Poll

If you could build and deploy only one of the IS designed omnimechs in your forces, which would it be?

Raptor
Arctic Fox
Owens
Strider
Firestarter
Blackjack
Men Shen
Black Hawk-KU
Avatar
Perseus
Templar
Sunder
Hauptman

Author Topic: If you could build only one omnimech ...  (Read 19899 times)

LastChanceCav

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If you could build only one omnimech ...
« on: 09 February 2011, 08:43:56 »
I'm curious what people's preferences are after reading the comments on various designs in the ongoing "fate of omnimechs" debate.  When you vote, if your reason tied to anything beyond just your preference for the specific mech (i.e., your faction of choice and their current inventory of equipment) please explain.  I'm leaving the Celestials out due to their WoB exclusivity.  I also left off "none of the above" on purpose.

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PS I also started a thread in the design forum for people to post their ideal base omnimech, if none of them really fit the bill.
« Last Edit: 09 February 2011, 08:46:36 by LastChanceCav »
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Moonsword

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #1 on: 09 February 2011, 09:27:09 »
Avatar, followed by the Hauptmann if I could get two.  The Avatar's armor isn't bad, the pod space and crit openness is great, and it can make a solid stab at replacing most of your classic 4/6 heavy BattleMechs by the use of sensible configurations while offering some options they can't manage as readily.  The Hauptmann offers similar options for classic assault 'Mech jobs but I'd rather have the flexibility in my traditional heavy forces.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #2 on: 09 February 2011, 09:56:44 »
Since the woodsman was not an option :P

Templar has mobility and a decent frame.  some of the criticals make it difficult to work with but if the thing can mount a gauss rifle I think it is open enough.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #3 on: 09 February 2011, 09:58:23 »
Hauptmann. Cheap and as flexible as it gets. Oh and it blows stuff up. Quickly.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #4 on: 09 February 2011, 10:06:11 »
Blackhawk-KU. I can definitely see the arguments for the Avatar and Hauptmann, but if I only get one, I'd prefer one light enough to perform virtually any role successfully. The Black Hawk has the combination of size and speed to play armed recon, trooper, cavalry, and strike roles all very well. It might not have the straight fighting capability of the other two, but it will be more versatile, which is what an Omni, especially your only omni, needs to be.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #5 on: 09 February 2011, 10:09:33 »
 Avatar. Hauptmann would be the secondary choice. Avatar is not saddled with crappy fixed equipment like many other IS "Omnimechs" ( medium lasers are never crap ).

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #6 on: 09 February 2011, 10:16:12 »
Avatar. Hauptmann would be the secondary choice. Avatar is not saddled with crappy fixed equipment like many other IS "Omnimechs" ( medium lasers are never crap ).

But the Hauptmann is?
« Last Edit: 09 February 2011, 10:24:30 by ABADDON »

Moonsword

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #7 on: 09 February 2011, 10:23:39 »
Blackhawk-KU. I can definitely see the arguments for the Avatar and Hauptmann, but if I only get one, I'd prefer one light enough to perform virtually any role successfully. The Black Hawk has the combination of size and speed to play armed recon, trooper, cavalry, and strike roles all very well. It might not have the straight fighting capability of the other two, but it will be more versatile, which is what an Omni, especially your only omni, needs to be.

That Black Hawk-KU was going to be my number 3 pick, although it's only barely behind the Hauptmann.  To me, the sheer flexibility of the other two (and the breadth of machines they can replace in one go) is more useful.  Some of the jobs the Black Hawk-KU does I really prefer to hand to a faster, more mobile chassis in this day and age while a lot of the big mediums are solid enough in design that the OmniMech really doesn't bring enough to displace the Avatar for the purposes of being my only OmniMech.  But if I can branch out from one Omni, it's near the top of the list.

But the Hauptmann is?

Lyran 95 ton 3/5 SFE heavily armored Omni with no endo-steel, no ferro-fibrous, CASE in the right torso, 11 DHS in the engine, and 43 tons of pod space.

ABADDON

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #8 on: 09 February 2011, 10:26:35 »
I'm aware of the Hauptmann's key data. ;) thx anyway.
But I for one wouldn't refer to '+1 DHS and Case' as crappy. But maybe that's just me. So if that's his only reason for choosing the Avatar over the Hauptmann...

« Last Edit: 09 February 2011, 10:30:13 by ABADDON »

Moonsword

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #9 on: 09 February 2011, 10:31:37 »
Okay, wasn't sure what you were asking about there.

In terms of fixed equipment, I think we're all mainly circling around the Owens and its 3.5 tons of electronics.  The Hauptmann, in terms of fixed equipment, kind of falls off the radar since it's not weapons or electronics, it's a freezer in the engine and CASE.  Filling your engine with freezers is rarely a bad idea.  CASE is also not a bad idea in a lot of cases since, like the Avatar's lasers, it's probably going to wind up on a lot of configurations anyway.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #10 on: 09 February 2011, 11:17:21 »
The Firestarter.  No one would see it coming.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #11 on: 09 February 2011, 11:18:26 »
That Black Hawk-KU was going to be my number 3 pick, although it's only barely behind the Hauptmann.  To me, the sheer flexibility of the other two (and the breadth of machines they can replace in one go) is more useful.  Some of the jobs the Black Hawk-KU does I really prefer to hand to a faster, more mobile chassis in this day and age while a lot of the big mediums are solid enough in design that the OmniMech really doesn't bring enough to displace the Avatar for the purposes of being my only OmniMech.  But if I can branch out from one Omni, it's near the top of the list.

And I can definitely understand the reasoning. The Hauptmann is great for replacing your entire Assault force, but by and large, Assault mechs only really fill a handful of functional categories by design, though exceptions do exist. The Avatar, on the other hand, while technically an assault is essentially an excellent high-end heavy. I would justify it more than the Hauptmann on my list. Both excellent mechs, but one more versatile. The Black Hawk, however, I feel could more easily slot into more potential lances and company types than could either. It's an excellent mech for faster cavalry formations, flanking in larger heavy and small end assault formations, spotting for fire support formations, etc. It's a difference of degrees, but enough to give it the edge for me.

In terms of fixed equipment, I think we're all mainly circling around the Owens and its 3.5 tons of electronics.  The Hauptmann, in terms of fixed equipment, kind of falls off the radar since it's not weapons or electronics, it's a freezer in the engine and CASE.  Filling your engine with freezers is rarely a bad idea.  CASE is also not a bad idea in a lot of cases since, like the Avatar's lasers, it's probably going to wind up on a lot of configurations anyway.

Amen. Any unneccesary fixed equipment is a negative on an Omni, but the Hauptmann is among the least offensive designs in this fashion that exists in CBT. As you said, a DHS that takes up no crits is never a problem, and CASE is handy in most designs, even if it's a wasted half ton on the occasional flashbulb.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #12 on: 09 February 2011, 12:04:03 »
Not even your own pilots  :D

That's officer thinking right there!
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Bowman

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #13 on: 09 February 2011, 12:11:42 »
Templar.

Out of all of the 4/6 mechs, this one has the most free tonnage and still has a reasonable amount of free crits. Its armor may be the second highest and it has an XL, but the 4/6 movement profile is more attractive than the Hauptmanns' 3/5.

If there were more free tons in the Blackhaw I would have picked the KU, but 17 tons is too little to play with even for a heavy cavalry mech.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #14 on: 09 February 2011, 12:21:22 »
I'm an assault mech guy so I'll take the pure assault, the Hauptmann.  The Templar would probably be my second choice.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #15 on: 09 February 2011, 12:26:39 »
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #16 on: 09 February 2011, 12:40:02 »
And I can definitely understand the reasoning. The Hauptmann is great for replacing your entire Assault force, but by and large, Assault mechs only really fill a handful of functional categories by design, though exceptions do exist. The Avatar, on the other hand, while technically an assault is essentially an excellent high-end heavy. I would justify it more than the Hauptmann on my list. Both excellent mechs, but one more versatile. The Black Hawk, however, I feel could more easily slot into more potential lances and company types than could either. It's an excellent mech for faster cavalry formations, flanking in larger heavy and small end assault formations, spotting for fire support formations, etc. It's a difference of degrees, but enough to give it the edge for me.

I'm not looking at slotting an Avatar into anything.  I'm looking at taking the thing and churning it out in staggering numbers to outright replace my 4/6 heavies in front line forces.  The effect of its potential seems to be greater given that the Black Hawk-KU isn't really a perfect fit for some of the jobs I'd want to do with it as my singular OmniMech.

Amen. Any unneccesary fixed equipment is a negative on an Omni, but the Hauptmann is among the least offensive designs in this fashion that exists in CBT. As you said, a DHS that takes up no crits is never a problem, and CASE is handy in most designs, even if it's a wasted half ton on the occasional flashbulb.

Actually, filling the engine's capacity for heat sinks is generally a good practice in designs with plenty of tonnage free, especially assaults, which tend to run into crit problems anyway.  There are very occasionally configurations where that's not helpful... but that's not very common.
« Last Edit: 09 February 2011, 12:49:14 by Moonsword »

ABADDON

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #17 on: 09 February 2011, 13:00:25 »
There are very occasionally configurations where that's not helpful...

Jup, those involving really big boomsticks, sometimes also known as double Gauss or double Heavy Gauss.  :P

Moonsword

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #18 on: 09 February 2011, 13:04:14 »
Jup, those involving really big boomsticks, sometimes also known as double Gauss or double Heavy Gauss.  :P

Even then, I can usually cram enough lasers on as backups on a lot of configurations to make use of the freezers.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #19 on: 09 February 2011, 13:06:59 »
Its the Blackjack for me, if there was a second choice it'd be the Black Hawk-KU.

ABADDON

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #20 on: 09 February 2011, 13:09:52 »
Quote
Even then, I can usually cram enough lasers on as backups on a lot of configurations to make use of the freezers.

Well, that might get difficult with a double Heavy Gauss config, depending on the mech. Though I agree, it would presumably be close to impossible to waste the bigger part of such mech's heat dissipation potential. Even if one or two DHSs are wasted, I think such specific case inefficeny is negligible compared to the advantages it brings for laser/ppc based configs, which often would be impossible without those engine fixed sinks.
« Last Edit: 09 February 2011, 13:14:35 by ABADDON »

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #21 on: 09 February 2011, 13:14:50 »
I'm not looking at slotting an Avatar into anything.  I'm looking at taking the thing and churning it out in staggering numbers to outright replace my 4/6 heavies in front line forces.  The effect of its potential seems to be greater given that the Black Hawk-KU isn't really a perfect fit for some of the jobs I'd want to do with it as my singular OmniMech.

Manuever warfare. I tend to prefer a relatively mobile line force. Heavier and slower designs for special purposes or heavy combat. But the baseline force I prefer to use are high-end mediums and mobile heavies. Simply a personal preference.

Well, that might get difficult with a double Heavy Gauss config, depending on the mech. Though I agree, it would presumably be close to impossible to waste the bigger part of such mech's heat dissipation potential. Even if one or two DHSs are wasted, I think that disadvantage is negligible compared to the advantages it brings for laser/ppc based configs, which would be impossible without those engine fixed sinks.

Yeah a big problem here is what the hell else you do with those extra couple of tons. There's not much you can add that won't either increase the heat or take up too many crits. And what you can add is of arguable utility. An extra heat sink or two can help cover things such as engine hits, hot planetary conditions, heat weapons, etc. Never hurts for what you spend.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #22 on: 09 February 2011, 13:28:29 »
Hauptmann, no question.  The base is cheap, versatile, and well-designed.  Heavy and slow?  Sure, but I'll take that trade.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #23 on: 09 February 2011, 13:41:02 »
Most of my mech forces are going to be Medium mechs.  If I could only use one Omni, I'd want something that would fit with them, and not be a bear to produce.  Hence, why I chose the Blackhawk-KU.

Beyond the XL engine, it doesnt have any advanced materials in it.  I wish it didnt have the build in JJs, but it's still a nice, workhorse Omnimech. 

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #24 on: 09 February 2011, 13:56:56 »
What? No option for the Battle Cobra (C*-built)?!

Well, I guess I'll just have to go Black Hawk-KU then. :P

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #25 on: 09 February 2011, 14:34:53 »
The templat just looks cooler.  The Hauptmann, while it has that "cigar," it's just, visually, not my cup of tea.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #26 on: 09 February 2011, 14:36:42 »
The templat just looks cooler.  The Hauptmann, while it has that "cigar," it's just, visually, not my cup of tea.

You mean a Daishi crossed with an Orc crossed with a USMC Drill Sargent doesn't do it for you?
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Dread Moores

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #27 on: 09 February 2011, 14:38:33 »
Black Hawk KU, with the Men Shen coming in a close second. Medium weight Omnis offer the most flexibility, I think. And flexibility is what Omnis should be about.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #28 on: 09 February 2011, 15:12:39 »
The Black Hawk-KU is a heavy OmniMech... 60-tons, remember?
The Draconis Combine could have made it a 50-ton design, but they don't like mediums, so we made it a heavy instead.
(Do the math, a 1-on-1 Clan/IS conversion of the Nova is possible, although at the cost of 6 crits.)

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #29 on: 09 February 2011, 16:19:34 »
As a fervent cavalry-man, I have to put a word in for the Men Shen.  The pod space is a little light and it tends to run hot, but if you're picking one mech, why not pick a mech that could do genuine recon and stand and deliver in a pitched battle.  About the only thing it can't be expected to do is solo a mech 25 tons heavier, but no mech really can.

I would say Templar second and Firestarter third.  Hauptmann is one of the best purely-designed omnis, but its a walking pillbox.  I like the Black Hawk, but the hard truth of the matter is that it has a lot of flaws as an omni that detract from me picking it over the Men Shen.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #30 on: 09 February 2011, 16:37:57 »
I had to go with the Templar.  While I generally like faster medium-weight 'Mechs, the Templar just seems to scratch me right where I itch.  It is probably more expensive and has some wonky crit issues; but I love it and I have had great success with it.  Despite the fact that I use it more as a heavy rather than a true assault 'Mech/


That said, the Hauptmann is a very close second from a sheer utility standpoint.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #31 on: 09 February 2011, 16:51:59 »
considering the templar was builot to replace some 15 mechs in the 70-90 ton range, I don't see a probl;emw ith deploying it as a heavy
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #32 on: 09 February 2011, 16:53:57 »
Part of the reason I say "Hauptmann" above is that it is so unbelievably cheap.  Fast mechs, especially those with a meaningful amount of pod space, tend to come with obscenely expensive and fragile XL engines.  If I'm limited to one omni design, I'm getting the most out of my C-Bills, and I do best that with a slower, cheaper, tougher design like the Hauptmann.

As much as I'm a "mech" guy, speed/recon work is one of those places where I see non-mech units performing the role adequately (and at greatly reduced cost).  If I need something faster than a Hauptmann, I could give up the flexibility of pod space and not lose much overall.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #33 on: 09 February 2011, 17:29:54 »
I think I would go with Black Hawk-KU, even if there are several decent choices.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #34 on: 09 February 2011, 17:31:24 »
The poll curve is heavily tilted towards the heavier OmniMechs... As it should be! ;)  The Lyrans know how to make a fine 95 ton 'Mech.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #35 on: 09 February 2011, 17:32:52 »
What? No option for the Battle Cobra (C*-built)?!

I know *fume*

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #36 on: 09 February 2011, 17:39:03 »
but its a walking pillbox. 

So, what is wrong with a walking pillbox? Almost impossible to crack, it walks and... it kills things. Lots of things.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #37 on: 09 February 2011, 20:33:26 »
So..I voted for the Owens. 


WHY?!  you ask.  Well, because I'm a huge fan of combined arms coordination and it's the best omni mech out there to forward deploy a group of BA quickly and then provide assistance to coordinate the rest of your forces' fire. 

Additionally, it's lighter and a bit cheaper than the others. 

For a close second I go with the Men Shen. 

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #38 on: 09 February 2011, 20:45:59 »
I took the Avatar even though I could probably just as easily take the Black Hawk-KU or Hauptmann. 

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #39 on: 09 February 2011, 20:59:38 »
Additionally, it's lighter and a bit cheaper than the others.

It's comparable in BV to those around its size (roughly average to slightly below it), but the Arctic Fox and Raptor are both lighter and are joined by the Strider in being considerably cheaper by C-Bill cost.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #40 on: 09 February 2011, 23:33:12 »
It's comparable in BV to those around its size (roughly average to slightly below it), but the Arctic Fox and Raptor are both lighter and are joined by the Strider in being considerably cheaper by C-Bill cost.

I will certainly grant you that it's more expensive when compared to those in it's weight range, but not when compared to the heavier omnis that most are mentioning here.  That was my point even if I didn't explain it really well. 

Additionally, the speed advantage of the Owens relative to those other platforms is an offsetting advantage in my mind. 

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #41 on: 10 February 2011, 03:42:59 »
I would go for the Templar, it's perfect for the Fed Suns Calvary role of 'Mech.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #42 on: 10 February 2011, 07:41:24 »
I will certainly grant you that it's more expensive when compared to those in it's weight range, but not when compared to the heavier omnis that most are mentioning here.  That was my point even if I didn't explain it really well. 

Additionally, the speed advantage of the Owens relative to those other platforms is an offsetting advantage in my mind. 

I was just pointing out a few facts that didn't seem to line up.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #43 on: 10 February 2011, 16:11:13 »
My vote has to go to the Hauptmann. Because it does it's job as an omnimech best.

The whole point of an omnimech is customization, and with it's standard engine, standard chassis and standard armour the Hauptmann just gives you the most freedom to do with what you want.

The Templar would be a close second, but with the XL engine and endo steel chassis it might have the tonnage to play with, just not the crit space to reach it's full potential.

Other lighter mechs like the Blackhawk-KU and Men Shen would probably see a lot more service, but with their fixed pieces of equipment, I just feel that they aren't living up to the full potential that is an omni chassis. They are by no means bad chassis, and even though I might put jump jets on all the variants I make for it, I just think they should leave the decision to mount such equipment or not to the pilot or force commander.


In short. I pick the Hauptmann because it gives me the most freedom to do with it what I want, because that is the point of an omnimech.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #44 on: 11 February 2011, 05:17:43 »
Well, to the Black Hawk-KU's defence: it was designed to be the IS Nova.
The Nova has fixed Jump Jets, the Hawk-KU has fixed Jump Jets.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #45 on: 11 February 2011, 07:27:03 »
The Firestarter.  No one would see it coming.

Except me, since it's my favorite Omni as well. The FS9-OF is a great general purpose unit, and the other versions all offer something useful as well.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #46 on: 11 February 2011, 07:37:11 »
I tend to think of the FS9-O more as an omni-Phoenix hawk.  I think you could build a pretty solid force around that, the BHKU and either the Avatar or Sunder.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #47 on: 11 February 2011, 07:47:31 »
Well, to the Black Hawk-KU's defence: it was designed to be the IS Nova.
The Nova has fixed Jump Jets, the Hawk-KU has fixed Jump Jets.

Yep, and I don't really ding it because of that.  The Nova gets away with this a lot better for most people because it's not sitting right over the limit for half-ton jets.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #48 on: 11 February 2011, 07:51:35 »
If the JJs on the BHKU didn't straddle the 20 ton mark (22 vs 17 tons of pod space) they probably wouldn't be so irksome, preventing the BHKU from packing some heavier weapon (all be it ground-bound) configs.

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« Last Edit: 11 February 2011, 11:21:02 by LastChanceCav »
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #49 on: 11 February 2011, 08:25:36 »
I'm going to weigh in on the side of the Firestarter, also. Being a 6/9/6 it neatly fits into that medium category where it can fulfill a heavy backstabber role, a recon role, a trooper role, mobile fire support, electronic support, and all while bringing a squad of BA to the fight. While it is more killable than other non-omnis in it's weight class, it's sheer flexibility makes it a superior weapon IMHO. YMMV.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #50 on: 11 February 2011, 09:02:40 »
I'm going to weigh in on the side of the Firestarter, also. Being a 6/9/6 it neatly fits into that medium category where it can fulfill a heavy backstabber role, a recon role, a trooper role, mobile fire support, electronic support, and all while bringing a squad of BA to the fight. While it is more killable than other non-omnis in it's weight class, it's sheer flexibility makes it a superior weapon IMHO. YMMV.

I think part of the problem with the Firestarter, in the context of this thread, is that medium mechs are no longer medium mechs. By this I mean that the average mech size for most roles were Mediums. Troopers, armed recon, and even some that were considered weapons-heavy mechs at the time were all handled by the multi-purpose medium weight class. Weight saving technology, especially the XL engine, has moved the median weight for most roles into the heavy category. As such, if you can only build a single Omni, you'll probably want a heavy.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #51 on: 11 February 2011, 13:05:08 »
Am I the only one who has noticed a trend back toward centerline with advances like C3 and the transition of universe focus away from the Clan front? IS forces don't generate the same lethal long range fires that the Clans do. In that context, mediums are much more viable and, given the lack of 6/9/X in the heavy weight class (admittedly more than before the Clan invasion), there's not that many options for fast attack / heavy recon. Centurions, Legionaires, Dervishes, Phoenix Hawks, Trebuchets, etc etc... while they are indeed still more vulnerable to fires than they were in 3025, still fill all those required niches. Pushing the weight class median North, while nice from an individual survivability perspective, also deprives units of key capabilities. I think that, with the LCTs, the rebalance of international powers, and the recovery from the Jihad, we'll see a shift back, to some degree. It just doesn't make much sense OOC to make the median mech weight over 60 tons, you just impose limits on the viable forces your players can field. If it is true that the median weight shifted up, then I for see a rebalancing back to the original distribution. Anything else would relegate whole weight classes to marginilization.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #52 on: 11 February 2011, 13:40:16 »
I do agree that the current push by the fluff seems to be back towards high-end mediums and low-end heavies. I'd assume this was a concious decision by TPTB in order to help make the lighter weight classes relevent again. The problem is that the genie won't go back in the bottle. XLEs, LFEs, iJJs, FF Armor, ES IS, etc have all conspired to allow larger mechs to do all but light recon and fast strike harassment jobs. While there is still a role for Medium mechs, they are largely less effective as mainline combat forces, and are performing roles traditionally reserved for lights, and Lights themselves are largely irrelevent except as light recon, and even then only offer a small advantage over a medium mech in a similar role. There are definitely a few light designs that are still relevent, but until we have a de facto state of the universe wherein lighter mechs are the norm again, the rules simply give little reason to down grade aside from personal preference.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #53 on: 11 February 2011, 17:02:14 »
Quote
In that context, mediums are much more viable and, given the lack of 6/9/X in the heavy weight class (admittedly more than before the Clan invasion), there's not that many options for fast attack / heavy recon.
Plenty of 6/9/X movers in the heavy bracket, although I'm not up-to-date on which are still being produced.
Grand Dragon (DRG-5K, -7K, -9KC, -C), Lancelot (LNC25-01, -04, -5, -6), Ostsol (OTL-8M), Paladin (PAL-2, -3), Spatha (SP1-X, SP2-X), Ti Ts'ang (TSG-9C, -9H, -9J), Balius, Exterminator (EXT-4D, -4Db, -5E, -5F), Linebacker, Morpheus (MRP-1, -3, -3S, -3T, -3W), Ninja-To (NJT-2, -3), and some 5/8/X heavies with TSM.

A 6/9/0 60-ton (IS) Omni would have about 19 tons of pod weight. Balius has 20. Linebacker has 17.5.
It'd be interesting to see an Omni with an XXL engine.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #54 on: 12 February 2011, 13:01:05 »
I picked the Templar since it is an Assault mech that is durable, can move well for its weight size and can still pack enough weapons to take down just about any enemy. Yeah, the XL engine and crit spacing aren't perfect but the Davion's seems to like their XL engines so...

A very close second was definitely the Avatar since I like the idea of a heavy omnimech with alot of versatility. Of course, I would have preferred more speed on the design but as a "trooper" mech of the IS, 4/6 seems fine.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #55 on: 12 February 2011, 14:48:31 »
I misunderstood the question- I thought it was "pick with only canon variants," so I went with the men shen, though I very nearly picked the Blackhawk.

If I'd picked "pick my base," I'd go with the Blackhawk.  Damn close either way.

Honorable mentions go to the hauptmann (I tend towards cav-style play, but if I was GONNA pick an assualt omni- well, the LAAF does build 'em right!  ;) ) and the firestarter: for such a small mech, there is a surprising amount of really useful and fun variants- hell, one has a SWORD!  Just for fun and versatailty it scores high with me.

I like some of the rest, some are crap, but, hey, your experience may vary...  :)

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #56 on: 12 February 2011, 16:21:12 »
A very close second was definitely the Avatar since I like the idea of a heavy omnimech with alot of versatility. Of course, I would have preferred more speed on the design but as a "trooper" mech of the IS, 4/6 seems fine.

Just out of curiosity, why pick the Avatar over the Perseus then?  The only real disadvantage the P1 has over the AV1 is the amount of open space to work with.  Aside from that, it has more free tonnage, more armor, and better heat sink optimization in engine placement.  Not questioning you, just wondering why the gravitation to the Avatar?
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #57 on: 12 February 2011, 16:46:28 »
That space issue severely limits The versatility he's looking for.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #58 on: 12 February 2011, 17:03:48 »
That space issue severely limits The versatility he's looking for.

Yeah, this is the major reason but I must admit that I have never actually used a Perseus in game and since I have used the Avatar I am definitely more biased towards it.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #59 on: 12 February 2011, 17:09:33 »
Well i put Templar for obvious patriotic reasons, that and it's very effective.  Though i also admit i am fond of the Avatar also.

If one could though, personally i'd love to have the Thanatos in it's intended Omni version.  I know, i'm eccentric.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #60 on: 12 February 2011, 17:11:08 »
Well i put Templar for obvious patriotic reasons, that and it's very effective.  Though i also admit i am fond of the Avatar also.

If one could though, personally i'd love to have the Thanatos in it's intended Omni version.  I know, i'm eccentric.

Heck yeah! That and the Argus Omni would really make my day.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #61 on: 12 February 2011, 17:14:09 »
Yeah admit i almost said that too.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #62 on: 12 February 2011, 17:18:54 »
I'd prefer to see a Thanatos.  The basic chassis had some potential to it and, removing the freezer outside the engine, 21.5 tons of pod space isn't bad for the speed, 26.5 if you don't use fixed jets.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #63 on: 12 February 2011, 17:34:08 »
Heck yeah! That and the Argus Omni would really make my day.

Who knows maybe one day we will and the Thantos.


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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #64 on: 13 February 2011, 13:53:22 »
XTRO: OmniMechs-that-we-forgot-to-put-in-other-products, perhaps?

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #65 on: 13 February 2011, 15:16:03 »
XTRO: OmniMechs-that-we-forgot-to-put-in-other-products, perhaps?

XTRO:  Mechs We Mentioned Elsewhere but never got around to making, due to writer's party induced amnesia.  Seriously, we write these TROs at parties.  Any inconsistencies are there because of that.  I'd like to see you write a TRO while doing shots off a Timber Wolf.  That's right, we have the actual Mechs at the parties.  No, you can't have one because you're not one of the writers.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #66 on: 14 February 2011, 09:36:08 »
Well I think a large part of the issue is they feel no real need to go back to those designs. The Argus and the Thanatos both come from one of the less-well-regarded TROs, from a volatile time in CBTs history. I like a great many of the 3067 designs, but it's hard to argue that any of them are considered "classic" or even overly popular designs. Unfortunately, like so unfortunately many of the post-3050 designs, the Argus and Thanatos are getting no love.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #67 on: 14 February 2011, 09:39:03 »
We know that Catalyst is Up To Something regarding TRO3067 and probably looking to get the sheets back out.  It's entirely possible we'll see some love given to these designs in a sort of RS3067 Unabridged once they get around to it.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #68 on: 14 February 2011, 09:47:56 »
Now if only we could get some clean, refined artwork to go with the excellent visual design for some of those mechs.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #69 on: 14 February 2011, 23:54:00 »
Given Unabridged versions are already covering really out their variants, including the Omni Arctic Wolf the ComStar Battle Cobra I pay tribute to on the left, its pretty much a given we'll get Omnified Argus and Thanatos

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #70 on: 15 February 2011, 00:04:48 »
Even if only to showcase what the original omni proposed designs were like and they never get used in canon in the universe.

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #71 on: 15 February 2011, 07:06:06 »
Well I think a large part of the issue is they feel no real need to go back to those designs. The Argus and the Thanatos both come from one of the less-well-regarded TROs, from a volatile time in CBTs history. I like a great many of the 3067 designs, but it's hard to argue that any of them are considered "classic" or even overly popular designs. Unfortunately, like so unfortunately many of the post-3050 designs, the Argus and Thanatos are getting no love.

In my opinion a great deal of the 3067 designs are unfairly pilloried.  Ok there are a few howlers there, but by and large many of those mechs are fine units.  Both models of the Argus have served me well on many occasions.  The second Argus in fact being a favourite for filling a gap, that of a heavy missile boat in modern AFFS rosters.  That's a heavy indigenously produced one, as opposed to some Archer or another by dubious means.  I'm funny like that, i prefer to use units i can actually justify.   

The Thanatos Omni in all honesty might have been the most useful of all for mobile heavy units.  One can imagine what the FSACR would have made of a few of those in their ranks.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #72 on: 15 February 2011, 08:58:02 »
^Well the art was a big turn off for a lot of people. While the visual design on many of the mechs was very good, the actual quality of the lines and such was terrible. Real grade school stuff. I think that certainly did a lot to hurt the book's reputation. It also suffered from being the FanPro TRO, which was largely a bad time for CBT as a whole.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #73 on: 15 February 2011, 23:48:45 »
Late to the party, but Blackhawk KU.  Its the speed I like and with newer weapons like the HPPC, I can mount heavy firepower and backup mediums with no problem. 

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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #74 on: 16 February 2011, 04:27:20 »
Voted for Avatar as a decent Mech with enough pod space and tonnage.

The Hauptmann would be a close second, but IMHO the number of assault s is more limited in the Universe.
I woudl use the Avatar as standard; conventional assault mechs could be used as command mechs or hammer for large-scale assaults.
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #75 on: 16 February 2011, 14:00:52 »
Can I steal a Clan OmniMech instead, even a bad one? ;)
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Re: If you could build only one omnimech ...
« Reply #76 on: 16 February 2011, 16:30:54 »
Can I steal a Clan OmniMech instead, even a bad one? ;)

Sure but you can only use IS weaponry and you have to stick to Zell in every battle. Your opponent does not. have fun!
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