pairs this with 9.5 tons of standard armour, making it one of the most heavily defended Hatchetmen.  Its weaponry is also excellent: a devastating Rotary five autocannon, three extended range medium lasers (none interfering with the hatchet arm) and the classic hatchet itself.  As the cherry on this Whipped Cream Sunday of Pain, it also mounts Guardian ECM. Faster, better armoured and better armed, this chassis really shows what you can do with advanced tech.  Just watch your heat soak: ten heat sinks do not cover a full jumping alpha.

The HCT-5DD seems to be a bastard offspring of both the 5D and 6D, and tries to make the best of both designs.  Built almost exactly the same as the 6D, the ultra ten of the 5D gives way to a rotary 2 autocannon, with the single ER medium laser retained.  Both weapons are linked to a targeting computer, and the whole package is wrapped in ten tons of standard plate.  The one chink in its armour is a lack of case: with two tons of rotary ammo, any ammunition explosion is going to leave the pilot rocketing clear of a nearly 7 million C-Bill cloud of debris.  One benefit to the design is the  heat curve: its almost impossible to get this baby hot.  Spam the autocannon as much as you like.

The HCT-6S is Defiance industries take on an upgraded 5S, and is a very solid upgrade.  For a start, it sidegrades the XL to a light, and reclaims tonnage from the medium pulses by upgrading them to ER mediums.  The new engine comes with double heat sinks, and the LBX autocannon gains a much needed additional ton of ammo.  Armour remains an acceptable 8.5 tons of ferro-fibrous.  This is a solid upgrade, available during the civil war from 3064 onwards, and is a very capable brawler. 

Across the border, Independence Weaponry in Combine space developed their own variant for the Samurai of the DCMS.  Dropping the 'inelegant' hatchet for a sword, the HCT-5K also uses an XL engine to add weaponry.  It has two medium pulses, an ER medium and an MRM 30.  This design also has 9 tons of armour, and a C3 slave.  As part of a C3 enabled lance this machine is a fearsome little spotter as it really, really wants to get close and give the rest of its lance the improved targeting data.  Available from 3070 onwards, this design showcases that even when pandering to its Samurai, the Combine is eager to make use of the powerful C3 system.

On the other side of the 'sphere, House Marik was tinkering with captured 5S Hachetmen and produced the HCT-6M.  The major changes to the design are the replacement of the LBX autocannon with a Heavy PPC, a beagle active probe and an additional heatsink.  This is another difficult machine to use effectively: the pulse lasers and hatchet demand you close, while the heavy PPC would prefer you stand about 120 meters away.  It seems to be more geared to offensive action than defensive action, rooting out hiding units then attacking at a range of its pilots choosing.

The HCT-7S is a Jihad design, mounting for weapons a MML 9 and two ER medium lasers.  A hybrid of previous design ideas, it mounts a 225 light engine, ferro fibrous armour and uses standard structure.  Guardian ECM helps it close and disrupt Blakist C3I networks when it gets to its target, and its getting there a bit faster than the base Hatchetman thanks to its larger engine.  Three tons for the MML allow you to contribute meaningfully at most ranges, but is nasty up close, with the MML producing more damage than an LBX cluster shot at close range and almost the same amount at long range.

Finally we have the Dark Age Variants.  The 7D is a bit of an enigma, as I have no data on it at all apart from that it uses armoured components, dropping weaponry to achieve this.  Any further details are left to the imagination.  The HCT-7R (R for Republic!) is a variant developed by the Republic after the Capellan Crusades.  Another light engined 85km/h machine, it mounts jump jets for a 150 metre range leap and 8.5 tons of ferro-fibrous armour.  It retains the hatchet, but also mounts a medium X-Pulse laser and six medium lasers in the left arm.  This variant makes use of the Actuator Enhancement System, giving its arm weaponry superior accuracy comparable to a targeting computer, but affecting the melee weapon as well.  This is a mean devil in a firefight. 

Finally, we have two canon custom configurations, both used by Mech warrior Austin of the elite Fox Teeth.  The 3039 3F variant mounts an experimental NAIS LBX autocannon, and three medium lasers all concentrated in the left arm.  Quite why any future variant mounts a medium laser in with the hatchet after the deployment of this test bed is an enduring mystery.  The upgraded variant is the Austin 5S, this is pretty much a Lyran 6S, again with all the ER mediums concentrated in the left arm.

Deployment and manufacturers

The Hatchetman has been used all over the Sphere and seemingly beyond, and is manufactured by every Great House except the Capellans after a certain point, with even the Republic of the Sphere getting in on the action.  The profusion of variants and updates have kept this mech hacking away at its enemies right up until the Dark Ages, where it can still be found lurking in cities and woods, waiting to mug an unwary opponent. 

Tactical and Strategic use

As you would guess from a jumping, melee armed machine, the Hatchetman is best used in the close confines of urban areas or broken terrain such as canyons or forests, where its lack of armour is offset by its manoeuvrability.  Strategically, assigning this machine to urban garrisons is a smart plan, as its main gun generally requires ammunition and have small bins.  The later variants, which pick up some more speed and have less of a glass jaw, can be used in more open environments as a more conventional medium trooper, but to get the best out of this 45 ton maniac, you want to be looking your enemy right in the cockpit before you smash it clean off.

Countermeasures

The best way to stop a Hatchetman is to get it out in the open and hammer it.  Generally lightly armoured and with explosive internals somewhere, a good salvo can put one down if you are lucky.  Advancing into a city in echelon, with units covering each others blind spots, is the best way to force a Hatchetman to either retire and find easier pickings, or go for a death-or-glory attack.  Ironically, one good counter is your own, bigger, nastier melee mech.  Send in a Nightsky or Axman to hunt it down, and turn the tables.  Some of the larger scout hunters like the Wraith can also make short work of it thanks to its less than ideal armour load and comparatively low speed.

That Butcher Pete is a crazy man
Tries to chop down the wind and the rain
Just hacks on anything he can get
Say, turn this record over, you ain’t heard nothing yet!


Final thoughts

I've always loved melee mechs, the appeal of them is undeniable.  But they are tricky beasts to use, none more so than the first melee mech.  But if you are looking for something that is a lot of fun to harass an enemy with, threatening him with a bit of hatchet-to-face action, you can't go far wrong with a Hatchetman.
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vidar

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #1 on: 11 March 2016, 10:07:23 »
I will always remember a set of early games set as ladder campaign.  I was DCMS vs the Davion players,  and they "found" an extra Lance Hatchmen after I mugged the assault Lance in the city.  Nasty city fighters, but the AC just did make it.  I as using mostly lances of Panthers and they were hunting big mechs as a unit.  So they took to using the salvaged Lords lights to replace the AC.  That was a nasty hot field refit.  The number Of Panther with hatch scars in that campaign was insane.

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #2 on: 11 March 2016, 11:59:05 »
An excellent article! I didn't realise there was so many Hatcheman variants and that the DCMS had made their own take on it as well.  Well written, entertaining and educational :)
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nckestrel

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #3 on: 11 March 2016, 12:18:01 »
The Hatchetman has also suffered from being first to a melee weapon.  It's never really optimized for it.  From putting a medium laser in the arm with the hatchet, to an IS XL engine on a slow 'mech, to never matching TSM with the hatchet.  The Hatchetman always seems a bit gimped. 
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sadlerbw

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #4 on: 11 March 2016, 13:03:52 »
I must admit, that I am a diehard Hatchetman/Axman fan. That said, I've often found the best way to use one is to largely ignore the hatchet. It doesn't do THAT much damage, and using the hatchet-arm laser and kicking usually ends up doing more damage than actually using the hatchet if you are in melee range. I almost feel guilty when I actually use the hatchet...but I do it anyway half the time because it is fun to imagine!

I actually like the -5S better than the original, but freely admit that it likes to disappear in a puff of logic after a couple solid hits. With the 5S, I basically never stop jumping. Between the cluster ammo and the pulse lasers, the modifiers for jumping don't hurt so bad, and if you can also use cover it helps even more. It isn't fast enough to really be a flanker, but it can usually keep up with the line units and keep it's mods high enough not to be an easy target compared to lumbering heavies and assaults nearby. Once in close, it becomes a backstabbing threat, or a good defense against sneaky lights. The key is just to keep jumping and keep that to-hit mod as high as you can. The minute you slow down, things tend to get bad.

The -6S and -7S are probably my favorites, but if I'm honest, I rarely turn down a hatchetman no matter what the variant!

SteelRaven

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #5 on: 11 March 2016, 13:40:11 »
The major problem with the Hatchetman, in fiction and in game, is how some people use it. They see that hatchet, forget all about that Class 10 AC and start swinging like Leeroy Jenkins.


The Hatchetman is a good skirmish mech and very good partner with the Enforcer or Griffin, just don't charge across the open battlefield like your a Viking Berserker (thats what the Berserker was designed for) 
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #6 on: 11 March 2016, 14:35:05 »
The Hatchetman is a fun mech, but I typically like using the Nightsky better- that boost to speed is just too useful for a melee oriented mech.
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garhkal

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #7 on: 11 March 2016, 14:43:24 »
An excellent article! I didn't realise there was so many Hatcheman variants and that the DCMS had made their own take on it as well.  Well written, entertaining and educational :)

I was also surprised at how many versions there are.  And further surprised so many stuck with the big boom stick in the torso and lasers in arms with the hatchet.. 

Quote
The major problem with the Hatchetman, in fiction and in game, is how some people use it. They see that hatchet, forget all about that Class 10 AC and start swinging like Leeroy Jenkins.

Good point raven.  Imo the hatchet is more of a 'IF needed" item on the hatchetman cause of the AC and lasers.

Quote
The Hatchetman is a fun mech, but I typically like using the Nightsky better- that boost to speed is just too useful for a melee oriented mech.

Same here.  Either that or some of my own custom 45 ton hatchet wielders which DO use TSM..
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #8 on: 11 March 2016, 15:51:22 »
The funniest thing that ever happened with me regarding the Hatchetman just occurred a month ago.  My group just started a merc campaign, and the first mission was a breakthrough where we had to punch through the attacking Liao lines to get back to our dropship during Operation Gurrerro.

Our mechs had preexisting damage, which turned out to be 50 points on the 3F Hatchetman (AKA, most of its frontal armor).  I ended up doing a Leeroy Jenkins with it against a Charger 1A5, which reacted by backing away.  Sadly, it wasn't enough to save my Cyclops, but only because one of the other Capellan mechs got a floating crit that blew the Cyc's leg clean off.  Still, it was enough to delay the Charger for three rounds, which is a pretty impressive showing when you're talking about a no-armor mech against an assault monster twice its size.
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GreekFire

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #9 on: 11 March 2016, 16:55:21 »
I see the Hatchet a bit differently; in its current incarnation, it's a pretty decent BV dump. Most Hatchetmen are based around a single weapon system; the LB-X on the -6S, the Ultra/AC on the -5D, the Heavy PPC on the -6M, etc. They have a small array of back-up lasers, but the key draw to all of those 'Mechs are their primary weapon system. From there, the other main draw of the Hatchetman over a vehicle would be its ability to jump. You gotta jump with it, preferably somewhere where it's 4 jump won't leave it at a disadvantage against enemy targets. That means broken, wooded or urban terrain of some sort.

Combine those features with a 3-ton, 13.5 BV hatchet, the XL engine and the relatively slow movement profile, and you've got a cheap way to bring that main gun to the table. It's a good support 'Mech, one that can compound on firepower offered by tougher, more attention-grabbing troopers. And hey, if you get a chance to use that 9-point hatchet...it can be a decent alternative to kicking, missing and failing the PSR.

With that said, I recently played around a bit with the -6M. The Beagle is handy enough, I guess, and I liked having those Medium Pulses handy to scare away any lights. It worked well enough alongside a Blackjack-OF, Anzu -G60 and Tempest -3M. Also fiddled with the -7R, really disliked its weapons layout. Having all of your guns in one arm is just horrific.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #10 on: 12 March 2016, 02:14:32 »
I won't lie, hadn't looked at this guy in Alpha Strike til I saw this thread, and...

I'm... not hating it. Oh, many of the variants have all the terrible problems that you'd expect, but even the -3F is pretty darn cheap at 21 PV for a unit capable of a 3-point hit. The -5DD is a good bargain for 26 points with A5/S2 and 10"j. In point of fact, all the post-SW models have A5/S2, which isn't great but does survive two 3-pointers. Weirdly enough, the -3F has A3/S4 for the exact same number, though obviously risking crits.

The -7S and -6D are also solid, and I'm not sure how the -5K missed on my C3 guide for 'budget' picks, as with a 4/4 damage profile it can deal a pretty significant hit independent of MEL. Even the -5S brings a dirt-cheap 26 point FLK 1/1/1 to the table, and that's all you need to force lawndart checks on ground attacking craft.

However, I do think even the 10" MV ones need to be used more defensively than offensively, threatening a jumping backstab with that MEL on anything closing too close to vulnerable units such as ART carriers. And, of course, there's always the classic city-mugging mission. 

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #11 on: 12 March 2016, 02:43:01 »
Humorous aside, does anybody see a sort of quirky spiritual similarity between the 3F Hatchetman and the Urbanmech?

It's... honestly... really not a good mech, but it's got a gimmicky feel that you can't help but love, and they basically fight the same way.

I think every house should have their own spiritual urbanmech.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #12 on: 12 March 2016, 03:13:30 »
I'd like to think that the Hatchet is a weapon there to discourage getting close.  Not many lights and mediums want to tale a 9 point wallop and it creates a bubble where it becomes dangerous to get close because the Hatc can then go RARARARARARA and run on over and slap you one.  But by trying to keep out of that bubble you've then got an AC to contend with that's the Mech's real weapon.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #13 on: 12 March 2016, 03:41:42 »
Admittedly on paper and initially in my own mind the 3F and 5S were riddled with flaws, but in practice I'm yet to find a bad Hatchetman when given the opportunity to be used right.

Sure, most of them will be chewed apart on an open field, but the ACs in tight confines with the jets make for a surprisingly good combo.

But I still think the 5S sacrificed so much that it had to be deliberate. They knew then what they could have done with it but decided it would be too much.

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #14 on: 12 March 2016, 05:58:26 »
Humorous aside, does anybody see a sort of quirky spiritual similarity between the 3F Hatchetman and the Urbanmech?

It's... honestly... really not a good mech, but it's got a gimmicky feel that you can't help but love, and they basically fight the same way.

I think every house should have their own spiritual urbanmech.

The two have a very similar design brief: defend an urban area against things bigger and nastier than them by being sneaky.  As I was writing the article I was thinking that the two would make a good operating partner.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #15 on: 12 March 2016, 07:04:45 »
Admittedly on paper and initially in my own mind the 3F and 5S were riddled with flaws, but in practice I'm yet to find a bad Hatchetman when given the opportunity to be used right.

Sure, most of them will be chewed apart on an open field, but the ACs in tight confines with the jets make for a surprisingly good combo.

But I still think the 5S sacrificed so much that it had to be deliberate. They knew then what they could have done with it but decided it would be too much.

But all it needs is an extra ton of ammo!  How much is that to ask?

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #16 on: 12 March 2016, 10:24:15 »
The low ammo and armour together works well.  Blast away with the AC in the first half of the battle and during the second half or last third of battle when the ammo is gone and the armour is patchy, wade in with the hatchet. Sprinkle in with lasers when able.

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #17 on: 12 March 2016, 12:12:20 »
The Hatchetman fails to combine the other elements needed to make a hatchet worthwhile. It doesn't really have the speed even in a  very dense, urban terrain fight its jump just isn't enough.  It doesn't have the armor. It doesn't have TSM.

I think its more than time for an official Hatchetman variant that gets the melee job done, or makes it even worth engaging in melee in the first place.



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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #18 on: 12 March 2016, 14:00:02 »
I was little underwhelmed initially when i was introduced to the Hatchetman.  The later versions of it more impressive. The 6S is nice range machine, though hatchet usage seems to be redundant thou since the Kicking is still more effective than Hatchet unfortunatelyu.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #19 on: 12 March 2016, 16:04:50 »
I was little underwhelmed initially when i was introduced to the Hatchetman.  The later versions of it more impressive. The 6S is nice range machine, though hatchet usage seems to be redundant thou since the Kicking is still more effective than Hatchet unfortunatelyu.

Depends -- the Hatchet is a kick that can hit the whole table, not just a leg.... if you have someone that was using partial cover, that chance of putting a "kick" on any of the upper areas is enough to make your opponent react to you.
During one game, a few years ago, I hit a Salamander with indirect fire from 2 LRM carriers.... and then rushed in with a Hatchetman .... once I got inside the minimums, I was able to chase that mech all over, pretty much taking my opponents fire support out of the fight...... it doesn't always work, but it can be an interesting option, sometimes.

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #20 on: 12 March 2016, 16:14:13 »
What annoys me in the first Hatchetman is the medium laser mounted with the hatchet. Can't fire it and use the hatchet in the same turn, effectively wasting 5 (or 9!) potential damage. I'd prefer either move it or yank it (and a heat sink) for extra armor.

The thin head armor is also an annoyance. Heck, the 'Mech's filled with annoyances.

But whatever, a lovely machines anyway.

garhkal

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #21 on: 12 March 2016, 16:37:09 »
I'd like to think that the Hatchet is a weapon there to discourage getting close.  Not many lights and mediums want to tale a 9 point wallop and it creates a bubble where it becomes dangerous to get close because the Hatc can then go RARARARARARA and run on over and slap you one.  But by trying to keep out of that bubble you've then got an AC to contend with that's the Mech's real weapon.

I don't really see it as much of a bubble of doom though..  Sure its 9 points of concentrated damage, but can be easily taken out or avoided (staying 2-3 hexes away)..

The Hatchetman fails to combine the other elements needed to make a hatchet worthwhile. It doesn't really have the speed even in a  very dense, urban terrain fight its jump just isn't enough.  It doesn't have the armor. It doesn't have TSM.

I think its more than time for an official Hatchetman variant that gets the melee job done, or makes it even worth engaging in melee in the first place.

I have several custom jobs for my home made companies at 45 tons that do well, but all use XL engines, and C3 to do that. 

One option i would love to see though, is a Stealth Hatchetman..  Just doing a quick play around, i can come up with 3 variants.  All are based around maxed armor, Left arm hatchet and a spread of 6/9/6 for speed
Option one goes with a light engine, endo steel internals with a large laser and 3 medium lasers in addition to the hatchet.  How ever cause of the Endo, there is no space for TSM.

Option 2 drops the Endo (which takes me from 8 usable tons to 6), dropping weaponry to 2 ER mediums, 2 regular mediums and 2 small lasers (with one additional double heat) but does sport TSM.

Option 3 has me shifting up to an XL engine, pushing my usable tonnage to 8.5, which lets me go 1 large, 1 er medium, 2 mediums and 1 small.. 
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garhkal

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #22 on: 12 March 2016, 16:38:17 »
What annoys me in the first Hatchetman is the medium laser mounted with the hatchet. Can't fire it and use the hatchet in the same turn, effectively wasting 5 (or 9!) potential damage. I'd prefer either move it or yank it (and a heat sink) for extra armor.

The thin head armor is also an annoyance. Heck, the 'Mech's filled with annoyances.

But whatever, a lovely machines anyway.

I've never understood that either..  Put the ML in the head...
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #23 on: 12 March 2016, 16:55:49 »
I don't really see it as much of a bubble of doom though..  Sure its 9 points of concentrated damage, but can be easily taken out or avoided (staying 2-3 hexes away)..

That's exactly how that bubble works. Consider that on most published Battletech mapsheets, your typical stand of woods won't be more than a few hexes across. If you have a Hatchetman in the middle of those woods, then it can probably reach almost every hex of those woods. Someone who wants to avoid that hatchet(especially light or low-end mediums) must also avoid the woods, denying your enemy that cover.
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Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #24 on: 12 March 2016, 17:04:08 »
Humorous aside, does anybody see a sort of quirky spiritual similarity between the 3F Hatchetman and the Urbanmech?

It's... honestly... really not a good mech, but it's got a gimmicky feel that you can't help but love, and they basically fight the same way.

I think every house should have their own spiritual urbanmech.

Yes.  It's probably why I like them both so much.  The Panther runs with a similar concept too.
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jklantern

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #25 on: 12 March 2016, 17:20:09 »
Yes.  It's probably why I like them both so much.  The Panther runs with a similar concept too.

And I DO like all three of those Mechs on a conceptual level.
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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #26 on: 12 March 2016, 17:35:37 »
It's never really optimized for it.  From putting a medium laser in the arm with the hatchet, to an IS XL engine on a slow 'mech, to never matching TSM with the hatchet.
What he said.


The 3F-Austin is one of my favorites for the basic simplicity of the upgrade.

The 5S looks horrible on paper but if used correctly as a body guard w/ cover its not half bad at all.

The 6D seemed like a step in the direction of moving it from "Urban Brawler" to "Skirmisher" and looks great on paper but its actually a tad under-sinked I find I miss a lot since I'm prone to now using the JJ & has no Pulse/TC to compensate.

That 7R Republic model seems really interesting.

But what it really needs is a TSM model to make for some scary cleaving ability.

I'd love to see something that combines the 5S & 6D with TSM.

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Nikas_Zekeval

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #27 on: 12 March 2016, 19:54:38 »
I was in a Grinder match last month, when I jumped to a medium mech I landed near to a Hatchetman.  Too bad for him I had just picked up a Hunchback, the classic 4G.  Even worse, the way the balancing worked I had a 5/2 warrior.  >:D  Can't recall if the other guy was a 5S or 6S, definitely had an LB-10X.

We ran out of time, but I was beating him around pretty good by the time the match ended.  First shot from the AC knocked him on his ass, second snapped the hatchet.  }:)

Which was one weakness of having that hatchet, the temptation to get in close and use it, regardless of how wise it is to do so.  Otherwise you are 'wasting' the weight invested in that hatchet.
« Last Edit: 12 March 2016, 22:01:02 by Nikas_Zekeval »

glitterboy2098

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #28 on: 12 March 2016, 20:48:49 »
What annoys me in the first Hatchetman is the medium laser mounted with the hatchet. Can't fire it and use the hatchet in the same turn, effectively wasting 5 (or 9!) potential damage. I'd prefer either move it or yank it (and a heat sink) for extra armor.

The thin head armor is also an annoyance. Heck, the 'Mech's filled with annoyances.

But whatever, a lovely machines anyway.

honestly the impression i get from the original hatchetman is that the hatchet wasn't originally part of the plan. the weapons load and placement, combined with the speed and mobility makes for a fairly solid trooper design, along the lines of the Enforcer or Centurion. the armor is too light for that though, but if you assume they freed up mass for the hatchet by thinning the armor out and maybe dropping some ammo, it kinda fits. this would also explain the poor placement of the medium laser.. if they added the hatchet near the end of development, they'd have wanted to minimize the extra work in redoing the plans. easier to just adjust the arm to mount the hatchet than to redesign several locations to handle a weapon location change.

« Last Edit: 12 March 2016, 20:55:19 by glitterboy2098 »

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Re: Mech of the Week - Hatchetman
« Reply #29 on: 12 March 2016, 21:57:04 »
I remember in one of the novels or Merc Handbook write ups the GDL being described as mod'ing their melee weapon 'Mechs by removing the axes to stick on more sensible weapons. Not sure if it was Axman or Hatchetman designs they were talking about without finding the reference though.


Any official mods for the Hatchetman like that?
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