Teach me about Fed Suns Artillery Units

[Jackmc]

Page and source of the retcon please.  My FM: FS shows 108 per regiment.

I wasn't saying there was a RetCon, I was asking if there was one?  I'm loooking at the Armor table on p. 23 which is a cut and past of the Mech table from p. 21 complete with error in the final "Combat Strength" entry which should read "120-220" instead of "120-132."

-Jackmc

[Moonsword]

Sounds like there was an errata fix somewhere.  (Note: Errata and retcon are two different terms, folks.)

[Devens]

I wasn't saying there was a RetCon, I was asking if there was one?  I'm loooking at the Armor table on p. 23 which is a cut and past of the Mech table from p. 21 complete with error in the final "Combat Strength" entry which should read "120-220" instead of "120-132."

-Jackmc

Actualy a reinforced regiment entry is errored but should be 120 - 156.   36 x 4 (Battalions) = 144 + 12 (Command Company) = 156

[Hellraiser]

Does the FedSuns even do Arti-Regiments ?

I thought it was Battalions assigned to Line RCTs and Companies assigned to Militia RCTs.

Of course I take that to mean SPA myself, tanks, etc.

With 5 Regiments of Infantry I would think at least a platoon/company of Fieldguns for a Regiment is not out of the question at all.

Another option, not mentioned, is the FS Omni Vees can pack in Artillery, though only the Schiltron-Prime as a canon config.

There is also the non-canon Sniper-SPA from BT Magazine.

I'd say your most common are Thumper-ICE of the canon designs.

Just some addition thoughts.

I'd like to see the fluff for the MWDA Sniper & Longtom units when it comes out, the Thumper-ICE was a very nice unit to stick back into canon history, I sincerely HOPE the same happens for the other 2 pieces.

[Moonsword]

We were suggesting that they should, not that they do.

[Jackmc]

Actualy a reinforced regiment entry is errored but should be 120 - 156.   36 x 4 (Battalions) = 144 + 12 (Command Company) = 156

No, a Battalion can can carry an extra company which would turn the base unit count to 48 + the Batt CO Lance would =52 which is correctly noted on the table.  52x4 = 208 + the regimental command company = 220.


-Jackmc

[hussar]

Pre Jihad the 2nd Davion Guards have Fielded an artillery regiment.

[Paladin1]

I can remember one or two artillery regiments in the FM:FS but I can't remember for certain which RCTs they were attached too.  I'm thinking the Light Guards and one of the Ceti Hussars though.

[Taurevanime]

No Ceti Hussars never have artillery regiments since they don't use the RCT structure but something very different.

[deathfrombeyond]

Meh, the FedSuns regiments operate on a 132 unit standard, so if you mount at least two tubes on each SPA that's at least 264 guns firing.

-Jackmc

I was under the impression that was only for the 'Mech regiment of an RCT, not for ALL regiments. Also, I was under the impression that 108 vehicles made up a standard armor regiment. Thus, any other further augmentation/added units would not be "standard".

[Jackmc]

I was under the impression that was only for the 'Mech regiment of an RCT, not for ALL regiments.

Could be.  I seem to recall that the FS favored the odd setup of 2 command companies per regiment and I thoguht that it applied to all line regiments not just emch ones, but I'm not  finding the reference in FM:FS.

NVM, just was looking at the RCT table in FM:FS and it clearly shows that the Mech regiment is using the 132 build but the armor regiemtns are each using the 108 build.

-Jackmc

[Devens]

No, a Battalion can can carry an extra company which would turn the base unit count to 48 + the Batt CO Lance would =52 which is correctly noted on the table.  52x4 = 208 + the regimental command company = 220.


-Jackmc

Except that it says 3 to 4 battalions NOT reinforced battalions.   Anything above 3 companies per battalion is a reinforced battalion. so no it can't be 220 max by the way it is written in the Field Manual.

[Gracus]

The 41st Avalon Hussars fielded an artillery regiment prior to their death.

[Jackmc]

Except that it says 3 to 4 battalions NOT reinforced battalions.

Ah,but look at what makes it a reenforced battalion or regiment "reenforced"; it's the additional command elements not the presence of a  4th company or battalion. 

At the low end, you have a regular 3x3 mech regiment reenforced by three battlaion command lances for a total of 120 mechs, you then have the RCT-standard organization which adds the regimental command company for a total of 132 which is obviously what the authro of the table was thinking.  However, you can also start adding in 4th companies and even a fourth battlaion, and you can reenforce the 4th battalion so it is possible to to have four 52 unit reenforced battalions led by the regimetnal command company for a total of 220.  Thus, I stand by my assertion that the table is in error.

-Jackmc

[deathfrombeyond]

Ah,but look at what makes it a reenforced battalion or regiment "reenforced"; it's the additional command elements not the presence of a  4th company or battalion. 

At the low end, you have a regular 3x3 mech regiment reenforced by three battlaion command lances for a total of 120 mechs, you then have the RCT-standard organization which adds the regimental command company for a total of 132 which is obviously what the authro of the table was thinking.  However, you can also start adding in 4th companies and even a fourth battlaion, and you can reenforce the 4th battalion so it is possible to to have four 52 unit reenforced battalions led by the regimetnal command company for a total of 220.  Thus, I stand by my assertion that the table is in error.

-Jackmc

Isn't this discussion somewhat academic?

I was under the assumption that the field manual really didn't cover artillery TOEs to the same depth as armor, infantry, or 'Mech TOEs.

[Hellraiser]

Could be.  I seem to recall that the FS favored the odd setup of 2 command companies per regiment and I thoguht that it applied to all line regiments not just emch ones, but I'm not  finding the reference in FM:FS.

I think what you might be thinking of is a line about FS having a RegComCompany and a FireSupportCompany for each regiment.
I want to say that is from HB:HD somewhere.

[Devens]

I think what you might be thinking of is a line about FS having a RegComCompany and a FireSupportCompany for each regiment.
I want to say that is from HB:HD somewhere.

It that is in HB House Davion then that would be a change, though more of a filling out than an actual retcon.  A retcon would me more like changing the RCT so that they were LCT's in the 4th Succession  War.   

[Devens]

Isn't this discussion somewhat academic?

I was under the assumption that the field manual really didn't cover artillery TOEs to the same depth as armor, infantry, or 'Mech TOEs.

So far the information given is that they use Battalions and Companies just like the Vehicle/Armor TOE.  But it does not specify platform other than a 36 Unit Battalion.  To me this implies Vehicles because they are considred part of the Armor Brigade with a designation of AB.  Does anyonw know if thier are any cannon RCT's that use an artillery regiments?

[Nebfer]

Well quite often the artillery unit is not listed,
also to muddle the waters Artillery Groups are labeled as AG
Armored Grenadiers are also labeled as AG... (both are in the vehicle section)

The 42nd Avalon Hussars has a full artillery regiment, though it's not clear which unit is the regiment.
The 2nd Chrisholm has the 1st Crisholm Heavy Artillery (HAY code) -no indication if its a Regiment, Group or a Battalion
The 1st Ceti Hussars has an artillery Group with 2 battalions.
The 3rd Ceti Hussars has 3 battalions, effectively a full regiment.
The 1st Crucis Lancers has a full Artillery regiment (but it seems to be not listed, or a typo)
The 4th Crucis Lancers has effectively 2 battalions (a double strength battalion)
The 8th Crucis Lancers has two battalions
The 2nd Davion Guards has the 740th "Heavy" Artillery (HAY code) with 4 battalions

Interestingly the Davion assault guards seems to have it's artillery listed with the infantry, not the more typical armor units.

It seems that about 20% of front line RCTs has 2 or more battalions of artillery.

[Jackmc]

It seems that about 20% of front line RCTs has 2 or more battalions of artillery.

Makes senes, the only truely uniform thing about the canonical RCT's is thier lack of uniformity.

-Jackmc

[deathfrombeyond]

It seems that about 20% of front line RCTs has 2 or more battalions of artillery.

Which means that the "average" RCT won't have 200+ artillery vehicles.

[Devens]

Which means that the "average" RCT won't have 200+ artillery vehicles.

Nope the average has 36.

[Jackmc]

Which means that the "average" RCT won't have 200+ artillery vehicles.

lol, nope, but you can be sure that if any ever fielded a 4X4 AB, they'd rock your world, no and's if's or but's.

-Jackmc

[deathfrombeyond]

lol, nope, but you can be sure that if any ever fielded a 4X4 AB, they'd rock your world, no and's if's or but's.

-Jackmc

And if any opposing regiment had their own WarShip Fleet as orbital fire support, said Davion artillery wouldn't ever have a chance.

[Jackmc]

And if any opposing regiment had their own WarShip Fleet as orbital fire support, said Davion artillery wouldn't ever have a chance.

It's a shame that your observation wasn't as germain as it was obvious.

-Jackmc

[deathfrombeyond]

It's a shame that your observation wasn't as germain as it was obvious.

-Jackmc

Likewise.

It's a shame that my point was missed. Pity that.

[Jackmc]

It's a shame that my point was missed. Pity that.

What point?  It's not like they'd be parked in parade formation at a lager.   We're talking about dispersed spa's that are shooting on the move and thus no more vulnerable to Orbital Bombardment than any other ground vee.


-Jackmc

[Gracus]

Oh, look.  I didn't know we had two church ladies on the forum.

[Hellraiser]

The 2nd Chrisholm has the 1st Crisholm Heavy Artillery (HAY code) -no indication if its a Regiment, Group or a Battalion

As of HD:SB - The 1st Chisholm RCT has almost twice the normal # of artillery pieces.
That is however in 3025 and its the 1st not 2nd....but I thought I'd toss that out there that they had nearly a full extra battalion.
The 2nd Chisholm was only a Mech Regiment w/ extra Fighters back then, not a full RCT.

[RedMarauder]

So I'm not a big user of Artillery.
Been on the recieving end Plenty of times. And respect it as one should.
But I've seldom added it to my forces.

But with the Formation of the LCT and their Light combat teams.
I figure I should get better informed.
So what are the regular used arty pieces on the Fed Suns Roster.

I'm figuring that
Thors,Long Toms will still be common.
Chapperals are sold all over.

Maybe the Demolisher which replaces the guns for arrow IV's

But beyond that I can't think of many units with it.
I doubt we'd have the O-Bakemono.

You really should be.  You'll get quite a bit of mileage out of them in bigger games.