Author Topic: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord  (Read 18246 times)

VensersRevenge

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'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« on: 28 July 2019, 19:53:24 »
‘Mech of the Week: Warlord
Inner Sphere
TRO 3075
   
Technical Readout 3075 was an odd TRO. After a new Technical Readout every few in-game years from 3050-3067 with dozens of Inner Sphere ‘Mechs, 3075 had only fifteen in the new developments section. With a full six of those slots being devoted to the WoB’s Celestials, the other Inner Sphere factions only had a couple selections each. In fact, the Warlord is the only assault ‘Mech not built by the Word of Blake. But it is a high quality one. Between the chaos of the FedCom Civil War and the opening stages of the Jihad in the Federated Suns, the AFFS apparently felt that a durable flashbulb design was necessary. GM decided to base this new ‘Mech on the Battlemaster, and needed assistance in gaining the schematics for the design. The El Dorado branch of the Davion family, the Sanromea-Davions, stepped in and acquired the plans for GM, who built the Warlord on El Dorado. Although the Warlord’s aesthetics are clearly based on the Battlemaster, and according to information on sarna.net, that is what it was based on out of universe as well. But to me, the Warlord is a completely different ‘Mech. It is a flashbulb Thug. Whatever ‘Mech the Warlord is based on, the more important question is if House Davion got an assault ‘Mech worth buying. To see that, we will have to examine the variants individually, as they have very different chasses.

Warlord BLR-2D:
   The base variant of the Warlord in TRO 3075 is the 2D, and it is built extremely tough. Using only endosteel for advanced construction materials, the 2D variant of the Warlord is a very durable 80 ton ‘Mech. With no ammo or engine crits in the side torsos, the only way to kill the Warlord is to rip it to pieces. And that is difficult when you have to shoot through 14.5 tons or 94% of the maximum standard armour to get into the internal structure. The Warlord can run 64 km/h, allowing it to keep up with heavies like the Jagermech, Marauder, or Black Knight as well as assault ‘Mechs like the Victor or the Battlemaster it is inspired by. However being well-armoured and extremely durable means nothing if the Warlord can’t kill anything, so let’s look at the armament. The Warlord is a bracket-firer, using either it’s two arm mounted heavy PPC’s or it’s six torso mounted ER Medium lasers. One thing to note is that unlike the Warhammer or Marauder, the Warlord still has its hand actuators for two 8 point punches in melees. Now this isn’t the most inspiring firepower ever, only a max of sixty points in a turn and considering it only has sixteen double heat sinks the Warlord is going to be hard put to do more than 40 points in all but the most desperate situations. But the sheer durability of the Warlord and its energy loadout means it is going to keep firing turn after turn, and two reasonably long-ranged headcappers is nothing to be sneezed at. While the Warlord cannot simply brutalize everything it’s path, it will keep fighting for as long as is necessary, exactly what the FedSuns needed during the Jihad.

Warlord 2Dr:
   A refit of the 2D, the 2Dr  makes no changes to the engine, heatsinks, structure, or armour. It adds a C3 slave and TSM; and modifies the short range loadout to four ER Mediums, a Medium Pulse, a regular medium, and a Small Pulse Laser. This puts the Warlord three tons overweight, and the weight is gained by dropping one of the Heavy PPCs for an ER PPC. While gaining some range is nice, I feel like losing the second headcapper really hurts the Warlords capabilities. So the question is if the short range gains are worth the cost. Adding C3 is undoubtedly useful for Davion C3 lances, although coming out during the ECM glutted Jihad limits the value of C3. TSM is undoubtedly useful in keeping the Warlord mobile as it gets hotter, and can allow for devastating melee attacks. But the changes in energy armament make the close range damage much less consistent. Especially with the loss of long range damage, the short range armament has to be more damaging, and the mismatched weapon ranges make it difficult to consistently use. Is this variant worthless? No, but I don’t think it is worth taking over the 2D unless you really need a C3 capable Warlord.

Warlord 2G:
   While El Dorado could make the vast majority of the Warlord components, it did not have the orbital facilities necessary to produce endo-steel. It could produce the needed materials for XL engines though. The 2G variant uses the XL engine to not only remove the endo-steel, but to add the last ton of armour the Warlord can mount and to revamp the close range weapons. Defensively, this is a clear loss. While getting the last one of armour is nice, the side torsos only gain one point of armour which simply is not going to help. So if the Warlord is now vulnerable to side torso destruction and has more engine slots to be crit, does the short range firepower make up for it? Well, it certainly is exciting. Instead of six ER Medium lasers, it has twelve regular mediums of which two are rear-facing. This makes the close range firepower fifty damage instead of thirty, and let’s the Warlord protect it’s back. Is this better? Clearly, but the question is how much better when compared to the sharp decrease in survivability. According to the Battle Value, the answer is not much. If you are fighting in open areas where range is more important, the 2D is much better. But it might be worth the loss of survivability for a powerful close range punch in an urban fight. I prefer the 2D, but the 2G is still a useful choice.

Warlord BLR-2XC:
This one is weird. Being found in XTRO Phantoms, it is very different than the other Warlords. To begin with, it is only 75 tons. This means that it has less internal structure, weaker melee attacks, and it mounts half a ton less armour than the 2D. The 2XC still moves 64 km/h with an XL engine and has normal structure and armour. The armaments are simple, two ER PPC’s and six ER Medium lasers. No headcappers hurts, but Warhammers have done it for centuries and it worked fine for them.   While the weapons are uninspired, the equipment choices make this Warlord a worthy XTRO project. Clearly built as a Command ‘Mech, not only mounting a Command Console but also C3i. An odd choice for a Davion ‘Mech, but whatever. I guess they were experimenting at the time. It also includes an Angel ECM suite, a Bloodhound Active Probe, a TAG, and a Remote Sensor Dispenser. This lets the commander riding in the Console to be hard to target with advanced electronics and create Ghost Targets, sniff out hidden units that might ambush it, and drop super accurate artillery on anyone who gets close. This is a good command ‘Mech if you have a commander that, you know, commands instead of getting into the thick of the fighting. But being a lighter variant without the trademark Heavy PPCs makes it not feel like a Warlord.

Fighting with a Warlord depends on the variant. I am only going to talk about the two main variants, because those are the ones most people are going to fight with and against most often. With the 2D, you mostly want to stay in mid-ranges. I would probably lean more on the PPCs than the lasers, but you are mostly relying on being impossible to kill. With the 2G, while you will use the PPCs closing, you really want to be right in the enemies face taking advantage of laser spam and melee attacks. Fighting Warlords is the same for both variants, just a matter of degrees. Neither of them have very much range, as the PPC range simply is not what it was in 3025, so LRMs and ERPPCs are a good way to kill Warlords with no threat of headcaps. This is even more important, and easier, when facing the 2G, as ten medium lasers is not something you want to get close to. Heat based weapons are also useful, as the heat balance is very precise. The Warlord was built to fight long battles far from supplies, and it certainly delivers. Now tell me how you have used the Warlord in the comments below.
MUL: http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3509/warlord-blr-2d
Camospecs: http://camospecs.com/Search/Index?Term=Warlord
« Last Edit: 29 July 2019, 14:33:19 by VensersRevenge »
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #1 on: 28 July 2019, 20:15:18 »
My biggest complaint about the Warlord is that the mini was produced when IWM was having its "scale? What's that?" Phase and is ridiculously large.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #2 on: 28 July 2019, 20:26:00 »
Not a fan of the Warlord. Feels too much like an optimized version of the BattleMaster.
And the 2xPPCs of some type, 4/6 movement, and supporting armament has been done so many times. The Warhammer, Marauder, Royal BattleMaster, Thug, Hatamoto, along with many others.
Sure, the Warlord is good, but i'll pick something else than Warlord for the role, something more interesting or just something more classic.

The "Phantom" Warlord has some of the weirdest equipment placing i've ever seen. Most 'Mechs just omit arm actuators or something rather than going for full on weirdness.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #3 on: 28 July 2019, 21:27:41 »
The 2d also feels a lot like a non-jumping Penetrator.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #4 on: 28 July 2019, 22:30:06 »
It basically IS an optimised Battlemaster with Penetratoresque armament.

And then in short order came the Sphinx and Lament

Rather disappointing

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #5 on: 29 July 2019, 07:23:05 »
The Warlords a very powerful if a bit dull. Its what happens when you leave a Thug and a Penetrator in a hangar. At mid to short ranges this thing will murder stuff quite happily and vent heat very well. Its also a pain to knock out as its stuffed with heatsinks and carries no explodium either.

I do suggest a lil edit of the article itself, as its one HUGE paragraph that can be a bit hard to read, but otherwise, good job :)
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #6 on: 29 July 2019, 07:24:48 »
I could forgive the Warlord, bland as it is, if someone else built it. But we just got a beefy flashbulb from the Feddies in '67 with the Sagittaire, and it kind of feels like that was enough- a variant of the Sag with a Warlord-ish loadout would have been fine by me, but why the Feds would build two similar designs within a few years of each other- particularly with resources strained after so many years of constant conflict, Jihad included- is beyond me.

Boring Mech to use, boring in looks, awful miniature. Absolutely forgettable Mech.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #7 on: 29 July 2019, 08:11:31 »
Warlord 2G: Instead of six ER Medium lasers, it has twelve regular mediums of which two are rear-facing. This makes the close range firepower fifty damage instead of thirty, and let’s the Warlord protect it’s back.

Explaining the 2G's rear mounted medium lasers: They're an homage to the BLR-1G.

Warlord BLR-2XC:
This one is weird. Being found in XTRO Phantoms, it is very different than the other Warlords. To begin with, it is only 75 tons. The armaments are simple, two ER PPC’s and six ER Medium lasers.

It basically IS an optimised Battlemaster with Penetratoresque armament.

If memory serves, I think Cray(?) said he built this design originally at 75 tons to show that a BattleMaster could be optimized for production as a heavy 'Mech.

In fact, the XTRO:Phantoms Warlord 2XC entry says:
Quote
El Dorado has thus
reportedly designed a somewhat lighter, streamlined model that
could use more common parts than the 320-rated engine and
four-ton gyroscope of prior Warlord models. The reported “BLR-
2E” is supposedly stalled because of production problems with
“powder metallurgy endo steel” that can be built in a planetary
gravity well,

So I'm going to speculate: The 2XC was designed with the 2E plans as a starting point. Since the Suns has several Marauder lines, producing a 4/6 75-tonner should be fairly straightforward. But the endo steel failed so they went with a standard frame and XL engine. Dropping the 2XC's electronics equipment would free room for more and heavier weapons as well, like the Heavy PPCs of the original 2D.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #8 on: 02 August 2019, 11:28:20 »
I want to say the story was it WAS originally a 75t mech and when putting together the TRO they needed something heavier so it got bumped up and assigned to the FS to fill the slot for them.

I used one to pound at folks in my group's tournament last year, unsurprisingly it performed pretty well just wading forward in most games until one game where it was only taking damage to one location- then had the head blown off IIRC.  Unsurprisingly I lost that game since it was waddling forward to go after a top gun assault.  It chewed that assault, but my force was mostly spent and I was trying to not get wiped out.

Not a fan of the mini at all, tried cutting up a AS Lance pack Cyclops to make something better.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #9 on: 02 August 2019, 13:36:05 »
Kitbashing is possible. This used all DA parts, plus a little balsa wood - Scourge torso, Panther arms, and the legs escape me but it was a brick-like medium IIRC.



And yup, there are a bunch I'd recomission when I won my millions  ::) - Grand Titan, Grand Crusader, Warlord.
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #10 on: 03 August 2019, 12:02:41 »
...you forgot the Kraken and Galahad in there, chief.  :thumbsup:

(Oh, and the Griffin IIC. You know, THAT one...)

Anyway. Warlord mini. The fact that the wrist-mounted PPC ports aren't really aimed where the arms are pointing weirds me out- I get it, to an extent, but it just looks weird- I'd rather they have been mounted sort of like the PPC on the reseen Wolverine, on the outside of the wrist rather than built into it for that reason.
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Luciora

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #11 on: 03 August 2019, 12:33:28 »
Hmm..I'd probably use a Zeus as a starting base for a Warlord if I were to kitbash one.  Then you can pick and choose arms.

worktroll

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #12 on: 03 August 2019, 15:00:30 »
The Kraken XR is a great base for making older Banes, particularly the Bane 2. You have to saw off the LRMs, though. The Reseen Viper is also great once you saw off the side torsos to bring the size back down. And the Galahad is salvageable; all you need is replacement legs, waist, and guns ... (will post pics with very little encouragement).
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Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #13 on: 03 August 2019, 15:03:33 »
When you say "Galahad", do you mean the Glass Spider or the Star League Galahad?

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #14 on: 03 August 2019, 15:07:40 »
Glass Spider - the Reseen. Appears to be part of the first generation of CAD designs with 3D printed prototypes (see also Grand Crusader), that due to "state of the art" at the time lack the level of details you get from hand-sculpted masters. The state of the art has moved on considerably since those minis.
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* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

Empyrus

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #15 on: 03 August 2019, 15:09:37 »
Thought so. The Glass Spider sculpt looks horrible IMO. The Galahad seems pretty neat... just haven't gotten around assembling it, let alone so many others...

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #16 on: 03 August 2019, 15:12:33 »
My remake just uses the upper torso & frisbee ... Just painting up an old lead Glass Spider at the moment, nice mini for that period. Never had a SL Galahad, agree it looks nice - how many pieces?
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #17 on: 03 August 2019, 15:18:59 »
My remake just uses the upper torso & frisbee ... Just painting up an old lead Glass Spider at the moment, nice mini for that period. Never had a SL Galahad, agree it looks nice - how many pieces?
Torso, legs, arm spruce.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #18 on: 03 August 2019, 15:29:23 »
Well, sounds like that goes on my next IWM buy list. Once my wallet (and wife) recover from the KS ... ;)
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #19 on: 03 August 2019, 20:39:53 »
The warlord is straight up vanilla, never my first choice, but I'll still enjoy it if I don't have another option. I always felt the same way about the Thug.

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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #20 on: 03 August 2019, 21:25:52 »
The positioning of the Warlord's PPCs actually makes sense, given that it's intended to wade into combat and start throwing punches.  Still looks weird, though.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #21 on: 03 August 2019, 21:41:33 »
team "I'm shooting you with $10 worth of tin"

boring competence isn't my first go-to (except the Ryoken Prime. it can stay)

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #22 on: 04 August 2019, 01:16:06 »
Thanks for the write-up! This is a mech I see mentioned a lot but I was never very familiar with. This really helped me get to know what it's all about.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #23 on: 04 August 2019, 07:50:19 »
I dunno.
It's a good article.
But, there just isn't much to be said about the design. It mostly just has two weapon systems, no ammo... at least it's a bracket firer, or it would be completely boring.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #24 on: 04 August 2019, 18:31:06 »
Someone left a Awesome 8Q and a Hunchback 4P alone in the dropship too long . . .

Its not complicated to use, as mentioned . . . you just shove it up the middle and watch folks get out of the way.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #25 on: 05 August 2019, 11:14:13 »

I’m gonna go against the trend in this thread, and say that I wish there were more simple, straightforward, efficient, effective, even brutal designs like the Warlord in the game.  As the lengthy threads on “Mech Designs That Make No Sense” up on the Ground Combat board indicate, the canon seems littered with way too many designs that don’t match their fluffed mission or role, that are severely flawed and suboptimal, or are just confused amalgamations of weapons or technologies.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m fine with unusual designs to fill some dueling function for Solaris VII games or one-on-one Clan trials.  I’m also fine with unusual designs to fill combat niches in different armies.  Or even the occasional flawed/failed experimental design that is still pressed into combat due to circumstances.

But I also look through the TROs and wonder, “Where are the standardized and highly effective T-34s for BattleTech?  Where are the efficient STuGs and Shermans?”  Long before Star League and Clan tech, I used to home grow Warlord-type designs (dual peepers, massed medium lasers, adequate sinks for bracket firing, thick armor).  And then I wondered why designs like that didn’t appear in the TROs in addition to the flawed Warhammers, Marauders, and Awesomes with their thin armor, inadequate heat sinks, ammo bombs, and/or exposed minimum ranges?

For me, there’s as much enjoyment in using terrain and tactics to my advantage with solid, effective, standardized designs on both sides as there is in treating each engagement as a series of duels between flawed designs trying to cover/exploit their weaknesses.  The former is more like real combat, which I wish we had a little bit more of in BT, versus the fantasy gladiatorial robowars designs and combat style.

So I say give us more Warlord and Marauder II and Hellstar types of designs.  I’m trying to run army units here, not Islands of Misift Toys.  My 2 Kerenskys... YMMV.

« Last Edit: 06 August 2019, 00:19:11 by Natasha Kerensky »
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #26 on: 06 August 2019, 08:48:18 »
Above.

This forum seems to love niche designs, everything else is ether under optimized or over optimized.

The Warlord was design to be a brute and does the job very well. It's up there with a few SLDF era designs that people still drool over while still being true to it's own era in design.
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grimlock1

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #27 on: 06 August 2019, 08:48:58 »
So I say give us more Warlord and Marauder II and Hellstar types of designs.  I’m trying to run army units here, not Islands of Misift Toys.  My 2 Kerenskys... YMMV.
I hear you.  The quirky stuff has its place, and can be fun, but we're all trying to win a war here.  We need troopers.
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Sure it isn't the most practical 'mech ever designed, but it's a hundred ton axe-murderer. If loving that is wrong I don't wanna be right.

mbear

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #28 on: 06 August 2019, 10:02:56 »
Anyway. Warlord mini. The fact that the wrist-mounted PPC ports aren't really aimed where the arms are pointing weirds me out- I get it, to an extent, but it just looks weird- I'd rather they have been mounted sort of like the PPC on the reseen Wolverine, on the outside of the wrist rather than built into it for that reason.

Just finished looking at the mini over on Camospecs. Those PPCs look like they're mortars of some sort. Or maybe loudspeakers.

Anyone know how hard is it to remove them and build up the base of the PPCs so they rest on the forearm and point the right direction?
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Luciora

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: Warlord
« Reply #29 on: 06 August 2019, 10:07:41 »
Would need dremel work.  They take up a nice part of the arm its attached to.

Just finished looking at the mini over on Camospecs. Those PPCs look like they're mortars of some sort. Or maybe loudspeakers.

Anyone know how hard is it to remove them and build up the base of the PPCs so they rest on the forearm and point the right direction?